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    Results 1 to 13 of 13
    1. #1
      Join Date
      Oct 2007
      Location
      ridgefield ct
      Posts
      876

      R/R engine, now it won't start.

      the car ran fine then i had to pull it to check the bearings. i changed the bearings, oil pump, and oil pan seal.
      when i got everything back together and primed the engine it fired right up and ran for a few seconds. that surprised me so much i turned it off (whoops!) but after then it won't fire. when i first turn the key it fires and almost starts. but after a very short time it stops firing. it gets so bad that it won't do anything, even on starting fluid.
      i've played with the timing, reversed the distributor (caused backfiring so i set it back), lowered the float (q-jet), tested the compression (150psi), have spark at the plugs.
      i'm out of ideas of what to test. any and all advice is really appreciated.

      work in progress--for the next 10 years.
      1987 monte carlo ss 383ci, 9.7:1, xe274 cam, vortec heads, 200r4, 3.73 posi.


    2. #2
      Join Date
      May 2002
      Location
      Northern California
      Posts
      10,716
      Country Flag: United States
      pull the plugs and see how they look.
      MrQuick ΜΟΛ'ΩΝ ΛΑΒ'Ε


    3. #3
      Join Date
      Apr 2005
      Location
      USA
      Posts
      4,462
      Country Flag: United States
      You may have fouled the plugs OR .... the ignition timing may be way out ..

      Is the needle and seat stuck open on the Quadrjet , causing it to flood and foul the plugs ???
      Jeff Tate
      U.S.A.
      "The best thing about participating in these events is that you get to hang out with a group of intelligent like minded people who live to achieve things in their lives. You won't find a lazy, mean, or dumb bone in their bodies." Bret Voelkel, RideTech

    4. #4
      Join Date
      Mar 2009
      Location
      San Antonio, TX
      Posts
      1,635
      If you have spark, I'd put money on the timing being way off too.

    5. #5
      Join Date
      Oct 2007
      Location
      ridgefield ct
      Posts
      876
      the plugs don't LOOK fouled. they are black but not wet and they do have spark. they did get wet with fuel at at least one point during this. they're NGK platinums if it matters. could they still be bad?
      i have set the timing a few times and it keeps coming up at the same point. but if it is the timing, could that start out firing, and then die off? or is that just from the plugs getting wet?
      i'm pretty sure the needle's OK, the bowl was filled when i reset the float level and the float free floating. (sorry, i'm not too familiar with carbs yet, so i'm guessing at how the internals should be) BTW the carb was rebuilt about a year ago and ran fine till now.
      thanks!
      work in progress--for the next 10 years.
      1987 monte carlo ss 383ci, 9.7:1, xe274 cam, vortec heads, 200r4, 3.73 posi.

    6. #6
      Join Date
      Jan 2009
      Posts
      56
      Two things come to mind because I have done them before
      1 make sure you have the wires in the right posititons on the caps and plugs.
      2 Are you sure the your #1 pistion was at TDC when you dropped your distrubitior in?
      Hope this helps
      Mike your friendly USAF B-1 CREW CHIEF

      72 Chevy Nova in pieces trying to rebulid this bucket of bolts (really just a labor of love)

      Crew Chief's: were are better than you because we keep you employed

    7. #7
      Join Date
      Aug 2004
      Location
      England
      Posts
      1,042
      For some reson if you foul the plugs even if they spark they fail under compression ,also take air filter off a chuck a 1/2 cup of gas down carb if it fires and revs up its a fuel problem.

    8. #8
      Join Date
      May 2002
      Location
      Northern California
      Posts
      10,716
      Country Flag: United States
      yeah, plats don't like being fouled. Don't even bother cleaning them. I have seen guys try for hours just find out new plugs did the trick. You can try to reinstall them after its running to see if they will come back but not while you are trying to diagnose a no start.

      I'd pull them, put a new set in. Set the crank to TDC #1 verify by watching the valves. Then back it up and put the crank to 12 degrees BTDC then set the distributer to get rotor right at #1. I find this easier cause its less likely to mess up and go retarded.
      If the carb is even questionable I sometimes clamp the feed to the pump and run it on starter fluid or a bit of fuel down the carb.

      good luck, I know this can be a pain sometimes.

      Vince
      MrQuick ΜΟΛ'ΩΝ ΛΑΒ'Ε


    9. #9
      Join Date
      Oct 2007
      Location
      ridgefield ct
      Posts
      876
      i'll definitely try the plugs.
      i haven't clamped off the fuel line, but i did try starting fluid w/out pumping the gas or cranking the engine. and the car takes a little bit to get fuel pressure, so it shouldn't have been getting too much fuel, at least at first. but i'll try that too.
      wires/firing order has been double/triple/quadruple........checked i always mix up 5 and 7 so i got used to making sure.
      also tried raw fresh fuel down the carb, no difference.
      looks like i'm gonna clamp the fuel line, pull the valve cover and check timing, swap the plugs, and pray like hell!
      thanks for the advice guys. i'll let y'all know how it turns out this weekend (but don't let that stop any more thoughts!) lol
      work in progress--for the next 10 years.
      1987 monte carlo ss 383ci, 9.7:1, xe274 cam, vortec heads, 200r4, 3.73 posi.

    10. #10
      Join Date
      Apr 2005
      Location
      USA
      Posts
      4,462
      Country Flag: United States
      Be careful dumping raw fuel down the carb !!
      If the timing is off , you could have a backfire and cause a fire !!

      You can just clean the plugs..
      There's no need to throw them away..

      Pull the drivers side valve cover .
      Rotate the engine clockwise until the #1 piston is at TDC and both valves for that cylinder are closed.
      This will be TDC on the compression stroke , NOT on the exhaust stroke..
      Remember : Intake /Compression / Power /Exhaust
      The intake valve will have closed and you rotate the engine clockwise until the piston gets to TDC .

      Then make sure the ignition rotor is pointing towards the #1 terminal on the distributor cap.
      ( You can even stop the engine rotation at 10' before TDC . Then adjust the distributor so the ignition rotor lines exactly up with #1 terminal on the cap. )
      ( Then you'll be at 10' before TDC )
      Last edited by JEFFTATE; 04-28-2010 at 08:03 PM.
      Jeff Tate
      U.S.A.
      "The best thing about participating in these events is that you get to hang out with a group of intelligent like minded people who live to achieve things in their lives. You won't find a lazy, mean, or dumb bone in their bodies." Bret Voelkel, RideTech

    11. #11
      Join Date
      Sep 2006
      Location
      Southern Indiana
      Posts
      4,709
      Country Flag: United States
      heck if you got a propane torch simply get them good and hot, I even let the negative electrode get good and cherry red(if you saw how hot they really get you would understand why its not that hard on them.
      Burn all the gas out of them and try again, put them in hot of you can even
      Lee Abel
      AFTERMARKET PERFORMANCE

      1977 Chevy Monza 2+2:Project "Cheap Trick"
      1978 C10 Long bed , On air and trailer puller
      2006 Buell Blast ,Just a bike to ride and for mileage
      1966 Caprice 4dr Sports Roof fact.327/now 350/SOON 454???? Project "II Old,,,ZERO BUDGET OR LESS CAPRICE!"

    12. #12
      Join Date
      Aug 2004
      Location
      Rustburg, Virginia
      Posts
      3,436
      Country Flag: United States
      If you're unsure about the timing...put the timing light on number one and get somebody to turn the motor over while you watch the timing tab/balancer.

      some emory cloth can shine up the plugs pretty quick, then check or reset the gaps
      1970 RS/SS350 139K on the clock:
      89 TPI motor w/ 1pc rear seal coupled to a Viper T56 via Mcleod's modular bellhousing w/ hydraulic T/O bearing from the Viper, 12 bolt rear w/ 3.73 gearing, SC&C upper control arms, factory lowers with Delalums, C5 brakes at all four corners, Front Wheels 17x8's with Sumi 255/40/17 and Rear Wheels 17x9's with Sumi 275/40/17.
      Brief description of the work done so far can be found here: http://www.nastyz28.com/forum/showthread.php?t=112454


    13. #13
      Join Date
      Oct 2007
      Location
      ridgefield ct
      Posts
      876
      well i know it's been awhile, between bad weather and just pure laziness i wasn't able to really get to the car. (god i miss having a garage) but the good news is that i got her running.
      lowered the float, used a mapp gas torch on the plugs (they were black, but more of a carbon than oil and just a basic even layer) (BTW thanks monza!) and regapped them. honestly i think that was the main problem. i didn't check where they started but i put them to about 38 and there was PLENTY of room before that. i'm guessing at least 50, how they got there i don't know.
      sprayed a bit of ether in and she started right up! even ran decent. and she restarts evenly.
      still have to tune 'er but at least i got somewhere.
      thanks for all the help!
      Nick
      work in progress--for the next 10 years.
      1987 monte carlo ss 383ci, 9.7:1, xe274 cam, vortec heads, 200r4, 3.73 posi.




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