Tips for DIY body work??

[Josue]

As some may have read, I'm a collision tech by trade. Been doing it full time for 7-8 years now. I've cut my teeth on MANY MANY complete paint jobs and even a handfull of slight restorations over the years, against my will pretty much. LOL Nothing to the extent of a complete, intensive restoration like the one I'm about to embark on though. (see sig) Usually, it was just some exterior patch work, and lots of mud. At the shop I was just at, I mudded the doors, top to bottom, edge to edge, and 1 fender on a '67 Comet Caliente, and hung them after paint. Did the same thing on a '56 Chevy too...

With my dad's '69 Firebird convertible, I'm gonna need to do the whole 9. New quarters, trunk extensions, inner quarters, floorboard work, firewall, etc. Was going to do skins on the doors, but to save $, I'm just gonna straighten them. I can get them pretty straight, and he doesn't need 100% show quality perfection.

I'm fairly confident that even though I've never done a ground up resto like this, I can still get it done. It's only metal right! haha I'm still looking for any tips you DIY'ers have for doing body work on these old cars. And if anyone's a body man as well, how do they differ from the new cars? I see all the pics on here, and it all looks like the same process for the most part...drill some spot welds, clean it up, fit the new part, weld it in, done...

I also had a question on the quarters. I always fit the adjacent panels before welding a new one on at work, but with this Firebird, everything is off, it's just down to a shell. Common sense is telling me, that I need to get the doors mounted and in the right place, to get my quarter gaps right....but, I'm not sure how far I should go with that? To get the door gaps good, should I mount the fenders too? The subframe is off, so I'd need to mount that, then the core support, then the fenders, and probably the hood to get the fender gaps good too. Or can I just get the door gap good and even with the rocker and then get good gaps to what's left of the quarter jamb? (only putting skins on) I see some of the builds on here, and people have their cars on jigs and all kinds of other stands/dollies, and it looks like they welded everything together without fitting the entire car like I'm thinking I have to....unless they just don't show that part of the process?

Naturally, if I can get away with doing less work, then I'd like to go that route, but I have no problem with assembling the whole car...it'd give me a change to get all the parts fitting right anyway. I just don't want to be doing it 50 times...LOL

[ssealeycpa]

The answer to what is the difference between the newer cars and an older one is RUST! You indicated that you had work to do on the firewall and floors, is this rust related and if so, are you going to replace the complete firewall and floor? If the answer is no and your rockers are good, I would put the body shell on at least 6 jack stands and set the car perfectly level (front to back and side to side). Mount your original doors and align them perfectly with the rockers and the quarter panels. Then install the trunk lid and align. Now do your work on one side at a time using the original door and trunk lid to align the gaps. I would assess the damage and if you can get away with it, I would recommend cutting the quarter with a cutoff wheel at the top body line and at the door opening and butt weld a skin in place taking your time to keep the heat down to minimize any warpage. Do one side at a time from start to finish and you should be good (a full quarter panel replacement is a pretty big job). If you do have to replace the firewall and full floor, this is a very big project (I am doing a 67 Camaro now and basically the only original parts will be about 85% of the door frame and A-pillar and that is all). You will need to brace the inside very well and cross brace everything and do sections at a time. I hope you don’t have to do what I have, but if so, you will need a new set of cobalt drill bits and a drill doctor to keep them sharp (I have tried all spot-weld cutters and have found a sharp drill bit works best for me. I also used a torch, air chisel, and a plasma cutter) Again I hope you don’t have to go this route but if you do, now is a great time to get a tetanus shot!

[Topless69]

Josh please keep us updated WITH pics. I may be doing some minor/medium body work soon and can use all the tips possible. These guys here are the bomb.

[ssealeycpa]

Josh and Jeoff,
I was in the same boat as you two back last December (I have done extensive body repair in the past but not to this extent on a unibody car) I lucked up and visited the website for Mike’s Custom Cars (A sponsor here). I highly recommend going to his site and seeing the extensive photo albums on his restoration projects. Once I saw how these cars went together it wasn’t too bad as long as you remember to brace everything and do sections at a time so that you do not jeopardize the structural integrity. I have gone back to his site for reference shots on how some on the panels fit (such as how the inner and outer rockers meet with the bottom of the A-pillar). Check it out – you won’t be disappointed! BTW, He makes a killer backseat to fit between the DSE deep tubs and I hope I will be ready to buy one in a couple of months.

[Josue]

The answer to what is the difference between the newer cars and an older one is RUST!

Hahahaha

You indicated that you had work to do on the firewall and floors, is this rust related and if so, are you going to replace the complete firewall and floor?

No, it won't need complete replacement, just patchwork. The firewall just needs some patching down by where the fender meets the rocker, behind the motor and all that is still solid. The previous owner already welded in a driver side floorboard....but there are still some holes that need patched. There's enough of the floor left that's still good, that I don't have to put a complete floor in.

If the answer is no and your rockers are good, I would put the body shell on at least 6 jack stands and set the car perfectly level (front to back and side to side). Mount your original doors and align them perfectly with the rockers and the quarter panels. Then install the trunk lid and align. Now do your work on one side at a time using the original door and trunk lid to align the gaps. I would assess the damage and if you can get away with it, I would recommend cutting the quarter with a cutoff wheel at the top body line and at the door opening and butt weld a skin in place taking your time to keep the heat down to minimize any warpage. Do one side at a time from start to finish and you should be good (a full quarter panel replacement is a pretty big job).

This is the news I was hoping for! haha So, assembling the whole car to weld quarter skins on is excessive/unecessary?

If you do have to replace the firewall and full floor, this is a very big project (I am doing a 67 Camaro now and basically the only original parts will be about 85% of the door frame and A-pillar and that is all). You will need to brace the inside very well and cross brace everything and do sections at a time. I hope you don’t have to do what I have, but if so, you will need a new set of cobalt drill bits and a drill doctor to keep them sharp (I have tried all spot-weld cutters and have found a sharp drill bit works best for me. I also used a torch, air chisel, and a plasma cutter) Again I hope you don’t have to go this route but if you do, now is a great time to get a tetanus shot!

It sounds like what I've been seeing around here! Just a skeleton of the original car is left. Ours is braced as well, being a convertible, this is the 1st thing the guy did...thank god. haha

Josh please keep us updated WITH pics. I may be doing some minor/medium body work soon and can use all the tips possible. These guys here are the bomb.

Absolutly! I like taking lots of progress pics, to share, and also for my own memories.


Dammit....these font changes are annoying!!! lol

Here are a few of what I'm working with...

See, I was wondering if I could just mount the doors on the car as it sits now, and then weld the skins on...



I need to cut that quarter off though, the guy welded it too low...luckily he didn't finish welding it, so it won't be bad and hopefully I can reuse it. He also did the inner quarter on that side, and it looks jacked up too....big globs of weld. ick...

Driver side rocker, below the fender



Passanger side door jamb...



He already air chiseled the passanger side quarter off, just need to trim it up.



Floorboard...I don't know WHY he would weld good metal on top of bad metal like this??????? I really don't want to redo this...we'll have to see once I get into it...



Passanger side floorboard, up by the dash...



Ick...

[Josue]

God......that last picture....look how bad all that fits right there at the bottom!? I might end up cutting all that off TOO. Crap...

[Josue]

Bump! Anyone else with some input?

[zzfranczz]

It would be cool to see an update on this one.

[Josue]

I've got plenty of pics, just need to upload them. lol I've been waiting to get more done on the car before posting an update, but it's looking like I'm going to miss my year-end goal of where I wanted to be with the car. I can't believe how hard it was to get out in the garage and get stuff done! I DO do this for 8 hours a day though, so it's hard to come home and essentially go right back to work. lol Ran into a bunch of snags too, with parts and equipment...

[69camarobuilder]

Josh,

I just joined this site, ironically i was looking through all kinds of post of things to do to my fathers 2010 camaro as far different body kits go. Not sure how far along you are in the project that you have been doing, however based on the pictures you, i know the boat that you are in. I just recently restored a 67 convertible camaro that was literally one of the worst cars that i have ever purchased. To put it plainly, the only salvageable metal on the that car were the rockers, firewall tulips, wiper panel, and inner fenderwells. I have built close to twenty of these cars personally, and had my hands on several other f-body cars of these years, so if you need any kind of tip whatsoever, be it body dimensions or anything (i have a factory spec book) just let me know.

[Josue]

Thanks, I appreciate the offer!

So far it's been kind of similar to the newer cars I work on at work, but much more of a pain in the butt because these aftermarket replacement parts don't fit worth a damn, it's hard to find all the factory spotwelds, and most of the metal is freaking thick! Not to mention the rust. haha

I also had an issue with the car sagging in the middle prior to me welding the floor up. I thought the car would be alright since there was bracing across the door frames, but maybe the previous owner did this after he had the car apart and already bent? Or maybe it was the dolly I had it sitting on? I put it on 6 jack stands, lined up the doors, welded the floor in, and it seems alright now. Still gonna have alot of work to get the door gaps good, but that's next season's project. (I'm not giving up my garage spot in the winter. lol)

[Josue]

It would be cool to see an update on this one.

Finally got around to updating my build thread. lol

https://www.pro-touring.com/showthre...d=1#post862330