Brake line fitting sizes

[Vicinity]

Finishing up my brakes, the last thing to order is lines and fittings.

I'm using LS1 brakes, and I've measured stock to be 3/16" tubing and 7/16" screw/fittings.

I'm looking on Jegs and I can't find a simple 3/16 to 7/16 flare nut. Is there something special I need to look for? And what's this business about -3AN and -4AN, what's the measurement on that?

Should I go with those sizes, or larger or smaller?

[JRouche]

Finishing up my brakes, the last thing to order is lines and fittings.

I'm using LS1 brakes, and I've measured stock to be 3/16" tubing and 7/16" screw/fittings.

I'm looking on Jegs and I can't find a simple 3/16 to 7/16 flare nut. Is there something special I need to look for? And what's this business about -3AN and -4AN, what's the measurement on that?

Should I go with those sizes, or larger or smaller?

AN fittings are in sixteenths of an inch. So, -3AN is 3 sixteenths (3/16"), -4AN is four sixteenths (1/4"), -10AN is ten sixteenths (5/8").. Interchangeable with JIC fittings that use common measurements. But remember, they are 37* flares, not 45* like what is on brake lines. JR

[JRouche]

Oh yeah, I forgot to reply to the first question. The adapter you need. I dont get it. You need 3/16" male to 7/16" male?

7/16" thread is odd anywhere on a car. I personally have not seen it on brakes. But then again, I dont have ls1 brakes. Where did you get that number? Are you sure its not a metric thread???? Like 11mmx1.2 JR

[Vicinity]

Oh yeah, I forgot to reply to the first question. The adapter you need. I dont get it. You need 3/16" male to 7/16" male?

7/16" thread is odd anywhere on a car. I personally have not seen it on brakes. But then again, I dont have ls1 brakes. Where did you get that number? Are you sure its not a metric thread???? JR

I just measured it. I don't know how accurate it is. I'm saying the tube is actually 3/16" and the size of the screw, the part that threads into the caliper/master cylinder is either 3/8" or 7/16". Does that size even matter?

[MrQuick]

LS1 brakes use banjo fittings at the calipers but what master are you using?

The banjo fittings are metric, 10mm banjo bolts and copper washers. You can run a regular 3/8" banjo hose to the caliper. I like to run the regular 3/8" banjo hose cause then you can run standard 3/16" line to it.



The lines and nuts going to the master will depend on which one you are running.
Vince

[Apogee]

Below are some standard part numbers for the tube nuts you're asking about in the standard brands that most auotmotive parts stores either carry or at least can get on short notice:

(Edelman/Everco/Weatherhead)
121003/105B/105X3 - 3/8-24 SAE male tube nut for 3/16 tube

121034/105BC/n/a - 7/16-24 SAE male tube nut for 3/16" tube

121004/105C/105X4 - 7/16-24 SAE male tube nut for 1/4" tube

You didn't specify the application you're working on, however most GM muscle cars have 3/8-24 SAE inverted flare fittings at the frame end of the front caliper hoses on 3/16" tubing and a 7/16-24 inverted flare at the frame end of the rear center hose with a (2X) 3/8-24 SAE inverted flare tee-fitting on the axle end. You don't need to run 1/4" hard line front to rear unless you want to use the factory tube nuts. A lot of people running 4-wheel disc will swap out the front to rear hard line with 3/16" since it doesn't expand as much under pressure and can handle the volume requirements for late-model discs without any issues.

The LS1 calipers will use a M10x1.0 banjo bolt which is compatible with a 3/8"(10mm) banjo fitting as they tend to use the same size.

HTH,
Tobin
KORE3

[Vicinity]

How do Banjo bolts work?

I'm using 3/16" Line to LS1 Calipers all around. I'm using the stock LS1 Car Master Cylinder and booster and this proportioning valve...

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...#ht_1182wt_753

Apogee, you said people swap the body line, so the body line is not 3/16"?

[MrQuick]

Whet Tobin is saying is that people swap out the factory 1/4" line that runs from the combo valve to the rear tee to 3/16" due to the reduction necassary to operate the rear discs calipers.


thread jack...Tobin, would you have the Edelman part numbers for the LS1 C5 master metric line nuts? I found a source for them but I don't need a bag of 50. Thx
vince

[Vicinity]

Whet Tobin is saying is that people swap out the factory 1/4" line that runs from the combo valve to the rear tee to 3/16" due to the reduction necassary to operate the rear discs calipers.


thread jack...Tobin, would you have the Edelman part numbers for the LS1 C5 master metric line nuts? I found a source for them but I don't need a bag of 50. Thx
vince

So instead of buying a stock line, just get some more 3/16" line and run it instead? Can't be too difficult.

[Vicinity]

http://www.jegs.com/i/JEGS/555/100742/10002/-1

So this is what I need to connect my calipers to my hardlines?

Along with this tubing/kit?

http://www.jegs.com/i/JEGS/555/63030K/10002/-1

[MrQuick]

theres a few ways you can go about it...
you can use that fitting kit you posted with this...http://www.jegs.com/i/Russell/799/656022/10002/-1 to go from caliper to this adapter... http://www.jegs.com/i/Wilwood/950/220-6410/10002/-1 to go to the 3/16" line. or run this banjo bolt... http://www.jegs.com/i/Earl%26%23039%...77517/10002/-1 to run this hose kit ...http://www.jegs.com/i/Russell/799/692080/10002/-1 to the 3/16" hard line

[sebtarta]

Or you can buy this http://www.eastwood.com/brake-line-t...parent_id=1363

and run your own lines.

OR for $50 more you get the SS lines
http://www.eastwood.com/stainless-br...-fittings.html

And this http://www.eastwood.com/ew-brake-for...parent_id=2342

[Vicinity]

I should probably include, directly off the caliper, I already have a flex hose (stock line) connected.

Is that where the banjo bolt connects?

[Apogee]

I should probably include, directly off the caliper, I already have a flex hose (stock line) connected.

Is that where the banjo bolt connects?

The LS1 caliper flex hoses have a 10mm banjo fitting on the caliper end and M10x1.0 ISO bubble flare fittings where they connect to the hard line. The banjo bolt is what connects the banjo fitting to the caliper with two crush washers to make sure everything seals properly. The banjo bolt is a drilled through the center and then cross drilled under the head to allow fluid to travel through the bolt and into the hose. Remove one from your caliper and it will be evident to you how it works.

As for ISO bubble flares, they're not any more difficult to flare than an SAE inverted flare, but will require the proper dies for your flaring tool when making your hard lines.

Tobin
KORE3

[Vicinity]

The LS1 caliper flex hoses have a 10mm banjo fitting on the caliper end and M10x1.0 ISO bubble flare fittings where they connect to the hard line. The banjo bolt is what connects the banjo fitting to the caliper with two crush washers to make sure everything seals properly. The banjo bolt is a drilled through the center and then cross drilled under the head to allow fluid to travel through the bolt and into the hose. Remove one from your caliper and it will be evident to you how it works.

As for ISO bubble flares, they're not any more difficult to flare than an SAE inverted flare, but will require the proper dies for your flaring tool when making your hard lines.

Tobin
KORE3

What's the difference between inverted and bubble flares? Where can I get the dies? How do you tell what requires a bubble flare and what required an inverted flare?

Thanks.

[claytonisbob]

If I wanted to use the stock LS1 rear brake flex lines with the ISO bubble flare, is there a fitting that will convert it to 3/16" SAE flare? This would keep from requiring a different flaring tool/dies, and still be able to use the stock flex lines.

So a M10x1.0 ISO male fitting to 3/16" SAE female.

[Apogee]

If I wanted to use the stock LS1 rear brake flex lines with the ISO bubble flare, is there a fitting that will convert it to 3/16" SAE flare? This would keep from requiring a different flaring tool/dies, and still be able to use the stock flex lines.

So a M10x1.0 ISO male fitting to 3/16" SAE female.

Yes, those adapter fittings exist. Refer to Brakequip #BQ49 at the following link: http://www.brakequip.com/mfthread.html

While adapters can and do certainly serve a purpose, it's generally better practice to minimize the number of connections in any brake hydraulic system IMHO. As for Dan "Vicinity" Page's post above, I would suggest checking out the fittings on Brakequip's site as well so that you can see the difference between ISO bubble flares and SAE inverted flares.

Tobin
KORE3