RideTech 33 Ford

[bret]

I've not said a lot about this project yet becasue I wanted to get it further along first. I'll get some pictures up later this weekend but here is a link to what we have right now:
http://www.ridetech.com/33ford/?p=154&pid=340&pageid=154

Some specs:

The started out as a standard Factory 5 33 Ford street rod kit. We changed some things.

Engine - 427 cu in small block Ford with a Dart aluminum block and Brodix Neal heads built by Sunset Racecraft in Lubbock, Tx. MSD ignition, Holley Dominator EFI, custom stainless headers, Earls oil cooler, Mezeire electric water pump Approx. 630 hp and 600lb/ft torque
Trans - Rankin magnesium case clutchless 4 speed from the old Jasper Engines NASCAR program
Clutch - Tilton 5.5" triple disc carbon fiber, Magesium bellhousing, 8 lb steel flywheel
Rearend - Winters quickchange
Brakes - Baer 13" rotors with 6p calipers
Wheels - Speedlines 18x13 and 18x11
Tires - BFG KDW 295-35/18 and 335-30/18
Rear suspension - custom wishbone with TA series shocks. We will trade off between Hypercoil coilsprings, ShockWave airsprings, and some new Carbon fiber springs we've been playing with:)
Front suspension - inboard rocker arm with custom built control arms and the original Factory 5 attachemnt points, and the same shock combo as the rear
Custom stainless rollcage
custom built stainless exhaust with oval tubing and some special stainless mufflers that Flowmaster built for us. It should scare large children.
FuelSafe fuel cell
FuelSafe fire suppression system
custom built tinwork throughout...about 400 hours worth. All panels are double wall with some zoomy ceramic hi temp insulating blankets between the layers
ididit shorty tilt steering column
Unisteer electric power steering unit
Optima battery
Kirkey road race seats



We should fire the car the week of April 10. If nothing implodes we should be testing the following week. The car should make its track debut at teh 1st annual Battle at the Banks autocross at Salem Speedway on May 5. http://calekernhotrods.com/batb/register.php

After that we'll start hitting the Goodguys autocrosses and the track days.

I hope it's fast.

[jorge]

Here are some earlier pictures of the ford. The rest are up on a build blog at: http://www.ridetech.com/33ford/ More pictures on the way as the build progresses!



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[SRD art]

I hope it's fast.

Um you were joking right?? ;)

Everything looks just plain killer. Great design execution and cool to see another "hot rod" set up for beating it on the autocross.

[BulldawgMusclecars]

Nice! My wife wants me to build here one of those. I can't wait to see what it does, especially with the changes you are making.

[coolwelder62]

Guy's I have seen this car in person.Wow!! it is way cool.I can't wait to see on the track.

[85coupe50]

Very cool... Love those Factory 5 rides!

[jorge]

Some pictures from Friday/Monday. Interior paneling and valve covers were recently painted flat black



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[Yelcamino]

Wow! That thing is going to be a terror on the autox and road course!

[jorge]

Front and read windshields are in. Still hammering away at the interior.

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[66SuperSport]

Uhhhhhhh. WOW !!!

This thing will be interesting. Any idea on weight???

[rfalker1]

this looks cool... and extremely fast

[67speedfreak]

Love it !

[Ron.in.SoCal]

Brett - Put a Racepack in it! :)

[jorge]

Uhhhhhhh. WOW !!!
This thing will be interesting. Any idea on weight???
Not much :fingersx: My guess would be somewhere around 2,300 lbs


Below are some more pictures from the past few days. We're starting to incorporate a Ford V8 Ridetech logo all over the car.

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[LowFast]

Logo is great!

[AutoX_a_Truck?]

Coolest '33 I have ever seen. I hope you bring it to Des Moines Goodguys so I can catch a ride around the autocross

[Dons67]

Wow - I wish I had a 1/3 of the knowledge and talent going into this build, and 1/2 the budget so I could do something with it.

[bret]

Our prototype machinist John Hochegsang came up with a really cool logo that incorporated the ridetech icon with the old time Ford V8 logo. We will be sprinkling it around the 33 Ford. Here is a video on the logo being created on the battery compartment cover...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gfw4wROgXg

We're getting close...brakelines are being built now, the rearend has been installed for the final time...the painted interior will go in tomorrow...wiring this weekend...

Debut at the Battle at the Banks autocross on May 5 in Salem Speedway. Bring a video camera. http://calekernhotrods.com/batb/register.php

[srh3trinity]

Liking that logo and the build.

[Kenova]

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Okay, this is driving me nuts, so I just have to ask.

Exactly how are the axle tubes secured to the aluminum differential housing? Are the bolts just big set screws, or are there threads in the steel axle tubes? I think it's safe to assume that the tubes are a press fit, just wondering about the bolts.

Ken

[454bug]

Great project Bret!! :1st:

[jorge]

Interior is being put back in today. Wiring is the now the focus, the engine should be fired this weekend / early next week.

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[65-fastback]

Nice project!!

Going ISIS with the wiring?

[Tig]

That looks amazing.
Great job guys.
Cant wait to see some vids of it in action.

[jorge]

Wiring, always a bunch of fun.

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[jorge]

Steering wheel is in, lots of behind the scenes work being done.

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[Yelcamino]

Beautiful! Absolutely beautiful! :twothumbs

[sokoloka]

What style / layback Kirkey seats are those?

[the dan]

looks great, those dynasty tigs are the s*** for aluminum

[Dalamar]

beautifully done at every step!

[wellis77]

Love that you're running air on this. Can't wait to see how it performs.

[Chevrolaine]

Stunning and it's not even done yet!!

[bret]

Love that you're running air on this. Can't wait to see how it performs.

I will likely debut the car on coils first. We fit the ShockWaves to make sure there was clearance for everything. Since this car has so many new [and untried] components [rear wishbone suspension, quickchange rearend w/ floating axles, handbuilt front control arms, 5.5" carbon clutch, really light weight and short wheelbase] and there is so little room for the compressor/tank/controls, I want one less variable for the initial run. Another issue is the front ShockWaves/coilovers sit inboard right behind the radiator. I do not yet know the effects that amount of heat will have on altering the contained air pressure [and therefore the spring rate] in those units, and don't want to find out at the first event. We will likely start with the TA shocks with the Hyperco coils and very quickly we will be comparing the ShockWaves and the new Hyperco carbon fiber springs.

I have no illusions that this car will be totally immune from the normal new car issues that must be sorted out. Just as any NASCAR, F1, or NHRA team does, we'll be testing and trying diffrerent combinations to find A. what falls off the car first, and B. what makes the car fast.

Why am I saying this? Well...don't draw any conclusions if the car shows up for a couple events with coils. I'm still thinking it will end up fastest with the Shockwaves...or maybe the carbon springs. We'll see...

BTW...look for the 48 Hour Camaro to show up with ShockWaves at Nashville. The 66 Chevelle and the 69 Mustang already have the TA series ShockWaves and are REALLY good right now. The 66 Chevelle ran 2nd at Charlotte last year with those TA Shockwaves, and the Mustang was the winner of the Vendor class in Texas this spring. They will both be at the Battle at the Banks in Salem next weekend and Nashville Goodguys on May 18-20.

The 33 Ford and the 48 Hour Camaro will also be running the Optima series this year at the Power Tour, Road America, and [hopefully] in Vegas. We'll also be in Columbus for Goodguys, at Gingerman for the Motorstate Challenge, and are trying to attend the Pirelli Ultimate Track Car Challenge at VIR in July.
I'm getting worn out just thinking about it!

[jorge]

There are now wires coming out of every opening on the car ... :)

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[tommycomfort]

I remember seeing this when I stopped by for the 48 hour Camaro build. Then over the winter Deb and I picked up coilovers for the wagon and got to see it well on its way to becoming a monster, but now... Holy Smokes!
Tom

[bret]

The engine ran for the first time at 7:32 pm Saturday night. Yep, its a race car. The 6 lb clutch allows it to rev like a cup car. Today we'll likely drive it at least around the block. Still to do:

hook up fans, headlights, turn signals, guages
re-bleed brakes
mount headlights
scale
paint seats
install harness tabs and harnesses
install doors, decklid, and hood
install remote charging terminals
radiator overflow
make breathers
get a real air filter
shifter boot
hook up power windows
rearend vent can
license plate light
license plate mount

Possible testing on Wednesday. Hope so, we need to race on Saturday!

I'll try to get some video up later today.

Busy...bye!

[jorge]

Here is that video of the 33 starting up:
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/04/a-1.jpg (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d41LHbDsngo&list=UU5XK1QOYR9VaZUGQfLgCpog)
Music to my ears!

And here are some pictures from this morning:

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[tommycomfort]

Absolutely love it! Was there a change of plan on the gauge cluster?

[Daves69Coupe]

that thing sounds effing mean!

[Z06killinSBF]

Nice, what was the big spark during start up?

[jorge]

Absolutely love it! Was there a change of plan on the gauge cluster?

We initially had problems with the gauge displaying oil pressure and voltage readouts. We had a Racepak sitting around and we are a little more familiar with that system.


So much has happened in the past day or so!

The guys got the wheels back on the car
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New fabricated Ridetech V8 Logo on the valve covers
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Machines drilling away at some custom made headlights
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Seats were painted
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Some more drilling on the headlights
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Ridetech Triple Adjustable Coilovers are on the car now
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The creator with his creations
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Custom made heel rest, helps a lot
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Puting the trunk lid back on
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The car at our company lunch which was just minutes ago
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The car is driving and operational (for the most part), just finishing up the details now!

[srh3trinity]

I guess I had lost a little bit of that childhood hot rod fantasy due to my love of muscle cars, but this car looks like it will be an absolute blast. Killer!

[Yelcamino]

That thing sounds awesome! You gotta love a 6lb clutch!

I can't wait to see video of it scaring some cones!

[LeighP]

Terrific!!!! Looks completely over the top!

[93Polo]

Awesome build! Interested to see it on the track too.

[Tig]

That looks and sounds amazing. Those wheels are insane.
Lets see some more shots from differnt angles.

[Wesley J]

Sweet ride, to say the least. This is going to be my next build so its nice to see one that's pushing the performance envelope of the chassis. I think the 200 treadwear tires is going to be the major limitation. It's be interesting to see how fast it is with some warm manly tires!

[jorge]

Posted a teaser video on youtube of the 33' running. Still got some kinks to work out. The car is at the track right now doing some more advance tests.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/05/video-1.jpg (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SihDlknejSs)

[Daves69Coupe]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SihDlknejSs

[DustinS]

looks like it has a little giddyup!

[Yelcamino]

Posted a teaser video on youtube of the 33' running. Still got some kinks to work out. The car is at the track right now doing some more advance tests.

That car is BAD AZZ!

[caudill_danny]

What Guage pack is in the last pic?




There are now wires coming out of every opening on the car ... :)

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[bret]

It is made by a company called Koso from Canada. They build a lot of oem ATV guage packages. They typically do not have an oil pressure or battery voltage read out because ATVs typically do not have pressurized oiling systems or batteries. I didn't use it because I couldn't figure out a good way to display oil pressure and battery voltage alongside that dash and make it look good.

[bret]

The 33 did appear at the Battle at the Banks this weekend in Salem, In., but I did not put it on the track.
Two reasons for that...

1. The OEM FFR steering rack is not up to the loads imposed by the 295mm wide tires on the front. Too much flex and bind creating inconsistent steering feel. Hard to drive a car that you can't steer!
2. There is a spark scatter problem above 3000rpm. This is a fresh engine so I don't want to beat the bearings out of it [or worse] the first weekend.

We will address both problems this week [along with some remaining details to be finished up] and have the car at Nashville Goodguys in 2 weeks.

I will say that the little I drove it on the street [about 3 miles] was...inspiring. If it ever really hooks up it will be the first pro tour type car that needs wheelie bars.

[Flash68]

Absolutely love this thing. Sounds like a beast!




If it ever really hooks up it will be the first pro tour type car that needs wheelie bars.

Now Bret... that would just be... unfair. :)

[Yelcamino]

If it ever really hooks up it will be the first pro tour type car that needs wheelie bars.

That would be a fun problem to have!

[LeighP]

Very nice....really moves!!!!

[jorge]

The car is currently on a lift, as the build team is planning the next move to fix the problems Bret mentioned.

It attracted a lot of attention last weekend at the Battle at the Banks even though it didn't run. It will be exciting to take it out to a GoodGuys show!

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[Wesley J]

Do you guys sell the coil over remote reservoir holders? I bought the triples but couldnt find them.

Car looks great!

Wes

[jorge]

Do you guys sell the coil over remote reservoir holders? I bought the triples but couldnt find them.

Car looks great!

Wes


Hrmmm strange, they come standard with each TA shock. Sent you a PM.

[bret]

Well, we have resolved the spark scatter problem. It was just a rotor phasing problem...no big deal, but took a few hours to identify.

The steering problem was a little tougher. The OEM FFR steering system was apparantly intended to turn a narrow tire. We are using a 295mm tire. When I turned the wheel you could watch the rack visibly flex. It would encounter a significant bind at around a half turn of input. The size of the rack components was compounded by the rear steer configuration, very short steering arms, and the incorrect placement of the rack itself. Totally unacceptable.
After more research and conversation we have decided to cut bait on that system and redo it completely as a front steer Woodward power rack. This will allow exact placement to optimize bumpsteer and Ackerman, as well as providing tuning capabilities for feel. The Woodward components are true racing components that are completely capable of withstanding the forces imposed on them by this car.

I had assumed that FFR had designed this steering system anticipating this kind of use and had not paid a lot of attention to it. After encountering problems I called my friend Chris Alston who was a seriously good source of valuable information. He then referred me to Tony Woodward who spent a couple hours filling me in on the finer points of rack and pinion steering systems. Tony is a classic example of "paying for a degree in steering and getting his parts for free". Knowledgeable, articulate, friendly, experienced, realistic, and able to relate to whatever level of driving you are attempting.

Now we get to spend a few DAYS sawing the frontend off the car and installing a proper steering system. I still hope to make it to Nashville next weekend.

Don't get me wrong...I'm not blaming FFR completely for any of this. Their system would likely work fine with their recommended tire sizes in a "civilian" environment. Obviously we are working with neither. My aggravation is only with myself. I should have not assumed that this part of the car would be any less customized than the rest of it. I should had examined, evaluated, and fixed it months ago.
We will fix it now. It will be cool and fast. Its what we does.

[wiedemab]

I can't remember what the issue was, but several years ago when I was at OUSCI, didn't a FFR '33 have some sort of an issue that caused it to go off track. I want to say it was steering related (tie-rod breakage maybe?), but I may be wrong. Have you had any contact with the folks at FFR? I wonder if they would want to offer some sort of a different optional steering package for wide tire/harsh use situations?

Good luck getting it together for Nashville.

[bret]

I have not talked to anyone at FFR...and I probably should have...my bad. At this point the timeframe to get this thing on the road/track is so short that I didn't feel I had time to go back and forth for several days to find a solution. I had to fix the problem NOW. I have complete confidence this new system will work because I have worked successfully with Chris and Tony before. Also...after I was able to remove my head from my ass, I could see clearly what the problem was and how to truly fix it. It just took some "reminding" to make that happen!

This is a good example of how even an experienced car builder can become the victim of assumptions and oversight [on my part, not FFR].

For someone with a bit more time and a different set of resources, I would absolutely recommend contacting FFR [or whatever appropriate manufacturer] to resolve a serious problem.

I have been told by several [in my own household] that I have a habit of ignoring my own advice:)

[bret]

I can't remember what the issue was, but several years ago when I was at OUSCI, didn't a FFR '33 have some sort of an issue that caused it to go off track. I want to say it was steering related (tie-rod breakage maybe?), but I may be wrong. Have you had any contact with the folks at FFR? I wonder if they would want to offer some sort of a different optional steering package for wide tire/harsh use situations?

Good luck getting it together for Nashville.

I watched Rob Kinnan crash that car at OUSCI. He went in WAY too fast. I figured he just ran out of track, but it could have been a steering breakage/flex problem, I guess. I never got a chance to discuss it with him after the fact. I have talked to other FFR owners who have raced their cars with no problems, but I do not know at what level they are running.

[wellis77]

Tony is an awesome resource and my Woodward rack is almost art. Good choice on the change.

[feeble]

Bret: You said that the tire is wider than FFR originally designed for the car. If I understand correctly (and I may not be, I am still learning), if you did not increase the offset of the wheel to compensate, would this not increase the increase the scrub radius, making the car harder to steer and increasing the stress on the steering components?

This is the reason I am redesigning the front suspension on my Mustang II project (with Ride Tech coil overs of course.) Which reminds me, I need to get a CAD model for the front shock and coil over, the 5" travel shocks I bought for the rear are too long for the front.

[wiedemab]

I watched Rob Kinnan crash that car at OUSCI. He went in WAY too fast. I figured he just ran out of track, but it could have been a steering breakage/flex problem, I guess. I never got a chance to discuss it with him after the fact. I have talked to other FFR owners who have raced their cars with no problems, but I do not know at what level they are running.

It very likely could have been that he went off track and that is what broke stuff.

I completely understand the timing and needing a solution put in place quickly. - -Tru-Turn for the FFR '33 ;) I hope you make Nashville. That is a great GG show. My daughter's B-day is always the same weekend so until she is old enough and has the desire to go to a car show for her b-day, I'm probably out of luck!

[bret]

Bret: You said that the tire is wider than FFR originally designed for the car. If I understand correctly (and I may not be, I am still learning), if you did not increase the offset of the wheel to compensate, would this not increase the increase the scrub radius, making the car harder to steer and increasing the stress on the steering components?

This is the reason I am redesigning the front suspension on my Mustang II project (with Ride Tech coil overs of course.) Which reminds me, I need to get a CAD model for the front shock and coil over, the 5" travel shocks I bought for the rear are too long for the front.

Ha! Good call! Actually...we lucked out a little on this one. The Speedline wheels [that I found on ebay:)] hit the Baer calipers, so we built a hubcentric spacer of appropriate thickness to compensate for the extra width and offset in that wheel. In the end the tire centerline is .560" inboard from the SAI/ground intersection. Opinions vary, but that dimension is within a decent range for street tires and the weight of the vehicle. It was about 2" before we built that spacer.

[1971novaSS]

Good to see someone built my dream car. Love everything about it! Top notch! Maybe someday I'll start to build a car half as good.

[jorge]

The new steering rack came in today. It looks beastly! Should solve our problems.

Here are some pictures from this week:
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/05/10JPG-2.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/05/6JPG-2.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/05/8JPG-3.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/05/9JPG-3.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/05/11JPG-3.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/05/12JPG-2.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/05/13JPG-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/05/14JPG-2.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/05/15JPG-2.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/05/16JPG-1.jpg

[dougnugent1]

This is a hotrod that can truely be put in that class of badass. Very nice work. Please post videos of it on the track. Hopefully will be a project of mine one day.

[bret]

Were in the middle of installing the Woodward front steer rack this weekend. Its a fair amount of work, but nothing a sawzall and a 2 million dollar machine shop can't fix. Its looking like we'll have to move the grille shell/radiator a couple of inches forward. Sounds harder than it is. [thankfully] I think we'll make it for Nashville.

Kurt got the interior door panels done on Friday. I'll get pictures up on Monday. They look just as cool as we had envisioned! We still have to paint the dash and make a rivited insert for it...and make some emblems for the seats...and the artwork on the doors. All in good time. Racin's first...it's gotta run good before anyone cares how it looks!

[ace_xp2]

Well, I guess it's handy that those spindles appear to have bolt on steering arms then!
About the rack flex, how was it flexing? was it bending across the whole rack? or just outside the mounts?
I ask because it looks like the one mount on the rack can slip left to right, so for others maybe moving that mount out could help a little.
The half turn bind sounds like it was u joint bind to me.

[LeighP]

Wow, that new rack IS a work of art!

[jorge]

The Rack is still being installed on the 33, its taking some time to get it to fit right. But all is still going according to plan.
Got a few pictures from this week + pictures of the new door paneling.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/05/1JPG-3.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/05/2JPG-3.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/05/3JPG-4.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/05/4JPG-4.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/05/5JPG-3.jpg

[A.I.I.]

Wow, this car is amazing.

?, are you guys running a scatter shield between the tranny and the tunnel?

[bret]

The bellhousing is magnesium. The clutch is a 5 lb. 5.5" carbon fiber triple disc clutch and an 8 lb steel flywheel . The reason we don't need a "traditional" 38 lb. .250 wall steel bellhousing is the rotating mass of the small diameter lighweight carbon clutch/flywheel is exponentially smaller than the traditional 12" diameter clutch/flywheel unit that weighs 50lbs. When a 50 lb/12: diameter mass rotating at 8000 rpm decides not to do that anymore, it takes that thick hunk of steel to prevent limb amputation. If the 13 lb/5.5" unit come apart, the most painful thing is the sound of your checkbook being pried open [again].

The additional benefit of the lightweight clutch is that this engine gains RPM like an F1 car. It will see 8000rpm on a simple throttle blip. And the street manners are not terrible. It takes a little getting used to, but I would easily drive this thing in city traffic. Another benefit is that this unit will control up to 1200 lb ft. of torque.

Downside? This Tilton unit is around $7,000. I found mine on ebay off a used ARCA racer for $1500. It took a little thought and machine shop time to mate everything up correctly, but that's what hotrodding is!

For those who want a "bolt it in and go" solution...we recently put a Centerforce Dyad clutch in the 48 Hour Camaro. THAT is a nice piece...and it drives like butter!

Man, that was a longassed answer to a simple question, wasn't it?

[bret]

As for the Woodward rack installation...its not for the meek. Woodward make the best racks in the business, bar none, BUT it is a racecar part and needs above average talent and resources to install correctly. You cannot order a rack for a 69 Camaro [or any other specific application]...their components are manufactured and sold by dimensional data.
On the 33 Ford we made the decision early on [after we discovered the inadequecies of the oem rack system] to do whatever it took to do this steering system right. This meant basically sawing off the front of the car and starting over. After the radiator and grille shell were out of the way, things cleared up nicely. Removal of a few more brackets and tubing cleared a path for proper placement. To determine proper placement we modeled the frontend digitally nad ran the data through our suspension analyzer program. This told us exactly where the rack needed to be in every axis. We fabricated the neccessary mounts to put it there, ran the suspension through it's travel, and determined that there was less than .015" of bumpsteer through 6" of suspension travel. Winner!
This also meant fabricating a set of custom steering arms to get the ackerman and bumpsteer optimized. Not a huge deal if you have a CAD guy 25 ft away and a CNC mill in between the two of you.

Is it worth it? Obviously, because the alternative is that I have an expensive paperweight. [That would be a car that you can't steer]

I point all this out not to explain how smart we are [we're not...if we were, we would have identified and fixed this problem months ago:)] but to demonstrate that sometimes hotrodding takes a little perserverence, a little money, a little talent, a lot of help from your knowledgable friends. Something to consider when you have to round the corner on a bracket or enlarge a bolt hole to get some aftermarket part bolted on your Camaro.

Will we make it to Nashville Goodguys this weekend? I think so.

[ace_xp2]

...Downside? This Tilton unit is around $7,000. I found mine on ebay off a used ARCA racer for $1500. It took a little thought and machine shop time to mate everything up correctly, but that's what hotrodding is!

The other thing about the carbon/carbon clutches is the material tends to shred rather than shatter, so in the event it goes ejection is even more unlikely.
I got my quartermaster version off a (now defunct) ASA racer, it's supposedly already set up for an LS motor. What did you need to do to get it on an SBF?

[bret]

Well...the clutch itself had the correct spline for the Rankin NASCAR trans we used [can't remember the exact spline right now] so that was fine. We used the LS flywheel it came with and redrilled the bolt pattern for the Ford crank. This engine is a zero balance unit so that was not a big deal either. The only real trickery was getting a bellhousing/starter/ring gear to work together. The bellhousing that came with my ebay find was for an LS engine so that was a non player. I found a mag bellhousing on ebay but it was for a larger flywheel system that couldn't work with the tiny clutch. So...we used an LS flexplate, redrilled it for the Ford crank [like the flywheel] and sandwiched it between the flywheel and the crank, making all the neccessary spacers/pilot hubs, etc.
Worked perfect!

[jorge]

The steering rack and radiator are back on and it looks like its going to be at Nashville this weekend! And if not we've always got a backup (1969 Silver Mustang)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/05/6JPG-3.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/05/8JPG-4.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/05/10JPG-3.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/05/11JPG-4.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/05/12JPG-3.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/05/13JPG-2.jpg

[Vicinity]

I'm loving the door ink. :)

[Kenova]

How are the steel tubes attached to the aluminum quickchange?
I assume there is a press fit (how much?) but was wondering if the bolts act as big set screws, or are they threaded into the steel tubing. If so, how did you get the threaded hole in the tubes in the right spot.

Ken

[Motorcitydak]

man I am jealous on the steering rack, they must have rushed you one. I am going on 6 or 7 weeks or waiting for mine. I really like that first gauge cluster you guys had, looks like the one on my gsx-r

[bret]

Well, we did make it to Nashville. The 33 ran well...nothing fatal fell off...the steering worked GREAT...and we generated a short list of items to address before the Midwest Musclecar Challenge next week.

First on the list is swaybars. I knew the car had some roll issues but simply could not get a swaybar designed and built in time, so we worked around the problem with excessive spring rate. Better than nothing, but still a compromise. We'll have that all fixed this week.

Second is tires. The tires that we had on the car at Nashville were old when we installed them for initial fitment 3 years ago. I left them on to shake the car down a bit. Now its time for some real rubber:)

Power steering vent - If anyone saw the run I made where I ran down 6-8 cones...it was because I saw some fluid hit the windshield and got...distracted. We band-aided itwith a shop towel and a zip tie, but will fix it permanently this week.

The last item is some kind of hood ornament. Why? Because I can't see anything out of the car...no tires, no fenders, no hood...nothing for a reference point to aim the car with. Rob McGreagor told me I was missing my apex cones by six feet! Anyway...I might just make something to bolt to the top of the grille so I can see where the hell the front of the car is!

Thankfully a short list. Picures shortly!

[Yelcamino]

Bret, it sounds like the '33 is a wild ride, especially when you have ps fluid on the windshield and no reference points! :drive1:

In high school a friend of mine had a Vega wagon with a 400 SBC, no hood, and no window wipers. Whenever he got on it hard, oil would spray from somewhere all over the windshield!

[GrabberGT]

You mentioned hood ornament and I immediately pictured a dashboard Hula Dancer and duct tape. What can I say... Its been a long Monday.

[bret]

You mentioned hood ornament and I immediately pictured a dashboard Hula Dancer and duct tape. What can I say... Its been a long Monday.

I am imagining the look on that hula dancers face when I pull 3rd gear...

[RobNoLimit]

How about a Mary Pozzi bobble head, you could hear it, "easy in, easy in, .... on it, on it, go go GO!!!" Anyway, I rode in the car on saturday and it rocks. You sit on the deck, low, and there is a lot of room. It pulls like crazy, and the transfer is smooth. Yep, springs were on the stiff side, and maybe not enough caster, then there's gear match in the quickchange. - is it fast? - YES. will it be faster? - YES. It just needs some tuning and getting used to. Thanks for the ride Bret

[brrymnvette]

I say MAC Truck hood ornament.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/05/IMG_4489JPG-1.jpg

[Motorcitydak]

I think a nice cross hair hood ornament would be way cool on this

[LeighP]

Heres what you need...comes in chrome or black.... :)

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/GUNSIGHT-CAR-HOOD-ORNAMENT-METAL-BADGE-Chrome-Emblem-Anti-Aircraft-Gun-Sight-/160801683943?pt=AU_Car_Parts_Accessories&hash=item257086f9e7

[JEFFTATE]

Power steering vent - If anyone saw the run I made where I ran down 6-8 cones...it was because I saw some fluid hit the windshield and got...distracted. We band-aided itwith a shop towel and a zip tie, but will fix it permanently this week.

A buddy of mine that runs a lot of HPDE and TimeTrials in NASA uses baby socks and rubber bands over the brake fluid cap and power steering cap , to soke up any residual oozage .
( It's straight-up low tech , but it works )

[Z06killinSBF]

This one is kind of evil

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/05/KGrHqNq0EZRGuSSfBPs5cUS7nw60_12JPG-1.jpg

http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-CHROME-WINGED-DEVIL-SKULL-DEMON-FENDER-HOOD-ORNAMENT-chopper-bobber-hot-rod-/251063856142?pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&hash=item3a74926c0e&vxp=mtr

[jorge]

It was hard to get pictures of the car at the show with so many people hovering around it all weekend :smoke: It sat in our booth for a while on Sunday and a lot of people stopped to check it out which was cool!

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/05/1-2.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/05/2-2.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/05/3-2.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/05/4-2.jpg

[Motorcitydak]

Sway bars are indeed needed...and ill take those shocks when you go to air bags :)

I forgot if I saw it somewhere but are you running power brakes? Also how do you like the pedal hinged on the floor vs them on the firewall?? Im thinking about pedals rite now so Ive been trying to decide but have never driven a car with them on the floor

[jorge]

Sway bars are indeed needed...and ill take those shocks when you go to air bags :)

I forgot if I saw it somewhere but are you running power brakes? Also how do you like the pedal hinged on the floor vs them on the firewall?? Im thinking about pedals rite now so Ive been trying to decide but have never driven a car with them on the floor

We don't normally prefer the pedals hinged on the floor, but the way you sit in the 33 it's pretty nice. And as far as the shocks go, sure you can have them! We'll need an address and... some sort of identification... like a credit card :evil:

A little update on the 33: We had it out last weekend at the Midwest Musclecar Challenge, though it didn't get to run much because we still had some kinks to work out. Lately, we were able to whip up a nice new custom made sway bar for the car, and a nice new license plate holder.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/06/1JPG-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/06/2JPG-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/06/3JPG-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/06/4JPG-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/06/5JPG-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/06/6JPG-1.jpg

Also we uploaded new video footage of the 33 making a lap at the GoodGuys Nashville autocross.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/06/autocross-1.jpg (http://www.ridetech.com/tv/2012/05/ridetech-33-ford-nashville-2012/)

[rockytopper]

Is the 33 going to compete in the face off this weekend in Texas?

[dougnugent1]

Where is the face off in Texas at this weekend?

[rockytopper]

It will be at Quik Trip park (next door to lonestar park horse races) in Grand Prairie on Friday during the last stop of the hotrod power tour. Saturday it will be at Eagles Canyon Raceway in Decatur, tx for the hot lap event.

[jorge]

Is the 33 going to compete in the face off this weekend in Texas?

You Bet! :drive1:

Yeah the 33 is on the Power Tour right now and then will compete at the Faceoff starting this Friday.

Some pictures of the ford right before the tour and at the tour:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/06/1JPG-2.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/06/2JPG-2.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/06/3JPG-2.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/06/4JPG-2.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/06/5JPG-2.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/06/6JPG-2.jpg

[brrymnvette]

Thanks for the new desktop background!

Trying to talk the wife into letting me build one for our son's first car. He's not even a year old yet. :)

[fordsbyjay]

Looks awesome.

[jorge]

Thanks for the new desktop background!

:cool:

The car made it back home safely from the Power Tour and the Optima Ultimate Streetcar qualifying event in Texas. The car placed in the top 5 in the autocross and top 10 in the speed-stop challenge at the optima event. We were very pleased with the results considering we ran the car against z06 corvettes, a GT-R, and even a Lamborghini.

One of our employees filmed the 33 at the Optima event, check it out:
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/06/v-1.jpg (http://www.ridetech.com/tv/2012/06/33-ford-at-the-2012-optima-ultimate-streetcar-qualifier-texas/)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/06/1-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/06/2-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/06/3-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/06/4-1.jpg

[AutoX_a_Truck?]

The '33 is looking mean out on course

Maybe I missed it earlier in the thread, but what did it end up weighing on corner scales?

I understand it is still in the experimental/testing phase, but (provided they are not top secret) what sort of spring/wheel rates are you running and what rebound/compression settings do the coilovers seem to like?

I am finally starting to get a handle on tuning the Triple Adjustables on my truck, but I would be interested to see what works for other people and even though every vehicle is different the FFR '33 is more similar to mine than most :idea:

[nicks67camaro]

I love the look of the open engine.....But something in me wants to see a custom carbon fiber hood / engine cover with open wheels still.

This thing rocks!

[jorge]

The '33 is looking mean out on course

Maybe I missed it earlier in the thread, but what did it end up weighing on corner scales?

I understand it is still in the experimental/testing phase, but (provided they are not top secret) what sort of spring/wheel rates are you running and what rebound/compression settings do the coilovers seem to like?

I am finally starting to get a handle on tuning the Triple Adjustables on my truck, but I would be interested to see what works for other people and even though every vehicle is different the FFR '33 is more similar to mine than most :idea:

Hey Tyler, I'll make sure to track down the numbers for you. Sorry for the delay.

Little bit of an update. The 33 is back from the Motor State Challange, twas a blast. Got a little dirty as you can see :)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/07/1-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/07/2-2.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/07/3-1.jpg

:drive1:
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/07/4-1.jpg

Here's a few pictures we got from Robert McGaffin at the Optima Faceoff event a while ago, some of the best shots we have of the car so far :headbang:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/07/a-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/07/b-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/07/c-1.jpg

[jorge]

New shoes for the 33! We put on Forgeline wheels and Falken tires today for the NSRA Louisvile show this week. Went an inch wider on the front.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/08/bigwheelsstreetrod-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/08/factoryfive-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/08/forgeline33ford-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/08/ff33-1.jpg

[LowFast]

Those look straight nasty! Nice choice.

[fordsbyjay]

It is even more beasty now....lol

[armourmark]

I typically don't care for those wheels, but they are perfect for the 33!

[LUV2XLR8]

interesting question... how were you going to hook up the speed sensor with the koso gauge? thats a pretty cool setup

[srh3trinity]

Those wheels are much better. The other wheels weren't bad, but these fit the attitude of the car.

[Tig]

I love this thread. FFRs 33 is a kick ass ride and you guys made it that much better.
Great job.

[rustomatic]

Darkly colored wheels are so much better. When my career as a life coach takes off, I'd like to...

[jorge]

Rock on, thanks for the comments guys! The 33 is resting in the garage while we wait for the Kirkey seats to come back with some much needed padding. Here are some newer pictures of the wheels:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/08/DSC_0406-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/08/DSC_0430-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/08/DSC_0416-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/08/DSC_04412-1.jpg

[Z06killinSBF]

Hi def version of b&w please?

[coolwelder62]

Just outstanding.

[LowFast]

One bad Mama Jama. Just sinister.

[BBC71Nova]

Hi def version of b&w please?

What ^^he^^ said

[jorge]

Hi def version of b&w please?

You bet, [link] (http://ridetech.com/images/forum/33-ford/33-full-size-bw.jpg)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/08/33thumb-1.jpg (http://ridetech.com/images/forum/33-ford/33-full-size-bw.jpg)

[Zanie]

Wow, those wheels look much better. That car is crazy cool.
What would it look like if that grill shell was an inch and a half shorter and the insert was black or charcoal (the verticle bars).

[Z06killinSBF]

You bet, [link] (http://ridetech.com/images/forum/33-ford/33-full-size-bw.jpg)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/08/33thumb-1.jpg (http://ridetech.com/images/forum/33-ford/33-full-size-bw.jpg)

Sweet, thanks! *new background pic*

[jorge]

New seat padding, feels a lot better than bare metal haha.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/08/1-2.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/08/2-1.jpg

[LowFast]

Those are awesome, what does it cost to get something like that made up? I like how they have a brutally functional appearance yet maintain some comfort.

[bret]

I drove the 33 from Ridetech over to my house yesterday. Before, 20 minutes was about all you could stand to ride in the car without your whole lower body going into a giant cramp. Now, in only 5 miles I can tell that it will be not only tolerable, but actually comfortable.

And comfortable is faster

Tracey Weaver at the Recovery Room is a true professional who not only is an artist but knows what it takes to make a component function as well. When he saw my car at Columbus, he said "I think I can make your car faster" who can resist that? After sharing some thoughts over the weekend I went home to take some measurements with me in the car and then sent him the seats. The artwork you see is what I received back.
The leather texture is best described as "elephant scrotum". Next time you go to the circus you'll remember that, won't you... The Ridetech logo you see on the seat back was burned in with a branding iron we made at the shop. The billet grommets come right out of our catalog (love cnc machines!)

Pleased? Yeah, and way beyond that. Thanks Tracey! Now I owe you that ride

[jorge]

Took some more pictures of the interior now that it's a little more finalized.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/09/1-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/09/3-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/09/2-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/09/4-1.jpg

[Hotwhilz]

Pure!
I like it a bunch! Tahnks for sharing such a great build!

[fordsbyjay]

Very nice.

[Tig]

That looks amazing.
Great work.

[jorge]

Something hilarious happened this weekend at the GoodGuys Indianapolis show. A local TV reporter took a ride in the 33... listen closely after the 2 minute mark :twothumbs

3bhAx-hUp5A

[LeighP]

lol.......

[Tig]

That was great, hah.

[The GMR]

phenomenal build. I'm very jealous of this project!

jason

[tazzz25906112]

In true Bret form,,, perfect LOL!!!!

[Hotwhilz]

Awesome! Hilarious!

Great Car!

[rohrt]

The video was AWSOME!

[Martin71RS]

HAHAHAHAHAHA !!! the look on the reporters face is priceless!

[MSTSFabbed]

Hahahaha yeah HEs a car guy...

[jorge]

Have a few important updates on the 33. A couple weekends ago Bret won the GoodGuys Texas autocross with it which is always a bonus! We fabricated a wing and installed a Centerforce Dyad Clutch in preparation for the Optima Ultimate Streetcar Series coming up here in just a couple weeks. We're now working on making some decals for the race. (Optima just posted a story about us prepping the car for the race on their website (http://www.optimabatteries.com/us/en/experience/power-source/ousci-preview-bret-voelkel-33-ford-coupe/))

On top of that, the car will be featured on this weekends Optima Faceoff Road America show. (premiering Sunday 21st 1:00pm EST)

Centerforce Dyad Clutch meet the 33.
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/10/3-5.jpg

Pictures of the new wing
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/10/1-5.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/10/2-5.jpg

Video of the Centerforce Dyad Clutch being installed.
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[jorge]

The 33 is all decked out with decals and is sitting in the Optima Ultimate Streetcar Invitational corral waiting for the race this weekend. (as you may noticed we edited the wing again) Come by and see it you're at SEMA. Our booth is #22589 if you want to talk to us about the car.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/10/1-7.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/10/2-7.jpg

[LowFast]

Funny parked next to the GTR, as if there are any two cars more polar opposite but with similar performance.

[jorge]

Funny parked next to the GTR, as if there are any two cars more polar opposite but with similar performance.

Ha so true, sounds like there is going to be a pretty eclectic mix of vehicles in the race this year.

[LowFast]

BTW I would take the 33 over the GTR, no question or second thought.

[jorge]

Optima Ultimate Streetcar Invitational results: 5th in autocross, 7th in road course, 1st in speed stop! 3rd overall (out of 60 high performance vehicles). Good day for the 33 Ford!

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/11/1-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/11/2-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/11/3-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/11/4-1.jpg

[bret]

Wow...what a week at SEMA and Optima!

I have not been on here recently to post because, well...we've been working on the car that much!

I was very pleased with the results we acheived at Optima this year. Since "finishing" the car in May, we've proceeded to tweak, refine, change, and tune all summer...until about a month ago.

I had a lot of people ask about the car, how its doing, and what we've changed so here is the readers digest version of the refinements and the results.

When we very first put the car together and drove it, we could tell there was a significant bind in the steering system. After some investigation and research, we found that the steering rack itself was simply not stong enough to turn the front tires. It was a rear steer Omni rack that was coupled with a ver yshort 3.5" long steering arm trying to turn a tire that was about 100% wider than what Factory Five intended. The ultimate fix was to use a front steer Woodward rack. After about 70 hours of design and fabrication time the steering was fixed and we started racing.

The very first competitive event was Nashville Goodguys autocross. I had a set of old [hard] BFG tires that we fitted up just to get the car shook out. Success in that nothing fatal fell off the car, but it wasn't very fast.
After Nashville we came back and built a front and rear swaybar for the car and installed a new set of Falken 615K tires. We had previously seen a radical improvement in the 48 Hour Camaro with the Falkens so we wanted to try them on the 33 Ford as well. Off we go to the Midwest Musclecar Challenge at Lawrenceville on Memorial Day.
The initial runs at MMC were great and we were just getting ready to get fast when the distributor gear on the cam died. Done for the weekend. We replaced the cam the next week and took of for the Hotrod Power Tour and the Optima Qualifier in Arlington Texas.

The car did great at Arlington...top 10 in all segments...but I was still chasing a frontend chatter through the corners. We started looking at control arms flex, loose bearings, spindle flex...all sorts of things. Nothing immediately identifieable.

Next event was the Optima Qualifier at Road America. Again the car did great, but the clutch started going away. In reality it probably made the car faster because it took the edge off the corner exit tire spin [because my right foot is not nearly talented enough]. We ended up in the top 5 in all segments.

After freshening the clutch up I was expecting great things at the Columbus Goodguys event. What I got in addition to the 106 degree weather [in a flat black car with a flat black sheetmetal interior...] was rearend posi problems and a frontend chatter that was getting worse, not better. Results were poor. the rearend problems were an easy fix, but we were still looking at mechanical flex issues for the frontend chatter.

Next event was the Motorstate Challenge at Gingerman. I spun the car in someone else's oil on the first lap. No damage but still not a great way to start the weekend. It didn't get any better because the car started running like hell as well...and ended up dying completely on Sunday for the autocross.

The good this is that now we've got about a month before we race again...time to get some stuff lined out. More on that in a bit!

[bret]

double post

[HarleyR]

very cool... why would you opt for a trans with a side mounted shifter with exposed linkage rather than a trans with internal linkage like a G Force GSR or a C&R

[bret]

very cool... why would you opt for a trans with a side mounted shifter with exposed linkage rather than a trans with internal linkage like a G Force GSR or a C&R

Cheap. It's a used magnesium Rankin clutch less 4 speed with cryogenic treated gears and other cool cup treatments. (a friend of mine works across the street at the Jasper Engines NASCAR transmission shop)
Also, we moved the shifter back 10" and over on top of the trans. Then built custom shift linkage.

[bret]

After the Motorstate Challenge we had some time to work on the car...theroretically. Remember that a huge part of our business is Street Rods...and military...and ATV...and...you get the idea. Although the 33 Ford was resting, we weren't!
Anyhow, the issues were:
1. didn't run - found a replacement throttle position sensor was also bad. Fixed, but still not running "happily".
2. clutch wore excessively - discussions with Tilton revealed that this clutch was just too small to carry the torque. I bought this unit from an ASA racer who used it on a LS spec engine that was making about 500hp...not the 600 that I was making. HE was also fine with rebuilding the clutch every month...I'm not. Now searching for an alternative.
3. frontend chatter - no friggen idea.

Next event...Run Through the Hills in Pigeon Forge, TN. The car was running...OK...and we were hoping for a great weekend. I made three runs until the power steering slave cylinder rod broke :(. The bright side is that the frontend chatter stopped! All this time I had been searching for a mechanical flex issue...now I started looking for a hydraulic problem. In the meantime I drove the rest of the event with manual steering. Consider a 10:1 steering ratio with a 315mm tire...my arms looked like my legs by the end of the weekend!
In addition to the power steering failure, the car quit running. After taking many peoples and parts names in vain we found that the spark from the coil was REALLY weak. We installed a new Autozone coil and it not only ran...it made about an extra 100 hp! This is what the unhappyness was all the time! The silver lining that weekend was that we won the event with the 48 Hour Camaro!
After a conversation with Tony Woodward about the powersteering, we determined that the pump was cavitating for fluid and the resulting fluid frothing was inducing the frontend chatter, which eventually broke the slave cylinder rod. [got all that?]. We raised the fluid reservoir about 3", rerouted the supply line to give it a straight slope down to the pump [think how a sewer works...] and the problem was completely resolved.
After Pigeon Forge we also fixed the clutch. I'd had wonderful luck with the Centerforce DYAD clutch in the 48 Hour Camaro. It was smooth, linear, and VERY durable. It was also considerably heavier than the 6 lb assembly I had in the 33 Ford. In this case I thought the extra weight would help calm the car down.
It did. We took the car to Texas with the new DYAD clutch, the newly fixed power steering, the resolved running problems...and won the event! NOW I could start tuning on the handling performance [and my performance] without trying to drive around the rest of the issues that had plagued the car all year.

[coolwelder62]

Good lookin car,Good lookin owner!https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/11/122076-1.jpg

[bret]

This was moments before the celebratory cocktails began. It got less good lookin after that...:)

I got a lot of comments about the "GROUCHY" license plate. I figured that described the car and all who worked on it most of the summer. I guess now I'll have to get a smiley face license plate frame!

[MichaelLeeHearn]

Nice build and car.

[eric1967]

Great job at Optima Bret. Car looks great.
Thanks Eric

[shane38]

BadAss Car!!!

[ace_xp2]

Tilton thought 600ft/lb was too much? Wow, not only do they rate it for 150 more than that, but it's been used at the 1000ft/lb range in at least a few cars. Maybe it's something specific to the clutch you got? They did come with different spring strengths.
Can I ask what your first and final gear ratios are? I'm thinking of going low to help with that first gear engagement.

[67zo6Camaro]

Good lookin car,Good lookin owner!https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/11/122076-1.jpg

Congrats Bret, a 1st, 5th and 7th with an overall 3rd place is very good. One of my favorite builds out.

This pictures captures it all "A man and his machine" on a mission.

By the way, just got done reading Robs story... My hat is off to you. Cheers for all the good things you do.

[bret]

I was wrong about the 7th place finish on the road course...it was actually 12th. My stopwatch was apparently optimistic! The other finishing positions are still correct. I think I ended up around 17th in the design challenge segment.

On the Tilton clutch, remember this is the 5.5" diameter unit, not the 7.25". I've got one of the 7.25 units in my Mustang for several years now...works great! That's the one that will hold 1200 ft lbs of torque. I bought the 5.5 unit used off eBay from an ASA racer who was running a 500hp spec motor. Just wouldn't live a long life at 600hp.

I'd have to check the 1st gear ratio again...too many numbers in my head. The rear gear is a 3:48. I could have used more gear at Pahrump...only running about 5500 at the end of the backstretch.

[tommycomfort]

I was wrong about the 7th place finish on the road course...it was actually 12th. My stopwatch was apparently optimistic! The other finishing positions are still correct. I think I ended up around 17th in the design challenge segment.

17th in the design segment??? That's the most ridiculous thing I've heard in a while! If not 1st I think it would be a stretch to say the 33 wasn't in the top five. Oh well, Incredible showing nonetheless!

[ace_xp2]

Don't mean to keep going off topic in this thread, but I can't PM you. Here's the carbon catalog for Tilton:Google pdf viewer link (https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=cache:eBgS4JN5crsJ:www.tiltonracing.com/sites/default/files/editor_uploads/files/Tilton2012%2520-%2520OT-Series%2520Carbon%253ACarbon%2520Clutches.pdf+tilt on+carbon+max+torque&hl=en&gl=ca&pid=bl&srcid=ADGEESjedEhRcZEBdy_c9Jtv43JY3FQxjed-An35Eue3LO5lwYilohCXsUjbYzNFCn0HzNsjBb6bkcMYVjcUmT uix4OeOHi2WsMm-5vCdAtIdj58Cz8nQSCOP7nhAEzl5ALafv7UElWk&sig=AHIEtbRsCenLu3ChXBlqusDrFw3tR1CLLg)
I only bring it up because I'm really surprised (and a little worried for mine) that you had trouble getting the clutch to hold. According to that the lightest pressure plate is rated to 750lb/ft in 5.5" triple disc. Maybe it was already over worn? Either way, glad the new clutch sorted it for you!

[Crestronwizard]

Awesome build. Love it!

[bret]

17th in the design segment??? That's the most ridiculous thing I've heard in a while! If not 1st I think it would be a stretch to say the 33 wasn't in the top five. Oh well, Incredible showing nonetheless!

Hehe...well, I can't say I disagree, but it's hard to quantify humans or their opinions. I have to say, the three top picks were truly awesome, certainly well above what I'd consider prudent to put on the track. Worthy choices!

Thanks for the vote of confidence Tom...always appreciated!

[bret]

Ok...now that we've got all the known shortcomings on the car fixed, were ready to get this ready for Optima.
After running a few road course event this summer I knew I needed some downforce on the rear of the car...it wanted to get light and spin the tires over the bumps at speed. Tire spin at 130 sounds very masculine...until it happens.
So we built a rear spoiler for it based on some ideas given to me by a customer who works with aero on Indycars.
We also had not ran the car on the road course with the larger 12" wide front wheels and 315mm tires...or the new clutch. Lots to test on the road course! So it's off the Putnam Park near indianapolis.
Call it superior planning and engineering...or plain good luck (like I do) but the car was so good we changed nothing...no tire pressure, no shock settings, no alignment settings...nothing. We ran a 1:20 lap time with a 147mph straightaway speed. Yes, I'm sure we could have eventually made it even faster...but we could have laso made it a lot slower...or worse. Too many stories of last minute engine changes :).
We brought it home, changed the fluids and filters, wiped it off, and put it in the box for Vegas.
At this point I'm feeling pretty good about things because I'm hearing stories about other competitors with new engines, new suspension systems, new tires...all kinds of unpredictable stuff.

The results at Optima have already been documented...5th in the autocross, 12th in the road course, 1st in the brake stop, and 3rd overall.
Obviously I was pleased with the results! We've had a lot of help on the car this summer. Greg Schneider at our shop was responsible for all things mechanical and worked tirelessly to make it run better every week. Paul Cox at Fox and our engineer Britt Marolf put their heads together about shock and spring tuning. Falken sold us tires and gave us a LOT of insight on how to use them. Centerforce clutches custom built a DYAD clutch for our unusual combination that works flawlessly. And Holley EFI and Mile Norris helped work through some EFI tuning. Great team, great results!

Now the 33will run the last 2 Goodguys events at Scottsdale and Delmar...then back home for the winter.
Refinements? Look for ShockWave air suspension next year. It'll be even faster :)

[bret]

On the Tilton clutch...it was a 5.5 double disc, not a triple. That is why the lower torque rating. Remember that torque rating is when everything is fresh and perfect. The first time you run the car the torque capacity will deteriorate some due to disc wear and the resulting increasing clearances.

[HarleyR]

Cheap. It's a used magnesium Rankin clutch less 4 speed with cryogenic treated gears and other cool cup treatments. (a friend of mine works across the street at the Jasper Engines NASCAR transmission shop)
Also, we moved the shifter back 10" and over on top of the trans. Then built custom shift linkage.

Ive built a few of them...nice pieces... I used to get parts from Terry DeKemper at Jasper when we were sponsored by them a few years back...

[bret]

Yep...Terry is the transmission whisperer. I wish I could afford that new piece they are currently supplying for NASCAR!

[bonecrrusher]

Nice job @ Optima!

[66larkgs]

Hehe...well, I can't say I disagree, but it's hard to quantify humans or their opinions. I have to say, the three top picks were truly awesome, certainly well above what I'd consider prudent to put on the track. Worthy choices!

Thanks for the vote of confidence Tom...always appreciated!

Couldent agree with tom more about the 17th place. Thier was some REAL nice cars but the level of fabrication and attention to detail is truly a piece a art. I looked at your car over 5 different times during SEMA and Optima and ever time i saw something different. I got to say thanks for spending the time talking to us during sema and it was a blast to watch you guys run the car in vegas.

[Martin71RS]

B1wDePOuf4U

u0bc2tMbrnM

[jorge]

^ That's awesome, thanks for posting the videos.

[Tig]

Nice, car sounds amazing.

Any new photos?
I love this build.

[Tig]

Congrats on your feature in Hot Rod:cheers:
It looks awesome.