DSE600 vs AGR box

[Jeremy]

I am looking to order a new steering box for my 80 TA and was wondering if the DSE 600 box is noticeably better than the AGR quick ratio box. Both boxes claim to offer better feel and I was wondering for a mostly street driven car if I would notice any difference between the two especially given that the DSE box is $200 more than the AGR.

My box is leaking and my car has little feel to it and the steering feels sloppy. Everything on the front end is new except for the box so I am reasonably sure that a new box should tighten things up. Chime in with suggestions--I would like to order a new box by Monday at the latest.

[79TransAm]

for a street drive car id go with the AGR. Thats what im going with on my 79. BTW nice bird. If your looking to build your car as cheap as possibly while still using quality id say go with the agr. And please lemme know how ya like it. For your front end, who did you use for the front end steering and suspension. I'm looking to rebuild the entire front end with moog.

[Jeremy]

I used moog for all of my hard parts. I originally had poly bushings and do not recommend them at all for a street driven car. I went back to rubber in the lower arms and am either going rubber on the upper arms or with tubular arms with solid greasable bushings.

I went with the DSE box after calling DSE. If I had not already had metric compatible lines, I would have gone AGR. I could afford the box but was not willing to spend money on changing other parts to accomodate the swap but I already had the lines.

The selling points for me were that the box was brand new and they assured me that it would have a much improved on center feel and distinct center.

Lately, my build up has gone from budget minded to quality minded. Some of the cheaper parts I purchased several years ago have left me wanting more in performance and reliabilty. All of my recent purchases have been more towards the top of the line and the overall quality of the car is much much better. Working the second job to finance the car has been worth the higher price of parts for me.

Thanks for the positive contact on the car. I can't wait to post pics when I use a better resolution camera.

[Todds69]

I'm switching from manual steering to power and have considered the same two boxes...I'm going with the AGR unit mainly for cost, but I really don't think I will see the $200 in feel for a street driven vehicle. Not to mention that $200 can pay for something else.

[Steve1968LS2]

All I can say is that I was VERY happy with my 600 box.. felt very responsive and as good as any rack and pinion car i have driven..

It is not the cheapest way to go but I was a happy customer..

If you are on a budget I see nothing wrong with a good AGR box or worked over 800 box..

[68SSConvt]

I've tried several boxes over the years, the stock unit, a late model z28 unit, then a AGR version of the stock box with a new AGR pump to go with it. I was never really happy with the feel. I recently sold the AGR and bought a DSE 600. Now I'm happy. The feel is great.

The DSE box seemed pricey, but I'm not dissappointed.

Ray

[Jeremy]

I got the DSE box today and got it installed. So far I have only been able to drive around town, but it is extremely precise. Now my car has a distinct center to the steering wheel. When I go over bumps the steering no longer feels twitchy. The effort is a little harder than I expected but still comfortable to drive. It takes three turns to go lock to lock which suprised me for a 12.7 to 1 box, but I don't know if I have more steering travel than before.

So far I am very pleased with the box. I did have to make a custom pressure line since the adaptors I had did not fit. The new box had the seat for the o ring deeper than the 3rd gen box I had. I used a pressure line from an 87 TA and cut the box fitting off. I cut a pump fitting off of a 79 line and had the two mated with a new hose. Everything worked great.

[Jeremy]

I had a chance to do some two lane highway driving and the box is well worth the money. The steering is firm but very precise. The ratio is quick--most curves required very little input. Bumps mid corner do not upset the front end like they used to. The car truly drives like a new car now.

One thing else I noticed is that it felt like the new box was more than 6 pounds lighter. I could easily manipulate the new box with one hand. I wish I would have weighed them, but it felt like more than 6 pounds lighter.

[Rick Dorion]

The box is about 6-8 pounds lighter. Interesting comment on the pressure hose fitting. I have had a heck of a time resolving leaks at the o-ring fitting. The -6 AN adapters are too short I found due to the hole being a bit deeper! Paul at Hydroboost has developed a new adapter fitting with the o-ring in the top of the fitting to seal against the box. I'm going to try it and see.

BTW - I too love the DSE box feel and performance.

[Jeremy]

Rick, I had the same problem with the adaptors I had being too short, not by much but the top of the adaptor would bottom on the box before the o ring would seat. The holes appeared much deeper -- it looked like about an 1/8 of an inch over my 3rd gen box.

[Rick Dorion]

Exactly and people thought I was nuts. How tight do you tighten the fitting? I ruined a few o-rings because I believe I overtightened and cut them. Sucks blowing out PS fluid miles from home.

[Jeremy]

Rick,


I went to when I got some resistence. I then tried to wiggle or turn the line. I continued until the steel line was tight and resisted movement. This worked for me.

I guess it would not be a bad idea to keep some o rings and power steering fluid in the trunk for a while. I would hate to blow a ring away from home.

For the return line I used a 3/8 fuel line with the o ring fitting and it fit perfectly. The threaded nut was shorter than the pressure line but I was able to get everything snug with just a little clearance before it bottomed out on the box. I think this piece cost me around 4 buck but I did have to cut a 90 degree turn off.

[Rick Dorion]

It's in the trunk Thanks.

[68SSConvt]

I found a thicker o-ring and put that on first then the normal o-ring. That solved the adapter leak problem for me. The thicker one seems to seal in the larger part of the housing and also holds the normal one down where it can seal against the reduced part of the housing.

Ray

[Rick Dorion]

Well, using the high pressure hose end DSE supplied, the o-ring gets cut on the lip of the box hole when you tighten everything down. The -6AN adapter is too short. Out of desperation I'll try stacking two o-rings and hopefully the modified adapter Paul (Hydroboost) is making will be the permanent fix.

It's irksome to be told 'we've never heard of any problems before you', I will say, when we can share this problem here. It's obviously real.

I guess another approach will be to buy an 87 TA hose and go to a local hydraulic hose maker and have a hybrid line made up.

[vanzuuk1]

hey rick not to change the subject but i p/m'ed you with a request for photos.

[Rick Dorion]

I don't have any PM. When did you send it? Be glad to send any pics.

[vanzuuk1]

Damn I will try again.if you dont see it by the a.m. email me at [email protected]. I was thinking about getting the same rims as you , curious to see photos and hear specs on rim/tire size offset wheelwell mods etc.All the usual new guy questions but I am a fellow new yorker so cut me some slack.Also going to the show/ cruise in L.I. tomorrow early if its not raining .

[CarlC]

Rick,

I'll take a look later today at my fittings. The box is in the car and there are no leaks with -6 brass adapters using the same teflon braided hose for pressure and return.

The -600 box is a world better than the previous fast-ratio setup. However, the old box was just a stock setup with no mods. It does have more road feel, IMO, then a Lee's box. The on-center is very nice as well.

[Rick Dorion]

I love the box, too, and have a few miles on it. I'm sure you can appreciate my joy in migrating from a manual box! The -6 adapter that came with my hydroboost is chromed. I think Paul uses aeroquip but not sure. Glad to hear yours works well. Maybe I'll order a brass one. I too am using the teflon braided hose. Thanks, Carl.