SPC Arms Seizing Up??

[SicMonte]

Has anyone with the SC&C (SPC) upper control arms had a problem with the adjusters seizing up?

I had mine in for an alignment and the shop said they are 100% seized up and even took a torch to them to try to get them to turn...and they didnt turn. So now I have shims on my "adjustable" upper control arms and torched...once anozized...adjuster sleeves.

just my luck huh?? I had these arms installed up at SC&C in 2006.

:machine: :hammer: :box2:

[BonzoHansen]

the stupid steel adj sleeves? or the hex ones?

[Tony_SS]

One end is reverse thread... did they know that?

[98ssnova]

One end is reverse thread... did they know that?
I would hope that we would have told them that...

[JRouche]

I have some SPC adjustable arms. They were as smooth as any threads.

I dont know but I would never take a car with far from stock components to an alignment shop. I dont want them guessing and learning on my car.

Not saying they dont know what they are doing. But just the fact that they took a torch to yer arms without asking you is a clue. That woulda flamed me and I would sue them.

Unless you gave them permission to do whatever they wanted, including torch your arms they were reaching beyond the scope of an alignment shop Plain and simple. An alignment shop will inspect and correct. If they see broken parts they will advise and wait for instructions from the car owner. OH!!! Unless the kid doing the work realized he F-ed up and was hurrying to try to fix his mistake before the boss saw. Tried to heat it up to free the bolt he seized, then saw it was really seized and the arm has obviously been torched, they had to reveal that to you. They prolly F-ed up your arms and tried to fix it.

I dont trust ANYONE to work on my car except the tire changer, and then I still remove the wheels and load them in the truck to have a tire swap.

I dont trust any mechanics besides myself for my Nova. All the other cars I dont mind. But I know my nova far better than any mechanic. For example, I dont use an air hammer gun on any parts of my car. Mechanics will use air guns for the speed issue. And sometimes because "something" is not just right in their opinion.

No one touches my car, plain and simple. So when something gets broken, and it has, its MY fault. I can live with that. And Ill fix it. JR

Oh, one last point. I think you need to take a lil of the blame. Sorry, just the way it is. Anytime you install after market products on your car you should fully inspect them. I dont care what part it is. Some will take a general visual inspection. But serious parts, like control arms need to be fully disassembled and inspected. I disassembled my arms for two reasons. Primarily to inspect them for any damage. But I also painted the arms. Did you paint the arms or were they already coated? But even when parts are coated from the manufacture they need to be disassembled and inspected. That is the time that you would have put some anti-seize on the adjuster threads and noticed if there was any issues with thread galling. If you took those steps before hand there is no way the alignment shop would be able to say the parts were defective.

Duurrr!! I re-read your post. You didnt install the arms, SCC did. They should have put anti-seize on the sleeves and bolts. If its not part of their installation it should be. Aluminum and steel dont mix, ok well, they mix too well. They will seize to each other. Anti seize!!! Its a requirement with aluminum to steel fasteners.

[Tony_SS]

^ Exactly.

[SicMonte]

well it wasnt an alignment shop it was a buddy of mines shop. This guy builds high end drag cars and some pro-touring stuff. He knows whats up with this kind of suspension.

I am really pi$$ed off about him taking a torch to it. I am going to the shop tonight to pick up the car and will get some pics....I will tell you one thing...he is NOT getting any money out of me.

[John Wright]

Mine has a liberal dose of anti-seize on the threads too...after all of these years sitting, I can go out there and turn the adjusters by hand(with the weight off the car). The jam nuts are to keep everything from moving, once the alignment is set.

I'd be pissed about the torch too.....

[SicMonte]

Well I went last night to see the car. Turns out he used a propane torch on them so the aluminum is ok. But it does look like he used a king kong wrench on them b/c the anodizing is just trashed. The driver side is adjusted using the control arms but the passenger side is seized up he said, so there are shims on it. That is just ugly but it will do for now.

Does anyone else, besides Global West, make an upper control arm for G-bodies? After this dillemma I want to get away from the adjustable type.

[John Wright]

Here's what I did to mine....I had thoughts of what a pipewrench would do to these sleeves. I like the hex sleeves better, but I purchased these before I knew they existed. BTW, Marcus has these for sale and can send you a set of hex sleeve in whatever lengths you need.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/10/MVC004F-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2009/10/MVC003F-1.jpg

[SicMonte]

that looks really good. I like the Hex sleeves better too but the ones you have look like they are easier to adjust and more functional. I will have to call him to see what I can do.

This weekend I am getting the car back and will be taking the control arms apart to see what "seized up" means to these guys. More to come.....

[John Wright]

I forget what size hex nut that is....it adds unwanted weight to the arm, but it makes it so that you can use a regular wrench on it. Those were slid up onto the sleeves just for the picture....I ended up putting them on the car to see where they would be most useful (ie. see where I had room to get a wrench to them), and then tack welded the hex nut to the sleeve(while unassembled).

[stealth71]

I don't recall the directions saying to use anti-seize, but I did notice they say to put loctite on the lock nut.

[John Wright]

http://www.scandc.com/prolite.htm

If you're interested....Talk to
Marcus about these hex sleeves(shown on his light weight UCAs).

[SicMonte]

yeah dude...that's what I have on the car now!!

[John Wright]

Oh crap...I thought you had the smooth steel sleeves like mine.

[SicMonte]

here is an old pic of my motor...but you can kinda see the red adjusters on the control arms....

I like what you did to your smooth sleeves. I might just end up doing that. It is easy and functional!!

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/04/IMG_29681-1.jpg

[stealth71]

I'm wondering if I should take mine apart while I can and anti-seize them. Anyone worry about the lock nuts backing off with anti-seize?

[SicMonte]

If I had known this was an issue....I would have anti-seized the threads on the adjuster and used lock tite on the lock nuts. That should be a done deal right there!!

I would do it if I were you!!

[BonzoHansen]

I bet if you call Mark he can get you the parts to fix it. Cheaper than new arms.

[John Wright]

This weekend I am getting the car back and will be taking the control arms apart to see what "seized up" means to these guys. More to come.....
I hope they didn't just bottom them out and then thought they were seized.



edit:........or forget to loosen the jam nuts and try to move the sleeves.....uggh.

[stealth71]

Good luck man. Seems like it's always something.

[SicMonte]

Good luck man. Seems like it's always something.


I hear ya...it is ALWAYS something!!

I talked to Mark and he can hook me up with some new parts to "rebuild" my control arms. I need to take them apart this weekend to estimate the damage.....:machine:

[rentedmule]

Does anyone else, besides Global West, make an upper control arm for G-bodies? After this dillemma I want to get away from the adjustable type.

UB Machine makes a tall balljoint friendly UCA for G-bodies, I'm running them on my truck. They don't advertise them but dusterbd13 (a member here) and Tony from UB designed them. Unfortunately you need plenty of ugly shims to align them (not a big issue if your suspension is as ugly as mine!).

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/04/S6302048-1.jpg

[SicMonte]

Thanks man! The more I look..the more I find vendors selling upper A arms for g bodies!!

I would like to support a pro-touring.com sponsors if I do get new ones. Anyone sponsor here sell this kinda A arm??

[Skip Fix]

I had the nut on my Bilsteins seize and snap off awhile back,luckily enough threads to still get a nut on it. I put a dab of anti seize on most things. The humidity here in Houston will get just about anything.

[JRouche]

I talked to Mark and he can hook me up with some new parts to "rebuild" my control arms. I need to take them apart this weekend to estimate the damage.....:machine:

If you plan on fixing the arms you have and determine they are in fact seized they shouldnt be too difficult to remove. The sleeves are prolly toast so what you do to remove them wont matter much. But brute force is not yer best friend with seized threads. Thats what usually gets folks deeper into trouble. They feel the threads getting tight and think they can just add more force to make it work. They are just welding the threads tighter.

What I have done before is chill the entire part, in the freezer if possible. Over night is good. Then I take the part to the bench and clamp it solid in the vise, moving fairly quickly. With the torch (propane is fine) I heat the outside part. In yer case the sleeve. Faster heating is better if you have a rosebud oxy setup. Heat the sleeve for about 30-45 seconds then remove the heat, shoot some decent penetration oil (I like Kroil) at the joint, both sides then use a wrench to get some movement on the sleeve. Back and forth. Then continue in the removal direction.

Different metals seize differently. Dry steel on steel works the best with that method. Stainless steel on steel or stainless works well too because the hot and cold opens up the fit a lil and there is some lubricating going on with the oil.

Now aluminum on steel is another story. Its the worst. The hot and cold helps because the thermal action will move the aluminum faster than the steel. So it will open up the fit faster. But it will also heat the shaft faster too. But then the real problem is all the lil tiny shards of aluminum still want to create a tight fit. Move fast and get some turning on the sleeve. Get a lil movement and work with that, dont try to force it off in one try if you get some movement and then it gets tight again. But if its moving and keeps moving go with it, take it all the way off. The arms will be fine. The sleeve is toast.

Seized fasteners!!!! I hate it. And yes, I have seized a few over the years. Even recently. I seized a 4140 rod end to a trailing arm tube. I was just putting it together for mock up. Just threading it in by hand and it got a lil tight. The threads were bone dry. Specially the threads on the arm tubes, I had welded the fittings in and they were really dry, and a lil rough. So stupid me, I used a wrench to turn the rod end in more. Yeah, it went in ok, not much force. But when it came time to remove them for paint the rod end was stuck, it started to come off ok, then got tighter and tighter. What did dummy do?? Yup, I got a bigger wrench, I kinda panicked instead of thinking. Before I knew it the 8 inch wrench turned into the 12" wrench and that one was swapped out for the 24" wrench and a long tube. STUPID!! That dude was welded tight.
Heating was out, the rod end had teflon in it, and I didnt want to ruin the 38 dollar rod end. So.... I sliced off the tube, I only had 12 bucks in the trailing arm, two welded fittings and some DOM steel (oh, and my time to make them). So I chucked the rod end up in the lathe and turned down the fitting so it was .005" shy of the rod end threads and removed the tattered remains of the fitting. It was actually un-threading itself at that point, reverse rotation and upside down tool bit.

So... maybe this last episode with seized threads will cure me of my stupidity. I hope anyway. I use anti-seize on all dissimilar metal threads now, even for mock up.

Oh and the anti-seize with thread locker. Someone asked. Its a messy animal, anti-seize. For control arms I would just wipe the outside of the thread (where the nut is going) really well and dont be afraid of using a lil acetone, I dont think it will creep up into the threads enough. Then some blue thread locker and yer good to go. Anti-seize compound is some wicked stuff. A lil goes, well, EVERYWHERE.. I like the napa (permatex) stuff. Just a dab will do ya, and then some. Like spark plugs in aluminum heads. A 1/4" dab will do an entire set of plugs. I like Q-tips for that.

Anyway... I yapped enough, its drunk friday LOL Sorry about the issues. Sounds like you will get-her-done, one way or the other. JR

[SicMonte]

dude it's all good! Thanks for the pointers on dealing with threads and seized up crap. They might be a pain but it only makes us stronger right??

[Bowtie1z28]

Anti-sieze and no loctite on my SPC aluminum adjuster sleeves going on 2 years and never had the jam nuts come loose. I use anti-sieze on all of my suspension bolted/threaded connections, yes it is messy at times but everything comes apart as it is supposed to later on. An alternative to anti-sieze would be a light oil. Dry threads are never a good idea IMO especially if you want to get it back apart. Lubrication helps to prevent corrosion as well especially on disimilar metals.