No road feel with quick ratio steering

[rohrt]

The other post got me thinking.

I had my original steering box rebuilt by Lee with the quick ratio gearing. I also added an AGR pump. The steering is effortless.

I have been in other cars where the steering has more effort when you start turning and wants to jump back to center if that makes sense. This gives a nice sporty feel. I thought I recall reading a while back that this feel comes from some kind of torsion rod in the steering box, or is it the byproduct of how much caster you have dialed in?

[silver69camaro]

Caster will have an influence on steering feel, as well as torsion bars. Larger torsion bars will stiffen the steering by reducing the spool valve's opening rate.

Reducing system flow will also increase effort. Contact Lee to see what flow he recommends, then get a good quality pump with linear output (which excludes every OEM pump). KRC allows you to adjust flow to your liking and will greatly enhance steering feel by it's uniform flow. This makes a big difference that most people don't realize.

Another issue of feedback is system design. Drag-link type steering setups by design offer poor feedback due to lack of stiffness and stiction. Rack and pinions are much stiffer, thereby allowing more feedback to be transferred to the driver. Better yet, high-end racks are virtually friction-free. You can get some good feedback from a draglink system, but don't expect it to feel like a BMW.

[rohrt]

My point of refrence is how the late 80 Monte SS cars feel. That is what I was hoping to get. I think Lee put in the same quick ratio they have (12.5:1 I think) but it doesn't have the feel. Sounds like it could be the torsion bar.

[JRouche]

Gobs of positive caster works great with power steering. It gives you some more road feel back if the steering is too by loading up the steering force. And you get a side benny of a lil more camber gain if you are lacking in that area. If I had power steering I would adjust in as much positive caster that you could. On a manual steer car too much caster can make it a difficult car to drive. With power steering you will get a firm steering feel at speed and self centering that might be lost with a over powered booster. Then in the parking lots its as light as a feather. Im wishing I had put a power rack in my car. Hmmmm, not too late JR

[mrn2obelvedere]

The torsion bar has little to do with the feedback at the wheel.

Adjust your alignment for more caster if you can, this will give the steering a natural tendency to return to neutral.

[John Wright]

http://www.krcpower.com/flowvalves.html


I'm thinking you will want a pump that has some adjustment in the flow....KRC dirt track pumps have these valves available to help you get the feel that you are looking for...see link above

[nicks67camaro]

http://www.krcpower.com/flowvalves.html


I'm thinking you will want a pump that has some adjustment in the flow....KRC dirt track pumps have these valves available to help you get the feel that you are looking for...see link above

OOhh these look nice.

[mrn2obelvedere]

Out of curiousity wouldn't underdriving the pump by changing the pulley have a similar effect?

[Bow Tie 67]

http://www.krcpower.com/flowvalves.html


I'm thinking you will want a pump that has some adjustment in the flow....KRC dirt track pumps have these valves available to help you get the feel that you are looking for...see link above

I used a KRC pump on my car, and would highly recommend it. I used the smallest restrictor to give me , close to, the feel I was used to with a manual rack.

[rohrt]

The flow valve are cool.

I'm most likely not going to put any more money in the steering, Just wanted know why I don't have the same feel as my brother 70 sTrans AM or llike my old monte SS.

Sounds like its a combination of the torsion bar and flow valve

[John Wright]

The flow valve are cool.

I'm most likely not going to put any more money in the steering, Just wanted know why I don't have the same feel as my brother 70 sTrans AM or llike my old monte SS.

Sounds like its a combination of the torsion bar and flow valve

I'm wondering if you can swap out the valve from back of an IROC pump or something similar to give you about the same flow as those boxes felt a bit heavier/stiffer than my over boosted stock 70 had.

[rohrt]

If I get time I might just give the flow valve a try. I can tell you the one that came with tha AGR pump (right side) is huge compared to the factory one.

URL=http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2839340490055925676LpqkFd][/URL]

[dipren443]

If I get time I might just give the flow valve a try. I can tell you the one that came with tha AGR pump (right side) is huge compared to the factory one.

URL=http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2839340490055925676LpqkFd][/URL]

Call Lee. Tell him what pump you are running. The flow rate, etc... I bet you he will tell you exactly what flow valve you should run.

[John Wright]

If I get time I might just give the flow valve a try. I can tell you the one that came with tha AGR pump (right side) is huge compared to the factory one.

URL=http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2839340490055925676LpqkFd][/URL]

Hey, I bet that is your overboosting problem ;)

[silver69camaro]

If I get time I might just give the flow valve a try. I can tell you the one that came with tha AGR pump (right side) is huge compared to the factory one.

URL=http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2839340490055925676LpqkFd][/URL]

Are both of those valves off of a Type II pump? I've never seen a factory fitting with an oriface that big. AGR pumps are set to about 3GPM.

[JEFFTATE]

That's huge , I've never seen one that big either..
I think you have an overboost problem , hence no road feel....

[silver69camaro]

Does flow path neck down inside? If you try a KRC pump, you can reduce the flow to around 1GPM...

[rohrt]

I just called AGR and got some good info. My pump doesn't seem to be working anymore. Its pretty much a manual steering at an idle now. I'm past the warrenty so they quoted $75 if it needs rebuilt.

I talked to Larry at AGR about the pump and he basicly said that feed back is all about the torqu bar. The sizes range from 185 to 285. 210 to 215 being the recommended size for a street car.

Larry said using a flow valve to restrict flow can work but your starving the box to get the feel rather then using the proper torque arm. This would also mean that I would need to send back the steering box to get this done. The steering box would have to be completly rebuilt for this.

I just gave Lee a call too and they said they don't go by the torqu bar size as the material changes and the torqu ft-lbs change so I couldn't really get an answer on this.

They did seem to think that the piston was stuck in the pump to give the problems I'm having. They recomended removing the flow valve and moving the piston in and out first and make sure its not stuck.

[Red SS]

I had the same problem with a Lee pump. The piston was stuck in the bottom.I sent it back & they replaced it right away. Great customer service. I even got to speak with the boss himself. All the staff were VERY helpful & the setup (quick ratio) on my 64 Chevelle conv't works great!

[rohrt]

I had the same problem with a Lee pump. The piston was stuck in the bottom.I sent it back & they replaced it right away. Great customer service. I even got to speak with the boss himself. All the staff were VERY helpful & the setup (quick ratio) on my 64 Chevelle conv't works great!

Good to know. I hope to look at this before the weekend.