Am I getting ripped off?

[blissbsm]

Im just curious if i am paying too much or if its in line with what everyone else is paying? I have a 67 firebird convertible that a high school friend of mine is working on for me. I have supplied all of the parts, he is just charging me labor. I gave him a deposit of 5k when the car was dropped off. We are replacing every body panel on this car! When i dropped the car off to him I was told the 5k should get me to the front clip, meaning floors,rockers,mini tubs,quarters and rear tail panel and trunk lid.
So far the rockers,mini tubs and quarters are installed and the rear tail panel is clamped on.
I was informed a few weeks ago that he is out of money and i need to come up with more cash for him to resume. I was also told that it would take another 20k -30k to finish.
Is this in line with what everyone else is charging? Mind you this shop is in upstate ny and this is by far his biggest build ever!

[Restomod]

Did you get that $5k quote on paper???

[blissbsm]

No he's a friend from school, plus im a hand shake kind of guy

[dhutton]

Sounds high but you don't say if it's ready for paint when he is finished or if he is just installing the panels. If it's just installing the panels that sounds high to me. Check out Mike's Custom Cars or Muscle Car Metal for comparisons. Both have websites.

[MuscleRodz]

$5K for what is done is not far out fo line dpending on how much per hour he is charging. The 20-30 number could be way out line depending on how far he thinks it will go.

[blissbsm]

I think he might be in over his head. Im thinking about pulling the car out of his shop and sending it to someone that does more of these builds.

[jy211]

Pull it now. Then find someone who knows what they are doing.

[BRIAN]

Everybody sees the cheap rust buckets and think they are cheaper to fix rather than start with a rust free car. Metal work is expensive if done right. If your car is set up on a dedicated bench and getting a real spot welded as per factory spec job $25 is not out of the question depending on how much paint work is being done. 2 tone? Undercarriage? Engine compartment? If you are using aftermarket panels it gets real expensive.

Again everyone see the cheap cost of aftermarket panels but they cost 2x as much to get on the car correctly.

If it is not a restoration shop pull the car. Production body shops make 10x the cash out of the spot that your car is taking up and just don't like resto jobs for that reason. Then there is the do overs and the never satisfied customer on a high dollar car.

Many good shops on this site. Take the initial loss and get the car done correctly the 1st time. You can have a $100k in parts and have a **** bucket in the end if the paint and metal isn't right. The worst thing you can do is have a car done by a friend. It just creates problem as he will always feel shorted on the cash end and you will have hard time discussing problems that occur.

GOOD LUCK

[MuscleRodz]

I think he might be in over his head. Im thinking about pulling the car out of his shop and sending it to someone that does more of these builds.

If you are already thinking that, pull it now, instead of later. You will be better off in the long run.

[blissbsm]

Easier said than done...car is 350 miles away

[oestek]

That's alot of work for $5000.00 in labor. Most shops charge upwards of $75 / hour, and that would give you less than 70 hours of labor for $5k. It doesn't seem like you agreed on an hourly, more of a lump sum for the work, but it takes hundreds of hours to do a complete re-body... heck, Frank Serafine will tell you it takes a couple hundred hours to get a car ready for paint, after the panel replacement is complete! Unfortunately, I think the only ripoff here is if you were led to believe all that work could be completed for $5k in the beginning. That seems extremely unrealistic, even for someone giving you a killer deal on labor.

[blissbsm]

Kevin, so is 20 -30 k a reasonable price to complete the body work?

[Restomod]

Whats cheaper, a 350mi ride or your car??????????????

[blissbsm]

Thats not my point...Im just not sure if im getting ripped off or not...according to kevin im not.

[oestek]

I can't say for sure or not without seeing the car, the quality of work, level of finish desired, gaps & alignment, etc., etc. All I am suggesting is that if you took a rusty tub to a shop and asked them to replace all the panels you requested, I could see how one could ring up a $25k bill. Especially if it includes rust removal / media blasting, panel alignments, extra gap work, etc. I don't know your car or situation, this is just my 3rd party observation. Heck, I've seen places charge $3500 for quarter panel SKINS for crying out loud.

[oestek]

To further answer your question, again, it depends on the quality of paint job you want, but a $10k paint job (including materials) is no longer considered an expensive paint job... materials are brutal... 2" wide rolls of 3M green tape now list for over $12 / ROLL at parts stores... and that's without any margin added for the shop. A good paint job (stripping / prepping / spraying backsides of fenders & stuff) will go through dozens of those alone. Plus labor. It gets steep. I wish the media would lend more coverage to the "true" costs of these things, instead of pushing how to get them done cheap... quality work and materials don't come cheap.

[mikey]

Really need some specifics on the work that he's going to do for the extra $$$$. To answer your questin accurately. You can also check out this site they post the prices right up front. I know nothing about the shops quality of work though.http://www.camarohouse.com It was temporarily down a few minutes ago so I'm not sure if the link will work.

[vintageracer]

Are you getting ripped off?

YES!

You should NEVER give anyone any money up front to work on your car. Why would you give anyone any money up front to work on your car when they already have recourse if you do not pay? That recourse is called a Mechanics Lein and is at the front of the line in virtually any state in the US to get paid FIRST or they can sell your car for charges via a state outlined process.

If the vendor wants the work your car said vendor can provide to their customer (you) a weekly bill for the work they ACTUALLY DO! That way the vendor is never more than a week behind in pay and you are never more than a week behind in paying for work on your car.

Paying a deposit up front, especially to a "friend", is the ABSOLUTE BEST WAY to lose a friendship AND never get the work on your car completed!

That's my opinion and you did ask!

[HOTRODSHOP]

Bottom line,,Cheap jobs are not good , good jobs are not cheap,,

[Tony_SS]

No he's a friend from school, plus im a hand shake kind of guy

You might not be one anymore after this deal... Get it all on paper before you go any further or pull it now before things go really sour.

x2 on what Mike said.

FWIW the place that painted mine, gave me quote, everything on paper. I saved up and they still honored that quote 2 years later! They did not ask for a penny up front and I paid in full on completion.