Wont run, please help

**1Bad68camaro** · 06-20-2005

Ok, i've had all kinds of problems from this thing. At first it wouldnt even try to start, just backfired out the headers or carb. Found out i had 0 compression at all cylinders. Backed off all valves to zero lash and locked them down and got 150 on all cylinders. So much for lunati's instructions to take them to zero lash, then half a turn more. Anyway, started trying to start it. Wouldnt even try exept for a moment after i primed it. Found a stuck power valve on the front of my holley. After a tap or 2 with a rubber malet it came unstuck and is working like a champ. Now the current issue. When i turn it over it acts like it is really trying to start, while turning the key over it pops and stays right on the verge of completely running on its own but dies when i let off the starter. Retimed it 3 times, set on tdc and restabed the distributer, traced all wires for correct firing order. checked for spark at plugs. I just dont understand it. It has been like this for 2 days now and i cant figure it out. It acts like its so close to starting its crazy. If i advance the distr very much it kills the starter to much, and if i retard it it starts backfiring out the carb. Its a 383 with hei and accell supercoil. new msd 8mm wires, new accell header plugs. Distributer and wiring for ignition was put in while the old motor still ran so i know its all wired up correct. Any ideas for this very frustrated mechanic?

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**Fuelie Fan** · 06-20-2005

Could you also have a stuck float in your carb? Can you smell that it is getting too much fuel? Or perhaps you have a something clogged and it's getting none? Does starting fluid help? When all else fails, if you've got ignition and a squirt bottle you can keep a vehicle running by "force feeding" it with fuel or starting fluid, just remember to wear your safety glasses!

**kamaroman68** · 06-21-2005

Check for the full 12 volts when the key is in the run position at the distributor. It sounds to me like your getting the 12 volts there only during cranking and when you let go of the key and it snaps back to the run position your losing the 12 volts. What type of distributor are you using points/ hei? I have seen this before and it was a mix up in the wiring.

**kamaroman68** · 06-21-2005

Sorry I guess I should have read the fullpost. Use a meter and measure for the full 12 volts at the input to the Hei in the run only position my guess is its not there but is when cranking. Good luck

**1Bad68camaro** · 06-21-2005

Its got the voltage. I'm not saying to runs until i let off the starter. It acts like it is trying until then. But the starter is definately keeping it turning. I'm taking the end off the carb tomorrow to see if the float is stuck or something. i had the carb rebuilt about 5 months ago and used it for a little while on the old motor until i took it apart 3 months ago. So everything was working until then, same for distributer. I was running the same one with the same wiring on the old motor. its crazy.

**CAMAROBOY69** · 06-21-2005

This sounds like another issue of improperly adjusted rocker arms. Just a guess since you sound positive that you have your timing nailed. I really doubt it is a carb problem. Bypass the carb and just pour gas in there. If it starts right away then its the carb. But if it still doesnt start then try the rockers again.

**1Bad68camaro** · 06-24-2005

I have already set them all at zero lash, any more than that and i loose compression.

**Charley Lillard** · 06-24-2005

Before you said you had them at zero lash and half turn and there was no compression. You say you are now at zero lash but I'm guessing your interpretation of zero lash has the lifter completely collapsed. Half turn past zero still should not have kept the valves open. The half turn they want is just to start to depress the cup in the lifter. I think you have the valves too tight.
If you are running a HEI in a 68 you need a new source for the 12 volts because the stock resistor wire is not 12. To test you can make a wire straight from the positive bat terminal to the bat terminal on the HEI.
Pull the plug on the side of the float bowl on the Holley to see if maybe it is just the float level to high or a stuck float. If the plug is out, you are cranking and gas is coming out then I would try lowering the float or pulling the needle and seat to check for debris.

**Yenkostyle** · 06-24-2005

Ok so here is something I ran into once on a Ford but maybe it applies here too?

It sounds like a problem I had when trying to start a 69 Mustang I had. It would run or want to run until I let of the starter switch. Turns out I forgot about the neutral safety switch.

I know, I know, I was not very smart but my last name does ends in "ski" :D

It just seems that sometimes when a car has been apart for a long time you overlook the little things. It took me two weeks to figure that out and it really had nothing to do with the ignition, like I had thought.

Like I said I don’t know if that helps but sometimes if we look in a different direction we find the problem is a little less of a pain then we think.

Good luck!
Tony

**1Bad68camaro** · 06-24-2005

Ok guys, fixed it. I went ahead and started the day off by adding 5 more gallons of gas to the tank and that helped me find my first problem. I had i hole in my fuel line about 6 inches from my tank so my pump was sucking air. Replaced the hose and got gas in the carb right away. Then advanced the carb all the way and it started right up. Aparently i was also one plug off on the timing so i rotated them on the cap one over and its perfect. Oh yea, what i call zero lash and what i was told was zero lash is when you tighten down the rocker just enough that you cant spin the push rod anymore. Is that correct? I was told to set them you go half a turn past that and that was what i had done. But it was holding my valves open. It was running great so i took it for a test drive for a mile. When i pulled back in the parking lot i let it idle and it did for a couple seconds then died, and wouldnt start back again. just bogged the starter real bad. I tried adjusting the timing just a little but the battery died to fast to try again. Tomorrow i will check to make sure the alternator is charging. And i will use the timing light to set the timing this time. What would be a good place to time it so it will run good and still be able to start descently when hot? I'm running 93 octane fuel and just over 10 to 1 compression.

**Charley Lillard** · 06-24-2005

No that is not ZERO lash... Zero is when it doesn't move up and down anymore before you start depressing the plunger in the lifter. You have plunged the lifter all the way and then opened the valve 1/2 turn. I would get the clips that snap on the rocker arm to keep the oil from spraying and adjust them running since you are this far. With it running, back off a rocker till you hear it clacking(means there is clerance between the and the valve)..Then slowly tighten till it gets quiet, then slowly tighten 1/4 turn or 1/2 turn..either one will work.

**1Bad68camaro** · 06-25-2005

And what about the timing? any ideas on what i should run? Is it dieing and not wanting to start again when hot a timing issue or fuel issue?

**Charley Lillard** · 06-25-2005

I would adjust the valves again before doing anything else. When it heats up , things expand and you are probably holding the valves open even more.

**Charley Lillard** · 06-25-2005

Decent timing would be 12-15 initial advance and 36 total at about 3K rpm. Every car is different but that is runnable.

**1Bad68camaro** · 06-25-2005

Ok, i'm going to reset the valves tomorrow. Can you give me a quick step by step on what you mean. I cant tell when they are at the zero lash you described. I know its better to do it with it running but my entire engine is silver, chrome, and polished. I'm really trying to keep from spraying oil all over it with the engine running. Is there much of a difference on it being right if its running or not? I've done alot of work on cars, but never got into the tuning part of it.

**Charley Lillard** · 06-26-2005

Stores like NAPA sell steel clips that snap over the rocker arm and cover the oil hole to keep the oil squirting to a minimum and then a pair of valve covers with the top cut off help a bunch also.
The lifter has a plunger or piston in it that is held in by a snap ring. The 1/4 -1/2 turn is basically using some of the travel of that plunger. Say the plunger has a total travel amount of 1/4", the 1/4-1/2 turn uses up some of that travel. That is when the clacking stops. If you use up all of the travel like I think you did you are then opening the valve with your wrench instead of waiting for the cam lobe to do it. If you want to do it without the engine running the goal would be to rotate the engine so the valve you want to adjust has it's lifter on the low spot of the cam and not lifting at all. Loosen the rocker till it is loose, slowly tighten it while moving the pushrod up and down until you have no up and down travel, then tighten 1/4 turn. A simple but slow way to find the low spot on the cam is to rotate the engine by hand and watch the rocker arm that you want to adjust. After you see it open the valve and go back down you are probably close enough to adjust that one. You are trying to make the adjustment when the cam is on the low part of the lobe.The part you have to pay attention to is making sure that your up and down movement is not plunging the plunger like I think you were doing before. Hard to explain but the idea is to remove any freeplay in the pushrod and then add just a tiny bit of plunger travel to keep the lifter on the cam and make things quiet. If you remove all the plunger travel and then some you end up opening the valve before the cam has a chance to. I hope this makes sense. I will PM you my phone # in case this just confused you more.

**1Bad68camaro** · 06-26-2005

thank you. i will be trying to do this tomorrow. it rained on me today. will call if i get confused. and thank you again for your help on this. Its nice to have others to help.

**Charley Lillard** · 06-30-2005

Have you had any luck ?

**1Bad68camaro** · 06-30-2005

Yea, a friend hooked me up with a local chevy guru that likes to tune them. He said they were already set well, i just got lucky i guess. The rocker noise i was worried about he says is normal and he showed me his 69 rs made the same noise. Anyway, the whole problem was my carb. Apparantly it has a bunch of rust in it and was jacking it up. We bolted it on his mild 350 and it was doing the same thing on his. Ordered a new Holley 750 with vacuum secondaries today and it will be here tomorrow. Will let you know as soon as i bolt her on and see how she does.

**1Bad68camaro** · 07-04-2005

Well she will idle descent now, but still wont run worth a damn. It was revving good and sounded great so i took it for a drive, made it about a block and it started bogging down like something was dragging behind me. Then it started popping out the carb a couple of times so i headed straight back home. By the time i got there it just died and wouldnt idle again. I have two inline fuel filters on it now so i know it isnt carb issues. I put on the new timing advance curve kit but it didnt help any. Any thoughts?

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Wont run, please help