Homeless Homeowner

[Code Red]

This is actually a friend of mine. Please share the video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OB4TSfDX3Xo

[John Wright]

Man, that stinks.

[cheapthrillz]

So the house was built on a pier.... nothing wrong with that. Many Many buildings are built on piers, but the fact that the soil has so much differential settlement is rediculous. The city administrator says that everything was built to code is a lie...... just because you build the house on piers, doesn't mean that you neglect the existing soil conditions and fill material. From the video though, it doesn't look like too bad of a fix....

[John Wright]

the fact that the soil has so much differential settlement is rediculous. The city administrator says that everything was built to code is a lie...... just because you build the house on piers, doesn't mean that you neglect the existing soil conditions and fill material.

I was thinking that same thing too....compaction must not have taken place as they filled....must have just dumped the fill dirt in...or they could have filled it with large chunks of concrete, and all sorts of debris before they started filling with dirt.....add in any underground water and there is a good chance you will end up with large sink holes like this guy has in his yard and under the sidewalks.

[cheapthrillz]

He needs to go after his insurance company.... they should really be the ones footing the bill.

[RMerritts]

I'd burn the place down, it's gotta be a crappy feeling paying for a place you can't even stay in.

[mc84_zz4]

Wow, what a mess.
I'd call the title company that handled the property sale and see what they may offer for tips, the home must have
been inspected prior to the sale, and should have noted if there were issues at that time.
If the city changed the area property drainage after that, it could be a partial source of the problem (?)
The mortgage company is essentially the owner of the house, they could be sympathetic to the problem, and may give some guidance, they also stand to lose some $.

What happens if the house would collapse and kill some people inside? then who is responsible?
The Builder? the engineer that signed off on the pier specifications? The pier and foundation specs should be documented somewhere, or the lot information should have a special footnote somewhere (?)
I hear that they said it was 'built to code at the time', what was the code? was it truly to specs?

Maybe the only option is to lawyer-up.

[TonyHuntimer]

I wonder which would be cheaper and less headache...getting a lawyer involved or jack up the house and move it to a new lot. Seems like a lost cause until some serious money goes into the pockets of a good lawyer.

If it were my house, and there were no homeowners association or laws against it, I'd turn the house into a huge ugly billboard. Might upset the neighbors, but maybe the city would help in some way to keep property values from dropping.

Good luck to your friends.

Tony Huntimer
RaceHome.com

[John Wright]

What happens if the house would collapse and kill some people inside? then who is responsible?
The Builder? the engineer that signed off on the pier specifications? The pier and foundation specs should be documented somewhere, or the lot information should have a special footnote somewhere (?)
I hear that they said it was 'built to code at the time', what was the code? was it truly to specs?

Thing is, the piers are doing their job...the house hasn't gone anywhere, the surrounding soil has. The house is still at a particular elevation while all of the surrounding soil has dropped several inches taking the pipes within the ground with it, as noted by the separation at the floor drain.

[cheapthrillz]

Thing is, the piers are doing their job...the house hasn't gone anywhere, the surrounding soil has. The house is still at a particular elevation while all of the surrounding soil has dropped several inches taking the pipes within the ground with it, as noted by the separation at the floor drain.

Yep..... the piers are doing what they are designed to do, and I doubt the house would collapse (ie. Mc84_ZZ4) since it should have been designed to be supported by and span from pier to pier. If the pier system was designed to be stand alone, then all he needs to do is fix the plumbing and keep trucking. If the pier system was desinged to work in correlation with the existing soil, then the builder is at fault (well, in SC atleast).

Andrew, in SC we have a contractor regulating agency called LLR (SC Dept. Labor, Licensing, & Regulation). Maybe where you are, you all have a similar agency that can help?


As I type all of this, I am sitting in a "brand new" public school wing that is having repairs done to the foundation. New wing was built on 10' of fill material that was installed improperly. We are supporting the building with 50 helical type piers. They do work. Another school I worked on a few years ago, the gymnasium was built on an old natural pond site and was supported by 150 auger cast piles.....

[John Wright]

If I was in the home owner's shoes....I'd be inclined to fix the plumbing to make it liveable again(I bet he could do most of the work himself with the advice from a plumber friend if needed), live there for a while and pay the mortgage down some and then put that house up for sale. He's going to take a bath in losses whichever way he goes.

[Uneek68]

jee that sucks, my father is a concrete contractor and is having a similar issue with a property he built a foundation with footings. So the property is sinking, its already sunk about 4", the problem? the soil were the property is sitting isnt stable there actually used to be a river there so its eventually going to sink more and more troughout time. had he known he wouldnt had bothered

[NJSPEEDER]

Code Red, would your buddy mind if I shared your buddy's situation with a few co-workers of mine? I work in mortgage servicing and I know that we have had to deal with cases of sink holes/foundation erosion before and I may be able to find someone in the office with a little insight as to handling such situations.

He's a real stand up guy to keep paying his bills for a house he can't even live in.

-tim

[Code Red]

Code Red, would your buddy mind if I shared your buddy's situation with a few co-workers of mine? I work in mortgage servicing and I know that we have had to deal with cases of sink holes/foundation erosion before and I may be able to find someone in the office with a little insight as to handling such situations.

He's a real stand up guy to keep paying his bills for a house he can't even live in.

-tim

I don't think he would mind he asked the vid be shared.

[FatfreeGTO]

Well I don't see why the house isn't livable other then the plumbing issue. That was never clearly stated other then its "pulling down the pipes" from the ceiling in the basement. First thing he should do is simply cut the stack and install an expansion fitting to alleviate the pulling pressure on the system. If the entire surrounding area of ground is going down at the same rate the lateral out to the street should still be usable I would think.

This is happening because the "water table" of the area is going down.

The downtown area of Milwaukee WI is completely built on a pier system because the city is built on a swamp. This is where I live. Back in the 90's there was a deep tunnel project that took place to help alleviate overflow of the sewage system during heavy rains which would get dumped (no pun intended) into Lake Michigan. One side effect of the deep tunnel is that the downtown area is drying out and the water table is lowering causing damage to the business foundations that are in the area. Basically the piers were drying out and then rotting. Somewhat similar issue as your friends house. The business's sued the owners of the tunnel but ultimately lost their case earlier this year I believe. I believe the water table has since risen to "pre tunnel" levels and basically fixed itself.

If the city did something to cause the water table in the area to change I would think they would be held liable. If the lagoon is simply drying out on its own due to nature I don't see how he has a case. If the previous owners could be proven to have known about the issue and not listed it on their property condition report at the time of the sale maybe they could be held liable. Call Mike Holmes see if he will do a show with them.

Or they could stop paying for the house all together. If they haven't lived in the house for 2.5 years now and have been living with what sounds like a family member they could have pocketed that $1500 a month and would have already saved $45k. Do that for another couple years until their credit is back to normal and they could of had $100k in cash for a down payment on another house.

The whole situation sucks that's for sure.

Maybe the place will continue to sink fast and the electric meter pedestal will pull off the side of the house causing a "short" and the house will start on fire......

[paul67]

Yep it's not the house it the services that are moving ,he needs to dig the services,and put flexi pipes in, to allow the ground to drop around it and allow the services to move with the ground,if its only moved that much its not a lot,we have problems over here now as the big building companies started building timber frame houses over 4 stories but put nothing in to allow for shrinkage,and they now have major problems with the services cracking and leaking into lower floor including sewage yuk,

[Kenny]

It sounds like everyone was prepared for this kind of construction except for the guy that laid the sewage line and the guy that lives there. I think he needs the right person to put his mind at ease with a thorough explanation of why this is happening. He seems to have the idea in his mind that there are underground rivers cutting canyons under his house, and he's gonna wake up in a sinkhole. He needs someone to explain that the lowering moisture content, and probably a very high percentage of organic material that is decomposing is the culprit, and was expected hence the piers. He has paid for this house while feeling it is unlivable and that he has been duped, so that would lead me to the conclusion that he is not out to get something for nothing. My advice would be fix the plumbing, get the HVAC back on to control the moisture before he has to do a giant black mold abatement job, and move back home.

One piece of advice that I can give from experience: Don't let the wife feed your neurosis until you have talked to some pros. This advice may or may not be applicable here, just sayin'...............

[Poopy]

What a load of crap. Whoever signed off on the foundation inspection should be on the hook. That would never fly here. "Footing shall rest on undisturbed soil" BC Building code. ;)

[fordsbyjay]

Some home builders and city officials should be shot. My connection is to slow to watch the video but based on the comments I have seen this before. When I was a kid I worked at a temp agency for awhile. One day I had to go to a job site where they built all these new homes on an old swamp. It had been a swamp forever so I don't understand how the city could even sign off on it. Anyways, they were digging holes around the foundation two feet deep, inserting 18" piles, welding them in and pressing them into the ground. They kept doing this till they would hit something hard I guess. And at 5' around the perimeter. My job was to haul 5 gallon buckets of mud out of the basements so needless to say I was not there long.