69 GTO Build

[ekmxryda]

Careful what you offer, I might just do it...LOL



What are the tire sizes?

Andrew

Hey Andrew,
The fronts are 275/35ZR18 and I think I can go wider but I need to check.
The rear tires are 345/30ZR19 and I have almost 3/4" clearance on both sides of the tubs.
The Vette rims are for mock up, I won't feel comfortable driving it with the 1" spacers.

[ekmxryda]

Mike,
Sorry to hear about your bent pushrod (thats my guess since it happened so quickly) it should be an easy fix if that is all that was damaged. Worse case it is a good excuse for an upgrade like you said!
Love the new pics! But they make me sad because I can see that I still have many hours left of cutting banging and re-welding my new quarters to get my door gaps as good as yours!
I will be running my AC lines the same way you went through the firewall, I need to see how much room is left after the roll cage is in. Hope that I can still fit the AC! Guess I could mount it in the trunk.
Funny that you mentioned seat position fixes, I was working on testing steering column lengths tonight and I need to move the seat back a couple inches. Going with a new 32" tilt column and moving it back so I get more leg room, I am 6'2" and will need some space. Going with aftermarket seats too so I figure I will need to make custom mounts, hope to get seating position lower too since the side of my head will be right at roll bar height.

[Fastmonty]

Eric,

I have a funny feeling you'll be fine with setting your gaps... I only had to reset the doors like four times? (I didn't have to add any metal, just a tiny bit of filler to make the gaps straight) I'm sure you know this... I started with the doors, then set the fender gaps, and double checked the hood gaps. Last is the bumper shaping. I originally set the doors, fenders, then bumper. After shaping, etc... I set the hood. The freakin gaps were around 3/8"! So, I started over, pulled the doors in, set the fenders, then the hood. Geeeeeze, the stuff I learned from this project.

Anyway, thanks for the heads up on the possible bent pushrod. I've never worked on this motor... I assume the issue will present itself when I measure the rocker displacement when hand turning the motor? Any troubleshooting guidance will be appreciated...

Talk soon, Mike

['71cutlasluvr]

Gus it will be a while before I spray the black, I need to do more work on all the gaps after the car is assembled.

Understood.
Man I sure wish we lived closer, like across the street! Having you for a neighbor would be a great motivator, knowing (or at least hoping you don't run away when you see me cross the street) an answered question or a helping hand is a quick walk over away.. Plus the threat of you harrassing me with a visit and friendly advice occasionally would help too!

['71cutlasluvr]

Hey Gus I am sure the body will be off again soon, I need to install the fuel cell, run fuel lines still and I didn't get the brake lines installed yet either.
I just want to keep the progress going on the body and get all the gaps worked out.
Watched a Christmas movie with the family tonight so I had to rush getting the fenders and nose on, only put a couple bolts in just to keep parts from falling off.
Cool to see it on the ground again! I like how low it sits and it will be a bit lower once it has all the rest of its parts

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OMG!!! (My daughters would bust a gut if they new I used OMG... not a phrase I use frequently but nothing else seems to fit the occasion... )That looks sooooo kewl Eric!! Thanks for the pics. Keep on keepin' on my friend!

['71cutlasluvr]

Hey Mike. Welcome Back! Sorry to hear about your stuck throttle. Perhaps as simple as a bent pushrod like Eric says. Fingers crossed.

Thanks for the heads up on the seat bracket extensions. Sorry you wasted the $ on them but I appreciate the heads up. I'm in the same boat as Eric, and the same height, so like everything else he does, I will be watching closely. Thanks for the a/c input too.

I'll weigh in more later but it's late and my fingers are shot.

Again, glad you're back and thanks for the input. Pics are great too!!

[ekmxryda]

Merry Christmas!
Not much of an update but Santa dropped off a few new parts.
Steering Shaft has a good 5" of travel to help keep the steering wheel from crushing your ribcage when really bad things happen.



Borgeson Universal Telescoping Steering Shaft BRG-450024, Steel Alloy,
(Mfr. #: 450024)

Mike any news to report on the engine damage done to the 400? Put up a Youtube video link if you haven't torn it apart yet so that people can hear it, I am sure people can give you some feedback if you still need it.

['71cutlasluvr]

Merry Christmas!
Not much of an update but Santa dropped off a few new parts.
Steering Shaft has a good 5" of travel to help keep the steering wheel from crushing your ribcage when really bad things happen.



Borgeson Universal Telescoping Steering Shaft BRG-450024, Steel Alloy,
(Mfr. #: 450024)

Mike any news to report on the engine damage done to the 400? Put up a Youtube video link if you haven't torn it apart yet so that people can hear it, I am sure people can give you some feedback if you still need it.

Merry Christmas to you too Eric. I can see Santa was good to you also.

Nice Piece. Very safe. Good thinking.

I'm a bit down on funds since the time came to make the decision of no more quick fixes with the drainage problem we have. Had a full blown drainage system installed to funnel all of the water from the house, walk out basement and detached garage. Mostly in preparation for paving next year, but water control was the primary reason. Took 4 days. Good timing since it was during the warm weather we had the last couple of weeks. Attached a few pics.

Well, tried to upload a few pics but forum wouldn't take them. ??

Will add later.

Since the driveway is now mainly sandy dirt (basically mud when it rains) , can't move the body/body cart back up to the main garage until the ground freezes. Then I will start body work/mods. Hoping to make lots of progress this winter. If the snow can hold off like has been, I just may get most of the body work/mods done by spring!


Enjoy the holidays.

Mike, would like to see that vid too if you have it.

[ekmxryda]

Happy New Year!

Good luck with all of your driveway drainage Gus. I have been busy working on my house the last couple weeks too.
Was able to cut back the stock steering column, made up a Delrin bushing to replace the sloppy old bearing



Moved the mount bracket down then slotted out one side so I could move the column back (inside the car) almost 2"

['71cutlasluvr]

Happy New Year!

Good luck with all of your driveway drainage Gus. I have been busy working on my house the last couple weeks too.
Was able to cut back the stock steering column, made up a Delrin bushing to replace the sloppy old bearing



Moved the mount bracket down then slotted out one side so I could move the column back (inside the car) almost 2"

Happy New Year to you too Eric!

Drainage work done and it's work perfectly! No more water in the basement rec/storage room (have lots of my Cutlass and Miata parts down there. A Real Pain to move everything when I had to vacumn up water!) The bad news? The driveway is pretty much sandy dirt and when we bring our dd's into the garage we bring in a bunch of mud which is a mess but once it feezes, we'll be better off. And that will be resolved permanently in the spring with asphalt.

As always, nice fab work Eric.

So any idea when in 2015 your goat will be ready for that first run through the gears? Bet your chompin' at the bit to get her on the road and at the track... I know I would be. Wishing you a great 2015 and a speedy completion of you '69 GTO project car.

[ekmxryda]

Having a little separation anxiety!
Dropped off the GTO at the frame shop for some help squaring up the quarters at the door jamb, drivers side was still a little in from the accident. Cool to see most of the body together again, first time in 30 years. I hope the tarp stays on so it won't fill up with snow.
I have plenty of work to do on the LQ9 but once again the old house projects are stealing my time. So Gus I would think at least another year before I am driving it, unless Chip Foose and his crew want to help out.

Mike any news on the engine noise?

['71cutlasluvr]

She looks great Eric! It's such a shame that as nice as the body is and is gonna be, that beautiful chassis is hidden underneath. Sorry to hear she's off to the frame shop but at least you know what needs to be done and that you need a hand to get it done right. Another year? I might just catch up with you yet.... NOT!

I'm having second thoughts about going the RS chassis route. Between the cost of putting in the drainage system and plans to pave my huge driveway, available funds for my project car will be seriously depleted. (finally allowed to post pics... I probably didn't size them right last time. See below.

Since My car won't be put through the rigors of competition like yours, unless I hit the lottery or have a long lost aunt/uncle leave me $16k (which was the final tally with all the options I would want from RS) I will probably just modify the frame to accomodate coil overs. No notching, not even sure if mini tubbing will be needed. I'd love to emulate your goat with the 335's+, but at this time just can't justify the expense. Since I won't be putting on those big/huge/large meats like you are, I can get by with smaller rubber and skip the notch job. I will still add the boxing plates for stiffness.

Will have to check out Mike's thread. I think he got 295's on his goat without any frame mods? Perhaps the mini tubs will give me a bit more room, depending on how much the frame protrudes into the wheel well after minitubbing. Will have to research that.
Either way, since the frame is pretty much welded up from my one plasma cut, I'll leave it as is on the support stands and weld in the coil over bar that ABC provided for the rears. (have to cut out the stock rear spring perches... I can handle that at least!)

There's another builder, buryingthesun, doing a '67 firebird who really does his research. He came up with these for the front coil overs:

http://www.speedtechperformance.com/...rod/prd272.htm

This will keep me busy welding and prepping for body paint over the winter. I hope to make some serious progress this year.

You can be sure I'll be referencing yours, Mikes and buryingthesuns build threads. So much I don't know and will be learning as I go.

Once the coil over mods are in place and the body work is done, I can apply lizard skin to the body, clean up the firewall and we'll be fairly close to paint.

btw: -4 this morning! Sheesh. The good news is that Now that the driveway is frozen, no longer mud, I can move the body/cart up to the heated garage to pick away at the metal work. All the kids and mrs. cars have been maintained for the winter, the Miata will stay in the trailer until the spring, so hopefully no need to move the body for access to the lift.

Stay warm my friend. Hope you get your baby back soon. Mine may be in pieces but I can go out to the garage and see her anytime. I can understand your separation anxiety!

Hope you have a great 2015.

['71cutlasluvr]

Mike any news on the engine noise?

+1. How goes the battle Mike? As you can read in my last post, I'm back to referencing your build since I will be retaining the stock frame albeit with some stiffening pieces and a rear coil over setup from ABC performance. Front coil over setup will probably be from Speedtech, since I already have some of their pieces.

Was hoping you found the engine noise issue and it wasn't an expensive fix. Let us know when you can.

[Roger Poirier]

Having a little separation anxiety!
Dropped off the GTO at the frame shop for some help squaring up the quarters at the door jamb, drivers side was still a little in from the accident. Cool to see most of the body together again, first time in 30 years. I hope the tarp stays on so it won't fill up with snow.
I have plenty of work to do on the LQ9 but once again the old house projects are stealing my time. So Gus I would think at least another year before I am driving it, unless Chip Foose and his crew want to help out.

Your having anxiety, I'm having withdraw! A whole another year to go. It can't be... Then your going to paint the car satin black. It will be another ten years before it's painted. Since your into the car full board anyways you might as well paint it. Be done with it. Please, pretty please...

[Fastmonty]

Guys,

Just popping in... I really wish this site would notify me when there's a post. Anyway, let's see... the motor noise, which was clicking, went away. Which tells me the lifters were collapsed. I had removed all of the push rods, and did a compression test, as well as a cylinder load test. Nothing! The motor still has a nasty vibration, with and without power... sooooo, today I ordered my custom heads from Jim Butler himself. I will be using my 400 block, but converting it over to a stroker... hmmm about 467ci. 550+ hp and over 550 ft lbs. of torque. Should be fun. I'm waiting for my cherry picker to be delivered, then I'll start tearing it down. I suspect I pulled a rod bolt, and spun a bearing. Place your wagers...

Gus, I saw you asked about tire fitment. I have 285's. BUT, 295's will fit when I order tires again. I suggest getting a Wheel Rite tool. It's around $60, but helped select my wheel offsets, etc... I think it looks great, but the test will be when 600 ftlbs gets laid down. Ha, ha....

I'll keep you guys posted...

Mike

[ekmxryda]

Showing off my new toy, Diversion 180. Will make my life easier when I get to welds I care about, once I learn how to use it.
They are offering rebates until the end of the month.
http://www.millerwelds.com/landing/b...content=online




Gus it would be nice if you could finish the mini tubbing over the winter, don't give up on it.
Mike glad you will soon be having fun building your Butler stroker, I love the way they sound.
Roger I wish that it would go together faster too, hopefully I will get the car back from the frame shop in a few weeks so I can get back on it! Seems like I am sadly at the bottom of their list. I have been thinking it would be nice to get the black paint on it before I drop the motor and drivetrain back in so that just in case it comes together sooner than I think. My to do list is still fairly long before I can call it ready for paint, but I think it will be quicker than 10 years, haha!

[ekmxryda]

I keep asking myself why I live here.



An hour later.



On the bright side the tarp was still on.

[Fastmonty]

Eric and Gus... I hope you guys are surviving the winter... I successfully tore down the motor and didn't find anything wrong! (Well, the front main bearing was worn, so I may have cracked the crank) Regardless, the block is at the machine shop, and my new stroker rotating assembly is on the way.

Eric, great choice on the Diversion 180... I have the Diversion 165, believe or not, that's all I used. The next project I'll get a MIG.

Question for you guys... should I go with a lightened flywheel or keep it at 30lbs? (Lightened is 15lbs). I'm having a hard time understanding the ramifications of going lighter...

Talk soon, Mike

[ekmxryda]

Hi Mike,
Glad to hear your motor is coming along, I have started to tear into the LQ9 and I am surprised at how clean it looks for having over 100,000 miles.
Unfortunately that is all I have had time for between all the shoveling around here! So sick of it!
The Frame shop hasn't made any progress either, maybe when the snow melts they can get to it. (I hope)

I have been thinking about going with a lighter flywheel as well, and have been reading up on them but I would love to hear from others with experience.
The reduced drivability wouldn't bother me since I won't be using this car as a daily driver in traffic.

[andrewb70]

Eric,

I can give you my own experience with a light weight clutch and flywheel combination and you can decide how much of it is applicable to your build.

I had a 1988 RX7 with a LS6 engine. The engine was mostly stock with the exception of a fairly mild cam, and made about 400rwhp. The clutch was a Quarter Master single disk 8.5" diameter with a super lightweight billet steel flywheel. The whole assembly came in under 20 pounds:



The transmission was a Liberty modified face-plated (dog ring engagement) T56.

From a drivability standpoint, there were no issues after I learned how to get the car moving. With a "normal" clutch you simple start to release the clutch while at the same time applying throttle. This didn't work very well, as the engine wanted to stall. I suppose I could have fed more throttle, but for some reason I developed a different technique. Just before I started to take off, I would blip the throttle just a little, hitting maybe 2000-2500 RPM. As the engine started to come down, I would start driving in the normal fashion, that is, releasing the clutch and applying throttle. This worked very well and after a while became second nature. The little clutches don't like to be slipped as this generates too much heat, so a quick release of the clutch is beneficial, hence the blipping of the throttle. Once under way, it was just like any other car.

The stock LS tune usually incorporates a slow idle down, which I think was done for emissions reasons, this actually helps with the drivability since the RPM drop between shifts was slow. All in all, there wasn't much downside.

The benefit was that the engine revved up very fast. In fact, it was so fast that I would throw belts as the stock Corvette tensioner couldn't keep up. I solved this by using a Katech non-spring loaded tensioner, which solved the problem. In fact, Katech developed this tensioner just because of this problem on the C5R program.

Another up-side was that the transmission shifted much smoother, and faster than with the stock LS6 clutch. I attribute this to the low overall mass and lower MOI (moment of inertia) of the flywheel/clutch assembly.

Here is an old crappy video of the car at the drag strip:



You can hear how fast the shifts are as it sounds almost like an automatic trans.

All that being said, I think a good compromise might be the new Monster clutch set-up that uses a custom billet (available in 28 or 18 pounds) combined with the new LT1 9.5" diameter dual disk clutch.

http://monsterclutches.com/1998-2002...t-fbody-clutch

I am actually considering this set-up for my Cougar project.

Hope that helps.

Andrew