Ultimate Street Car Association - 2014 rules

[mpozzi]

Brian and James ...

Very well said. I'd add one more and that's NO tire warmers ... period. Our cars are not baked potatoes! And drop that word "racing" from your vocabulary. Forget it exists for these events as the fact that a time is posted doesn't make this racing.



Mary Pozzi

[ZMANSZR1]

Jim,
The results from all the 2013 Qualifier events don't seem to support your comments on the stock suspension and sub-frame cars, unless we are putting 5th gen Camaros and Nissan GTR's into that category. I see that you are running an aftermarket sub frame....just an observation.

I wasn't going to comment anymore on the rules, but I just can't help myself now. I am just looking for clarification on what will be deemed a "race car" and what is a street car. I understand all too well that writing a rule book is a lengthy process and requires a great deal of time and brain power. In quite a few racing series that I have competed in, they would have round table discussions with car builders and discuss what should or should not be in the rules. This is a big help to everyone, as nobody want's to get sent home, or have to build another car.

As a car builder, who is in the process of building a few cars to compete this season, I am concerned that our cars will be deemed "race cars" and not allowed to compete.

"Vehicles built specifically for competition or race cars with license plates” are not within the spirit of the series and will be scrutinized before entry. USCA officials will make the final determination of eligibility"

I am in no way slamming anyone here, but as a car builder, we need to have a little more to go on here. Give us the rules and we will build a car that will compete. We just don't want to see any of our customers sent home, that's all. Plain and simple.

My suggestion of an unlimited class was just a thought to help some of the underfunded guys, not to create a bunch of different classes.

I am aware this is not the world of wheels....LOL.. but our cars win there too.

[ZMANSZR1]

John,
I agree with your thinking. The idea here should be to expand the hobby, and not turn people away.

[NOT A TA]

John,
I agree with your thinking. The idea here should be to expand the hobby, and not turn people away.

Well, I've been turned away. I'd really hoped my car would fit in but it doesn't. I wanted to go to the Daytona and Sebring events with no concern as to whether there were winners, losers or OUSCI invites just so I could finally share the tracks with other similar old cars. Instead I'll just go run with NASA or another group at the same tracks and play with Miatas, Vettes, BMWs, Porsches and other modern cars as I have in the past.

[79-TA]

Brian and James ...

Very well said. I'd add one more and that's NO tire warmers ... period. Our cars are not baked potatoes! And drop that word "racing" from your vocabulary. Forget it exists for these events as the fact that a time is posted doesn't make this racing.

Mary Pozzi

On the tire warming issue, some effort should be made by the organizers to make sure that a single car doesn't get back to back runs if and when its competitors don't get the same opportunity for consecutive runs . . . this would provide the same unfair tire temperature advantage. I'm not suggesting any kind of thorough documentation procedure. I'd just like to see the organizers mindful of the advantage this provides before they give someone the go ahead to just get their share of runs in real quick.

[71RS/SS396]

Well, I've been turned away. I'd really hoped my car would fit in but it doesn't. I wanted to go to the Daytona and Sebring events with no concern as to whether there were winners, losers or OUSCI invites just so I could finally share the tracks with other similar old cars. Instead I'll just go run with NASA or another group at the same tracks and play with Miatas, Vettes, BMWs, Porsches and other modern cars as I have in the past.

Why were you turned away? What makes your car not legal? It would be hard to imagine a car any closer to the edge than mine is, some would say it's a race car with plates, and I've run several qualifier events with it.

[juniorjohnson]

Donny, our goal is to find a way to get participants in. That being said, our focus is real street driven cars that are licensed and registered to drive on the street. If anyone has a question about whether a particular car is eligible for the event, please email me and we will make a determination.

While I like the thought behind what you are saying, the rules need to really be more clear about this. When I read the rules, I too see all Factory Five cars as Not Eligible...

The harsh reality of this is you will not be able to stop folks from having purpose built cars for the series. I would remove the kit car verbage, and leave it as insured, licensed, and registered. (You could even throw in must have full interior?) It just makes it easier on you and your officials. In the end Jimi, the cream will rise to the top no matter...

I've helped with rules in different Autocross formats for quite a while now, and you're NEVER going to make everyone happy. Just do the best you can and ALWAYS have an open mind. The key is making the events fun and SAFE. I think you are getting closer to what most would consider a "fair" event by changing your "Design" rules.

Since I'm new to your types of events, I would like to see more information on your Road Course section. Stuff like how it's actually run. (ex. how is the order determined, will cars be brought to green in a group like a NASA TT, or will there be one car every 20-30 seconds sent with a green white checkered approach, if you use the NASA approach, how do you determine who goes first, etc...)

I'm looking forward to seeing you all at an event or two in 2014.

[Smittys]

I think people are way over thinking all of this.

If it has plates, registration, insurance and a vin tag its a car. Have 200 tread wear tires and go run it. You will not do well in the points if its a gutted body that's street legal. If you can make a 100mi road trip then you will be ok.

For the guys who just want to have fun run the GOLD class no Points no Pressure.

[dontlifttoshift]

I think people are way over thinking all of this.

If it has plates, registration, insurance and a vin tag its a car. Have 200 tread wear tires and go run it. You will not do well in the points if its a gutted body that's street legal. If you can make a 100mi road trip then you will be ok.

This ^^^

As far as the street car vs race car argument, that's not for this thread and honestly don't know that anyone can win that argument. If YOUR car fits YOUR idea of a street car then it is. I didn't get into this hobby/industry to please any person or any rule book, the only time that it matters what anyone else thinks is when they are writing the check. I build cars because I truly enjoy it, I drive them because that is the payoff of a build. When miles start rolling on the odometer I have already won, I am driving the trophy. I will use the term race for lack of a better term. I "race" because it validates my development as a DRIVER!!

I have learned to enjoy the driving side of things, you tune the car to make it easier to drive, easier to drive makes you and the car faster. It's a drivers sport, from the outside looking in you might think these cars are built with cubic dollars, and some are, but the person holding the steering wheel makes the car fast. I try to refrain from saying that is a fast car, instead I say He or She is fast because that is the truth at this level. When more people start to grasp that concept, the race car vs street car argument will become irrelevant. When we can all wheel like Pobst, we can revisit the race/street discussion.

Well, I've been turned away.

Why were you turned away? What makes your car not legal?

Also curious as to why you have been turned away.

[James OLC]

I think people are way over thinking all of this.

If it has plates, registration, insurance and a vin tag its a car. Have 200 tread wear tires and go run it. You will not do well in the points if its a gutted body that's street legal. If you can make a 100mi road trip then you will be ok.

For the guys who just want to have fun run the GOLD class no Points no Pressure.

Perfectly put

[Gratefuldiver]

Well my rear tires, while it great shape will be just over of the 3 year date come event time :^( So looks like IM dropping 600 on tires if I want to run at Gateway. I might have to borrow a helmet now, as my helmet money will be used on tires lol. It should be worth it.

[Gratefuldiver]

While on the subject of the date, I guess if the date is on the inside the wheels are coming off for inspection? As far as the entry, if Im a noob and will only run one event I guess Gold would be the way to roll.

[NOT A TA]

Why were you turned away? What makes your car not legal? It would be hard to imagine a car any closer to the edge than mine is, some would say it's a race car with plates, and I've run several qualifier events with it.

DOT R tires.

[James OLC]

DOT R tires.

John - obviously you have a choice as to what tires you run. The 200 tread wear rule is pretty much globally accepted now amongst most groups and it's up to you if you want to run them and participate or not. To say that you are being "turned away" is a bit melodramatic.

Well, I've been turned away. I'd really hoped my car would fit in but it doesn't. I wanted to go to the Daytona and Sebring events with no concern as to whether there were winners, losers or OUSCI invites just so I could finally share the tracks with other similar old cars. Instead I'll just go run with NASA or another group at the same tracks and play with Miatas, Vettes, BMWs, Porsches and other modern cars as I have in the past.

Actually reading this you are being more than a bit melodramatic... You haven't been "turned away" and your car still "fits in"... It's a simple choice (and your choice) and I would guess that if you showed up and, as you say "just want to share the track" without following the tire rule you would probably be allowed, so long as you are sincere about having "no concern about winners, losers, or OUSCI invites".

[NOT A TA]

I did not intend to be melodramatic. I was just responding to the post before mine. " John,
I agree with your thinking. The idea here should be to expand the hobby, and not turn people away."

I probably shouldn't have used the phrase "Turned Away" and used "Turned Off" instead. I'll crawl back under my rock now.

[James OLC]

Sorry John - I may have still had my c-c.com hat on when I posted. Honestly though, yours is one of the coolest cars on the site and it would be great to see it in person (or at least hear about it in person). If the only issue is tires then it doesn't seem like to tough an obstacle to overcome over the next five months...

[bret]

Well my rear tires, while it great shape will be just over of the 3 year date come event time :^( So looks like IM dropping 600 on tires if I want to run at Gateway. I might have to borrow a helmet now, as my helmet money will be used on tires lol. It should be worth it.

If your tires are three years old they are neither in great shape nor competitive...and likely not safe to run high speeds. Time take its toll on tires, even on the shelf.
As for spending your helmet money on tires...buy cheaper tires and a better helmet.

None of us are cashing in food stamps on car parts. If you are, you're doing it wrong.

[ohsolow]

Starting March 6 I got a place you can practice your short coarse racing and hell we'll run anything. And by the way this is racing there is not one of you on here that was ecstatic with the second fastest time of your class, just sayin....

[Gratefuldiver]

If your tires are three years old they are neither in great shape nor competitive...and likely not safe to run high speeds. Time take its toll on tires, even on the shelf.
As for spending your helmet money on tires...buy cheaper tires and a better helmet.

None of us are cashing in food stamps on car parts. If you are, you're doing it wrong.

I think 600 is cheap for 4 tires and while Im not using food stamps LOL I am on a limited budget. The NASA group seemed very cool about loaning helmets. Maybe Im out of my league here. I was just hoping to come out and have some fun. Thanks for your feedback LOL

[James OLC]

Jim,
The results from all the 2013 Qualifier events don't seem to support your comments on the stock suspension and sub-frame cars, unless we are putting 5th gen Camaros and Nissan GTR's into that category. I see that you are running an aftermarket sub frame....just an observation.

Sorry missed this - the results from OUSCI might be different though. And yes, I've installed an aftermarket subframe but really haven't run it (sigh) - but my "stock" subframe did OK for us and was more than competitive in most venues.