Sub-frame from ECKLERS

[jpierson77]

has anyone tried this or know anything about this for the first gen F body?http://http://www.ecklerscamaro.com/...dept%5Fid=1803
Good price if its any good. The other front ends Im looking at is the Global west cat5 or the dse speed kit three. Any comments on these two would be appreciated.
thanks

[68Formula]

It's a Heidts subframe. http://www.heidts.com/heip43.htm#camframe

A search in this forum might come up with some stuff.

[jpierson77]

Thanks for the reply

[josh@scotts]

have you ever considered a scotts front end ?


www.scottshotrods.com

[TBART70]

looks nicer than mine.

[josh@scotts]

who did you go through?

[hotrdblder]

those body mounts look dangerous, what is the camber curve and bumpsteer numbers?

[josh@scotts]

dangerous? what do you mean? i can get you the numbers tomorrow at work ,just curious do you think the bumpsteer is less on a stock frontend? just so you know are front ends are in perfect angle with are a-arm points and rack pivot points. are ball joints are 2 inch for more travel, and this front end shown has solid stainless steel arms! for extra rigid and more use of the shocks instead of a-arm flex. camber curve is fully adjustable to your preference , but i know there is very minimal change in toe and camber ive seen these front ends with air bags and have seen little change between 0 and 12 inches of travel!

[silver69camaro]

camber curve is fully adjustable to your preference

Adjustable FVSA? I assume you mean static camber, right?

[hotrdblder]

he has to mean static, i doubt he knows what camber gain per inch of travel really is, but i would love to see or hear the numbers.
the reason the body mounts look dangerous is there is no triangulation to tie the mount area back into the frame, all that is welded is fore and aft, a good shot to the front would fold those over

[silver69camaro]

the reason the body mounts look dangerous is there is no triangulation to tie the mount area back into the frame, all that is welded is fore and aft, a good shot to the front would fold those over

Look at the first photo. It shows the body mounts with a plate welded to the back. It appears the last photo possibly isn't a completed frame. Judging by the first pic, it looks OK.

[hotrdblder]

looks to me like the last pic is complete and ready for shipping, and all the pics look a bit different.

[josh@scotts]

hey you guys i appreciate the tech questions ,its been awhile since ive read a front end book , but i do know the difference between static and camber gain per inch is ,but im serious guys ive been around suspension shops my whole life griggs racing,raceplace, jim hall sr, mckenzie racing ,and ill tell you i may not be a suspension engineer but i know the difference between a stock front end and one that has less than 2 degrees negative of camber change in 12 inches of movement !! im not saying this front end is the best front end in the world ,but i will say that it is the highest quality frontend available for the money!!

[TitoJones]

Wait-

You are telling me that the frame you just posted up has LESS than 2 degrees of total neg camber over a 12" suspension travel? That is terrible!

Why measure 12" of travel? These are pavement pounding muscle cars, not class 9 off road trucks; they have about 4" of usable travel in them total.

Here is what I would like to know:

Spindles- where are the from, what are they made of, what brake systems do they support?
What is the recommended alignment settings for that frame for a street car?
What is your bumpsteer figure? (Don't even think about saying zero, because that is not a possible number.)
what is your neg camber gain per inch of travel?
How much caster can you get out of the frame?
What kind of turning radius does it have compared to stock?
Can you fit wider than a 8.5" wheel up front without rubbing?
Where are your engine mounts?
What brand of shocks/springs?
What is the spring rate you recommend for SBC? BBC? LSX?
Will factory crossmembers bolt up without modification?
Are the framerails narrowed?
Will factory type headers fit?
You mentioned the arms are Stainless- what material type?
EDIT: One more- What is the track width compared to factory?

I know, lots of info to bring to the table. We as a group like hard data vs marketing hype, so research this stuff and get back to us.

Welcome to the site.

Tyler

[hotrdblder]

Wait-

You are telling me that the frame you just posted up has LESS than 2 degrees of total neg camber over a 12" suspension travel? That is terrible!

Why measure 12" of travel? These are pavement pounding muscle cars, not class 9 off road trucks; they have about 4" of usable travel in them total.

Here is what I would like to know:

Spindles- where are the from, what are they made of, what brake systems do they support?
What is the recommended alignment settings for that frame for a street car?
What is your bumpsteer figure? (Don't even think about saying zero, because that is not a possible number.)
what is your neg camber gain per inch of travel?
How much caster can you get out of the frame?
What kind of turning radius does it have compared to stock?
Can you fit wider than a 8.5" wheel up front without rubbing?
Where are your engine mounts?
What brand of shocks/springs?
What is the spring rate you recommend for SBC? BBC? LSX?
Will factory crossmembers bolt up without modification?
Are the framerails narrowed?
Will factory type headers fit?
You mentioned the arms are Stainless- what material type?
EDIT: One more- What is the track width compared to factory?

I know, lots of info to bring to the table. We as a group like hard data vs marketing hype, so research this stuff and get back to us.

Welcome to the site.

Tyler

perfect!!

[LONE*STAR]

man...I love you guys!!!

I have been wanting to select one of the many front ends out there for my Bird but really would like to see the PT experts on our site come close to a concencus to what is the best all around full feature set-up out there... It really would help us less engineering familar guys figure out whats best for our ride, without being sucked into markting hype like you stated. Keep up the good work fellas.

[Mr.VENGEANCE]

AME and DSE thats all you need to worry about..

[LONE*STAR]

Does ame= Art morrison and I thought he is out of a shop and might not return? I read that in some posts, I am familar with the DSE units although all said and done from hub to hub you will nearly spend $9k am I wrong? Is the speedtech frame going to compete with these two formentioned units. If price is a serious concideration and hard street driving and safety are top of the list then are some of the more affordable option acceptable or will two much tech or geometry be sacrificed? sorry for the thread jak just seemed like the right moment to pose some serios noob questions.

[dhutton]

You might want to check to see if the AME and DSE will work with your Pontiac 400. I'm not so sure that they will. Most aftermarket clips only support SBC, BBC and LSx. The Chicane LM might be the way to go there.

I received my Art Morrison clip last week. The workmanship and quality is excellent.

Don

[silver69camaro]

Does ame= Art morrison and I thought he is out of a shop and might not return?

Art's been in the business for about 35 years and wont be quitting any time soon. I think you're confusing him with Wayne Due.

Tyler, he goofed about the camber. He's talking about toe change.