Crossbreading acceptable??

**BRIAN** · 08-05-2005

Funny how the LS1 is thought of as acceptable but the generic SBC isn't? Not sure how you build a Pontiac engine for the same price? Problem with the LS1 is I wanted non FI motor for this one. By the time you add up all the related items for a FI motor you are way up there in cost. Thanks for the input and I have some thinking to do.

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**JoshStratton** · 08-05-2005

Put a Honda engine in it.

**rickk** · 08-06-2005

wick ,you better get with it boy . lol

rick kirkindall

**CamaroAJ** · 08-06-2005

Originally Posted by Kuhlryde

Is it black? I think I got a pic of it from DHardison. Looks killer!

yeah its the black one.

**redsand** · 08-07-2005

It is up to you. It is your car, your money, and if you are not showing it at pontiac only shows, it probably will not be a big deal. I put a pontiac in my trans am for my own reasons. If it is a pro-touring car chances are that there will probably be few pontiac items still on the car. (Suspension,brakes,seats,rear,wheels,gauges)

Good luck

**wick** · 08-07-2005

Now Rick, you know I got it.

13.30 @ 108 MPH on Radial TA's. Stock intake, Q-Jet, HEI, no power adders of any kind. No frame connectors or traction devices (try that with a 4 speed), everything stock for a 10th Anniversary TA except it was a 455 with a cam and headers. The short block wasn't even balanced!

I remember you driving a few Pontiac powered cars after you ditched the Fords.

**Roger Poirier** · 08-07-2005

Originally Posted by Steve1969LS1

Well today there is no such thing as a Chevy, Pontiac, Buick or whatever engine.. on GM corporate engines.

In fact the LS1 was used in the PONTIAC Trans-am so it would be like putting a Pontiac motor in the car.

Follow my drift??

Nothing wrong with keeping a vintage Pontiac motor in the car though.. sort of refreshing to see.

Yes, its acceptable. However, why would you put in a LS1 if a pontiac engine is available? I'm not positive but I believe a lot of people put LS1 engines in there cars because they are ready available as crate motors.

Not everyone has a pontiac engine to work with. Plus they make tons of torque and are a lot of fun to drive on the street. It will give that bird the authentic look. Just my thoughts.

Don't you chevy guys start jumping on me. Lots of love.

R.P.

**Scott Parkhurst** · 08-08-2005

Pontiac engines are cool because not everyone has one, knows about them, or knows how much potential they have in near-factory condition.

I love the oddball engines, since they add so much to the flavor of the car. And, of course, they're different. I began building cool cars to be different, and dropping an SBC into a Poncho makes it much "less" different to me. I love SBCs in Chevys, but if it's a Buick, Olds, or Pontiac, do yourself a favor and learn about an alternative make V-8. It's an education you'll never regret...

SP~!

**Steve1968LS2** · 08-08-2005

Originally Posted by Roger Poirier

Yes, its acceptable. However, why would you put in a LS1 if a pontiac engine is available? I'm not positive but I believe a lot of people put LS1 engines in there cars because they are ready available as crate motors.

Not everyone has a pontiac engine to work with. Plus they make tons of torque and are a lot of fun to drive on the street. It will give that bird the authentic look. Just my thoughts.

Don't you chevy guys start jumping on me. Lots of love.

R.P.

An LS1 IS a Pontiac motor

If you don't believe me just open up the hood of any 4th generation Trans Am or Firebird.. lol

A lot of people put in LS1 engines for several reasons, the hp per a $ is good, low weight, ease of living with an EFI set-up, great gas milage. Also, they have been out so long that you can find salvaged motors for good cost. (less than $3k with trans). Personally I don't see why people think it is so difficult to put in an EFI motor.. a few extra do-dads for the fuel system and an ECM programing.. I guess the worst part is that so few parts you already have will work with Gen III motor and that equals cash.

The ponitac motor would be cool and would get second looks from people since it is relatively rare to see built up Pontiac motors since most people go the easy route with a SBC.

**JLM** · 08-08-2005

I'm somewhat of a purist in this respect. I've got a Pontiac, and yes I've got a pontiac powerplant. I wouldn't be against doing an LS engine as they were found in pontiacs as well, so that's definitely acceptable. In fact I think it would be cool to do a 428 or 455 inch LS2.

I'll keep my 455 though. I can say that if I was building a new poncho motor it'd be around 440 inches. 4.0" stroke with 4.21" bore., forged i-beams, steel crank, edelbrock heads with torker II manifold with a turtle, dominator style carb and a cam in the neighborhood of a Comp 305H. In fact doing some checking you can get a balanced rotating assembly with the above mentioned parts from Butler performance for around 2000.00. Add in the extra funds for heads, intake, valvetrain etc and you're probably looking at about 4500.00 for a solid 500hp combo.

**yody** · 08-08-2005

Originally Posted by Steve1969LS1

An LS1 IS a Pontiac motor

If you don't believe me just open up the hood of any 4th generation Trans Am or Firebird.. lol

A lot of people put in LS1 engines for several reasons, the hp per a $ is good, low weight, ease of living with an EFI set-up, great gas milage. Also, they have been out so long that you can find salvaged motors for good cost. (less than $3k with trans). Personally I don't see why people think it is so difficult to put in an EFI motor.. a few extra do-dads for the fuel system and an ECM programing.. I guess the worst part is that so few parts you already have will work with Gen III motor and that equals cash.

The ponitac motor would be cool and would get second looks from people since it is relatively rare to see built up Pontiac motors since most people go the easy route with a SBC.

I've always wanted to know....... what in the hell does "uber" mean???? geek

**derekf** · 08-08-2005

It's german. I believe it roughly translates as "super" or "more than". Any German speakers want to correct me?

**formula** · 08-08-2005

uber=german for really or very, i believe.

i dont know how you guys can say it's ok to have an ls-motor because "it came from the factory in pontiacs" but it's not ok to have a gen 1 small block when my car, a ton of the later year second gens, and just about every third gen on the road (not counting the iron dukes!) rolled off the factory with one under the hood.

which sold better, 3rd gens or 4th gens? not a rhetorical question, i'm genuinely curious.

**yody** · 08-08-2005

ah, good to know, always wondered about that

**Steve1968LS2** · 08-08-2005

Originally Posted by yody

I've always wanted to know....... what in the hell does "uber" mean???? geek

German.. I thought it was for "super" .. like UberMan would be Superman..

I need to find a German now.. lol

**Todds69** · 08-08-2005

Uber is German for "great or "super"...my wife lived in Germany for 3 years...Air Force Brat..

**indyjps** · 08-08-2005

run a buick big block so everyone can say WTF. use what youve got and run it hard, when you blow it up then just build a better one.

**mlr1026** · 08-09-2005

I have a 69 bird that I'm dropping in a 385 sbc I had built (had the engine built for another project) I would have to say it all depends on what your car is ie: any value in restoring it or is it a plain jane firebird? When I bought my bird it had a 350 pont. engine out of a 78 actually the entire drivetrain and when I ran the # to check it out there really was nothing special so, I decided to build what I wanted not what everyone else wanted. If I were to listen to everyone else instead of myself I would have a typical suv monthly payment out of my a$$ no motorcycle, jeep wrangler or the pontiac. You are the one spending your hard earned money,countless hours working on it, bleeding for it. Also you can always change it later if you want. These projects are rarely ever truly finished.

**wantahertzdonut** · 08-09-2005

Originally Posted by indyjps

run a buick big block so everyone can say WTF. use what youve got and run it hard, when you blow it up then just build a better one.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who'd recommend a BBB!

**bobzdar** · 08-09-2005

I wouldn't run a Buick in a pro-touring app due to their oiling problems...

That being said, they are a great engine, very easy to make a lot of power with stock parts much like a Pontiac.

If you think it's going to be much more expensive to build a Pontiac, you really should do some more research. It only gets significantly more expensive if you're trying to make much more than 600hp at over 8000rpm. Up to that point it's not bad as you can still use the stock block and crank with relatively inexpensive forged rods and pistons. Over that and you have to start worrying about re-inforcing the block, expensive crank prep etc. What are your goals power-wise?

Also, I would not build a 4.21" (455) stroke pontiac for a road-race or high-rpm type application...There are a lot of reasons for that and I'd get into them if anyone is genuinely curious but due to the 400/428/455 all having the same bore, the bigger stroke doesn't make for the most powerful engine, especially considering the stock and common rod lengths available.

Anyway, how much power are you after?

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