aluminum -AN fittings?

[jordanh]

I want to know what your guys thoughts are on using aluminum fittings for brake lines? I have read a lot about people saying its a bad idea. I'm just strictly speaking of the bulkheads( going from hardline to braid) and the tube sleeves and tube nuts on that hardline. I have seen them used in a lot of high end builds by companies and on high-end rally cars, etc.

Whats the verdict?

[parsonsj]

I think aluminum is better than steel in one respect: it conforms and seals better. It's plenty for brakes -- just do your due diligence: test, inspect, and maintain.

[Twentyover]

Only downside is if you screw the flare up or install the line incrrectly and mar the face of the flare. There is a repair, I forget the name of the deal, but it's an aluminum bit with an internal and external flare to repair the seat.

[dontlifttoshift]

Flare savers, it's an aluminum washer that sits on the seat. Pure Choice and Earls have them.....I have never used them but have been told they can bail you out of a jam.

One more for aluminum fittings on brake lines, no problems.

[andrewb70]

Let's be realistic here. What is the intent of your build? Rally cars are maintained at a very meticulous level. All critical components are inspected and replaced before there is a failure. Along the same lines, "high end" builds get the same attention and limited street use. You have to ask yourself "how is the car going to be used and how will it be maintained?"

As people have said, aluminum fittings are fine, and I agree, however, personally I would never use them on a street car. A street car (not a race car and not a show car) should predominantly use SAE 45 degree double flare steel (or stainless) hard lines everywhere in the braking system except for the last 12-16 inches that goes to the calipers. You can use AN fittings from the frame to the calipers in conjunction with braided steel lines. I feel comfortable using them at that location because they are very easy to inspect. That's just my 2 cents...

Andrew

[Skip Fix]

Figure most of us and esp new cars have an aluminum MC fittings bolt to-what would be the difference?

[andrewb70]

Figure most of us and esp new cars have an aluminum MC fittings bolt to-what would be the difference?

New cars don't use AN fittings. They use bubble flare style fittings



Andrew

[Skip Fix]

Andrew no AN fittings but aluminum MC that is as soft as an aluminum AN fitting where the bubble seals.

Although most -3,-4 AN fittings I see are steel-but then they may go into a aluminum caliper with pipe threads if Wilwood or aftermarket, a a source to strip out if the AN ones will.

[andrewb70]

Andrew no AN fittings but aluminum MC that is as soft as an aluminum AN fitting where the bubble seals.

Although most -3,-4 AN fittings I see are steel-but then they may go into a aluminum caliper with pipe threads if Wilwood or aftermarket, a a source to strip out if the AN ones will.

I have no issues with aluminum. All I am saying that there is no reason to use AN fittings (with a few limited places), aluminum or steel, on a street car. A street car should be plumbed with steel or stainless hardline using SAE 45 degree double flares or bubbles flares.

Andrew

[Skip Fix]

I agree with you, the only AN I have even on my race car are at the caliper for the flex lines and for the brake pressure gauges.Wilwood uses a NPT hole so you have to use some kind of adapter. Prefer hard line also.

[jordanh]

-double post

[jordanh]

The car will be used as a weekend car, for track days, auto-x, etc. No DD. ocasional drive to work, etc. I am running hardline all over the car and only using flex lines on the front two corners from frame to caliper, and in the back from body to rear-end housing.

I was going to use hardline with an tube sleeves and nuts, this has got me thinking, what are the advantages/dis-advantages of the -an in the first place? I was going to use them primarily just to have a baseline flare size all through out the vehicle considering I used -an for fuel, coolant, etc. This also adds the simplicity for bulkhead fittings and so forth.

[andrewb70]

....

I was going to use hardline with an tube sleeves and nuts, this has got me thinking, what are the advantages/dis-advantages of the -an in the first place? I was going to use them primarily just to have a baseline flare size all through out the vehicle considering I used -an for fuel, coolant, etc. This also adds the simplicity for bulkhead fittings and so forth.

The AN standard was designed specifically for military airplane use. AN stands for Army Navy. If you are doing hard lines on a car I suggest you stick with the SAE (society of automotive engineers) standard of either the double flare 45 degree standard or the later bubble flare standard.

Andrew

[parsonsj]

AN fittings are also recognized by the SAE as J514. In fact, the SAE J514 standard has easier to machine tolerances and specifies less root thread area than the original MIL specs.

So are your Summit-bought Russell Performance fittings fully MIL-Spec compliant? I don't know, but I'll bet they are better than SAE J514 compliant fittings.

Anybody know for sure?

[jordanh]

Well I've decided to return all my -AN fittings and lines and do everything with SAE 45 flares. I was actually surprised at how much more simple the whole system will be.

Only thing I'm a bit confused with is that I am using a 02 camaro master. how am I going to get from the metric bubble flares on the MC to the 3/8" inverted flares on the wilwood proportioning valve?


I can't think of a way to do it without running a -3AN, and if thats the case it really doesn't make sense to me to not run AN through out at that point.

[parsonsj]

it really doesn't make sense to me to not run AN through out at that point.

It's ok. Just use SAE J514 instead.

[jordanh]

I'll have to do that or get a corvette master cylinder by the looks of it.

The more I look into it though I do like the sae45 fittings. It's actually a lot cleaner system to convert from hard line to flex line. -AN you need a whole seperate bulkhead fitting which actaully makes for a pretty messy setup once a guy really compated the two. I'll just use -an where needed.

[killer69]

Well I've decided to return all my -AN fittings and lines and do everything with SAE 45 flares. I was actually surprised at how much more simple the whole system will be.

Only thing I'm a bit confused with is that I am using a 02 camaro master. how am I going to get from the metric bubble flares on the MC to the 3/8" inverted flares on the wilwood proportioning valve?


I can't think of a way to do it without running a -3AN, and if thats the case it really doesn't make sense to me to not run AN through out at that point.

go buy a premade bubble flair line cut it and reflair it to SAE 45deg double flair................... don't forget to put the nut on first lol

[jordanh]

go buy a premade bubble flair line cut it and reflair it to SAE 45deg double flair................... don't forget to put the nut on first lol

I've obviously thought of that...but the 1/4" rear line on the M/C is my snag.

Your idea would work great on the front M11 fitting which uses 4.75mm(3/16"), but once I got to the rear M12 fitting I think I might run into problems considering it uses 6mm(1/4") brake line....Unless you know where I can get a m12 x1.0 brake fitting that runs 4.75(3/16" line) instead of the 6mm?

Even if I did find a M12x1.0 nut that used 3/16" line, would that even work properly inplace of 1/4" line.

[silver69camaro]

I think this thread is making a big deal about nothing - either AN or SAE 45* works great in brake systems and both are very well proven. Myself, I don't use aluminum fittings or lines but that's my choice driven by my education and the availability of available AN brake fittings.

Jordan, Brakequip has the fittings in 3/16" lines you are looking for. You will probably have to grind the snout of the fitting just a little to make them seal correctly on GM masters, but that's no big deal.