Gotta Do Homework Before Posting?

[zbugger]

It's "fify cent" you nerdy whiteboy ;)...

Who's white now? Written it's 50 Cent. Spoken, it's "Fitty Cent".



Derek, the reason it's recommended to look at all of the info you can is so that you will know more about your setup. If you decide to change things up a little, you'll know where to go. The more you know, the better you will understand what you are doing to your car. It's not that giving specific info is a bad thing, but it turns the mind into mush. Just like TV, you are given everything. If you have to sift through a couple threads to get specific info, you are reading other stuff that can let you know when you've gone too far or not far enough. Also, giving specific information doesn't mean you're gonna like that particular setup. Maybe you will want the ride to be a little more stiff, maybe you'll want it to be softer. In the end, it's all personal preference and what makes you comfortable behind the wheel.

[Steve Chryssos]

Just preface the question in your post with "I already searched previous threads, but......."

Again, these are just guidelines.

[baz67]

Those guidlines were a long time comming. They address many of the issues that I have seen. I like that the search issue is first and in bold. Mkelky had a very valid point pertaining to the reading. It is not nessasary for most of the bolt-ons. However, if someone want to did deeper into how thier fancy new bolt-on part affect the suspension then it is required that they have a basic understand of the terms.

I for one will hold any venders feet to the fire if they show up with fluff and no tech to back up claims. Denny did a great job IMHO on the closed thread. It did get a little out of hand, but chalk that up to growing pains. Sales pitches belong in the Gen. Discussion forum.

I also visit CC because I like thier no BS attitude. I have one whole post over there. That is because there has not been anything that I could not find in a search. No, PT will not become like CC, but I like the new guidelines.

[chicane67]

To end all........ about 80% of any question can be answered by using the "search" function. Some times, the same questions get really old, really quick. I have even had to goto the "cut and paste" route to fill the majority and then add the rest in specifics.... which I dont mind answering tech stuff, but lazy is still lazy to me.

[dennis68]

A's rock...Yankees suck.

[CoryM]

I understand that most people are backyarders and do not deal with cars for a living and therefore don't have the same knowledge as others. Thats a fact of life. These people will be asking the same kind of questions that you asked when you were at their level so you have to expect basic questions as they learn. Answering the same question over and over again gets old, I realize that, but there is nothing saying you have to respond or even read it (unless you're a mod, then I suppose you have to read some of them ;) ). If they are too lazy to do a search, don't post a response. If you don't feel like posting a friendly, informative response why bother? It just seems a little odd that people who have the knowledge complain about simple questions when they aren't required to answer them. Its nice, and it is appreciated, but if you don't enjoy helping people don't help them. I am not hacking on anyone in specific but it seems like people forget they don't need to answer simple questions if they don't want to. I pick and choose what I help out on because I like to help people, but not enough to read every post.
On that note I understand its a fine line between being nice to the noobs, and keeping the board attractive to the more knowledgable people and I think you guys are doing a good job of that. The book list is also very good and I would recommend to anyone learning to get them. For their benefit though, not mine :lol .
Cheers.

[Mean 69]

Funny thing about suspension geometry. After some basic reading you will be able to walk up to any pro-touring car and--with a quick glance--pretty much know if it's done right or not. It's a cool feeling.

I couldn't agree more, and to many of us, it is more than just a hobby, it is an absolute, and complete obsession. I think that is part of the reason that folks get so animated when it gets to the nitty gritty, such as myself.

I have gotten used to the repeat questions, to be honest. I don't even open the thread, it is a lot of extra noise, but that part doesn't really bother me too much. I agree, the dudes who have repeat questions will usually get them answered by people willing to spend their time answering. No sweat. My peeve is when folks bring empty claims, or worse, flat out wrong claims. I guess I'll just keep my mouth (keyboard) shut if it happens again.

Mark

[parsonsj]

when folks bring empty claims, or worse, flat out wrong claims. I guess I'll just keep my mouth (keyboard) shut if it happens [again]

That's different then newbie repeated questions: empty or wrong claims need to be challenged immediately. Sending donkey-boy packing was the right thing to do.

Making a guy who asks if 265 tires will fit his Camaro feel small is what I was talking about.

jp

[baz67]

...265 tires will fit his Camaro...
jp

You mean you can?!Yes!!!

[Derek69SS]

As a newbie with very limited knowledge and experience, I'd like to shed some light on the repeat questions... I'm guilty of it too.

For example, Say I want to figure out what spring-rate/height I want in my car. I'm on a pretty tight budget, and I don't want to buy 5 sets of springs before I'm happy with it, and I definitely don't want to do the assembly/dissassembly 5 times either.

*note: these are all made-up just for the sake of an example* I search spring rates, and find 20 topics, 5 are GM A-bodys.

One about an Alum. headed BBC 65 wagon with a T-56 and the B-body spindles, 1-1/4" sway-bar and 18" wheels that will be running autocross 20 weekends/year. This topic, may be informative, but it applies to a car with a different weight, different wheels, different suspension, etc. I might be able to guess a little closer judging by this car, but definitely not the exact info I'm looking for.

How much will this help me with my SB/auto, stock spindle, '69 coupe on 15s which will see 98% street use?

While this is certainly different than "Will brakes from a '72 Nova fit my '69 Camaro", it is why the repeat questions come up. Most newbies with limited knowledge want to be told what is perfect for their application, not sort through several topics and figure out what might work based on what contradicting advice was given in 20 previous topics.

It's also very hard to figure out what's BS when your new. It all seems more "Gospel" when someone is personally taking their time to answer your specific question.

[Steve1968LS2]

That's different then newbie repeated questions: empty or wrong claims need to be challenged immediately. Sending donkey-boy packing was the right thing to do.

Making a guy who asks if 265 tires will fit his Camaro feel small is what I was talking about.

jp

You know how many times I get asked what lid is best on ls1tech.com???

It is just part of the "interweb experience"...

[nancejd]

I think we are on the right track here. Basically, if you don't want to answer a basic question in a polite and helpful way, just don't respond, it's easy to do nothing. We have a basic statement that says that people who know stuff, appreciate it when you make the effort to do a search, read what's there, and then ask your question. I think that's good advice for everyone, new or old to the board. Vendors should be held to a higher standard, and have some evidence of their claims. What more do we need?

[Steve Chryssos]

I couldn't agree more, and to many of us, it is more than just a hobby, it is an absolute, and complete obsession. I think that is part of the reason that folks get so animated when it gets to the nitty gritty, such as myself.

I have gotten used to the repeat questions, to be honest. I don't even open the thread, it is a lot of extra noise, but that part doesn't really bother me too much. I agree, the dudes who have repeat questions will usually get them answered by people willing to spend their time answering. No sweat. My peeve is when folks bring empty claims, or worse, flat out wrong claims. I guess I'll just keep my mouth (keyboard) shut if it happens again.
Mark

I sure hope that you speak up. Ask for a clarification and if it does not come, we should show him the door. Manufacturers need to be held to different standards than novice rodders.

Standard for Novice Rodders and Members In General
They need all the help we can provide. Weened on advertorials and the Learning Channel, their grey matter has been blackened by terms like bumpstick, slug and hoops. They are led to believe that bolt-on parts are commonplace. That they can build a car in 10 days or perform most mods in a 1/2 hour cause some guy did the install on Spike TV.
:rtfm: "Just open a can of Instant Mule, pour it in your gas tank, and you'll have your very own supercar." :rtfm: All that should be expected of novice members is that they practice a little forum etiquette. The rest is up to us.

Standard for Manufacturers and Vendors
Now a manufacturer or vendor on the other hand! It's expected that he knows what he's talking about. It's expected that he tested his product over and over again. And it's expected that he did more than just Rip-off and Duplicate (The other R&D). So I would hope that you will challenge claims. Since this is a club of functional cars, if any manufacturer can't corroborate functionality, we should show them the door. But do it quickly.

Better to flush the toilet, than to roll around in the poop.

[David Pozzi]

I think it's great start (posting suggestions) but keep it short and sweet. I'd put the "meat" at the top then further explanation at the bottom. Most guys with short attention span will probaby skip the bottom part.

[skeevay]

I think Cory has some good points..... I also agree with most of the above statements, but I think this line...

Always remember that more knowledgeable members are here to help you, not serve you. Don't test their patience.

could be edited to sound a little more friendly too. Especially the last part...."Don't test their patience" I thought I only had to walk on thin ice around my wife!

[baz67]

Cory you have a good point. One thing I would like to point out though. How many times has there been a simple and often previously answered question started by someone new. Obvously they did not search and it does not get answered Then this person comes back and sees it is not answered and is now pissed this simple question is not answered. They know it is simple because they vaguely mention its simplicity in the post and then posts "anyone" or "hello". I am not pointing at anyone, but it has happened. Now they are pissed and then they get the "have you searched" responses. All of that could have been avoided with a simple five minute search.

[CoryM]

Ya Baz, that does happen and the guidelines with a recommendation to search before posting *should* take care of that. If they are too lazy to read the guidelines, or search, then I dont feel sorry for them to get a "do a search" response. No need to be uncivil about it though, they will figure it out soon enough.
I like the guidelines, and the book list and most everything about this board. Just seems strange to me to complain about volunteer work

[zbugger]

Tom, cut and paste? How lazy of you......

Dennis, when you get to the majors and start rooting for the Giants, you can join our little club.

The search function is something that does seem new to folks for some reason. It is a very helpful tool, but you also have to know how to use it for some strange reason. For what it's worth, the repeating yourself is never gonna end. Just try getting a job in sales. That's the same thing over and over and over again. You just gotta figure out a new way to say it. Brian, I know exactly what you're talking about. When I first started posting, I waited a couple days for an answer. It's all about patience. Then again, I waited for the bathroom once. I'm not finishing that story.

[baz67]

Is it not just as strange to get mad because one did not get free advice? Just some food for thought.

[CoryM]

Sure is Baz. If someone gets pissy because they didnt get free help they deserve a good solid bonk on the head.