PT Race Car Builds On The Way Out???

[vintageracer]

Spent a week + in Scottsdale at the January foolishness fun of buying and sellin!

Naturally there was a lot of talk about PT cars in the bunch I run with and people I know. The scuttlebut talk was about the trend the last 2 years about building dedicated PT autocross/race cars. Many of the builds have certainly been over the top, kool to look at, fast with a TON ON MONEY spent on them and an ole C3 Corvette STILL BEATS EM ALL! The consensus among everybody I spoke is that the trend of building these over top type of race PT cars/trucks is heading out the door and the builds in the future will still be nice and go back to reflect overall PT theme of modifying an old car into a modern car but move BACK to more driveable, street friendly, useful and family friendly builds.


Whatta Ya Think????

[cornfedbill]

I have always been a fan of street driven PT style cars. I don't get as excited about trailer queens and purpose built cars.

The most impressive cars drive to work during the week and compete in autocross and track events on the weekends.

My plan is to have a full interior and to drive to work on days when the roads are not covered in white stuff...

[CampbellshotrodsAZ]

I do think that all out purpose built PT cars won't command high dollars, much like spending big dollars on a drag car won't net you big money. Both cars are purpose built race cars, and not necessarily fun to drive off the road coarse. There are many of those purpose built cars on here that won't bid up to record dollars, but then again, these cars aren't built for revenue, they're built to race. The high dollar PT cars at Barrett are more street based with nicer plush interiors, good stereos, A/C, etc. I don't know if the over the top PT race type builds are headed out the door, since I don't know if they've ever been the "in" thing at auctions like this. What works at the race events, and what sells at auctions are two very different breeds IMO.

[chocthunder]

Most over the top PT cars are built by venders to showcase their products or by shops to showcase their skills. These cars are bought by people that want a turn key car.
I feel safe in saying, that is not the roots of the PT world. I enjoy improving my car a little at a time and seeing the results. I want my car to reflect my vision whether the work is done by a shop or myself. IMO, that is the true roots of the PT world.

[SSLance]

I rode in this car on an autocross course, the owner entered it in a Solo School I taught in.

http://www.barrett-jackson.com/Archi...N-TURBO-180018

While a very beautiful car that sold for a pretty premium dollar, it wasn't anywhere near ready to be fast on an autocross course. It might have had a lot of the right parts on it, and obviously had a lot of power...but it was basically undriveable in anything other than a straight line. The owner and the builder were both shocked when they went for a ride in my little old car and neither one of them have been back to race with us since.

To me anyway, PT cars can be both show cars and go cars...but the difference between them is huge.

[will69camaro]

I think I'm building a car to be what I want. But then again, i'm not building mine to ever sell...

[Arrowhead]

Timely post. I'm in the very early stages of a truck build. I looked for over a year to find the truck I wanted and grabbed it and a second one just in case. I kind of want to push the envelope and develop some of more fab skills with this one. So since it's going to be a while till I can actually start work on it, I've been going back and forth between a PT and a track truck. I want to build something over the top, but have to ask what am I really going to do with it and what serves that purpose best. Is there such a thing as being purpose built for Goodguys? HaHa. I really don't see me trailering it to a real track and doing 130 MPH, but driving 12 hours to Columbus Goodguys and running the autocross would be the goal (and driving home again).

[Gratefuldiver]

Maybe I'm wrong but it seems like these over the top cars are built for customers but those very cars sit in the showrooms of the shop that built them. That GTO that Kindig It Design build for example. OCC was the same way. Maybe it's just TV purposes.

[groho]

been to B/J a couple of times now, and what I see are two separate groups, the ones looking for an investment, museum quality, #001 builds, etc, or the resellers. The resellers are the ones that buy early weds, thurs, fri morning, will drive the car for a couple of years and dump it for a profit. The individual buyers for the personal long term are not that frequent (JMO). The specialty cars like PT builds and purpose builds definitely don't see a good return on the investment. Theres a big difference between restomods that are lowered with big wheels and lots of chrome, and a PT build that demands high dollars for suspension and drivetrain (+/- $80-100K). The PT C2's and C3's with modern drive trains are collecting respectable dollars but still don't see it at the level where you would break even. So personally, I don't think the buyers at B/J or Mecum appreciate the level of detail and quality in a PT build. Sticking with a drivable street friendly build is focused on keeping the investment cost down: restomod. I personally believe the cost of a PT build will prevent it from taking off at these auctions.

[ModernMuseum]

Most over the top PT cars are built by vendors to showcase their products or by shops to showcase their skills. These cars are bought by people that want a turn key car.
I feel safe in saying, that is not the roots of the PT world. I enjoy improving my car a little at a time and seeing the results. I want my car to reflect my vision whether the work is done by a shop or myself. IMO, that is the true roots of the PT world.

This.

To me, the PT world is divided up into three categories, more or less, with no distinct delineation between them:

• Ring Brothers style - over the top, incredible fabrication, mega $$, impeccable craftsmanship, innovative fabrication, will hardly be driven or raced
• Weekend warrior types with a project or two. Probably won't race them, but build a slick PT car with new guts
• Racing crowd, which can be an all-out streetfighter style with no frills or some combo of the above

I see the second two as being the fruit of the PT world, with no preference either way. Both have their place. All three categories are incredibly awesome though. I'll never have a super high end car or an all-out brawler race car, but I'll for sure take some ideas from all three categories and implement them onto my ride(s), pending funds of course.

[1965gp]

Those guys that bought Tues during the day and Wed had some deals to choose from! I was shocked to see what $15-25k could buy there.

On the high end cars I was surprised at a few-

This car had an amazing amount of fab work. LT-5 twin turbo (yes, LT-5!) and it sold for 110k. This car had over 100k in parts, let alone the work to build it. True, it may have been dated but certainly not out of style.

http://www.barrett-jackson.com/Event...N-TURBO-178488

[Bill Howell]

I have been saying it for a year now Mike. The over the top builds have moved on from Pro TOURING and moved into the race car segment. It isn't pro TOURING if it never TOURS!
Nothing wrong with doing what you like with your car, just call it what it is, that is all.
My current build is being purposely built as a driver, no racing for this one at all. I see and hear from people all the time that are doing the same thing. The hobby is fine and the segment is great, just need to be sure we call all builds what they really are and intended for.

[icemanrd19]

to me i want a stock looking but modified car, new suspension and modern touches. To me my car is the perfect balance. Interior will look stock with vintage looking recaros and 3 point seatbealts, suspension dse, modern drivetrain, modern but stock brakes etc

My car is a stock 67 camaro not a 67 camaro stock parts car if that makes sense.

Stock engine from a car
Stock brakes from a car
Stock E-brake assembly
Stock interior

[bergers59]

I am much more of a fan of autocross/race oriented pro touring vehicles with street being thrown in as an afterthought than their show/street driven counterparts. I personally think that its boring to have a first gen camaro or mustang that handles and brakes "just like a new car" with a/c and adjustable bmw seats. If you want that get a new car, 19 or 20 inch wheels included!

[Schwartz Performance]

Hey not all vendors have over the top racecar builds.
I keep thinking of Josh Leisinger in his "C2" carbon fiber body Vette. That one is over the top and isn't too practical on say the Hotrod Power Tour.
Our 65 Pontiac Tempest has always been a tough competitor, and it looks like a racecar but isn't, besides the fact it doesn't have AC and not much of an interior.

I don't think the pro touring race cars are on their way out... Most of us are men and that means competitive in nature. Heck I suppose that can be said for women too
However, more people want to get involved in the sport, so I think there is a larger group that doesn't have the money to build an over the top car; but there are still going to be guys pushing the envelope and have money to do so.

-Dale

[WallaceMFG]

In my opinion, there is a point when it's no longer a pro touring car and becomes a race car. For example, one time at a good guys show I saw a first gen Camaro that was in progress out running the autocross. It was a nice looking convertible, and I was impressed until it pulled into the pits. He was building a giant metal cover that covered the entire interior except for the drivers seat. Many people would consider this a pro touring car based on its looks and parts, but in my book it's a race car. Also, if it can't comfortably go over a speed bump that pretty much makes it a race car to me. Just my thoughts

[jeff s]

Every car I saw with an aftermarket chassis and efi engine sold for more money than those without.
I was happy with this:
http://www.barrett-jackson.com/Archi...N-TURBO-180304

[72BBSwinger]

My car has a cage, 8 point, and full interior and modern engine and 6 speed. Still on leaf springs and torsion bars. I want see just how competitive a stock suspension Mopar can be. Dont care what cliche it fits in. I want a car that can do it all very good with a 1972 skin and looks.

[Interceptor5588]

Tell you what, when it comes time to hit the track I'm much more comfortable out there with my $10,000 track mule than I would be with a $50k GTO build. Who really wants to push their pride and joy and years of blood sweat and tears to the limits with concrete barriers inches from your mirrors? I think we all put so much into our builds that they are better enjoyed on the open road anyways. My point is, PT builds have become so overbuilt in most cases that at the end most guys are afraid to hit the track with them . . . so they just Tour.

[NOT A TA]

Who really wants to push their pride and joy and years of blood sweat and tears to the limits with concrete barriers inches from your mirrors?

Me. I'm looking forward to having my drivers side mirror literally inches from the wall in turn one at Sebring as soon as I get my car back on track.