DSE Subframe official price

[Bill B.]

I see that DSE has officially put the price of their subframe on their website at $6700. I think some other folks had mentioned that it would be somewhere around this price.

Does anyone know what that includes?

Shocks?
Rack & pinion?
Brakes?

Bill B.

[Doug Cooper]

Kyle and Stacey had told me in Columbus that $6,700. includes everything but the brakes

[trapin]

Kyle and Stacey had told me in Columbus that $6,700. includes everything but the brakes

Tag on $3000 for some fancy Baer brakes and after taxes you've got $10,000 in just your front suspension alone....Wow! That's some serious coin. But I still haven't seen the numbers to prove that these aftermarket systems are any better than what Pozzi has stretched around a track. Who knows, maybe they are. But until then, I'll stick with the stock stuff. If Jeff Scwartz can backhand the competition in an '82 Fleetwood, then it's a safe bet the frame my car came with will do just fine.

In any event, I wish them the best of success with it. I hope they sell the hell out them. And I'm sure they will, no doubt it's a work of art in person. Still got a lotta love for that little company down in the Carolinas.

[Stuart Adams]

No need for the duct tape, you already spoke your mind, little late for tape. Bill wanted to know what the sub came with. Kinda like saying FU to someone then saying I love you two seconds later.

[trapin]

Why the edit. Didn't hurt my feelings, Bill asked a simple question and it was already answered by someone else. What did you expect to accomplish by bashing the piece and price?

Don't insult my intelligence by telling me what a message board is, but then again your just commenting and I'm just back patting, right?

God here we go again. I am not insulting your intelligence, take it easy. Where is it written that unless you're gushing or heaping praise on someones product that you're not allowed to say anything about it? I did not "bash" their product, all I did was balk at the prospect of dropping that kind of money for a complete system...is that some kind of crime I'm not aware of? Did I say you shouldn't buy it? Did I say you were crazy if you buy it? HELL NO. To each his own, and God bless.

I understand your sensitivity to DS&E Stuart because they've done a lot of work for you, but don't ever try to paint me as a hater. Kyle and Stacy are the best in the business. I have known Stacy for a number of years from her days at GM and Kyle has been great everytime I've dealt with them. I have purchased several products from them in the past and will definitely purchase more in the future. I love Detroit Speed.

Good Lord...its getting to the point where you can't say anything short of praise or adulation without someone jumping down your throat around here.

[z4me69]

i saw it at the street rod nationals and it is awsome put it this way there is not another aftermarket sub that will be under either of my 69s just waiting for it to be available

[trapin]

Stuart...a message board is a place for commenting not back patting. A discussion was begun on the DS&E subframe...I merely stated my opinion on it...like I have a right to do. Sorry if it doesn't jive with your opinion. I would never bash Kyle and Stacy...please don't misconstrue my tone inflection. If it helps I've edited it a bit.

[Stuart Adams]

Why the edit. Didn't hurt my feelings, Bill asked a simple question and it was already answered by someone else. What did you expect to accomplish by bashing the piece and price?

Don't insult my intelligence by telling me what a message board is, but then again your just commenting and I'm just back patting, right?

[novanutcase]

Sorry Stuart but I have to side with TRapin on this one. He is just stating that there aren't numbers to prove that this system is any better than stock. If YOU can provide those numbers and they show a marked improvement then T and I will be more than happy to apologize to you and whoever else was insulted because we spoke our minds. I'm sure DSE's system is great but I think the question that Trapin is posing is HOW MUCH BETTER! Is it really worth the money for the typical 99% street driven, 1% track driven car to go this route? Until we have the numbers that question cannot be answered. Sure it looks pretty and we all know the reputation that DSE has in terms of quality and performance but again numbers are what will be the deciding factor here.

[SatisTraction]

the more i hang around on this site the less i like "pro touring". it really is more like PRO SHOW and PRO MONEY!!! it really is kinda sickening.


now onto the subframe. it does look nice and would make your pro whatever car a notch above the others at the car show. now on the track, which most of thse cars never see, it may be better but that has yet to be proven.

[chicane67]

the more i hang around on this site the less i like "pro touring". it really is more like PRO SHOW and PRO MONEY!!! it really is kinda sickening.


now onto the subframe. it does look nice and would make your pro whatever car a notch above the others at the car show. now on the track, which most of these cars (will) never see, it may be better (looking) but that has yet to be proven.

I couldnt agree more.

[Bill Howell]

the more i hang around on this site the less i like "pro touring". it really is more like PRO SHOW and PRO MONEY!!! it really is kinda sickening.


now onto the subframe. it does look nice and would make your pro whatever car a notch above the others at the car show. now on the track, which most of thse cars never see, it may be better but that has yet to be proven.

I think it has, actually with DSE's blue test mule. If is hasn't yet, it will be, here, at our event, in two weeks. This part is definately Show AND Go.
Also, not every car here is about the promoney. I have just finished up on my malibu, and am looking forward to seeing how it stacks up against some high buck builds at our event. The total cost to build it is under 25K and hopefully it will show up some of the higher dollar cars.

Sorry to highjack the thread.
I have however seen the DSE frontend up close and personal and I really liked it. I have never bought anything from DSE, since I have not built a first gen camaro lately, but I really like the looks and performance I have seen out of their mule.
Again, we can debate/bench race parts, money spent, and pros /coms about them, or we can put them on the track and see the difference. I can not wait till we can see some real world comparisons between say DSE and Lateral Dynamics. Hopefuly next year, we can have that here at our annual event. Rather than argue about the parts, I think we should all be glad there are companies out there striving to make more and better parts. Until a couple months ago, us G-body guys did not have much in the way of suspension upgrades, but thanks to ATS we now have spindles that also lend themselves to brake upgrades. Yes, they cost more than the well known B-body conversion, and yes, I surely hope ATS makes money on them. That way they can create more neat peices. While I do think you can build a quality peice without breaking the bank, if you do go that extra step, and buy upgrades, I prefer spending my money on parts that have been well engineered and tested, rather than save a buck on knock offs. Does it cost $6700 for DSE to build a front clip, of course not. However, I am sure they will have to sell many copies before they break even on their investment in time, design, research and hydroforming. Will they make a profit sooner or later? Let's all hope so, so they can stay in business and make more cool parts. Who knows, maybe they will start doing some G-body stuff one day.....lol
Remember guys, PROFIT is not a bad word. It is what has made American great for over 200 years now.


<--off soapbox now.

[trapin]

Actually, I re-read my initial response to Stuart and it was a little condescending. For that I apologize.

[Steve1968LS2]

Please.. let's not have another discussion on "MONEY".. Different rides cost different amounts for different reasons. Sometimes a part is bought based on asthetics, sometimes on performance.. sometimes even for both (and that's where it gets REAL expensive). I've seen super low buck cars that I love (Alcino's Mustang, Lowbucks Nova) and high-dollar stuff I dig (Johnson Cuda, Fuel).

The variety is what makes the hobby fun. If you can afford the high-dollar stuff then go for it, if not then do your own thing. Either way the goal is to have fun and not to worry about what "joe blow" is doing to his ride.

If this thread gets all snotty I will lock it faster than you can say "whatchatalkinabout"

[trapin]

Different rides cost different amounts for different reasons. Sometimes a part is bought based on asthetics, sometimes on performance.. sometimes even for both (and that's where it gets REAL expensive). I've seen super low buck cars that I love (Alcino's Mustang, Lowbucks Nova) and high-dollar stuff I dig (Johnson Cuda, Fuel). The variety is what makes the hobby fun. If you can afford the high-dollar stuff then go for it, if not then do your own thing. Either way the goal is to have fun and not to worry about what "joe blow" is doing to his ride.).

I couldn't agree more, Steve.

People have to remember though, that whenever you ask a question about a product on a message board (especially this one) it's going to naturally open a discussion about it. And there's nothing wrong with that as long as that discussion is civil. But I don't condone bashing people for what they do or the money they spend.

[Steve1968LS2]

I couldn't agree more, Steve.

People have to remember though, that whenever you ask a question about a product on a message board (especially this one) it's going to naturally open a discussion about it. And there's nothing wrong with that as long as that discussion is civil. But I don't condone bashing people for what they do or the money they spend.

Hey, I agree.. the board is about the free exchange of ideas and thoughts.

Not all products are going to be for all people.. that's why there's eleventy billion companies making suspension parts (of various costs) for first gen f-bodies.. lol

[Stuart Adams]

Tony, no big deal. If I overreacted about DSE new sub I apologize. Their new subframe consists of very expensive engineering. I guess I just have problems with people bashing prices of products, cars, etc., I don't think it provides a healthy environment.

[jeffandre]

This site has changed, for the better in some ways, but anytime you have a 'society' that experiences the percentage of growth like this one, coupled with the fact that we all deal with each other through a keyboard, there are bound to be growing pains and occasional hurt feelings.

I remember the first time someone sent me to Corner Carvers for some info, I was blown away that people actually treat each other so poorly. We can accomplish much more by being civil and remembering that it is we who choose to take things personally. If someone criticizes me or is harsh towards me, I look at it as their problem and choose not to make it mine. I still check out Corner Carvers occasionally, I just act like the harsh treatment doesn't exist.

And Bill makes a great point, we need companies competing against each other to make awesome parts, and if they are priced out of the range we would consider, at least there is hope that the tech will become affordable for guys like me in time.

We make this site what it is, and it is up to us to keep our heads up and enjoy the wealth of knowledge and feedback for what it is, a goldmine that was never available to previous car crafting generations. I'm off my soapbox now, so let's continue having fun!:3gears:

[trapin]

Tony, no big deal. If I overreacted about DSE new sub I apologize. Their new subframe consists of very expensive engineering. I guess I just have problems with people bashing prices of products, cars, etc., I don't think it provides a healthy environment.

I'm with ya, Stu. If someone were to rip DS&E and call them crooks or their products junk, I'd be one of the first to jump on the back of their neck and start pulling their hair. And I'm sure that hydroforming process is not cheap either. It's all good.

Actually if you think about it....with Wayne Due closing shop, a huge chunk of the market has fallen right into Detroit Speed's lap. They could stand to make a killing on these frames. 21st Century is the only competition out there that I know of, you don't see too many people running the Martz Chassis or Art Morrison stuff under these cars.

[MStennes]

I'm with ya, Stu. If someone were to rip DS&E and call them crooks or their products junk, I'd be one of the first to jump on the back of their neck and start pulling their hair. And I'm sure that hydroforming process is not cheap either. It's all good.

Actually if you think about it....with Wayne Due closing shop, a huge chunk of the market has fallen right into Detroit Speed's lap. They could stand to make a killing on these frames. 21st Century is the only competition out there that I know of, you don't see too many people running the Martz Chassis or Art Morrison stuff under these cars.

Art Morrison, is picking up Wayne Dues sub. I for one would love to have a DSE sub, but after all the work I have done on my stock ut modified sub is it worth it for wider tires and once a year to the track? I'm still thinking than I have to figure what to do with my old one. But somehow there will be a DSE under one of my first gens.