Campbell Auto Restoration Subframe

**next69** · 12-09-2005

I was reading a thread at the begining of the year that really supported the first gen subframe offered by Campbell Auto Restoration but I have not seen any more information and there web site is still under construction. Is there anybody here using it? Does anybody have pictures? What happened were they just the flavor of the month? I am very surprised after all of the buzz that we are still talking about all of the other mustang type subframes .

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**67bird** · 12-09-2005

I think the main reson you don't here about it is the cost. I had them quote one for me and it was around $13,000.00. I also had to ship them the car because every frame that they make is custom. I talked to them they seem pretty knowledgable on their stuff. Also, check out Tony's book. There is a little bit of info there on it and some misc. pictures throughout.

**Steve1968LS2** · 12-10-2005

We are shooting two of thier cars (and testing them) on Tuesday.. I will pick thier brains on this..

$13k for a sub is a lot of cash.. wonder what it includes..

**67bird** · 12-10-2005

That quote included just about everything for the front. It was spindles, brakes, frame, fab work, all of it. To me it seemed like a good deal, if I had the funds. I seen the pictures of some of their work in a magazine (I think CHP). I think that their claim to fame is the "We can fit a 315 section width tire on the front of a 69". They were also working on a 3-link at the time they quoted my front suspension. I will try to find the quote tonight and list the info on it here. Their prices may have changed. This quote is several months old.

**David Pozzi** · 12-10-2005

The 69 Camaro I saw has a complete front structure like a NASCAR or IMSA car. They do a lot of high dollar cars and are into cars that go and handle. I've heard they have done a three link setup. They build cars from start to finish, including paint, they don't just specialize in one aspect like suspension, quite a talented bunch of guys!

**67bird** · 12-11-2005

Hey everyone, found my quote. It was apparently older than what I thought. It is from 7/04. This was for their base model subframe (what ever that means). It was set-up for the stock bellcrank assembly. Hydraulic T/O was addition fee. It would allow me to run a 275/40-17 on a 9.5" rim. It includes QA-1 coilovers, Eibach springs. Baer pin drive calipers with 13.5" slotted rotors, power steering rack and standard track width all for $13,500.00 plus tax. I don't know what their prices are now. At that point in time I had to ship the car to them, and provide and engine block, oil pan, cylinder head, and bellhousing and tranny, for the mock up. From what I have read in Tony's book and from pictures it looks as if anything that you want to adjust is adjustable. They had an article written about them in the October issue of Chevy High Performance in the tech section. If I had a scanner I would upload some picks. When I called them I talked to Kevin Long. He was very helpful, and sent me a quote in a couple of days after talking to them. I am no expert but they seemed pretty knowledgable.

**Mean 69** · 12-11-2005

The price quoted seems high, but there are a couple of factors that are not so obvious. I spoke with Kevin from Campbell at SEMA, if only for a minute or two, and their deal seems to be the top of the food chain, max effort cars. I saw a photo of their front setup on this site a ways back, but it seems to have been deleted? It is a really nice looking setup, though the geometry is always in question (and that statement applies to ALL aftermarket sub's, not intended to call CARS out by any means).

Keep in mind that custom fabrication costs money, you don't have to like it, but it is the truth. Nothing happens as fast as you think it should on paper, how many folks can state that their project went according to plan? I am not exclusively trying to defend CARS, after all, they are a competitor to my small business, but the fact remains that you can't just wave a magic wand and get everything that you want for a few hundred bucks.

I'd love to see the pic's again, I know Kevin watches this board, they should be proud to post their project photos. Else, look for the results in PHR, I am guessing that their cars will turn some really impressive numbers.

M

**Steve1968LS2** · 12-11-2005

Originally Posted by Mean 69

I'd love to see the pic's again, I know Kevin watches this board, they should be proud to post their project photos. Else, look for the results in PHR, I am guessing that their cars will turn some really impressive numbers.

M

Yea, Kevin seemed like a very cool guy on the phone. If they were a little closer I would have sent them Penny to do my firewall and trans tunnel mods rather than Hot Rods and Custom Stuff. If only because I would always choose a performance based shop over a street rod shop.

They are bringing a Mopar and a Mustang for the testing and photoshoot.. will be interested to see what they put down. Oh, as a ringer we are also testing a pretty bitchen 74 Mustang that the guy only has $6k into but races the snot out of it.. It is actually a cool little car. Tuesday should be very fun and I plan on picking Kevins brain in regards to thier stuff.

Oh Mark, can't wait till you guys move to the big shop and can do work on cars.. will be nice to have a shop with that capability in the area.

**Mean 69** · 12-11-2005

Oh Mark, can't wait till you guys move to the big shop and can do work on cars.. will be nice to have a shop with that capability in the area.

You!?!?! Me/us too. It will be really nice, with our partner it will basically be a one stop shop, with the exception of interior work, for now. Though it is fun to hang in my shop now, it is a pain to trip over stuff all of the time and not be able to do as much as we'd like. It will be a very welcome change.

That '74, is it our friend Alcino? Terrific little car, and a super nice guy if it is indeed him, and a 'homey. San Diego dude. Good tires on that car!
M

**Steve1968LS2** · 12-12-2005

Originally Posted by Mean 69

You!?!?! Me/us too. It will be really nice, with our partner it will basically be a one stop shop, with the exception of interior work, for now. Though it is fun to hang in my shop now, it is a pain to trip over stuff all of the time and not be able to do as much as we'd like. It will be a very welcome change.

That '74, is it our friend Alcino? Terrific little car, and a super nice guy if it is indeed him, and a 'homey. San Diego dude. Good tires on that car!
M

Yep, it's Alcino.. maybe it will shut up the "you have to have a high buck car to get in a magazine" crowd.. lol

What's the timetable on your new shop??

**Mean 69** · 12-12-2005

Al is a terrific example of what ingenuity and hard work can do. That little car is terrific, he did it all himself, on the cheap, and it appears to work really, really well.

Looking like January, or more likely February for the new shop. Stoked.
M

**alcino** · 12-12-2005

Guess I don't have to keep quiet anymore. Cats out the bag, just don't want to get jinxed, its the first ever magazine interest in my car.

Mark, Thanks for the complements. We need to have another "bachelor party" kind of event again. That was really fun to have many pro-touring cars at a road event. Also I may be in Carlsbad in a week or two, maybe I can come by the shop and say hello. Is the shop near Palamar Airport Rd?

Sorry, but this thread has officially been jacked!
Alcino
76 Mustang

**Steve1968LS2** · 12-12-2005

Originally Posted by Mean 69

Al is a terrific example of what ingenuity and hard work can do. That little car is terrific, he did it all himself, on the cheap, and it appears to work really, really well.

Looking like January, or more likely February for the new shop. Stoked.
M

Just in time to help me out with my temporary back suspension

Alcino: yea, cats out man.. see ya tomorrow!

**David Pozzi** · 12-12-2005

Al,
Congratulations! I can't wait to read about your car!

**MrQuick** · 12-12-2005

congrates Al, hey Steve, speaking of spread, whens that story coming out in speed reading??

The CARS frame is very nice but is over kill for a car that will see a track twice a year. Kevin is cool too.

**Mean 69** · 12-13-2005

I just got back from the testing event, I went as a spectator which is always painful for me, but it was great anyway. Kevin and crew from CARS were there with two very, very fine cars, and they were terrific guys and very open with what they have done and are going to do. They do, uh, "really nice" work, the 65 (6?) Mustang they had there was one of the nicest examples I have ever seen. I am sure that I took at least 30 pictures of it, best sounding trick exhaust I have heard in a long, long time, and the craftsmanship was outstanding. Al's car was awesome, I won't say more than that or the publishing police with come and get me. You'll have to read about it in print, highly recommended that you do so, too, I can guarantee that you will be extremely impressed by it. It was good to get to talk with the other folks involved too, always good to spend some time with fellow car dudes, and you always learn a lot more (well, I do) and a lot of the opinions that you might have had prior, are often not true in reality (well, mine anyway).

I have stated before that the type of testing that the magazines do is not the end-all in terms of characterizing a car (I like the road course as a defining judgement for instance), but you know what, I don't see a better way to level the playing field than what they do. Honest. I'd love to see road course stuff, or a comparison of one setup to another, but there are so many damn variables involved that if someone didn't like the outcome, there would be a million excuses. It really does put these guys in a tough place. I will say that I was impressed with the testing that was done though. If you want your car tested in such a forum, prepare to have it driven. Hard. By guys that know what they are doing, and have done so hundreds of times, and know a good car from a bad one. Based upon data, and real world comparo's. On a level playing field. It's the best thing going that I have seen short of competition.

One question that came up was the slalom, and why they use a shorter track than some of the other magazines, the response was a really good one. In order to give a good comparison base for ALL of the cars they test (and that measn more than just PHR, don't know exactly which other ones, but there are a lot that you probably read), the approach is to use the same type of setup. Now ponder this, these guys test everything from a full on handling g-machine, to good old fashioned 32 Ford roadsters, and everything in between. The test drive gets about four or so shots to learn the car, and put down the number. There is a huge difference between the longer and significantly faster courses that the Road and Track, etc, dudes, use, but their test cars are all new cars. Think about the anxiety of putting a $250k show car through the paces at high speed and have something break on the car, and wad it up? Um, I wouldn't want that job, and I can agree with, and accept their compromise. And by the way, there was one of those high price cars there today, and it too was very nice. And something on it, unfortunately, broke, prior to the slalom testing. They ran it anyway (it was not a safety issue, but rather something that adds horsepower to the car, by the way). I like.

We'll be letting them beat the poop out of our cars in the near future too, and will accept the numbers that are a result. Good (we expect), or bad (we don't expect, but won't shy away from the truth). Oh, and by the way, there wasn't one Camaro on site. Not one. Not even a 69. Of course, that will make half of the folks happy, and half of the folks mad. And you can't please everyone, ever, at one time. Oh well!

M

**Steve1968LS2** · 12-13-2005

Great post Mark but maybe it needs it own thread.. with a few pics ;)

Nice to see you today and glad you got to see the cars run.. especially the crazy numbers put down by that little Mustang..

**Mean 69** · 12-15-2005

Great post Mark but maybe it needs it own thread.. with a few pics

Yeah, I think it does deserve its own. I'll whip something up a bit later. I downloaded my pics today so I can drop one or two in there. I am looking forward to testing our cars, but I am a little concerned that the Mopar will even fit between the cones!!!! It's big. And long.
M

**TitoJones** · 12-15-2005

Originally Posted by Mean 69

It's big. And long.

You wife has been telling stories about me again huh? ;)

Tyler

**68protouring454** · 12-15-2005

the truth comes out, thats what was propping you up in the chair at pro touring dinner!!!!????
nah, it was the glue!!

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Thread: Campbell Auto Restoration Subframe

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