Sound Deadning: best combination?

[josht]

The 68 GTO is making some progress and I need to research/get opinions on sound deadening.

The car was media blasted years ago, the floors are decent, complete new trunk and most of the interior quarters/wheel well area replaced.
The roof was replaced at one time so I want to spray the interior with POR-15.



The car will have a full interior, the good/upgraded thicker carpet, front & rear speakers and ac.

I have a basic idea but need help with the combination on sound/noise/vibration/heat choices::


So far:
The interior is going to get a coating of POR-15 for piece of mind, I have the etcher/primer/bond stuff to spray over it.

I was thinking:
- POR-15 with the etcher/primer/bonding agent
- spray spectrum on the interior floor, roof & trunk
- spray a "bed liner" on the exterior floor pan and the trunk
- a thin vibration mat for the doors and no spray in material. (The doors are heavy and the original hinges were really bad)
- a thin vibration mat for the interior floor pans.

I don't know what to do with:
The roof, spray something on it? & what type: sound deadening? vibration? thermal protection?

what about the rest of the interior? - use the thin vibration mat? (I don't want to add more weight unnecessarily to already heavy car)

is spraying the bed liner over POR-15 on the underside a good idea or should I use a clean/etching agent and spray the bed liner directly on the clean bare metal?

should I use the thin vibration mat on both sides of the rear seat wall? (No plans for subs, I want the largest usable trunk space possible)

what about the firewall, is there a ceramic coating to spay/paint on for use near the headers? or do I need to coat the entire firewall?
- The headers are the discontinued Edelbrock LS conversion headers, so they have some sort of coating on them already.

Please recommend products

Thanks for the help

[Onebadtwo]

There is alot of good reading here...
http://www.sounddeadenershowdown.com/cgi-bin/index.cgi

Happy reading
Curtis

[5spd540]

I put dyna mat in my 69amc and 73 camaro man it made a big difference

[josht]

I put dyna mat in my 69amc and 73 camaro man it made a big difference

Did you coat/spray anything before using the dynamat?

Zip, has provided guidance so I am going to see if Lizard skin can be applied over POR-15
The basic idea is going to be: sound control then ceramic insulation, some sort of bed liner on the underside and trunk area.

I am not sure about the interior, I don't want to use the factory jute? as it is outdated and did not survive.
I am concerned about the Dyamat pre-cut kits. I know that the three spray on materials are mils thick but I don't want to add weight unnecessarily.

So sort of sound deadening material needs to be used on the floor and doors, not sure what else is necessary and what is overkill.
The other areas of concern are the roof, under the rear seat and the trunk/rear seat tray.

I don't know if I need any material on the inside firewall under the dash?

thanks

[5spd540]

Yes I por-15 on my car then put it down. I did spray my por-15

[mikes2nd]

alot of options besides dynamat, lizard skin.

To me dynamat is horrible... heavy, burdensome, a pain to work with, takes up space, expensive..

vibration dampers... frame foam... all lead to a super quiet vibration free ride.

I went with QuietCoat... stuff is great.

http://www.quietrock.com/soundproof-...quietcoat.html

Cheaper and better than lizard skin(imho).

[camloops11]

The quiet rock site looks like the stuff is used in construction, but metal is metal, so it can be used for cars aswell? Can it be put over Por15? How much of it did you buy, 1 or 5 gallon? The next step in the project is to put in sound deadner so...

[josht]

The deal with Por15 is that in order to spray over it you need the Tie-Coat Primer. I purchased two gallons of Por-15 and one gallon of the Tie-Coat Primer. About two gallons should cover the car, at least the inside.

One of the things that came to mind was the multiple layers will need to be sprayed on, this quitecoat stuff is a sound insulator. noise reduction. The interior of the car is going to black (original color) so if the car needs to absorb or transfer less heat by using ceramic insulation at least on the roof, firewall and interior.

I don't know about the doors, if they are sprayed with sound deadning material how thin is the "mat" material required to be as the door panels have a thin "water shield" type material originally. I don't want to add a lot of weight to the doors, but having replaced the hinges I am not looking for that hollow sound, a medium thud would be fine.

The original idea was to spray on the Por-15 for protection, then sound, vibration and temperature reducing materials before putting down the carpet in order to save weight. I don't know how much weight is going to be saved at this point since there isn't a single material that does everything. I don't want to skip using the por-15 and I don't know what to spray on the bottom of the car, the QuietCoat could be the answer.

The quiet rock site looks like the stuff is used in construction, but metal is metal, so it can be used for cars as well? Can it be put over Por15? How much of it did you buy, 1 or 5 gallon? The next step in the project is to put in sound deadner so...

[CharlieC]

Unless you plan to take showers or something in the car, I'd scratch the POR in the interior. Properly prepared and sprayed with a good epoxy primer should be more than good enough. POR in the interior door bottoms makes sense given you could have regular water in there.

Just MHO.

Charlie

[CharlieC]

...

[TheBull]

The sound deadener showdown link is a good one to look into. When most people think sound deadening all they think of is the vibration dampening. That is one part, but if you want to cut out road noise you need more. That is where closed cell foam ad mass loaded vinyl come in the MLV blocks road noise and the CCF is a barrier between the metal of the car and the MLV.

You do NOT need to cover the entire car with vibration products. It has been shown that only about 25% coverage is needed. If you contact Don at sounddeadenershowdown he will ask you for measurements of your car and what you are trying to achieve. He then works up a product and price list for you and, this is the important part, tells you exactly what to apply and where.

When I was doing my truck I thought I knew what I needed and had a price worked up. Talked to him and he changed the products around but came within $10 of my original estimate. I got a very detailed list of instructions of how much and what to apply to each area.

He is well known in the DIY autosound arena and is happy to answer your questions and help you out any way he can.

[Ron.in.SoCal]

Agreed Bull. Boomat guys told me 25% as well. Anything more is dead weight.

[mikes2nd]

The quiet rock site looks like the stuff is used in construction, but metal is metal, so it can be used for cars aswell? Can it be put over Por15? How much of it did you buy, 1 or 5 gallon? The next step in the project is to put in sound deadner so...

yep and yep... I got the 3 * 1 gallons of quiet coat for my car. I should probably have bought the 5 gallon for a couple of coats. I will probably buy more...

Beats the hell out of any dynamat. This stuff it the future. 10-15 decibals I have seen. Dynamat will claim about 5. 40% heavier...

Lighter, better, easier to apply, antifungal, antirust, non toxic... whats to complain about?

http://quietcoat.stores.yahoo.net/

I think i paid 59$ for a gallon.... plus shipping

http://astore.amazon.com/buy.best.ch...ail/B004ZFZARY

dynamat car actually create rust. Any moisture and you are doomed. it simply can't go where spray on can.

Large panels must be addressed differently(dynamat nor spray on will work), and absorbers can be used.

[TheBull]

yep and yep... I got the 3 * 1 gallons of quiet coat for my car. I should probably have bought the 5 gallon for a couple of coats. I will probably buy more...

Beats the hell out of any dynamat. This stuff it the future. 10-15 decibals I have seen. Dynamat will claim about 5. 40% heavier...

You've actually measured a 10-15db drop in your vehicle? That is a tremendous drop.

Their marketing is a bit misleading:

Remember high school science? Mats are the “old school” technology

Not necessarily, mats are just overused, as in "lay it over every square inch" over used. Much like this company advocates for spray on.

- they merely try to mask the noise by using mass.

That is pretty much what this does. sorry. Some use mass via their sheets of stick on. Other have specific products that go above and beyond vibration dampening. It's called mass loaded vinyl. That is actually used to block noise.

QuietCar converts the kinetic (noise) energy into heat energy. You can theoretically measure it, but it’s less than 0.1 degree Fahrenheit. By absorbing vehicle body vibration, engine and road noise can be reduced by up to 20dB – that’s an astonishing 75% of the noise - depending on vehicle and application.

As mentioned, dampening vibrations is a small factor in noise reduction. dampening products lower the resonant frequency of the panel, generally to a point where it doesn't make any audible noise. It takes something else to actually block sound waves.

dynamat car actually create rust. Any moisture and you are doomed. it simply can't go where spray on can.

I'm not a dynamat fan, but how does it create rust? Unless it is actually absorbing moisture which is doubtful, but maybe it does... Then again, spray over a wet surface and you get the same thing.

Large panels must be addressed differently(dynamat nor spray on will work), and absorbers can be used.

Addressed how? I use the same 25% rule on all the panels in my vehicle, large and small.

[TheBull]

yep and yep... I got the 3 * 1 gallons of quiet coat for my car. I should probably have bought the 5 gallon for a couple of coats. I will probably buy more...

Beats the hell out of any dynamat. This stuff it the future. 10-15 decibals I have seen. Dynamat will claim about 5. 40% heavier...

You've actually measured a 10-15db drop in your vehicle? That is a tremendous drop.

Their marketing is a bit misleading:

Remember high school science? Mats are the “old school” technology

Not necessarily, mats are just overused, as in "lay it over every square inch" over used. Much like this company advocates for spray on.

- they merely try to mask the noise by using mass.

That is pretty much what this does. sorry. Some use mass via their sheets of stick on. Other have specific products that go above and beyond vibration dampening. It's called mass loaded vinyl. That is actually used to block noise.

QuietCar converts the kinetic (noise) energy into heat energy. You can theoretically measure it, but it’s less than 0.1 degree Fahrenheit. By absorbing vehicle body vibration, engine and road noise can be reduced by up to 20dB – that’s an astonishing 75% of the noise - depending on vehicle and application.

As mentioned, dampening vibrations is a small factor in noise reduction. dampening products lower the resonant frequency of the panel, generally to a point where it doesn't make any audible noise. It takes something else to actually block sound waves.

dynamat car actually create rust. Any moisture and you are doomed. it simply can't go where spray on can.

I'm not a dynamat fan, but how does it create rust? Unless it is actually absorbing moisture which is doubtful, but maybe it does... Then again, spray over a wet surface and you get the same thing.

Large panels must be addressed differently(dynamat nor spray on will work), and absorbers can be used.

Addressed how? I use the same 25% rule on all the panels in my vehicle, large and small.

[yellow1098Greg]

All great info about the products and how they work......so what's the verdict on best combo?

[josht]

That is not the bed liner I am going to use, it will be a spray in/on deal

I am only going to use POR-15 on the frame at this point, no need to use multiple products unnecessarily.

Only the Liner Skin has a thermal option, so I could use Spectrum or Quitecoat else where, just have to figure out what I need to do to spray over it.

I also need to figure out what is required to spray over the epoxy primer if I went that route.

Note sure what to do with the doors, spray somethin or just go with a loaded vinyl barrier.

If I don't have to add all these layers it would be nice, I know that some type of barrier is going to have to be used on the floor.