too far gone

[est1981]

so i was watching Wrecks to Riches and they were passing up some rusty cars due to time restrictions, but is there a point were a car is just too trashed/rusted. i see a lot of vehicals in yards and i figure that if i waved enough, but not too much, cash that i could have it. would it be worth it thought? what should i look for and what should should i avoid?

[redfire69]

I would avoid cars w/out titles and cars too far gone that your investment in time + money is greater than your patience or funding to buy a better car to start with...

[sunkistcamaro]

Anything is possible, its just a matter of how much time and $$ you are willing to put in. Personally, I would avoid anything with frame damage because I have never replaced them before. But, someone else would take that car and back half it.
Do you plan on doing any of the work yourself? What are you willing to do?
2x on no titles

[James OLC]

I know that it is an over simplification but... the cheaper your starting point, the higher the bill is going to be in the end. This is especially true if you start looking at the really cheap stuff. Resist the temptation and (IMHO) buy the most complete, economical starting point that you can find within your budget. You will be much happier in the end.

[tmadden]

Looking at Mikes Custom Cars website and their project builds there is never a car too far gone. They bring cars back from the dead. Although I would have to think it would be cheaper to buy a new body than repair every bit of framing and sheet metal on a old body.

[willieboy240]

wreckes to riches show put false hope into non car guys and beginners. they tell you only how much they have in parts but not labor. it looks like that's the total on the rev limiter. so if it was in the real world. he would be loosing his A$$. JMO.

[1badchevelle]

Also a thing to consider is how rare is the car?

[est1981]

this is all good stuff!! thanks! obviously i am a real beginner but i plan on doing as much work myself as possible. i got some welding skills, mostly farm equipment but nothing too heavy duty

[Yoda4561]

There is a point, where even when unlimited money is factored in that it's not worth fixing. That's pretty rare though, but it's when sheetmetal, frame, engine, transmission, interior, etc are so far gone/missing they need to be replaced. Even if you try, by the time it's done there's nothing left of the original car but a hood ornament. That's not fixing up an old car, that's building a new one with some donor parts from the original.

[NOPANTS-68]

I know that it is an over simplification but... the cheaper your starting point, the higher the bill is going to be in the end. This is especially true if you start looking at the really cheap stuff. Resist the temptation and (IMHO) buy the most complete, economical starting point that you can find within your budget. You will be much happier in the end.

god this is so true. I'm weedking through this mistake right now.

[NOPANTS-68]

2x post! oops

[vintageracer]

I would avoid cars w/out titles and cars too far gone that your investment in time + money is greater than your patience or funding to buy a better car to start with...

You just eliminated 90+% of the project cars out there for sale right now.

Buy a great car done. It's a WHOLE lot cheaper!

[LateNight72]

Buy a great car done. It's a WHOLE lot cheaper!

Except for a large portion of garage restorers, that's simply not an option to drop the large chunk of finances at one sitting. However, even though they may spend more in the long run, being able to pay-as-you-go is a better option for a lot of folks.

[est1981]

i am more inclined to pay as i go and i really dont have a time limit and if the car is a heap that i could pick up for real cheap than i really wouldnt be at too much of a lose right?

[The Stickman]

I know that it is an over simplification but... the cheaper your starting point, the higher the bill is going to be in the end. This is especially true if you start looking at the really cheap stuff. Resist the temptation and (IMHO) buy the most complete, economical starting point that you can find within your budget. You will be much happier in the end.

Alot of that depends on the car you choose as well. It you want a more desireable car then it yea. But if it is a more offbeat car then finding a good cheap car to build up is easy. My car was a complete pretty rust free runner for only $1500

[vintageracer]

Except for a large portion of garage restorers, that's simply not an option to drop the large chunk of finances at one sitting. However, even though they may spend more in the long run, being able to pay-as-you-go is a better option for a lot of folks.

If that's the case for a lot of budget builders I suggest not buying a car at all!

Step back and start saving $500-$1000 a month and continue golfing, drinking, skirt chasing, porno watching or any family activities that you like to do with your spare time all the while saving that extra $500-$1000 a month. After 12 months of saving all of a sudden you have an EXTRA $6000-$12000 to spend on buying a GOOD car.

You will be much happier and I can guarranty you that the wife and family will be MUCH happier! You will not hear all the grief about that POS car sitting in the garage or shop on which you are trying to lavish what little extra time, money and attention you have at the expense of your family. Happy Mama means Happy House!

If you cannot afford to save an extra $500/month the last thing you need is a junk PT car sitting in your garage anyway since you do have any extra money to spend on it anyway! Labor and dreams are great but that will not pay for parts!

The above is a tough, cruel and harsh but is reality for a lot of car enthusiasts. These old cars sure do come apart REALLY EASY. Putting them back together is a REAL PROBLEM!

Why do you think there are SO MANY half finished car projects for sale ALL the time????

[James OLC]

Alot of that depends on the car you choose as well. It you want a more desireable car then it yea. But if it is a more offbeat car then finding a good cheap car to build up is easy. My car was a complete pretty rust free runner for only $1500

To be honest I don't that there is a difference at all in the concept - just a matter of scale; in fact, an offbeat car in particularly poor shape could be more of an issue regardless of what you pay.

No matter what, it comes down to your particular strengths and weaknesses. If you are a metal forming son-of-gun and are gifted with a welder you probably don't care about the condition of the sheet metal but can easily find yourself chasing down impossible to find small parts which have a way to eat up your budget before you even know that you are missing more. Conversly, if you are not blessed with knowing which hand to hold the hammer in and which one holds the dolly, you can spend more in your first two weeks in the body shop than you spent on your last two cars combined.

You can also fall in to the trap of spending money on stuff that means nothing to you. For example - I have a number matching '67 RS with a bunch of options sitting in the garage now that I am dragging my feet on because of the numbers deal. The numbers mean nothing to me but I paid for them and to someone they do matter. In hind site I would have much rather paid the same money for a roller with a better body or a six banger.

Know what your budget is today
Know what your budget is for "the future"
Acknowledge your strengths and weaknesses
Make a plan
Buy the best car that satisfies all those considerations.

[Jim Nilsen]

If that's the case for a lot of budget builders I suggest not buying a car at all!

Step back and start saving $500-$1000 a month and continue golfing, drinking, skirt chasing, porno watching or any family activities that you like to do with your spare time all the while saving that extra $500-$1000 a month. After 12 months of saving all of a sudden you have an EXTRA $6000-$12000 to spend on buying a GOOD car.

You will be much happier and I can guarranty you that the wife and family will be MUCH happier! You will not hear all the grief about that POS car sitting in the garage or shop on which you are trying to lavish what little extra time, money and attention you have at the expense of your family. Happy Mama means Happy House!

If you cannot afford to save an extra $500/month the last thing you need is a junk PT car sitting in your garage anyway since you do have any extra money to spend on it anyway! Labor and dreams are great but that will not pay for parts!

The above is a tough, cruel and harsh but is reality for a lot of car enthusiasts. These old cars sure do come apart REALLY EASY. Putting them back together is a REAL PROBLEM!

Why do you think there are SO MANY half finished car projects for sale ALL the time????

So much truth to that !!!!

The only thing that makes it tolerable to do a long term car is having the garage space and tools to build one that doesn't cost you as much as the car itself. Most people have a budget that will get them the car and it takes $$$$ for both so they only get a place to keep a car they can't afford to work on.

It can be done but it is rare for some.

[LateNight72]

If that's the case for a lot of budget builders I suggest not buying a car at all!

Step back and start saving $500-$1000 a month and continue golfing, drinking, skirt chasing, porno watching or any family activities that you like to do with your spare time all the while saving that extra $500-$1000 a month. After 12 months of saving all of a sudden you have an EXTRA $6000-$12000 to spend on buying a GOOD car.

You will be much happier and I can guarranty you that the wife and family will be MUCH happier! You will not hear all the grief about that POS car sitting in the garage or shop on which you are trying to lavish what little extra time, money and attention you have at the expense of your family. Happy Mama means Happy House!

If you cannot afford to save an extra $500/month the last thing you need is a junk PT car sitting in your garage anyway since you do have any extra money to spend on it anyway! Labor and dreams are great but that will not pay for parts!

The above is a tough, cruel and harsh but is reality for a lot of car enthusiasts. These old cars sure do come apart REALLY EASY. Putting them back together is a REAL PROBLEM!

Why do you think there are SO MANY half finished car projects for sale ALL the time????

In your first post, you mention to buy a "great done car", which is no where near $6,000 - 12,000 in realistic terms. A done car, is going to be well over double/triple that.

Now, what I think we're both trying to get out of this, buying a solid foundation car for a bit more money? Sure, I agree 100% with that. If you want a PT car or a cool cruiser, then spend the cash on a solid foundation. Based on your first post, I took it as going out and dropping $40K+ on a "done" car, not $10K on a solid car that you can work on.

[vintageracer]

In your first post, you mention to buy a "great done car", which is no where near $6,000 - 12,000 in realistic terms. A done car, is going to be well over double/triple that.

I said you will have an "Extra" $6000-$12000 to buy a better car. That automatically assumes you have some money saved to buy a car in the first place.

How much a "Done" car costs depends on an individual's wants, needs, desire and pocketbook. A good "Done" mid 80's PT'd Monte Carlo SS can certainly be bought for $12k-$15K max! Well at least all but the Prodigy Monte! Not so with a 1st Gen Camaro. Junk starter projects are still $3000-$5000 and we all know what they look like. Why start with one of those when $25,000 will buy a nice camaro. That $25K Camaro may not be a LS6 six speed with DSE suspension but it will still be a damn nice car. Those cars are only 2 years on my program. I'll bet most people on the "build it myself plan" spend more than 2 years of time building their car! Why not just save the money to avoid the heartache and accomplish the same goal in 2 years?

Right now I personally think that for every $1000 EXTRA you spend buying a "better" car in the beginning you are getting at least $2000+ worth of restoration work value in that more expensive car. The price of finished cars certainly has changed (dropped) but the price of labor, materials and parts continues their relentless climb upward. With the price of a finished car going down and the price of building a finished car going up the point where they meet in the "middle" should tell anyone that a done car is much cheaper and better expenditure of hard earned money right now than ANY project car you name. You work "hard for the money" (so says Donna Summer) to earn the money you spend on your car so why work hard again after you have spent your already hard earned money on parts and or labor on a project car that is not worth the sum of the parts and labor invested?

I understand that there is the pride of craftsmanship, personalization and all that. When it all comes down to it everybody I speak with at the events just wants to have fun with their car, enjoy the event and most important want to be with friends who have a common interest in cars. When it's all said and done you still have just as much "fun" with a $2000 car as the guy does with a $200,000 car! Maybe more so since your not worried about your car! The hobby is still all about the people. The cars just bring us together. Therefore in my mind the sooner you can get your car out to enjoy it no who matter built it or how you acquired it the better!