Its Time For The Builders To Come Together And Stop This Crap

[Fesler built]

With the economy so bad and times getting harder and harder for some its time that builders come together and stop the BS with these cars that are being produced.

I see all too often these cars that have a huge price tag on them and a build level of not even ¼ of what someone paid for it. We are fixing more and more half ass builds out there and its getting ridicules. Someone out there somewhere has to care that they are spending good money for crap.

It’s time for everyone out there buying cars to wake up and do some research on what you are going to buy or build. Whether you are going to buy a car or the parts to build the car stop going to the cheapest guy on the market because you don’t always get what you pay for.

The problem is everyone wants a deal and just because the economy is down does not mean the deal is good. Stop going to these guys that sell cars out of their house or that build them on the side out of their house for fun. Not all guys that do this are bad but with more and more cars coming up like the ones pictured here and this one is the worst I have seen yet it’s getting bad and bad fast.

I get calls and calls to go look at a car or pictures with can you look this car over and let me know what you think. Well no I can’t not anymore because there are more scam artist out there than ever before.

I had a very good customer of mine that was looking at buying this car. Look over the pics and let me know what you think. (NO WE HAD ABSOLUTLY NOTHING TO DO WITH THE BUILD OR BUY) I got the pics too late to say anything.







Seems like a nice car, price is great around $35,000 no way you could build it for that. Drives nice, underside looks nice, paint is very nice, can’t seem to find any rust or bondo problems, interior is perfect, everything works.

So he bought the car thinking man what a great deal and great buy. He looked at hundreds of pictures of the car and yes this car was a full rebuild. Everything new on it.

Look at the pictures and see just how nice the car really is.

[Fesler built]

I have more coming just have to get the pictures loaded and will finish the story

[MrQuick]

don't tell me, its a coupe with a vert top bolted on?

The problem is Chris that body shops are body shops. They have been trained and taught that procedures go a certain way and that flat rate thinking will get you sub par work no matter where you go.

Most regular body shops still believe patch and bondo work is normal. I walked into a body shop that I thought was high end. Owner sat with us, seemed high end, quoted us $7k for a standard straighten, flat panel and paint job with block and buff. I walked out to the back shop to find them Por15-ing and fiberglassing a quarter panel. Not to my liking but normal in the industry right? Surprisingly yes. We walked out body shopless.

Remember Ned's Cuda job up north? That is normal work for a standard body shop. Very common to find.

If you want high end work body and paint as your shop, Prodigy and DSE we expect to pay $15-20k to get it. I am not sure the average joe can afford that type of work. But it all looks the same when the paint is on.

When in doubt seek the advice of a pro, even if it cost you a bit more.

Just to think, your customer could have saved a bunch of cash if he had waited for your advice. From what you saw from a few pictures.

Curious, what do you see? I asked my buddy and he says it looks cool.


Vince

[Fesler built]

Now to the sad part of this story, this car looked really nice and drove really well but the scum bags of today have really figured out how to take advantage of everyone so OPEN your eyes and know what you are buying.

They put bondo over every part of rust but just thin enough that the bodo gauges had a rough time finding it. The complete underside of the car was coated and covered and looks completely factory. The work looked great and the average person would not be able to find this stuff.

There are people out there that will spend a ton of time thinking up ways that they can take advantage of someone buy cutting every corner of a build to make more money. Hours are hours when it comes to building a car and if you are going to be serious about this in any way it’s time to stand up and put these people out of business.






Yes the car broke into two parts all the way accorss





Here are some simple rules for you guys to follow when it comes to looking into buying a car or parts for your car.

• If it sounds too good to be true it is, no one is going to give you something unless they are going to lose it to an EX.

• Check their backgrounds find out what they have done before and if people liked it

• If they just sell on EBay stay away everything we have seen from there is crap and every good deal from there has cost more than expected because of the scams

• Pull up the carpet look under ask for pics of that build area

• Ask for pics before paint if they don’t have them they did not paint it

• Ask for engine out shots if they painted it with the engine in you probably don’t want the car

• Ask for interior build shots see what and how they did it, I will post up some shots of what we see all the time

• Pull up carpet in trunk climb in and check all the rust spots

• Look for all panel replacement work

• Look over suspension make sure it looks like they have at least gone over it all and fixed any issues, if it looks old it’s not a rebuild it’s not a restoration it’s a quick fix to make a buck and a fast one at that.

• Check body alignment make sure the cars fits, check door gaps if they hit its not aligned right and that will cost you labor and paint to fix, check hood/trunk gabs make sure they are correct or it will cost you

• Check windows make sure they all work and no water comes in the car in rain, check seals make sure they are all new not old and rotten

• Check engine fluids all of them, remove the oil cap and check the oil feel it to see how old it is, check water, trans, PS and so on. Smell them to make sure they are not burnt

• But best of all use your judgment when buying a car, if the guy seems weird, strange or won’t answer certain questions clearly don’t buy it move on. You don’t need the headaches of a used car problem

• Now some of you can fix all this yourself so if you are up to it good luck.


I am just so sick of the idiots out there that think they can build a car and do it as good as the larger shops for half the money. There is a reason that guys go to big name shops because they in most cases stand behind what they do and they have a name that over time will let them know the car will still be worth something.
A great question to ask any shop that you are at is what cars go for that you build if people sell them. If they tell you that a certain car that you know cost let’s just say $500,000 and they sell it for $200,000 that is not a good investment. If the cars that sell get close to the build cost then you have a good builder if not then something is not right. Now in their defense not all cars are the right cars to build and some people just have more money they style so that can play a roll.

This same deal runs in the parts business and wheel business you usually get what you pay for so a $300 wheel is nothing like a $900 three piece wheel no ifs ands or butts about it they are nothing alike same with parts for the cars. If you think a guy can make parts for your car at half the price than anyone else on the market they are not good parts unless he is doing it from his garage and making no money. Not many people want to do that either. YOU GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR and if it seems to good to be true than watch out because you are going to have problems.

Maybe if we (builders and buyers) get together and work together and not against one another we can make this whole experience 1000 times better. Sorry for the long rant but enough is enough and everyone needs to wake up and stop buying crap.

[fbody_mike]

Wow, the car literally cracked in half!

It is a good thing someone did not get killed while driving it.

[Rod]

We have come across the same problems, I would say that part of most of the builds here START with repairs of previous work
(I.E. a car came in and they had cover the bottom of the car with duct tape and the under coated it and then on the inside dynamatted right over the rust?? on the floor??)
that was the main emphasis on having our own body shop now with the build shop to control that aspect of the build also
and you are RIGHT there is to much shoddy work out there for that cash in on the trend (if they sell on eBay only and haven't had a store front(brick and mortar) stay away!! they have no risk they pay there $1.50 to sell you a car!! think they care? they have no employees, inventory, no reputation to risk,

[6'9"Witha69]

I'd be showing up with a single jack and a cinder block!! That is terrible!!

[wicked68]

It is rediculous what goes on. I remember a guy asking me if I would sell my mustang at SEMA last year - I said - sure - he asked me - what do you want for it- I said - 350K. He said- no way are you crazy.

I told him - not really - its a special car to me. I then said - if you can wait I will build you one for 225k.

He goes on to tell me that he can hire his own builder and get it done for 150k. I told him - yes you probably can and you will have a car that will not be this good and you can drive it a few years from now because it will take you that long to get it done- test it and work out all the kinks. I advised him it is about 185 k in parts and labor wholesale and I would manage it and test it for him for another 40k out of the deal and guarantee it and that it would take me a year to get it all in and done and adjusted for him to be able to have a solid car. Its just not worth my time to f with it for less than that. I have to carry the cost of the parts and car etc and spend a lot of time and money on final setup and managed the shops actually doing the work which can be challenging in of itself (no offense guys ;) )

He still gave me that look I was smoking crack and told me he could get it done for less in less time. I bet he still does not have one or has even started on one. People are clueless on cars.

I know - because I used to have unrealistic expectations as well.

You know - all the awesome after market products that just bolt right on? lol

Its funny that people think a hand made production car is worth 300k or more but they dont think a hand made one of a kind custom costs that much.

[mc84_zz4]

Holy crap! I wonder how long they were able to drive it before it snapped.

[Mr.VENGEANCE]

Daaaaaaaamn

[406 Q-ship]

OMG!!! I thought I had seen some of the crappest work done to vehicles. That is a lawsuit, it was represented as a driveable car when it was not. I'm sorry but at 35k (overpriced IMHO) I would go over the car with a fine tooth comb (I noticed the door gaps in the original pics) or at least pay the cost of taking the car to a trusted shop to get it on a lift and pull the carpets and backseat. If the seller refuses RUN! the other way. If it is too good to be true then it is, but I don't believe that was such a great deal even if it was a nice quality resto. Really what is a nice restored 67/8 V8 Mustang Convertible worth.....IMHO not 35k in todays market.

[buickfunnycar.com]

Anyone who buys a car on eBay sight unseen deserves to be taken by these losers...they are there just to prey on the unsuspecting.

[Kenova]

With virtually all of the good shops using aftermarket parts and panels, would it be feasible for SEMA to set up some sort of shop certification program? I realize that there are still people looking for that "too good to be true" deal who could care less whether or not the shop is certified, but for those of us that do care it would make life a little easier and less stressful.
During the last 6 yrs. (almost) that I have been a member here, I have grown to appreciate what it takes to build a quality car. It is doubtful I'll ever be able to build something like Bad Penny, Fuel, or the One Lap Camaro, but when I do spend my money I want to know I'm getting some of the best work available.

Ken

[CruizinKev]

omg damn!!!!!!!

[Rod]

You know - all the awesome after market products that just bolt right on? lol

HEY! they all bolt on after the 33rd trial fit and a few elongated holes and a little blood as lubricant don't worry its only an hour job, right

[dadto2jays]

People expect perfection for pennies on a dollar. I have to agree that there are more hack jobs than there are great work. Down here in South Florida I attend many car shows and you do see some serious vehicles but you see more junk slapped together than anything else. There is only one builder downhere that I believe is the real deal "Miranda built" other than them there is none that I can think of.

[Steve1968LS2]

This happens at Best of Show all the time..

Guy comes in.. want's a quote.. let's say it's a full tilt stip, fix and paint.. they quote $20k (just a number I picked)..

He comes back saying XYZ down the street will do it for $8k..

Well I'm sure they will.. but you will get $8k worth. Hell, on a NICE paint job you can spend $4k and up on materials. On a second get they just painted the clear alone was well over a grand.

But people buy on price and then gripe about the quality instead of buying on VALUE.

The shop has gotten quite a few re-dos and aborted projects that were gettting hacked by some other low-bidder shop.

cheap, good, fast.. pick two.. lol

[Steve1968LS2]

Another thing people don't factor in is that a top notch cut and buff can run 40+ hours

Does someone really think they are going to get that with thier $8k paint job?

[tellyv]

At my shop the last 5-6 cars that left here they've won just about everything you can win around here and at the shows I'll go through a half a box of cards, then on monday they call and ask ''how much will this cost'' and I tell them that its time and materials or bring the car stripped for a quote, then they hang up. I just don't ever see anyone who wants to spend any money. Like the saying goes you get what you pay for!

[Takid455]

Another thing people don't factor in is that a top notch cut and buff can run 40+ hours

Does someone really think they are going to get that with thier $8k paint job?

No Steve, they think they are getting that with a $4500 paint job. I will say I have seen some shody things done to make a buck. While the builder is to blame, people do need to realize that nice things cost money. More often than not, I get ' so and so can do for less'. Maybe so, but but I will charge you double to fix so and so's screw ups. I get people asking me for lump sum cost for driveline builds and custom work. They even want me to match some guys lump sum price. I wont do it. to many uncertainties. Once I see they have no money and are shopping for the lowest cost, I typically respond '100k would do the job'. this is for stuff that would be around 10k conservative. That usually shuts them up.