My 66 Chevelle P/T build

[andrewb70]

Thanks, Andrew. Do you know about cost? From the pics, it appears to have a standard Chevy bolt pattern. I already have a bellhousing, old school, that I know is parallel and has been dead on with two different engines. Haven't tried it on an LS yet. I had to sell my '10 Camaro motor to cover some hospital expenses before I had a chance to check it. Who makes the best bracket for an F-body clutch master?

Ric,

Mike can probably address the cost issue better than I, since he just bought one, but it appears that the trans is about $4K.

As for the MC, I personally would not run a F-body MC. They have a relatively short throw and various brackets that are available don't give the proper geometry.

I used a MC mount from Keisler, which is very well designed. Since Keisler is no longer, I suspect that Silver Sport offers the same bracket. The bracket uses a Wilwood "grilling" style MC that has 1.4" of travel, which offers a lot of adjustment.

The rest of the components you'll have to source yourself, depending on the clutch that you plan to use. My particular combination has been working well but is not for everyone. I use the Keisler MC mount with a .700 bore MC, Quarter Master TOB, repro 621 bellhousing, Richmond 6 speed, all mounted to a LS engine with a LS1 clutch.

As you can tell, I like picking my own components and don't generally go for the "kit" approach.

Mike, sorry for hijacking your build thread.



Ric, we can take this offline if you like.

Andrew

[MMcMasters]

Ric,

Mike can probably address the cost issue better than I, since he just bought one, but it appears that the trans is about $4K.

As for the MC, I personally would not run a F-body MC. They have a relatively short throw and various brackets that are available don't give the proper geometry.

I used a MC mount from Keisler, which is very well designed. Since Keisler is no longer, I suspect that Silver Sport offers the same bracket. The bracket uses a Wilwood "grilling" style MC that has 1.4" of travel, which offers a lot of adjustment.

The rest of the components you'll have to source yourself, depending on the clutch that you plan to use. My particular combination has been working well but is not for everyone. I use the Keisler MC mount with a .700 bore MC, Quarter Master TOB, repro 621 bellhousing, Richmond 6 speed, all mounted to a LS engine with a LS1 clutch.

As you can tell, I like picking my own components and don't generally go for the "kit" approach.

Mike, sorry for hijacking your build thread.

Ric, we can take this offline if you like.

Andrew

Not a problem at all Andrew, maybe I can learn something. Trans was just under $4000.. Ric, I ended up going with Bowler for my master bracket. I'm running a Willwood .700 bore master, a Tilton 6000 hyd T/O bearing and a stock LS7 clutch and flywheel. Here are all the part numbers for anyone that is interested.

RM6036 Quick Time bell housing
GM#12571611 Flywheel
GM#24255748 Pressure Plate/ Clutch
GM#12557583 Pilot Bushing
Tilton 6000 60-610 T/O bearing
Wilwood .700 bore "Grilling" Master Cylinder
Bowler master cylinder bracket


Mike

[64G-lark]

Looking really good Mike. I hope to do the mini tubs one day.

[andrewb70]

Not a problem at all Andrew, maybe I can learn something. Trans was just under $4000.. Ric, I ended up going with Bowler for my master bracket. I'm running a Willwood .700 bore master, a Tilton 6000 hyd T/O bearing and a stock LS7 clutch and flywheel. Here are all the part numbers for anyone that is interested.

RM6036 Quick Time bell housing
GM#12571611 Flywheel
GM#24255748 Pressure Plate/ Clutch
GM#12557583 Pilot Bushing
Tilton 6000 60-610 T/O bearing
Wilwood .700 bore "Grilling" Master Cylinder
Bowler master cylinder bracket


Mike

Mike,

That is very close to what I have. I like the new Tilton 6000 TOB.

Andrew

[MMcMasters]

I mocked up the engine (block) and transmission yesterday. The body went on and off the frame several times during this process. I firmly believe the Legend trans can be installed without any floor modifications, especially at stock ride height. With that being said and this being a pro touring post, I believe most of us here have lowered our cars quite a bit compared to factory.

Lowering our cars adds to a problem that we all deal with and thats drive line angles. My stock tunnel looked like swiss cheese from holes being drilled into it over the years for aftermarket shifters, cables and who knows what else. I decided to go ahead and cut the tunnel and allow myself that little extra room to raise the trans and optimize my working angles down the road.






Next I installed the stock steering linkage to check pan clearance. I really wanted to mock up with the new Moog stuff but my order didn't show up friday so I had to use the original stuff for now. It's my fault but I try to order parts as I think I need them and it bites me in the ass every now and then. I know the Moog ends are a little bulkier than the factory so I will see how much that changes things.

The AGR box is just under 3 turns lock to lock without the linkage connected. Once everything is bolted together, I have right at 1 3/4 turns from steering stop to steering stop. The inner tie rods are close but I still have clearance at the pan.



This is turned all the way to the left and up against the steering stop.



This is turned all the way to the right and up against the steering stop.



My concern is that the stock steering arm stops may not be giving me enough steering travel, we will see I guess. I'm still going to notch the pan as extra insurance.

The crossmember is just tacked together right now so I'm going to go out and finish weld that today. When my Moog order comes in I want to mock that stuff up and check fitment before blowing it all apart for powder coat.

Mike

[MMcMasters]

I meant to put what parts I used just in case someone reads this in the future and cares what I used:D

Dirty Dingo Sliders at the rear most setting
Energy engine mounts (short/wide)
Stock SBC frame stands
AutoKraft pan
Quick Time Rm6036 bell housing

Im not sure what headers I will be using yet. I have an idea of what will fit but thats never guaranteed.

Mike

[analyte]

Mike,
What angle is your tailshaft at in the pictures you showed? I beleive I was at 3.5 degs when I got everything back together.

Kerry

[MMcMasters]

Mike,
What angle is your tailshaft at in the pictures you showed? I beleive I was at 3.5 degs when I got everything back together.

Kerry

Kerry,

It was at 3* using a level frame rail as a zero but I checked it for a reference only. The measurements that matter are the working angles of both ends of the driveshaft but I can't check those until I have the car together and at ride height.

Mike

[rixtrix1]

Sorry, Mike, for hijacking your thread with Andrew. Thanks for your input, too. Hope everything continues to progress well for you. You've had a tremendous amount of work get done in such a quick timeframe.

[MMcMasters]

Sorry, Mike, for hijacking your thread with Andrew. Thanks for your input, too. Hope everything continues to progress well for you. You've had a tremendous amount of work get done in such a quick timeframe.

Ric,

I didn't think you hijacked anything man, I enjoy the conversation. Please jump in anytime!

Mike

[andrewb70]

Kerry,

It was at 3* using a level frame rail as a zero but I checked it for a reference only. The measurements that matter are the working angles of both ends of the driveshaft but I can't check those until I have the car together and at ride height.

Mike

Mike,

I think if you get the engine level with the frame, you'll be better off. This may not be possible, but if I was to do all this over again, that is what I would shoot for. The limiting factor might be the trans tunnel where the slip yoke comes out of the trans.

Andrew

[MMcMasters]

I have been pretty lazy about posting updates lately but work has been getting done. After mocking up the engine/trans I realized it would make my life much easier if I cut the tunnel and raised the transmission a few inches.

After that I made a pattern out of some construction paper and transferred it to some 16ga and formed my own redneck version of a trans hump.





I also called in the big gun (my 12 year old son) to help finish weld the crossmember mounts and trans mount pad. I'm a very proud dad and can't believe how talented he is at such a young age.





After this we blew everything apart and the frame is currently getting powder coated. The plan for this week is to finish seam sealing the floors and get the bottom of the car finished and painted.

I have everything for the chassis but I still need to decide what I'm going to use for a rear end. I'm strongly considering selling the 12 bolt and buying a new Moser housing with the big ford ends or maybe even a floater set up. I really don't like the idea of running C clips. I figured what it will cost to have the stock housing fixtured, tubes welded 360* and the ford ends installed and it's not much more to just start with a new housing.

Isn't that how it always is though, just a few more dollars....

[64G-lark]

Hey Mike looking good. Tell your son that's some great looking welding! Nice to keep them involved in the projects. My oldest is a better welder than me.

[analyte]

Wow, your son has impressive skills!!

Mind if I borrow him for a few days?? _

[MMcMasters]

He's all yours but I have to warn you that he will eat you out of house and home. I can't believe how much he eats for a little ****

[Motown 454]

He did a nice job!

[rixtrix1]

I meant to put what parts I used just in case someone reads this in the future and cares what I used:D

Dirty Dingo Sliders at the rear most setting
Energy engine mounts (short/wide)
Stock SBC frame stands
AutoKraft pan
Quick Time Rm6036 bell housing

Im not sure what headers I will be using yet. I have an idea of what will fit but thats never guaranteed.

Mike

With the mounts that far back, how much firewall clearance do you have, especially since you don't have any heads on the block. That seems to be the biggest problem I've encountered with LS swaps. A friend put an LS! in his '70 Chevelle using SB stands and DD sliders. The heads were very tight, but a stock Camaro pan cleared the Xmember by about a 1/4" .

[rixtrix1]

"Isn't that how it always is though, just a few more dollars...."

Don''t you know it, ha?!

[Yelcamino]

Isn't that how it always is though, just a few more dollars....

Lol! That and the good old.. as long I'm in here I may as well fix this too so I don't have to come back to it later!

[MMcMasters]

Ric,

I didn't take any pics with the heads on but I did test fit a set from my buddy. I have 1" from the back of the head to the firewall.

Mike