Young Person Rant

[TexasT]

As a guy who was young and was used to being the youngest at the gathering and Now having gone to being One of the old guys who brings his son who is as old as i was when I was the young guy, it doesnt get cheaper or easier as You go along. Marriage, children, day job, house repairs, goofing with uncooperative neighbors, youth sports, broken bones, other unforseen circumstances. You just have to make due with what You have and keep moving forward.



Keep what ever You choose operational. Nothing killz the buzz more than a busted non running Project. Even if You just take it out once a week or once a month for an ice cream run it keeps You interested.

Keep moving forward. The interwebz provides how to for just about every thing. If nothing else learn and do something new you've never done before. And keep moving forward. Nobody knew it all when they started.

[T_Raven]

I mentioned a couple of my projects in my last post but I'll share what I've done to keep others cheap.

Trucks can be built cheap

54 GMC

Making it awd with a turbo 5.3 with IRS.

$450 for the truck from a junk yard
$0 chassis and t case. Bought a 94 Bravada, parted it out and got my money back, free chassis and t case.
$180 3.08:1 T-bird 8.8 IRS from a self serve wrecking yard
$160 3.08:1 s10 front diff
$300 5.3 long block with intake. I have accessories left over from another project.
$150 starter, flexplate, coils
$100 engine harness
$30 pcm
$140 4L80e from self serve yard
$130 windshield/windows from junk yards
$575 custom shaft to use the tcase behind the 4L80e

So I've got $2200 in it. I still need wheels and tires, paint, turbo parts, any suspension upgrades, etc. But it's cheap so far.

To make it even cheaper, by the time I was done looking for parts I had 3 of these trucks. I put one together and sold it as a rat rod at a $1600 profit. I have all the major parts to put the 3rd one together and sell at a profit. Once it's sold I'll have all my money back plus some profit to spend on the parts I still need.



67 GMC

I bought it for $1200, sold the engine for $250, pieced together a 6.0/4l80e cheap rather than buying a pull out. I Bought a 5 lug, trailing arm chassis that already had drop spindles, air bags on the front, and a notch kit in the rear. I bought bags for the rear and new drop shocks all around. Shortened the frame and bed, put it all together. Modified left over ceramic coated headers and fuel system parts from other projects to get it running and drivable.

I've got $3100 in the whole truck so far. It's not super nice yet, but it's drivable and it's cheap so far considering what is there.



68 Mustang

$800 for the car
$350 for a Lincoln mark VIII with good 5.0 HO and trans
-$400 for the Mustang wheels
-$400 for the 289 from the Mustang
-$350 parting out the Lincoln

=Free so far, kept the engine, trans, axle, and wheels/tires from the Lincoln. Nothing special so far but it's free and could be drivable for little money.



79 10th anniv. TA

Paid $1300 for the car with a seized 403, interior totally destroyed, missing seats. I ended up with 3 more as parts cars. Kept the Olds 455 and headers that came with one of the parts cars. Kept a dash, set of seats, and a set of snowflake wheels. Put the 455 together and installed it. Parted out 2 parts cars, and sold one as a project.

I now have a total of $1000 into the car. I have $300 less into the car but now I've got a good engine, headers, a better dash, seats, various extra miscellaneous parts, and I can still sell the anniversary wheels for a few hundred bucks. I have a spare sub frame and axle, and other misc stuff that could all be sold to bring my total down more.


89 GTA LS1, t56 swap

I have around $11,000 in the whole thing. Stock LS1, monster clutch, Tick master cylinder, stage 2 trans rebuild kit from Tick, used Konis and Eibach springs, take off C6 wheels with new tires. I got a good deal on a donor and used as much as I could then parted out the rest so that helped keep the cost down. It's not super cheap but it's a fairly low total for a LS1 swapped 3rd gen with the mods it has. It would be a little cheaper if I hadn't put some money into the original engine, and I probably paid too much for the car in the first place.

[ixfn]

A good read, and a lot of different insights. I used to feel discouraged at times as well, until I gained enough perspective to not kid myself about actual needs, and how they relate to the outcome of the build. Actual needs meaning the parts needed to get the rubber on the road, not just the desire for the hottest, flashiest, most expensive parts trending in the market today. I'm tired of chasing perfection, I just want to enjoy my car. Good advice from a variety of perspectives.

[06RangerSTX]

I agree with everyone's assessment on this topic especially the trying to keep the dream alive. The thoughts seems to roughly be all along the same lines; from choosing a less popular platform to taking a project and planning slowly. I honestly am proud to be a part of this site and being able to listen to others is a valuable thing. But my story I am feeling will not work out so well with these thoughts. While I do have a good job; I need to think about the future of my family and what could be realistic as a dream. I feel like I am a bit skeptical when thinking that I will have another project one day. Unless some miracle happens in the near future; I will be saying goodbye to my car obsession.

[Onebad78ta]

Building a car with the best of all parts available is defiantly not for the guy who doesn't have the stomache to fork over the Benjamin's ,,,no matter the size of your wallet it hurts the same.

[Ghiaguy]

Another way is keep a look out for someone else blown up dream -- a project half done and given up on -- OR something a little less common --

I always get on Craigslist and type in race or drag just to see what pops up -- then hit other areas not to far off and do the same thing -- sometimes it's just parts sometimes it cars

I found my VW Karman Ghia about 6 hours from my house in Phoenix, BUT it was a complete SCCA E/M road race car that had been parked for 8 years for a couple grand -- -- wa-la instant race car that was already sorted out and just needed an engine -- I've made the car back into a street car and went way over the top with some of my mods (which I've done all myself so I could afford them), but I LOVE whooping up on V8's with my little 4 banger...

Just don't get hung up on all these Mega-Builds on here -- -- sure they're real nice, but stock brakes will work just fine for a quick parking lot run, old race tires will stick long after the race teams are done with them, Sway bars are ten times more important than new springs ;;;;;;

"It's what I've built, not what I've bought"

Lookie at this I just found -- -- http://inlandempire.craigslist.org/pts/5125352736.html

[T_Raven]

I think the biggest thing to keep in mind is that if you are trying to make an old muscle car more like a modern muscle car, you can't expect to do that for $10,000 when those new cars are $40k+.


I'm a bit of a craigslist addict. I have an app on my phone with probably 30 saved searches. I'm on searchtempest almost daily just looking at what's for sale in other areas.

I'm over seas again, but in the 2 years I was home from 3/13-2/15, I bought 21 cars. I parted out and scrapped 6 of those at a profit or at least got my money back and had free parts. I sold a few others at a profit, and the ones I've kept are fairly cheap projects considering what they are and what I have invested in them.

Not everyone has the time and space for that but my point is there are always deals. People ask me all the time how I found certain things. I looked lol. I've missed way more killer deals I didn't see quick enough too.

My area is not very populated and there's not a huge car scene. It seems like places with more people and a more active craigslist section have more and better deals. You just have to be quick. Though sometimes even a good deal will be on there for months because the right buyer hasn't come along yet. I lived in Cali briefly a few years ago. I bought the 00 TA that donated it's engine and trans to my 89 for $2800 delivered. The engine and trans alone were worth more. He could've got twice that but he was deploying and needed it gone. I also bought about $3000 worth of almost brand new welding equipment in Orange County for $1300. Some old guy had recently bought all new machines but then had a pace maker put in and couldn't use them.

I've bought a lot of used performance parts on forums and ebay. The Fikses on my Firebird cost the last guy $6000 for the wheels and tires. He had them on his car for Sema and sold them to me for $3000 with about 1000 miles on them.

Any work you can do, or parts you can build yourself saves a ton. Rather than spend $6000 for a sub frame, I spent $1000 for a C5 front suspension, a couple hundred for tubing, and $80 for a quick ratio steering rack out of a Mustang. I'm confident in my fabrication abilities and know enough about geometry that I'm sure with some planning, studying, a lot of cussing, and some wasted tubing, I'll build a good suspension lol.

I've done a fair amount of body work but haven't painted a car yet. I plan to soon. You can buy a lot of practice for what a good paint job costs lol.

Not everyone has the equipment, time, and know how to do their own fabrication, rust repair, body work and paint, but anything that can be done is a huge factor in keeping a car cheap.

Now if I can just focus on one for a change and quit dragging new stuff home, maybe I'll get one done and have a nice pro-touring car rather than a bunch of projects.

[LIL' JT hauler]

The only way for anyone to get into classic cars for cheap is to take parts from other cars, and also to not dream too big. I don't autocross or road race my truck, but in the same breath there are no tracks or even good smooth roads. My truck just goes to shows and maybe a cruise here or there. Even if I did autocross it though it would still have stock dodge Dakota suspension. You shouldn't be there to set records because there will always be someone there who will have overspent to have state of the art suspension and drive train, just go and have a good time because you have nothing to prove to anybody.

[Aficionado]

It sounds like you've really chosen to take stock and focus on what's most important. Often hard, but it's always best to put your family and long term financial stability first.

With that said, that doesn't mean you have to give up the dream; you can always keep it as a long term goal while you focus on getting your house in order so it can happen. Many of us were in a similar position at one point; being broke and having to sell your dream car, only to spend years working back up to actually being able to afford it, is a story a lot of us could tell, but usually don't. It took me ten years; it could take you more or less depending on your circumstances and, frankly, how bad you want it. But let me encourage you that doing the right, but hard, thing now doesn't mean you can't have fun later: it means that when you do have fun, you don't regret it.

Well done.

[srh3trinity]

I am similar to Traven, I scour craigslist, PT and Lat-g and LS1tech for deals. I don't get in any hurry. I have owned my car for years and knew when I started that I wouldn't be able to build it for awhile. When I couldn't afford to do anything big, I would buy engine parts or something that I would need eventually. The other day I found a guy that had a ZL1 supercharger, two sets of LS3 heads, an LS3 intake and a junked LS2 mock up block. He was trying to sell them off individually, but I bought the lot. Some of these parts I will keep for a future project and others I will pass on to the next guy. Two days later, I scored another LS2 block that a guy had pulled to go with an aftermarket block. I am looking at doing a truck next. For some reason, in my mind they are simpler (even though they really aren't) and they don't have to look like a show car. A truck with a little patina is actually pretty cool and paint/body are huge budget killers. Most full size trucks came with V8's and the aftermarket supports the truck world and has for a long time. Also, I can build it up over time. If I want to do dropped spindles and cheap big brakes for now, I can pretty cheaply. Down the road, I can scrounge up some money and go with Porterbuilt, No Limit, Roadster Shop, Speedtech, ridetech, etc because they are all flooding the market with C10 stuff right now.

[T_Raven]

^^^Yeah trucks can be cheap and fun.

I see people wanting a lot of money for complete 47-55 Chevys and GMCs that are in rough shape. I pieced all 3 of mine together cheap by not buying complete trucks.

My 67 has nice patina. I shortened the frame and bed and I'll just touch up the paint on the seams and leave the rest alone.

Having a sporty little old classic truck that you don't care about scratching is a lot of fun. I should've built one years ago.

[T_Raven]

I've gotten a lot of good deals on cars and trucks that were 2-4 hours away out in the middle of no where. It's inconvenient for people to go look at them but the prices were so low I just loaded up the trailer, grabbed cash and hit the road. I can think of 4 I probably could've just relisted and sold at a profit just by bringing them back to a more populated area.


Considering it took me 4 hrs to drive 30 miles across LA to buy a welder, I no longer mind driving 4 hrs to Montana to buy a car lol.

[Ishmael]

I'm 40. I've been working on the car on and off for 12 years. I've owned it since I was 15. Some have money. Some have skills. Apparently I have time and some patience. What do you have?

[yellow1098Greg]

Great read of this thread even though it's been up for awhile....Iv been slowly working on my TA for years as well... I wish I was little better at finding those used parts on craigslist and forums.....I can't never find anything and I'm down here in Orlando....always think I'm doing something wrong

[Decline]

Good advice here
I agree with alot of the above comments about older vettes. C5s can be had for under $10g and the performance per dollar is nuts. This past weekend at fontana Hotchkis autoX they were some of the fastest cars out there against some serious PT muscle.
Ive seen C4 and C3 for $5gs but those are going to require some upgrades to drive nice but you will have the classic style.

http://losangeles.craigslist.org/sfv...228461408.html
http://losangeles.craigslist.org/sfv...195822833.html

Getting the Car and the parts is only half the equation tho. My car was down for prbly 8-9 months total this year while i was getting everything installed/sorted out. Projects take years really and are an evolution

[nekkidhillbilly]

ive had the same 66 skylark since i was 21 years old and its been on blocks since i was 23. i do buy alot of used stuff.

[nekkidhillbilly]

the best way ive found to be cheap though is buy a 4 door car and buy something from 73 up might not look as cool as that 66 2 door hardtop but it cost nothing and you already have better suspension and rear end.

[MonzaRacer]

As I have stated before, I started building up my projects, maintaining my cars and actually driving a few, repairing along the way. My dad had a 1/4" skill drill, harbor freight tap set, some of his old wrenches and stuff, my school issued ool box and what I pick up used, borrow or buy new along the way.
first car was my 66 Dart GT, fixed turn sig switch with used parts, swapped fragged rear and rebuilt brakes with dads help, treaded for some hop up stuff on the slant six, found it had rust and dad had me get ride of it. Got a 69 Pontiac Executive, green on green on green. Lucky me it was dark green. Ended up with old superior fake basket wire wheels, Grand Am white letter tires, rebuilt another 400 for it, aded a dual gate 2 shifter and some power buckets from ex room mates GP, while driving this one found 66 Galaxie 500 289 2bbl 3 spd on tree, found t10 4 speed and shifter, added new clutch, it was bad one, had to replace second time. Put on some air shocks, got brakes going, got running with used,cheap, take off parts. Drove till found frame had rust, pulled engine, traded for some paint work, sold 4 spd, parked body thinking might find frame or pro street it. wound getting crushed out of buddies field by accident, Also picked up 69 Ventura, stripped Executive to rebuild Ventura, still have it. Picked up couple of 75-75 Buick Skyhawks, built a cheap 327 forged piston engine, went drag racing on $400 car (total build), pulled with 61 longbed unibody F100/ 292/granny 4speed, wound up selling and getting a suzuki bike for truck money, made Buick daily driver, then came across 70 Monte Carlo, no rust, no engine, trans, beige. Swapped 327 into Monte after trans went out, bought the stock MC trans back, also scrounged several ralleys. Bought some rings and centers used. Dropped valve in 327, installed borrowed used 350, bought a 12 bolt from 64-67 a body 3.55 limited slip. Wound up finding shop selling new Kelsey Hayes 8' Vette ralleys. Bought 2 with new Hoosier radial GTs.
also in there was 2 short bed Ranger pickups, one bought 350/pg other rebuilt from first one I wrecked.
ALSO wrecked second Ranger(hit semi trailer).
In 94 from ranger wreck I got broken hip,collar bone, as I healed I built a fresh 402 bbc for Monte, 7 weeks out from broken hip doc let me start walking on leg and in 3 weeks had it running, 2 weeks after got bbc on road trans goes out, swapped in used th400.
NONE of these vcars from 1984 through 1994 EVER had mre than maybe $1500 spent on them