Bogus traffic ticket

[cluxford]

On a forum down here in Oz a guy who got defected for a modified car made probably the best suggestion I have ever seen. Here you can be defected without proof. Yes. If a cop or anyone "thinks" your car is too loud, too low, or breaking the law you get defected (arrives in the mail). It's is up to you to then prove your innocence usually by going and getting the car inspected usually to the tune of a few hundred dollars. Oh and you cannot drive your car while defected, has to be trailed, so if you don't have a trailer = more expense towing. I know of guys defected literally driving past a police station, no one in sight, then 2 days later in the mail arrives a defect notice. Gets car inspected -al clear and legal but now out of pocket.

So the suggestion down here by one guy was if the defect is proven to be unfounded the person who brought the defect against the owner (cop or public) has to pay all out of pocket expenses themselves.



I love this as an idea, cause I am sick of the "prove you are innocent" rather than "prove you are guilty" nanny state we are heading towards....

[parsonsj]

My father-in-law and brother-in-law are cops. I've heard their stories many times.

Just look at the evidence in this thread. 3 separate reports of a cop lying. Many others saying not to sue, due to concerns about retribution. Look at the history of police corruption in New York City, Chicago, and LA. Thousands and thousands of cases all over the country.

It's not a pretty story, and thank goodness (in my case) for that dash cam. We teach our kids to trust the police, but most adults don't.

And don't get me started on the hypocrisy of speeding laws and its enforcement in this country.

jp

[Tony_SS]

I like the idea of these dash cams. I would love to see a cops face, if he pulled me over, approached my car and noticed that he was being recorded on my dash cam. lol! Whats good for the goose...

[parsonsj]

To be clear, I'm talking about the dash cam in the police vehicle. My lawyer was able to subpoena it in my case.

[Tony_SS]

To be clear, I'm talking about the dash cam in the police vehicle. My lawyer was able to subpoena it in my case.

I see. It sounds like he is talking about the cops dash cam in the OP too... if so, I wonder how he was able to get that footage..

[Blown73]

You can request the footage of the dash cam as evidence in your case. I don't know the legal jargon of how to acquire it, but if it is used against you in a court of law, you have the right to it.

[Six_Shooter]

Tell your wife to let it go or yourson, yourself, and your wife will be the focus of the local PD. It is done and the ticket is gone.

This^^^

I would also suggest letting it go.

I've been told a story about a guy that had a cop ticketed for an offense that he (the police officer) committed, I don't have time to get into details right now, but basically the civilian that had the officer charged was the target of the local P.D. and he couldn't drive onto a road way without getting harrased, is basically what happened. It's not right, but it happens.

[parsonsj]

You can request the footage of the dash cam as evidence in your case. I don't know the legal jargon of how to acquire it, but if it is used against you in a court of law, you have the right to it.

In my case, the officer didn't disclose the use of the camera, but lied repeatedly during my traffic court appearance. Afterward, I consulted with a local attorney, and he told me that it was possible there was a camera, he procured that evidence, and then we appealed.

Of course, I paid him well for his efforts. The whole ordeal cost me $1500.

jp

[Blown73]

In my case, the officer didn't disclose the use of the camera, but lied repeatedly during my traffic court appearance. Afterward, I consulted with a local attorney, and he told me that it was possible there was a camera, he procured that evidence, and then we appealed.

Of course, I paid him well for his efforts. The whole ordeal cost me $1500.

jp

I dont know of a cop in the world that would disclose the use of a camera that would let you off. But if you ask for it, they have to supply it. (of course, if the car isn't equipped with it then it's impossible)

A friend of mine got a DUI (dumbass) in San Jose. The cop originally pulled him over for wreckless driving and speeding in his 69 camaro. When he requested to see the tape, the officer told him that it was "lost". When his lawyer requested it again, it magically reappeared and he was not speeding or weaving in and out of traffic. Unfortunately for his luck, he was still driving under the influence and got pinned for that. But, there was no original cause in pulling him over after reviewing the tape.

[Gitter Dun]

I was making a right hand turn onto a two lane highway that turned into one lane after about 80 feet. My wife was in front of me and went first. I seen a car coming but I had plenty of room and pulled out behind my wife, she pulled into #1 lane and slowed up for me to pass her because I need to pull into the garage first. A highway patrol man passed her, sped up on my ass, and then hit the lights. I pulled over and my wife passed me and pulle over in front of me. When the officer came to my window I asked him what he pulled me over. He said that I failed to yield to on coming traffic. I told him he had to be out of his mind and that he pulled me over because he thought I was a kid in a hot rod. We began to argue and he asked me if I had something against cops. I told him no, I have something against *******s. He then asked me to go with him to his car and then proceeded to ask me if I had been drinking. I told him that he wished i'd been drinking because then he would have something valid to pull me over for. I told him he should have waited a bit and he might have been able to get me for speeding. He wrote me the ticket and I told him I'd see him in court. He never showed.

[bdahlg68]

For the many posts in this thread about abuse of power, I say file a complaint. For all the honest cops out there, they should be on your side. The problem is that there are probably so many frivolous complaints out there from people who really did wrong, that it then becomes the stereotype of more or less all people who actually file complaints against police are just trying to escape a citation. This is unfortunate, but it is reality and I'm not surprised given the general behavior of our population. Most of us on this site would typically side with the cops, but in these cases, they need to be able to decipher an actual concern from a stereotype. JMHO.

[DarkBuddha]

Look, I was given plenty of crap by plenty of cops back in my teens and early 20s for nothing more than being a big, young, metal head with long hair that drove a clapped-out muscle car. Sure, they always had some "legitimate" reason for pulling me over, like being 3 miles over the limit (in a 65mph zone), having a taillight out (bulb holder fell out the housing), or an "illegal left hand turn" (where I crossed the last foot the yellow line), or whatever. That's not the BS part of it... no, it was that they then always took every opportunity to search the car, detained me for an extra thorough check, tried to goad me into saying something stupid, etc. Hell, after stopping me for a lane change without a signal, I had to wait until a second unit showed up so they could search my car. The two cops purposely and provocative ruined several rolls of unexposed film in my face while searching my car for drugs for no apparent reason other than they wanted to be dicks (I had probably 20 film canisters in the car as I was a photo major at school at the time). That was $30 wasted that a poor college student (me) could've used.

The funny thing is that most of the time they ended up letting me go with nothing more than a "warning". But hell, I had no criminal record, no driving infractions, a 3.8+ gpa (in college), and was always respectful. What were they gonna do? The couple times I was ticketed, I went to court where either the cop didn't show up or the ticket was reduced to "court costs."

Now, am I saying all cops are dicks? No. I am saying that there may be a culture among law enforcement to target and lean on people that meet particular profiles and/or appearances. And since I seemed to fit those profiles/appearances and probably shared values with many of them, I got hassled for it. Back then I worried about it. Now I don't, and it's probably why I question any and all authority and claims to authority. Not all cops are dicks, but IMHO, if you're a cop that does that kinda **** and don't have the integrity or moral fiber to apologize for being wrong, then you're a **** and **** you. So go ahead, stop me... if you're a ****, I'll tell you so and I'll see you in court.

[The WidowMaker]

i drove the crap out of my car when i was younger and was pulled over no less than 10 times. i ended up with two tickets; exhibition of speed for doing a burnout (10k after 7 years of increased insurance) and a speeding ticket for running it thru first and second and coasting (70 in a 45 although my car maxed at 60 in 2nd). although i agreed with neither, the cops were more correct than i was. i wasnt driving my car like i should have been or how i would want someone else driving next to me.

i think some of you guys forget how difficult of a job cops have. some have talked about getting into pissing matches with cops. bad idea. they deserve respect and i would make your day miserable too if i was in their shoes and you blatantly disrespected me. would you talk that way to a judge as he was sentencing you? come on......

in my job, ive watched cops get spit on, hit, shot at, swung at with a knife, verbally assaulted etc. there is a reason that they have the attitudes that they do; they usually deal with the scum of the earth. and if you are profiled into one of those categories by your actions, well, God help you.

[parsonsj]

Same here. I got pulled over many many times during my late teens/early 20s. All kinds of bs reasons. Once I was following a cop home from college, and I was coming up on my exit. This was during the 55 mph stupidity and he was going 55 mph and stacking up traffic. We were in the middle lane, and I signaled, then moved to the right. The officer didn't look, didn't signal and nearly hit me with his sudden lane change (as I was speeding up to try enjoy the off ramp a bit more). Lights come on and he pulls me over from in front of me.

He told me I made an unsafe lane change. When I "mentioned" that I had signaled, checked my blind-spot and moved in a controlled way to the right lane -- none of which he had done, he came unglued. He started yelling, pulled his nightstick, and threatened to beat the crap out of me. Luckily, this was daylight on Highway 99 south of Sacramento, and dozens of cars were passing by. Then he searched my car, including looking under my hood and in my trunk, and finally let me go with a warning, after his rage had passed.

What an *******. Like Wyatt, that sort of thing happened to me all the time. I didn't street race, do drugs, or drive drunk. I was just a long-haired college student, and cops disliked me on sight.

jp

[The WidowMaker]

No. I am saying that there may be a culture among law enforcement to target and lean on people that meet particular profiles and/or appearances. And since I seemed to fit those profiles/appearances and probably shared values with many of them, I got hassled for it.

but if you were a cop and 9 times out of 10 you searched a guy like you described and found illegal drugs, how can you blame them? theres a reason blue hairs dont get searched and guys dressed like gangsters (not your example) do. it totally blows for the innocent guy that is being profiled, but imho thats what keeps our streets safer.

[parsonsj]

it totally blows for the innocent guy that is being profiled, but imho thats what keeps our streets safer.

I kind of get that for street crime and such. I reject that for cops doing traffic law enforcement. Why in the world would a cop make up a 100mph chase down a busy interstate about me? How is that keeping streets safer? My driving record was perfect. I was 43 years old, dressed in a suit on my way home from my office job. I was in a black 2001 Z28, and I can only guess he was into imports or something. That one still blows my mind. That dude should have been kicked off the force.

jp

[BonzoHansen]

^^not a lawyer^^ I think the term for getting the video is discovery. They have to share all evidence with the defendant. How it works I have no idea.

Same here. I got pulled over many many times during my late teens/early 20s. All kinds of bs reasons.

Hell yeah. Driving with no hood. Doing 28 in a 25 zone. Followed from one end of town to the other. Once I got 'you must have been speeding because I had to do 50 to catch you". Um, yeah, if you do the same 35 I was doing you'd never catch me. Simple math sir.

In the long run I figure it equaled out considering all the stupid things I did. And I got off with a lot of warnings in my day. Including 94 in a 55 zone.

[FMG CAMARO]

Just because your son got off on the ticket does not mean that the police officer lied. All it means is that your son could not be proved guilty beyond a reasonabale doubt. That is the burden of proof required no matter if it is a traffic ticket or a murder. A police officer only needs probable cause to arrest. This is why the district attorney's do not have a 100% conviction rate. Just because the violation was not on the dash camera doesnt mean it didnt happen. If a cop is parked facing northbound and turns his head to the left, now looking westbound the camera is still facing north. If the cop sees a guy blow someones head off should he not arrest because it is not on his dash camera? I doubt a cop is gonna totally make up a guy blew a stop sign when if he wants he can probable get 20 people an hour blowing said stop sign. If there was any inclination of the cop lying, there is a law called perjury and District attorneys would love to get a cop on that. I am not going to say that some cops dont lie. Everyone has a story about their sister's friend's cousin who was wronged by a cop. Blah blah blah. Just like people have been wronged by mechanics, parts vendors,contractors, doctors and so on. Bottom line is the service of police far out weigh the bad. No cops? What would the fatality rate be on america's highways? Would your hotrod still be in your garage? As far as making a complaint, the officers captain is just gonna piss on your back and tell you it is raining. Then your son will get wallpapered. Wallpapered means the cop will write your son so many tickets he can wallpaper his bedroom. Just be happy you beat the ticket and leave well enough alone. Dont let one bad experience taint your and your son's view of law enforcement.

[The WidowMaker]

Hell yeah. Driving with no hood. Doing 28 in a 25 zone. Followed from one end of town to the other. Once I got 'you must have been speeding because I had to do 50 to catch you". Um, yeah, if you do the same 35 I was doing you'd never catch me. Simple math sir.

In the long run I figure it equaled out considering all the stupid things I did. And I got off with a lot of warnings in my day. Including 94 in a 55 zone.

my 70 in a 45 was the same. instead of trying the math part in court, i went to traffic school and got it off the record. i was over the limit so he was only partially wrong.

how did you get off with the 94 in a 55? i have a feeling you started with a lot of "sirs".

I was 43 years old, dressed in a suit on my way home from my office job. I was in a black 2001 Z28, and I can only guess he was into imports or something. That one still blows my mind. That dude should have been kicked off the force.

maybe he saw a car like yours parked outside his ex wifes house. pretty outrageous that he would make that all up. but, there are bad apples. no profession is perfect. not one.

[DarkBuddha]

but if you were a cop and 9 times out of 10 you searched a guy like you described and found illegal drugs, how can you blame them? theres a reason blue hairs dont get searched and guys dressed like gangsters (not your example) do. it totally blows for the innocent guy that is being profiled, but imho thats what keeps our streets safer.

You conveniently left out the part of my quote that shows that I understand... up to a point. That point is when a cop doesn't show proper contrition when his decision and actions are proven unwarranted:

Not all cops are dicks, but IMHO, if you're a cop that does that kinda **** and don't have the integrity or moral fiber to apologize for being wrong, then you're a **** and **** you.

To quote Buckaroo Banzai: "Hey, hey, hey, hey-now. Don't be mean; we don't have to be mean, cuz, remember, no matter where you go, there you are."