Options for 15" tires? Options I have found, but which to chose?

[Midnight-Samurai]

Hey guys,
I am still riding with 15" rims for now on my Trans Am. Clearly there are not a lot of options out there for us guys sticking with the 15's on the street. After some searching, I've decided to lay out what I've found. I would really appreciate any comments or suggestions. I'm looking at tires that come in sizes like 235-60R15, 255-60R15, 275-60R15 etc etc. My preference is towards road handling instead of drag racing. (I pulled the ratings you see from summitracing or tirerack.com)



BF Goodrich Radial T/A
I had these tires on my camaro in '92. They come in all the sizes I want them in and they look cool. Everything I have read seems to indicate they have not changed with the times though. So you have a big tire that maybe is not giving you all it could?
UTQG: 400
Speed Rating: S
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires....e1=yes&place=0

Dunlop GT Qualifiers
Another tire that comes in all the right sizes. I get the feeling that the Dunlops are in the same boat as the Radial T/A's with the older technology.
UTQG: 440AB
Speed Rating: T
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires....e1=yes&place=1


Cooper Cobra GT
I know nothing about these tires other then they make them in the right sizes.
UTQG Rating: 440
Speed Rating: S or T



Goodyear Eagle GT II
In a comparison on tirerack.com the Eagles came in last in their category, which included the Yokohamas, Dunlops, BFGoodrichs, and Firestones.
UTQG:420
Speed Rating: S
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires....e1=yes&place=3


Mickey Thompson Sportsman S/R
I have seen several posts from people who have recently gotten this tire, however I have not heard how they perform on the road and corners. Mickey Thompson Tires seem to be very highly regarded as drag tires, but I don't know if that extends to their road capabilities.
UTQG: Not a clue
Speed Rating: Did I mention they look cool?
http://store.summitracing.com/partde...5&autoview=sku


Mickey Thompson ET Street Radial
I understand these tires can be used on the street or dragged. But what do they offer for cornering and braking?
UTQG: Its out there somewhere
Speed Rating: Hopefully fast
http://store.summitracing.com/partde...5&autoview=sku


Yokohama Avid S/T
The sizes seem to be a little more limited with the Avids. 235 and 225's only come in 70R15. However according to tirerack survey they handle well and have a very high customer satisfaction record.
UTQG: 420
Speed Rating: T
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires....e1=yes&place=4



Pirelli P600
I've only seen it come in 235-60ZR15. It sounds like a capable tire, and certainly the best speed rating of this group.
UTQG: 180AA
Speed Rating: Z
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires....tireModel=P600


Firestone Firehawk Indy 500's
This tire has the best stats on tirerack.com, beating all similar tires including the Yokohama Avid S/T. At this time, its the tire I'm leaning towards. However I have read some negative information that indicates the qualities of this tire diminish rapidly after you start driving with them. Not planning on putting them on a Ford Explorer
UTQG: 500 AB
Speed Rating: S in the sizes that matter.
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires....e1=yes&place=2

Well thats what I have found so far. Any tires i missed or experience/opinions would be great.

Thanks
Mike

[chicane67]

BFG made a huge change to the construction of the Radial TA in 1996 and it is a completely different tire all together.

Out of what you posted, they have been the best I used in that tire/wheel size for the money.

[High Plains Mopars]

The T/As are one of the best selling tires because they look really good and the perform reasonably well, especially for the restoration crowd. I have heard feedback some these same people that switching to Goodyear or Firestone was an improvement over the T/As as Goodrich tends to use a fairly hard compound in the T/A line to get mileage out of them. The Eagle and Firehawk also seem to perform better in the wet than the T/As. I've also seen quite a few Coopers out there with satisfied owners, but rarely any of the others you list.

I've heard the M/T SR has a pretty stiff sidewall and is not at all drag oriented like their other sportmans tires. Speaking of which, the ET street radial is a drag tire that just happens to be d.o.t. approved with a very soft sidewall. This one isn't a handling tire by any means.

Which brings up a question for me; M/T tires don't have a speed rating because drag racing speeds are very quick, short duration events, even at extremely high speeds. Speed ratings are arrived at for SUSTAINED speeds at the rating. What exactly consititutes sustained high speed? Two minutes, twenty mintues, two hours? What the standard for this rating as I'm pretty sure that very few of us here are ever driving our street cars at sustained speeds required for Z rated tires, although it is a nice safety margin to have.

A couple of manufacturers you didn't mention are Hoosier, who has d.o.t. approved tires in regular, autocross, and road race compounds, and Avon, who makes 15", Z rated, d.o.t. tires in a variety of sizes up to around 315-325/50. A couple more that are harder to find but are still out there are American Racer and Towel City. These two mostly produce oval track racing tires and are only available to limited distribution channels, but I do beleive they have d.o.t. approved tires also. Towel City is unique as they build position specific tires with 1-2 degrees of camber built into them. Thats a great stealth advantage for racing.

[Midnight-Samurai]

Should I be concerned about M/T tires lack of speed rating? My gut tells me yes, but I'm not sure. Typically out on 295 I'm going between 70 and 80 mph, not really epic speeds. I wish somebody could do a tire shoot out, similar to what grassrootsmotorsports does with racing tires.

I foudn this about speed ratings on wikipedia, that bastion of factual info. It indicates the rating is the maximum speed that the tire can sustain for a ten minute endurance run without being a danger. No clue about what the test invovles. From Tirerack.com: Speed ratings are based on laboratory tests where the tire is pressed against a large diameter metal drum to reflect its appropriate load, and run at ever increasing speeds (in 6.2 mph steps in 10 minute increments) until the tire's required speed has been met.

OK with Avon Tires I found:
ZV3 comes in 225-60R15
ZZ3 comes in 225-60ZR15

Street Legal Race tire:
CR6ZZ comes in 295/50R15, 275/55R15, 245/60R15, 225/65R15

I have not found a lot of info about the suitablilty of the avon street legal race tires for actual road driving. I'll look some mroe tires up after I get off from work Thanks for the replies.
Mike

[BonzoHansen]

BFG Radial T/A, Dunlop GT Qualifiers, Cooper Cobra GT, Goodyear Eagle GT II, Yokohama Avid S/T, Firestone Firehawk Indy 500's - it is a pick'em. I dare anyone to find any substantial difference - they are all "cosmtic performance tires". Buy on looks, price & avialability and you won't miss anything.

The BFG is the oldest design of the group. I bought the GTQs because I found the size I wanted (245/60/15). I am not unhappy with them - they met my expectations - which were not the same expectations as if i had bought 18" Pilots or something. The BFGs have been very hard to find. I have heard excellent comments on the FS and Coopers. I have a personal dislike of GY but no experience with that hoop.

The P600 is better then all of them, but is size limited and blackwall. Too bad they don't make a summer version like they did with the old P6. Great warm weather hoop.

I cannot speak for more race-oriented tires for street use. I hear the race Avons are the shizznit.

[High Plains Mopars]

Should I be concerned about M/T tires lack of speed rating? My gut tells me yes, but I'm not sure. Typically out on 295 I'm going between 70 and 80 mph, not really epic speeds. I wish somebody could do a tire shoot out, similar to what grassrootsmotorsports does with racing tires.

A tire shootout, that would be cool but I bet it would all be 17-19" tires. I wouldn't worry about the lack of a speed rating on the M/Ts. Their tires have proven themselves for decades on the track. Unless your going land speed racing, which has their own requirements for tires, the M/T would be fine for just driving on the streets with an occasional blast down the track.

I found this about speed ratings on wikipedia, that bastion of factual info. It indicates the rating is the maximum speed that the tire can sustain for a ten minute endurance run without being a danger. No clue about what the test invovles. From Tirerack.com: Speed ratings are based on laboratory tests where the tire is pressed against a large diameter metal drum to reflect its appropriate load, and run at ever increasing speeds (in 6.2 mph steps in 10 minute increments) until the tire's required speed has been met.

Hmm. So it isn't destructive testing like scattershields and vehicle loading will impact those ratings as well.

OK with Avon Tires I found:
ZV3 comes in 225-60R15
ZZ3 comes in 225-60ZR15

Street Legal Race tire:
CR6ZZ comes in 295/50R15, 275/55R15, 245/60R15, 225/65R15

I have not found a lot of info about the suitablilty of the avon street legal race tires for actual road driving. I'll look some mroe tires up after I get off from work Thanks for the replies.
Mike

I'd imagine that street legal racing tires are pretty soft. They will grip like an S.O.B. but wear out pretty quickley.

[Midnight-Samurai]

M/T tires have proven themselves drag racing, but have they been used for road racing/autocross type situations? I guess its safe to say the avon CR6ZZ race tires would not last long enough to be useable on a street car?

Bonzo, you mentioned that the Pirelli P-600 is better then all the other cosmetic radials I have listed. I should know the answer to this but I don't. At what point does a better tire trump a tire with more contact area on the road. For instance, the p600 comes in a 235 width, a bit bigger then the 225 stock size on my Firebird. Some of these tires come in 275 or 295 widths. Does a quality tire beat out the wider tires with mroe contact? I imagine that the wider tires must also weight a bit more. How much of an effect does that extra weight have?

Hey guys, another tire to add here. This time its a Hoosier.
Hoosier Pro-Street Radial
Comes in all kinda great sizes, and is apparently the only non race tire that Hoosier makes. H speed rating. I don't have a lot of info, so I'm going to email them about the tire. Once again, I don't know how well the tire does in the twisties, but hoosiers are pretty damn popular SCCA tires.

I'm going to start posting links to the tires I have found.
https://www.hoosiertire.com/strttire.htm

Thanks again, Mike

[High Plains Mopars]

These guys have a large assortment of 15" tires from Goodyear, Hoosier, Dunlop, Avon, Blockly and Toyo. Also lots of neat technical info on sizes as well as Koni catalogs and grooving service.
http://www.rogerkrausracing.com/

[High Plains Mopars]

Another potential source for 15 inchers. Most of these are racing tires, but they do offer a variety of tread and compounds that are d.o.t. approved and they are developing large sizes for Cobra kit car applications as well.

http://www.americanraceronline.com/

[Midnight-Samurai]

Hey Guys,

I contacted Roger Kraus Racing about the Avon CR6ZZ tires. He was cool enough to respond right away to my questions. This is the response I got:

"Hi Michael, The tires are race compound and DOT legal. They work excellent on Cobras and Ferrari's. I feel they will work great on any car but do not expect a lot of mileage. Give me a call if you have more questions. Roger 1-800-510-7223"

I will make a call soon to find out how many miles can be expected. I've been trying to decide in my head how many miles is acceptable, especially since they are pretty expensive.

I looked at the American Racing site and they specifically said that their tires, even the DOT ones, are not street legal. I dont know if thats just a cover my arse disclaimer like competition rims by Panasports who just want to keep their race rims on race tracks. God how I love panasports.

What is the difference between a passenger car tire and a truck street/sport tire? I have read that some people use truck tires on their cars. Difference in tread height or sidewall stiffness? There are a couple of promising tires in that category if they can be used on a car.

Also, is mixing different tires a bad idea? I have found a lot of potential tires that come in suitable sizes for front but not the back, and vice verca. Also will decreasing the height of tires from say a stock 225-70R15 to a 225-60R15 adversely effect brake performance? Anyways here are tires I found for the front:

Falken ZE-912
My friends who autocross a lot, love falken tires. These are listed at a very reasonable price as well.
UTG 60/65 Series - 65,000/480 A A
225-60HR15
225-50VR15
http://www.bigwheels.net/index.php?l...l&model=ZE-912

Falken Ziez ZE-512
As far as I can tell, the differnce between the 912's and the 512's is that the 512's trade some performance for all season capability.
225-60HR15


BF Goodrich Traction TA
It got a 6 out of 19 on the tirerack.com survey for rated performance. Seem to be higher performance then the Radial T/A. Too bad they don't make it in a wider size:P
225-60VR15
96V SL
UTQG: 440 AA A
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/Spec.j...num%3D26VR5TTA

BF Goodrich g-Force Sport
Its listed as a tire for sports compacts. No idea what that means for my 3500 lbs Trans Am. High performance summer tire, so no driving near frozen conditions...
225-60VR15
96V SL
UTQG: 340 AA A
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires....e1=yes&place=0

Bridgestone Potenza G 009
Its listed number 2 out of 19 on tirerack for High Performance All Season tires.
225-60HR15
UTQG: 460 AA
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires....e1=yes&place=3

Michelin PilotExalto A/S
Its the number 1 tire on tirerack for High Performance All Season tires. Its a bit more expensive then some of the tires I just listed , though no where near what the Avon CR6ZZ's are.
225-60VR15
96V SL
UTQG: 400 AA
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires....e1=yes&place=6


Kumho Ecsta ASX
This tire is listed in the ultra high performance category (all season).
225-60VR15
96V SL
420 AA
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires....1=yes&place=13

Here is what I have found that would be suitable for the rear. Any idea if running 255-60R15's on all 4 corners of a firebird would work/make sense?

Nitto NT-555 Extreme ZR
I've heard of many many people using this tire in the 17-18 inch rim size, but not so much with the 15 inch rims. Anybody using them right now?
275-60VR15
275-50VR15
http://www.bigwheels.net/index.php?l...20Extreme%20ZR
No other information

Hankook Venture ST RH06
I think I use to put cheapy hankooks on Taxi Cabs years ago. Anybody using them?
275-60VR15
http://www.bigwheels.net/index.php?l...us%20ST%20RH06
Not a lot of info either.

[BRIAN]

I had Falken 512's on the last car I built. I did one or two panic stops from about 50mph and the tires flat spotted. When I say flat spot I mean you could see it from 5 feet away. It literally went flat to where there was zero tread left. One was worse than the other. Swapped out and never had a problem again so it was the tires. Maybe I just got a bad set as the replacements worked fine even during harder braking.

[68Formula]

DOT tire is one that is approved by the Department of Transportation. I can't understand how they would not be street legal.

[High Plains Mopars]

It is a cover your arse statement in case you maime yourself or others in an accident using their product.

D.O.T. testing would be certain minimalistic requirements for a specific load rating of a tire that includes those parameters you see molded into the sidewall; treadwear, temperature, and traction. So these will have low treadwear capability with high temprature and traction numbers with these tires. Additionally, since these are constructed for racing classes that may require a d.o.t. tire, it is a good bet that the rule requirements in those classes also have a minumum weight the car must be, i.e. the load requirement, which is probably less than most street cars since even a hobby stock car can be built to around 3000#, which is easily 500-1000# less than a lot of street cars.

So Delbert Dumbutt puts 4 tires load rated for 1000# underneath his 5000# truck, loads the bed up with a 1000# of manure and not only is he going to accellerate the wear, but also exceed the duty cycle and run the risk of blowing out a tire when he goes flying around a corner down the highway from his buddies house at 95 mph.

Put those same tires under your 3200# Mustang and you have a car that sticks like flypaper in a corner, even at 100 mph, until they get wet. Even with a treaded face, a race type tire is not the most efficient mover of water and while not as slippery as an outright slick, are not really designed for rainy driving. Yet another reason for a disclaimer.

Which also ties into the P vs LT designation on the sidewall. An LT (light truck) will carry a heavier load rating than a comparably sized P (passenger) rating. So in the numbers game, using an LT tire with more load rating in a lighter passenger vehicle means it would be capable of supporting more speed for a longer period of time than the P tire at the same inflation pressures, load, and speed. However, this is where the ratings and load game gets really dicey about what tire manufacturers will or won't admit to for liability reasons. You could use a load rating one class lower with higher pressure or higher load ratings with lower pressure, but since the manufacturers don't typically test outside of the parameters the OEMs ask for, we're into some hypothetical area.

So MS, why are you looking at 225/235 for the front? That seems kind of narrow for a TA that should be able to support a 255 or 265 with decent backspacing.

[Midnight-Samurai]

Hey guys, just got back from a week in North Carolina. I still can't believe how nice it was in Nagshead.

Brian, were your replacement tires the same Falken 512's that had flatspotted? What kind of car are you using them on?

HPM, I had a previous experience with 255's in the front of a '77 Trans Am that rubbed very bad. But now that I think about it, I really don't know what kind of backspacing those rims had. This was in '95. The rims I am planning on using are 15x8.5" Western Turbine Rims with 4" backspacing. If I can get the 255's to work that would be fantastic.

I keep coming back to question about wider tires versus higher quality tires. If a 225 has superior qualities, does it trump a significantly larger tire?

If I understand correctly, a light truck tire should work with a passenger car, once the correct load rating and pressure is hashed out?

[High Plains Mopars]

In any of the books, manuals, or bulletins I have seen, they always recommend going with the widest tire possible. However, these have typically been in rule restrictive race classes that specify a maximum and/or minimum allowable tire sizes and have not been in street applications where it is only limited by your wheel opening.

I would have to say that there are not going to be huge variations in assembly and materials to the core parts of the tire, so the biggest differences in quality are going to be in tread design and rubber compounds. The contact patch of the tire is the most important point, so maximizing it should yield the highest grip. This would mean small block to void ratios that put more rubber down and minimized tread height to reduce squirm, so to me, there would be some dependancy on what consitutes the better quality.

So the problem with most 15" tires is that they are predominatly bought by the cruisers or racing crowd, so we have crusiers who want multi weather capability and long tread life and racers who want maximum grip. So those of us in the middle get to choose between fast wearing tires that grab good or long wearing tires that compromise grip.


BTW, Mickey Thompson S/Rs ARE speed rated, H to 130 mph. http://www.mickeythompsontires.com/s...em=SportsmanSR

[MonzaRacer]

OK Dunlops are gneric Good years as GY bought them years ago and took zero of the Dunlop tech, It is said that the tech the company had went over seas but havent seen any.
As for Cooper tires I wouldnt give the sweat off my B@lls for them, last time I was in a car in light rain the Cobra GTs slid through a lred light on an Escort too.
Also if you looka t any Mickey Thonmpson tires they are built by Cooper plants.
Now just to give you some info, Cooper has been selling everything not nailed down, including tire lines, they are trying to finace a cheap a$$ tire chinese tire plant so they can sell sub standard crap.
GoodYear has been making tires out of the North American continent for decades, big problem is the tires are crap, I worked for a GY dealer a year and all of the South American tires had serious qulity issues. The only tires made down there that were any good were the racing tires and they built 2 new non union plants in Ohio and brought all that racing stuff back after NASCAR found out they tires were made down there. you als osaw Goodyear have a lot of issues on tires for racing till they got the process down as they brought back pparts and tools not the smart people.
As for yokahoma i wouldnt walk across the street for them anympore even thier over the road tires for big trucks are going down in quality, and Prelli has been sawpped around and I am not sure who actually owns them any more but the actual prelli tire company is no more.
As for the Indy 500s I love them and since BF Goodrich dumped the Unirag (Uniroyal ) brand and tech on Michelin I might buy them again as my set I had on my 69 Pontiac were aewsome.
I do know that you can get 235,245,255,275 in 60s from Bridgestone.Firestone, oh and they have a 295 50 too and I believe the BFGs can be had in 2235.245.255.265.275 and I beliee you can get a few in 50 series too in BFG.
Falkens are built to spec for the company by who ever is low bidder,
Michelins is using a lot of older tech from thier purchase of Uniroyal, Kumho I have sold and was never impressed by them.
Hankook is a asain heavy tire comapny getting into otr tire for big and small vehicles,, good on a scrapper or pan but never was impressed withthem on street.
Now for street performance use I would use Nitto anyday as they are purpose built to Nitto spec.
Oh and as for the speed rating on any pmetric tire is an S unless marked differently, thier are base standards and that one is the minimum everytire manufacturer is using as a base even the Eastern bloc (ie old russian )manufacturers, which came back to thier base companies that they were divest from back in early 1900s when it went communist.
The technology infusion overthier has quadrupled thierr tire life(I have a friend who has a hot rodded Lada) and all western tires were blackmarket and runningthem was a fineable offence (and you paid everytime stopped, to that cop).
Good Luck

[High Plains Mopars]

Here is another source for performance tires for 13, 14, 15, and 16 inch diameters. http://www.towelcityracingtires.com/

I've abused many sets of these back in my racing days. A cool thing about these is you can get them with a couple degrees of camber built into them. That makes them position specific, but if you're looking for grip, mileage and rotation are secondary. You also can get a range of diameters in any wheel size to mix and match.

[High Plains Mopars]

bump up since its been a while

[Midnight-Samurai]

I contacted Hoosier Tires about the Pro-Street Radials (https://www.hoosiertire.com/strttire.htm). Mr. Steve Hudspeth returned my email very quickly. Here is his response:

Mike,
The Pro Street Radial is a LT (light truck) tires designed for street rods. If you had to compare, it would be similar to the BFG T/A. Typical mileage from the Pro Street is 25,000+ miles (under normal driving conditions). This would be the best tire we have for street application.

Thanks for the e-mail.

- Steve Hudspeth

So in the end I guess they are cosmetic tires. I imagine the Mickey Thompson S/R's are similar. I've been in limbo trying to decide what type of tires to buy. In the end I feel like I am going to end up getting the Pirelli P-600's even though they are a smaller option then other tires. I was thinking maybe I could put the Nitto 555's on all 4 corners of my car, but I do not think 275-50 or 60 R15's is going to fit under the front fenders of my Trans Am. As High Plains has pointed out, americanraceronline.com does seem to have some possibilities, but I need to contact them. They have not yet released any info about their future Cobra tires. I wish the Avon CR6ZZ's that Roger Krauss sells were not over 300 a pop. I just can't afford them, but they really do look like the ticket.

[pitts64]

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