Wheel width front to rear and Handling

[SkinsandJrfan]

Ok. I guess I misunderstood. I was assuming that using the same width tired was making it square. I was thinking in terms of width. Example, running 275 fronts and 275 rears. But I guess having the staggered size wheels keeps it from being out of balance.

So with staggered sizes generally not the best for handling, would I be best served by going away from the 20" in the rear down to an 18"? How dumb would it be to have 20" wheels all the way around? The problem is, the car sets so low now that it drags going over speed bumps. I would be afraid to see what it would do with smaller wheels on the back. I guess I can make that up by going with a 40 or 45 as opposed to a 35 correct? That would give me a little bit more tire and help make up some of the difference. Hell, maybe Im so confused, Im confusing myself. ha ha. I just dont know if I could get a 275 under the front without it rubbing since Heidts says that 265 is the widest.

[Paul Huryk]

Ok. I guess I misunderstood. I was assuming that using the same width tired was making it square. I was thinking in terms of width. Example, running 275 fronts and 275 rears. But I guess having the staggered size wheels keeps it from being out of balance.

So with staggered sizes generally not the best for handling, would I be best served by going away from the 20" in the rear down to an 18"? How dumb would it be to have 20" wheels all the way around? The problem is, the car sets so low now that it drags going over speed bumps. I would be afraid to see what it would do with smaller wheels on the back. I guess I can make that up by going with a 40 or 45 as opposed to a 35 correct? That would give me a little bit more tire and help make up some of the difference. Hell, maybe Im so confused, Im confusing myself. ha ha. I just dont know if I could get a 275 under the front without it rubbing since Heidts says that 265 is the widest.

It's easy to get confused on this concept - keep in mind that there is always a sacrifice when it comes to wheels and tires - size, width, looks, sidewall height, traction... Can't have it all in one set of wheels - that is why we advocate having additional wheels (or sets) for certain purposes.

I'm not stating that you can't run a staggered setup, but keep the contact patches and sidewall very similar front to rear - especially on a nose heavy RWD car. You could run a 265-35-18 in front and a 285-35-18 in the rear (or a 285-30-18). That would be only 20mm in section width difference (and a slightly taller tire in the rear with a 285-35).

As an example, you could have your setup for the street (looks and comfort) and have another pair of wheels with drag radials for the 1/4 mile. Conversely you may have a set of wheels and tires specifically for the road/autocross course that are only used there. I'd hate to drive all the time on drag radials (some do), or run low tread wear RR tires on the street. A few minutes and a jack and you are ready to change purposes.

Every car has a max tire size that can fit and not be a rubbing problem - this would be the width and overall diameter at all 4 corners. Every car also has an optimal mix of sizes in front and rear that will give the best balance in the corners (1/4 mile is another story). Factors such as brake clearance and sidewall height also make a big difference in wheel and tire selection.

I'm a third gen guy, having grown up with 245-50-16 tires that came OEM on some of the cars - and effective setup for the mid 80's onward until larger wheels became available. Some owners upgraded in wheel diameter (17" to 20"), others went staggered in terms of both tire width and/or wheel size. Others used spacers and stuck just about anything in the wheel wells that would fit. But the best handling cars (on the track and street) were the ones with either a square setup (275 to 295 all around), or a slightly staggered max fit setup (possibly a 285/305). This is something that I took into deep consideration when I designed our wheels - stick as wide of a 17" tire in the front (and still not stick out) as possible - and use the same size in the rear. I picked 17" as the diameter due to the sidewall height - it's not too small to destroy wheels going over moderate road imperfections, but allows some additional stiffness over the 16" when using a 25.75" tall tire like most do.

[BuddyP]

So for someone that has a staggared width, say 245 and 315 or 245 and 335, what benefits does a sway bar or stiffer rear springs do as far as "loosening" the rear of the car up helping it oversteer more? Sorry now I'm switching into suspension talk...

Also see a lot of good drivers on here running staggard sizes and widths (ie. James one lap camaro with 18/19 combo) but then you have Carl running 275's all 4 corners. Both which are said to handle very well.

[GeoffP]

Brian I don't know if it would fit but you're welcome to try one of my wheels at DSE's event just to see if it will. It'll at least give you an idea what you can stuff under there!

[SkinsandJrfan]

Awesome Geoff. I would love to. We will have to figure out how to link up there. It will be hard to miss my car. Silver with red hockey stripes. And my name is on the door. I know, I know. Lol.

[GeoffP]

Yep we met at RTTH last year. If they number by last name we should be right next to each other again.

[SkinsandJrfan]

Yes I remember now. I remember that you loaned me your GoPro battery. I'm probably going to be coming with two batteries this time. Lol.

[Paul Huryk]

So for someone that has a staggared width, say 245 and 315 or 245 and 335, what benefits does a sway bar or stiffer rear springs do as far as "loosening" the rear of the car up helping it oversteer more? Sorry now I'm switching into suspension talk...

Also see a lot of good drivers on here running staggard sizes and widths (ie. James one lap camaro with 18/19 combo) but then you have Carl running 275's all 4 corners. Both which are said to handle very well.

Buddy, it's hard to not lump tires and suspension together as they are a team and cannot stand alone, so let's talk a bit about them both.

For the rear - a stiffer rear bar or stiffer rear springs reduces under steer; higher tire pressure can also reduce under steer - which is why a lot of racers vary tire pressure to tune.

You can be running different sizes and width, but it may take a lot more tuning to drive smoothly.