how much power do you really need?

[no1udknow]

So I have been doing a lot of contemplating duri g this winter down time and I keep bouncing back and forth between directions for my truck. The problem is every time I start looking at engine setups and trannys, my brain automatically screams "more power". I'm sure we all fall for this trap, especially when we see other people posting their 1000hp ls builds. But how much power do I really need to be competitive. I would assume that so much power would not be that usefull in pro touring as keeping that much power attached to the asphalt in a corner could prove tricky. So who is racing and doi g well, and what kind of power are you making, and how heavy is your car?

[vintageracer]

"How Much Power Do You Really Need?"


A LOT LESS than you would think!

I always considered the guys who boast about the big HP they in their vehicle to have "Big Dick Syndrome". Mine is bigger than yours! Big Deal. Well I guess it really could be a big deal!!!!!

RARELY can folks with 500+ HP "Put That HP To The Ground" on a road course to the point that all that extra HP really helps and even MORE RARE is a driver that has the skill and ability to drive their vehicle to it's capability with 500 HP much less a 1000 HP. Better Brakes, Better Suspension Setup and most importantly Better Driver Ability is going to trump 1000 HP every time in amateur road course/autocross Motorsports and particularly in the type of events PT enthusiasts like to attend.

Blasting down the straightaway with big HP and creeping though the corners due to lack of driver skill and car setup seems to be more and more the norm these days!

[Schwartz Performance]

To be competitive, if you have the suspension already figured out, 600hp is about all you need.

-Dale

[Poorhousenext]

I'm old and Stupid, so my current project is to try and run in the 10's in 1/4 mile with under 400 RWP, and on Street tires, 200TW or more. The only way I can do that is to get weight of car down to get Horse Power to Weight ratio needed to pull it off. Car will ahve all the NHRA safety equipment required to run up to 10.00. Will have provision in place to make car legal to go 9.99 and under later on should I want to try that. The safty equipments added weight may be my downfall.

My current car can run in 11s even with 2.+ 60' times, with 360 RWP at 3559 Lbs with 4 gallons of fuel and me in it on 200 TW street tires and 3.55 rear gear. Can't even spin the rear wheels on preped track, in part because of little or no converter stall and 52% of weight being on rear tires.

I'm hopeing to get car finished by end of May so I can see if I can do it.

PS: I'm using a Mustang Dyno to tune on, along with LS2 style MAF to keep RWHP form going over 399. Dynojet Dyno numbers put engine RWHP numbers within 12% of crate Engine at the crank HP rating. Very unrealistic numbers for homemade headers and automatic trans I'm using.

[MonzaRacer]

I have plans for twin GT2871r turbos on my 283 in my Monza and at max boost it should turn over 600hp/600tq. all things considered I figure at 6 to 10 psi I can have a solid hard running car with reliability. My biggest issue is hooking it with a Monza,,,,,
I dont think running a big block in my 66 Caprice will be hard to hook, and I can always use same size turbos on my stock 454 and at 5psi it should be able to run upwards of 700hp if I push it.

[Interceptor5588]

My Formula is running about 300 rwhp and 370 rwtq and it's perfect for roadcourse work -- pulls pretty hard but very controlled, you can use the throttle like a switch most of the time. Don't have to worry about pedalling to control wheelspin, etc.

I guess it COULD use maybe another 100 hp or so though -- so 500hp/500tq at the crank in a 3000 lb car would be pretty good to shoot for. Of course I'm pretty old and conservative . . . well, maybe 200 more might be nice after all . . .

[no1udknow]

Well my current bored and but 350 (364) is supposedly making between 380-400hp at the crank but I haven't run it on the dyno yet..... hopefully this month my buddy will get the dyno set up in his new shop. Once I figure out whats happening undet the hood I will be deciding if I want to keep it or move to an ls

[GNon18s]

Running with the pro-touring crowd, you'll want 550-600. I've been getting by with @450 in a 3200lb car, but I've often wished I had 100 or so more.

[GNon18s]

Well my current bored and but 350 (364) is supposedly making between 380-400hp at the crank but I haven't run it on the dyno yet..... hopefully this month my buddy will get the dyno set up in his new shop. Once I figure out whats happening undet the hood I will be deciding if I want to keep it or move to an ls

If you already have a motor I would just run it. Worry about more power later.

[srh3trinity]

After having a mostly stock ls2 daily driver, I think my cammed ls3 stroker build will be plenty. I did the math on putting a zr1 blower on it but fortunately came to my senses. I do want a supercharged or turbo car at some point, but it would be overkill on my current build.

[Bonehead]

It all depends on your plans for the car. Once I have possession of my Chevelle here in my new home, I'm considering on reworking the car to participate in the Mojave Mile. Not quite sure I can get that brick to go 200 mph, but for now that's the goal. I'm going to guess its going to take around 1200 to the wheel to get that unaerodynamic pile moving that fast. Maybe even a bit more. Realistically, this might be a 5 year plan once I get started. We'll see. Maybe if you'd define "competitive", you'd get an answer you're looking for.

[72BBSwinger]

I think autox comp can be won with little power and good balance, good driver. Big road course comp, a big engine can shine.

[gscherer78ta]

A lot of it depends on the size of the course you want to run on. The larger and longer the course the more HP will be required to stay competitive. A shorter course will favor good balance and less hp. From what I see in my area, 400-500 at the crank and good balance on the car seems to do well in courses large and small.

[Gratefuldiver]

I have about 450-500 rear wheel hp and get beat up on by Miata's with less then 200 hp all day when I auto x lol

[cornfedbill]

I once watched a 1 liter Datsun powered Lotus Seven Series 2 that weighed 850 pounds empty run fasted time of the day at an autocross. He was consistently at the top of the pack. He was barely making 100 horsepower at the crank.

That said, I always say, "You can't have too much horsepower, just too little traction."

I'm running about 400 horsepower at the crank with lots of torque from my 377 small block. My goal is 3300 pounds for my Nova. I think I will be a bit shy on power, but able to have a lot of fun. I would love to have about 100 more horsepower. I think that would be as much or more than my tires could put to the ground.

[Mr.VENGEANCE]

To be competitive, if you have the suspension already figured out, 600hp is about all you need.

-Dale

came to say this.. left satisfied.

[parsonsj]

My Z06 makes 540 at the tires. It's a handful coming out of turns. The only time I felt the need for more hp was at Daytona. A cool 200 additional hp would have been most welcome on those banks!

[HomeBuilt]

I once watched a 1 liter Datsun powered Lotus Seven Series 2 that weighed 850 pounds empty run fasted time of the day at an autocross. He was consistently at the top of the pack. He was barely making 100 horsepower at the crank.

That said, I always say, "You can't have too much horsepower, just too little traction."

I'm running about 400 horsepower at the crank with lots of torque from my 377 small block. My goal is 3300 pounds for my Nova. I think I will be a bit shy on power, but able to have a lot of fun. I would love to have about 100 more horsepower. I think that would be as much or more than my tires could put to the ground.

I think Bill here made an excellent point. I think what you're looking for is not a hp number to be competitive, but a lbs/hp. number so what you'll need will depend largely on what kind of weight you're throwing around and the type of racing you plan on doing. My motor made 507 hp and i'm shooting for 6lbs/hp so I'm focusing on taking out weight to run at Willow Springs. But I think anything in the 7-9lbs/hp range is pretty good.

[rchaskin]

I’ve found that most people that tell you “you don’t need that much horsepower” to be competitive, always have way more than me…….LOL........

[SSLance]

My engine puts 283 hp\404 ft lbs to the rear tires and my suspension is very well sorted. On a tight technical type of autocross course it does very well and can beat the LS powered cars I typically race against. On a longer style, more wide open autocross course like you see at the SCCA Nationals, those same cars will nip me by just a tad on our best runs.

My car does okay on the road courses, is a ton of fun in the twistys...but on the straights it will get walked away from by the big powered cars. Nothing is more fun though than to get run away from on the straights only to run those same cars back down again by the time you come out of turn two. :D