C5 brake upgrade ATS spindles 1969 Camaro

[mean buzzen half dozen]

Hey guys,
I would like to upgrade my brakes. I am thinking about getting the Baer 13 inch GT front brake system or the Kore3 13 inch brake system, which one would you guys prefer?

I am getting the ATS tall spindles.
Thanks for any input much appreciated.

[mean buzzen half dozen]

Bump.

[Quikbrd]

I am running the ATS spindle with the GT brakes, set up works great, no regrets!

[mean buzzen half dozen]

Thanks

Quikbrd,


I am debating a bit on 17 or 18" wheels. Mainly debating on using 325 MM (12.8") brake rotors or the 355 MM (14.0") rotors.

I would like to try autocross, but would like to run some 1/4 mile tracks.

Wondering if having a 14" rotor & 18" wheels will kill my 1/4 mile times?

Today I was working on this conversion:

[another69]

That's pretty nice- who makes it again?

I would suggest going with 18s because it opens up your brake options. I'm looking to get the ATS spindles in the future and will probably go with Kore3 because the Corvette parts are cheaper, proven, and easier to get parts for at a local store. I have wilwoods now and like them, but I would go Corvette if I did it again (I probably will)

[mean buzzen half dozen]

It is made by Speed Tech. Chicane coil over adaptors.
I was leaning towards 18's, don't want to go bigger than that though.
Probably use some factory used Corvette wheels & use hub centric adaptors. Just because they are usually cheaper than nice aftermarket 18's.
Kore3 seems like a decent deal as compared to going with Baer brakes.

Mark Savitske, http://scandc.com/new/node/56 had told me the factory Corvette rotors are really thin & tend to warp when they are used on other cars other than Corvettes.
I am thinking with 14 inch rotors I will probably never get them that hot to warp them, but who knows.

That's pretty nice- who makes it again?

I would suggest going with 18s because it opens up your brake options. I'm looking to get the ATS spindles in the future and will probably go with Kore3 because the Corvette parts are cheaper, proven, and easier to get parts for at a local store. I have wilwoods now and like them, but I would go Corvette if I did it again (I probably will)

[Apogee]

The C5/C6 front rotors are all 32mm [1.26"] thick, and not thin by any standard IMO. Maybe Mark has had different experiences with these rotors than we have, or maybe you misunderstood something he said, however we've found them to be incredibly resilient on just about any application, including very fast 4000+ pound applications with big HP.

"Warping" rotors is a whole 'nuther topic, one that we probably don't need to get into, however that's a very generic and misleading term that typically has very little basis in reality, yet is used to describe a host of brake related issues. If you'd like to learn more, there's a decent white paper by StopTech here.

As for rotor size, I would lean towards the 325mm [12.8"] base level C5/C6 kits since they should provide more than enough braking performance for street, strip and auto-x environments, and not carry the weight and inertia penalty of the larger rotors aimed more at the road course applications.

Tobin
KORE3

[mean buzzen half dozen]

As for rotor size, I would lean towards the 325mm [12.8"] base level C5/C6 kits since they should provide more than enough braking performance for street, strip and auto-x environments, and not carry the weight and inertia penalty of the larger rotors aimed more at the road course applications.

Tobin
KORE3

Tobin,

PM sent.

[79-TA]

Here's a fixed/updated version of Tobin's link:

http://stoptech.com/tech_info/wp_warped_brakedisk.shtml




The base C5 rotor should be fine. It has enough thermal mass and a decent air gap. The vanes are nothing special, just straight***** and non-directional. I don't know any details about the Baer friction ring for a relative comparison. The Baer rotor assembly is a 2 piece which gives you some float (a good thing), weight savings, and more cost.


You'll have to decide what you want to do for a caliper. The Baer is a nice solid opposed piston caliper that should be stiffer while having staggered bore sizes to reduce pad taper. Again, the features come at a cost. Radial and axial wheel clearance should always be a concern.

*****EDIT, C5 rotors are directional.

[Nicks67GTO]

I got my brakes finished up last winter. I went from 15" wheels and TRSD 11" 4 wheels discs + 11" stock style power booster, to Kore3 C6Z51 brakes/2002 Camaro rear 12" brakes, Hawk HPS pads + a 9" dual diaphragm booster, 1" master cylinder and 18's wheels with Nitto 555's. These brakes/tires will practically throw me through the windshield if applied hard enough. I haven't track tested them quite yet but I can tell you for certain they are more effective just in day to day driving. If the Baer brakes are better I don't know. I cant imagine they are that much better but I would be interested in hearing from those that have made the jump. My guess is that its negligible for 99% of the drivers out there.

[Apogee]

Here's a fixed/updated version of Tobin's link:

http://stoptech.com/tech_info/wp_warped_brakedisk.shtml


The base C5 rotor should be fine. It has enough thermal mass and a decent air gap. The vanes are nothing special, just straight and non-directional...

It looks like our links both go to the same place...are you sure there's an issue with my link, and if so, what is it?

As for the C5 rotors, they're actually directional vane castings, not straight vane. The C6 rotors are a hodge-podge of directional and pillar vane castings depending on the applications as follows with respect to front and rear rotors:

2005-2013 C5/C6 (JL9): Pillar/Pillar
2005-2013 C6 Z51 (J55): Directional/Directional - LH Only
2006-2013 C6 Z06 (J56): Directional (LH Only)/Pillar

[mean buzzen half dozen]

Thanks guys,

I plan on installing a hydra boost system also, hoping for the car to weigh at the most 3000 LBS.

[mean buzzen half dozen]

Was wondering for when I race a 1/4 mile track or 1/8, if I switch to skinny front runners, what size rim would I need to clear, lets say 14" rotors?

Do they make skinny wheels 3.5"- 4" wide rims to work with 14" rotors?

Thank you.

[Apogee]

Short answer, you can't clear any brakes with 14" rotors with anything less than a 18" wheel. That said, if your wheels are pushed out sufficiently far, then the brakes could effectively be inboard of the tires and wheels...it would probably require bolt-on spacers and a wheel with almost no backspacing. When you're talking about 3"-5" wide wheels with tiny tires, fitment to the body suddenly becomes much less of a concern.

Most of our customers leave their pro-touring front tires on the car at the strip and just swap over to wrinkle walls in the rear if that's their thing, it sure helps to have a little rubber left at the front of the car if/when you need to stop at the end of the strip.

[mean buzzen half dozen]

Thanks Tobin,

I don't have any rims handy, but the back spacing is maybe 1.5"?

It is not much at all.

[CapSS92]

I went from 13" C5 rotors/calipers to 14" rotors using Tobin's hybrid kit. I also run hydroboost with a 1" MC. With the 13" rotors the hydroboost was really grabby and would lock up the front brakes pretty quick. When I switched over to 14's it felt a lot better and not as grabby. I could actually stomp on the brakes without going through the windshield. Tobin could probably give a better explanation as to why it worked better with the bigger rotors but I like it. I use an 18" Boss 212 wheel and I had to grind the front top part of the ribs of the C5 caliper as it was rubbing. I recently bought a Boss 338 18" wheel to check fitment and I'm going to have to grind the back part of the ribs and some of the front edge of the caliper as it won't even move. So, bottom line, cool bragging rights with a 14" rotor but super tight fit. Hope this helps.

Alex

[mean buzzen half dozen]

You are using the stock spindles?

That is good to know. I would not like the brakes to be so sensitive you are scared to touch the pedal.

Was wondering is a larger master cyl would help from being too sensitive?

[79-TA]

It looks like our links both go to the same place...are you sure there's an issue with my link, and if so, what is it?

As for the C5 rotors, they're actually directional vane castings, not straight vane. The C6 rotors are a hodge-podge of directional and pillar vane castings depending on the applications as follows with respect to front and rear rotors:

2005-2013 C5/C6 (JL9): Pillar/Pillar
2005-2013 C6 Z51 (J55): Directional/Directional - LH Only
2006-2013 C6 Z06 (J56): Directional (LH Only)/Pillar

Using google chrome, your link would not work for me. StopTech updated their website earlier this year and few of the addresses remained exactly the same. Your link leads me here:

http://stoptech.com/technical-suppor...nd-other-myths

Does this address work for you?


Here is the address that I know to be current:

http://stoptech.com/tech_info/wp_warped_brakedisk.shtml



Yes, you're right about the C5 rotor castings. They are directional.

[CapSS92]

Yes I am using stock spindles. I was actually planning on changing to a 1-1/8" MC before they got better with the larger rotor. But since it felt good I left it with the 1" MC.

Alex

[Apogee]

You are using the stock spindles?

That is good to know. I would not like the brakes to be so sensitive you are scared to touch the pedal.

Was wondering is a larger master cyl would help from being too sensitive?

Most people run a 1.125" bore master cylinder with the Bosch hydroboost units for that exact reason, it provide better brake modulation and control. The only reasons I can think of for the improved feel moving from a smaller to larger rotor on CapSS92's application would be due to the increased rotational inertia of the larger rotor, and possibly something different between the pad/rotor bedding process.

Tobin
KORE3