71 Chevelle suspension ?

[stealth71]

I have a 71 Chevelle and I am currently tearing it down to build a PT G-Machine. I want to at least keep up with a new Z06 in the curves. I want you to look over my suspension plans and let me know what you think. This is stage 1 of my project, also includes paint and body. Next stage will be motor (LQ4 402TT).

Front:
SPC Uppers
Global West Lowers
AFX Tall Spindles
QA-1 coil-overs
C5 or C6 brakes

Rear:
I already have.
SSM lowers (same as jegs lowers)
BMR adjustable uppers
Just ordered Wolfe Race Craft Spherical Bushings
What should I do for springs? Should I switch to coil-overs?
Disc Conversion, maybe C5 front brakes.

Wheels:
18x8 front
18x10 rear

What maser cylinder will I need to run for C5 brake at all four corners?
I will also be getting a new steering box, PS pump, and possibly hydraboost.

How well do you think this will handle?
What should I change?

I want to start ordering parts but have no money to waste? Planning is key.

Thanks, Mike

[Derek69SS]

change the SSM lift bars for something like the Wolfe Racecraft lower arms. SSMs are good for drag-use and mild-street but not ideal for road course with the shortened SVSA.

Do the BMR uppers have spherical bearings or bushings?

You'll have a hard time hanging with a new Z06 in the corners, especially with only bolt-ons in the rear.

[stealth71]

The BMR's do not have spherical bushings that is why I got the Wolfe sphericals to put in the top of the rear end. Can you run a rear sway bar with the Wolfe Lowers? Is a rear sway bar necessary? I have heard if the springs are set up right it isn't necessary.

Do you think I should order the Wolfe lowers while they are still on sale? Will they induce any wheel hop issues? I think that's why the SSM lowers were installed by the previous owner (my brother).

What would be the next step beyond bolt ons? Can a solid axle hang in there with a IRS?

[Marcus SC&C]

With your car you should be running a rear sway bar,probably 1" (depending on the rest of the setup). The line about not needing a swaybar if the springs are right would get a good laugh from ANY road race team up to and including Formula 1. Yeah and if your tie rods are level you won`t have any bumpsteer. ;)
Your goal is admirable but I`m not sure you realize what you`re asking. The new ZO6 is one of the best handling cars in the WORLD...EVER. There are no bolts ons that will give your Chevelle handling equal to a ZO6 in the real world (maybe on a skid pad). BUT,if you want to be able to keep up with a dentist or stock broker who bought a ZO6,is making BIG payments on it and make him really nervous and a more than a little PO`d that some old muscle car is "still back there dammit!" that you can do! :D
Loose the SSM arms with the solid steel bushings. They cause the rear suspension to bind up in roll. If you run the QA1 coilovers get our lower spring perches that let you run 5"OD springs with higher rates than the QA1 beehive springs. I`d suggest about 650lbs/in in the front and 175lbs/in in the rear. You can get what you want with OE style springs or coilovers ,the coilovers will just give you more adjustability. Mark SC&C

[Ralph LoGrasso]

Your goal is admirable but I`m not sure you realize what you`re asking. The new ZO6 is one of the best handling cars in the WORLD...EVER. There are no bolts ons that will give your Chevelle handling equal to a ZO6 in the real world (maybe on a skid pad). BUT,if you want to be able to keep up with a dentist or stock broker who bought a ZO6,is making BIG payments on it and make him really nervous and a more than a little PO`d that some old muscle car is "still back there dammit!" that you can do! :D

I think Marcus hit the nail on the head right there. The new Z06 is king of the hill, and it's quite the ambitious goal to attempt to handle as its equivalent. Besides his recommendations, I'd recommend shedding some major weight off of the car if you want to handle with the big dogs. The Z06 is real light, but besides that any weight you can shed off of the Chevelle will help you out all around. What wheels and tires are you going to be running? For your question up above, a solid axle rear suspension can definitely equal and surpass an IRS. It just needs to be set up properly. One of the most popular configurations for hardcore PT guys is the 3-link. It may be worth looking into, if you want to take it a step above a bolt-on setup.

[sinned]

The line about not needing a swaybar if the springs are right would get a good laugh from ANY road race team up to and including Formula 1. Mark SC&C

Come on Marcus, sta-bars are tuning aids and on the "A" body platform they have very negligible effect anyways as a result of the extremely long ends.



It is very possible to set the suspension up to run without a rear bar if the ride quality is worth the sacrifice.

[protouring70]

I couldn't remember your name but I think he needs to ask you about tall spindles. I wish I would have asked before I bought mine.
Thanks Brent

[Norm Peterson]

I have a 71 Chevelle and I am currently tearing it down to build a PT G-Machine. I want to at least keep up with a new Z06 in the curves. I want you to look over my suspension plans and let me know what you think.

Wheels:
18x8 front
18x10 rear

Marcus has already provided pretty good direction to this project (the spring rates my ~3450# '79 aren't much different from the numbers he posted, and as far as I'm concerned it's still a true daily driver). About all I'll add is that you really need to think in terms of wider front wheels in order to support rubber of adequate width. Don't forget - you're quite a bit more front-heavy than any C6 and will need relatively wider/greater load capacity front rolling stock than does your Corvette 'bogey'.

I have 8.5" wide wheels all around on my '79, and they're too narrow for really hard driving (auto-x). This much car needs 275-width or wider tires at both ends, and 8/8.5 isn't nearly wide enough to support that much tire. Any nationally competitive C-Prepared car has at least 10's all around, and that's the level of prep you're talking about to run heads-up with an equally well-driven Super Stock C5/C6. As a higher speed data point, I think Nextel Cup cars run 10" wide wheels (and they do run a couple of road courses).

I suppose that you *could* work this up around not using a rear sta-bar, and it could possibly be a superior arrangement in a competition-only environment (depending on a bunch of other stuff). But you probably wouldn't be entirely happy on a daily basis with the ride with rear springs that stiff and other compromises such as front spring rates and poorer rough road behavior that could be expected as a result of this choice. Maybe this is a good point to ask just how hard-core this project really is, and how much tolerance you have for noise/vibration/harshness and a "stiff-legged" ride.

Norm

[protouring70]

Hey Stealth71, I am Brent and I have installed the b-body or tall spindles on my car. I haven't driven my car for it is not ready. But, I have talked with a bunch of people about them. You have good stories and bad. So please do your homework on them before you make your purchase.

I done the whole setup that was done on the REDLINE '70 Chevelle that was in POPULAR HOTRODDING a few years back. I hope it turns out to be worth it!

Brent
Do a search here on PT.com for tall spindles and on the link below.

http://www.chevelles.com/forums/index.php?

[stealth71]

Wow. Some good points have been brought up. Maybe I was a little ambitious when I wanted to hang with a new Z06. I think the 402TT motor that will be going in will help make up on the straights. If I stick with bolt ons what lower control arms do you recommend for the rear? What is the cost of installing a 3-link?

I am looking at the AFX tall spindles which are supposed to have all the benefits of the B-body spindle without the side effects.

I don't know how wide of a wheel I will be able to run in the front. A 10" seems a little big. I also have not decided on wheels yet. Any recommendations for under $600 per wheel?

Do you think I have the front suspension planned well? Marcus I will be ordering some parts through you to complete this step of the project. Can I order the QA-1's without the beehive springs?

The car will not be a daily driver, but I don't want it to be too harsh. My goal is a true PT car with a mid 11 second quarter. I want to be able to take it on road trips like the power tour. I do have a budget. I'd like to keep suspension under 4k. So I am open to all suggestions. Thanks for the help.

[protour_chevelle]

What is the cost of installing a 3-link?

It's one off right now. No production "bolt-on" piece is available as of yet. However there is one currently in the works by Vince(MrQuick)... So if you can hang in there for a bit then.....

-Matt

[USAZR1]

Wow. Some good points have been brought up. Maybe I was a little ambitious when I wanted to hang with a new Z06.

I don't know how wide of a wheel I will be able to run in the front. A 10" seems a little big. I also have not decided on wheels yet. Any recommendations for under $600 per wheel?

Nothing wrong with setting high goals. If all you shoot for is mediocrity,that's all you will get.

I know a few things about installing big rolling stock under A-bodies but don't remember anyone running a 10" wide front rim,,yet. However,a 9.5" will definitely fit. Try an 18x9.5 with 5.75" backspacing and a 275/35 tire. That combo should fit like a glove.

My PSE 17x9 front wheels cost me $450/each without the pin drives so I would think you can find a pretty decent wheel for $600.

[stealth71]

I don't mind fabrication. Was wondering how complex it would be to build one? ie. relocate mounts, pan hard bar....

[protour_chevelle]

I don't mind fabrication. Was wondering how complex it would be to build one? ie. relocate mounts, pan hard bar....

Essentially it would be best to start off with a full floater 9inch with no mounts at all on it. That way it could be as clean as possible(you are not working with extra crap, seeing how the UCA mounts are cast into the axle). Buying weld on mounts for LCA mounts is cake. Making them is simple enough too, draw them up, get them cnc cut and weld them on.
I'll let Denny get in depth on the upper link length(if the discussion is needed) but you can practically do a bolt on style upper link, But it will be 10 inches or so long(not optimum length). To achieve the longer lenth of 19inches(I think that was the magic number?) cutting of the floor, having fun with the rear crossmember and possibly losing the rear seat is now a part of getting the best lengths and numbers possible.

-Matt

[Marcus SC&C]

Stealth71, I don`t think the QA1 coilover conversion package is available sans springs but I could be wrong. How hard it is to build a good 3 link rear suspension depends a lot on your definition of "good" and what your goals are. Matt touched on that pretty well. On upper link length,longer is better. Techno speak aside it basically makes the sweet spot of the rear suspension larger. However shorter lengths can work fairly well also,especially on a street car. The newest generation Mustangs have an upper 3rd link about 8.5" long,yet they work pretty well and are more predictable to drive than the previous models using converging 4 link (much like your Chevelle). Norm and Clint bring up good points though,it`s not just about suspension you have to get it all to the ground and make all the aspects work well together. Mark SC&C

[71FORDREAPER]

Hello Marcus,
I was following an old forum that you gave some pretty good advice for concerning a 71 Chevelle. https://www.pro-touring.com/showthre...lle-suspension . I currently have a 71 chevelle with all drum brakes(all stock as far as suspension goes). I also have the same ambition as Stealth71 in the forum post. Dream of starting/building a foundation for a suspension that can keep up with or compare to a ZO6 or it would probably be a ZR1 this day and age, as that post is from 2005. Of course I am working with a budget, but I would like have a list of supsension parts that could get me there or close regardless of having a big block,small block, or LS engine. I have heard alot of good things about your knowledge and experience and I'm looking forward to your help if its not to much to ask. If possible I would like a list of things without a budget cap and a list of things that would help me save every penny possible with the best possible options. But any help will be appreciated very much.
I also had a question about CPP stage 3 suspension package, do you thats something worth investing in or not?

Thanks
SSG Miller, Lashon
U.S Army Special Forces
Fort Bragg, N.C 28310

[71FORDREAPER]

Hello Marcus,
I was following an old forum that you gave some pretty good advice for concerning a 71 Chevelle. https://www.pro-touring.com/showthre...lle-suspension . I currently have a 71 chevelle with all drum brakes(all stock as far as suspension goes). I also have the same ambition as Stealth71 in the forum post. Dream of starting/building a foundation for a suspension that can keep up with or compare to a ZO6 or it would probably be a ZR1 this day and age, as that post is from 2005. Of course I am working with a budget, but I would like have a list of supsension parts that could get me there or close regardless of having a big block,small block, or LS engine. I have heard alot of good things about your knowledge and experience and I'm looking forward to your help if its not to much to ask. If possible I would like a list of things without a budget cap and a list of things that would help me save every penny possible with the best possible options. But any help will be appreciated very much.
I also had a question about CPP stage 3 suspension package, do you thats something worth investing in or not?

Thanks
SSG Miller, Lashon
U.S Army Special Forces
Fort Bragg, N.C 28310

[Norm Peterson]

I suggest contacting him directly via the SC&C telephone number.


Norm

[71FORDREAPER]

Ok, thanks.