Handguns......

[Samckitt]

I am thinking of buying one. I like the 1911 models. Particularly Kimber & Springfield. The kimbers are a little more expensive, but I think are better guns. Was thinking 9mm because shells are cheaper. Who has one, what is it, & caliber? What is your opinion on Kimbers / Springfield & 9mm or .45?

Scot

[EFI69Cam]

9mm is to expensive for target shooting, and would just annoy an attacker.

.40cal is the choice for defense. Ruger makes some nice .22 pistols that are great for plinking.

[DeepBlue68]

My dad has a Springfield .45 with a trigger job and some other custom work. That gun is sweet to shoot...better than any other .45 that I've shot (not that I'm a gun conniesuer or anything). I've never shot a Kimber though, so I can't compare the two.


9mm is to expensive for target shooting, and would just annoy an attacker.
You don't think 2 or 3 to the chest (or 1 to the head) from a 9mm would stop a guy dead in his tracks? Granted, it has nowhere near the stopping power of a .40 or .45, but it can still do some damage.

[kman67rsss]

I just recently bought my 1st hand gun and i got a Ruger P345 with the rail. i love this gun. its a .45 cal and is a great shooting gun. i carry it concealed without a problem but im also 6' 280lbs. ive never shot either of the guns you are talking about though so i cant help there. all i can say is that shooting is addicting. go once or twice and you will knoe what i mean.

[dropit69]

ive had a kimber .45 awesome gun..i own now a beratta >40 cal and a 9mm..both awesome guns too..it all depends what your gonna do with it..if its for home defense shot gun and 00 buck shot is the best no aiming needed..lol

[David Pozzi]

I like a 45 best to target shoot but only if it's a steel full size gun, I seem to shoot it the best of any guns I've shot.

For a gun to have at hand for defense, a 357 revolver is nice since it's very simple to use in an emergency and can be left hammer down on an empty chamber, but it's ready to go. When you need something in a hurry and probably haven't shot it or touched it in years, simple is what you want. Racking a slide or flipping a safety is fine when you are practiced in doing so, but in a pressure situation any extra fuss could cause an error.

I also like a Glock for this reason, it can be left with a shell in the chamber and the hard trigger pull is somewhat of a safety but you can't get caught with the safety on in an emergency, or leave it with an empty chamber and just rack the slide to have it ready to go. It also holds a lot of ammo in the clip.

[Samckitt]

Here is the springfield model I like but in stainless:
http://www.springfield-armory.com/images/pistols/PI9134LLarge.jpg

There is a lot I like of Kimber, I think the first one the most:
http://www.kimberamerica.com/pistols/customshop/grandraptor.php
http://www.kimberamerica.com/pistols/tactical/tacticalcustom.php
http://www.kimberamerica.com/pistols/custom/warrior.php
http://www.kimberamerica.com/pistols/custom/stainlesstlerl.php

Most of the Kimbers are listed (MSRP) of over $1000.

Scot

[eville]

HK USP
Best 1911 style around.
My absolute fav. 9 & .45

[Norwoodx55]

You don't think 2 or 3 to the chest (or 1 to the head) from a 9mm would stop a guy dead in his tracks? Granted, it has nowhere near the stopping power of a .40 or .45, but it can still do some damage.

I would think 2-3 should do the trick. Personaly, I would rather get it done in one. It could be hard enough to get the one in the heat of the moment. I think your defense(legal) would look a little better with one shot as well. If you really want something for self defense, the larger calibers are the best bet. My .02
Brett

[CarlC]

I also like a Glock for this reason, it can be left with a shell in the chamber and the hard trigger pull is somewhat of a safety but you won't get caught with the safety on in an emergency, or leave it with an empty chamber and just rack the slide to have it ready to go. It also holds a lot of ammo in the clip.

Another thing we have in common. I dig my G - 17 with a 19 clip.

[chicane67]

I am thinking of buying one. I like the 1911 models. Particularly Kimber & Springfield. The kimbers are a little more expensive, but I think are better guns. Was thinking 9mm because shells are cheaper. Who has one, what is it, & caliber? What is your opinion on Kimbers / Springfield & 9mm or .45? Scot
It really comes down to what your end use is going to be. I mean, there are options beyond belief and some suit a peticular application better than others. I am pretty much a 1911 homo so I may sound a little bias toward it, but I have enough experience and information to back up what comes out of my mouth.

Handgunwise, I currently own (and carry depending on my needs) a SIG220 .45ACP, a Trident Percision Machine ParaOrdnance P-14 .45ACP and a Trident Percision Machine SpringField Officers Compact .45ACP.

I went thru this same delima a few years ago in consideration for a carry sidearm, as my SIG220 was a bit too tough to conseal wearing shorts and a t-shirt in the Las Vegas summer heat. I was first looking at the Kimber Compact CDP II, the Springfield Custom Shop Compact and the Wilson Combat SDS. Although these are compact versions of the fullsize, the mechanics are the same.... so it is relevant.

Cost might be an issue, and most of the time it is, but the Kimber and the SpringField are about the same. You can pick up either one of them for around $950-1000. The WilsonCombat and the Trident Percision Machine are on the other end of the scale.... they are in the $2750-3200 range.

An old FROG buddy owns and operates Trident Percision so I got the scooby deal on the base SA Officers Compact he found at a local gun show... for $500, new in the box. When I was done, it cost me right around $900 total. 5 for the gun, 4 for the parts. He basically threw in $2k worth of finish and custom work.... but my point is.... find a good used 1911 and send it to a guy that knows what he's doing and you'll have a gun that beat's the crap out of an "out of the box" Kimber or SpringField for less than the price of a new. My shortie 4" barrel compact with 230gr SXT's shoots an 1.5" to 1.75" all day long. If I were to go down to a 185gr semi wad cutter and change the main spring it will close up to an inch and a quarter to 1.5".......

So back to the end use question. If its for carry and/or personal defense there is NO replacement for the 1911. Hands down. I dont wanna get into the whole 9mm vs .40 vs .45 vs vs vs vs. I know for the most part that there are not many people out there that can impliment two or three well placed shots into subject (or target) when the adrenalin starts flowing and/or they are taking rounds. But one thing stands for sure, it will be that one shot that counts and a 9mm doesnt cut it. The .40 is close, but cartridges are too expensive to practice with it enough to become proficient.

For personal defense, its about one shot that has the power to stop. A second shot (and/or a head shot) can be construed as 'excessive force'. After you unload 16 cartridges of 9mm into a subject and he still comes after you..... you quickly learn that there is no replacement for displacement. The .45ACP wins. Period.

On a side note: For home defense.... a 12GA semi automatic or pump. I have a Benelli M3 Super 90..... which does both semi and pump. But a Remington 870 is a darn good choice. A good used "Police turn in" runs about $200-220.

For plinking, the world is your oyster.... but you should practice with the same style or frame that you carry or use often. The 1911 is the small block Chevrolet of semi auto's..... everyone makes parts for it, it is customizable beyond belief and you can get a 22LR conversion for the 1911 cheap...... just for plinkin'.

I know enough that I would never carry a Glock, not to rain on the Glock owners here, but their "saftys" are all 'passive'.... and suck. Another cat in my group of gun homos is a federal witness to the US governement on just how 'safe' they really arnt. But..... Ill tell ya what, they do shoot rather smoothly and are accurate. Ill give them that.

I'll still take my 16 cartridge full size 1911 up against a 9x19. And Carl..... clips are for paper and hair..... magazines are for guns. :bicycle:


But I thought I would include this. The US Navy SEAL rules to a gun fight:

1. Bring a gun. Preferably, bring at least two guns. Bring all of your friends who have guns.

2. Anything worth shooting is worth shooting twice. Ammo is cheap. Life is expensive.

3. Only hits count. The only thing worse than a miss is a slow miss.

4. If your shooting stance is good, you're probably not moving fast enough or using cover correctly.

5. Move away from your attacker. Distance is your friend. (Lateral and diagonal movement are preferred.)

6. If you can choose what to bring to a gunfight, bring a long gun and a friend with a long gun.

7. In ten years nobody will remember the details of caliber, stance,or tactics. They will only remember who lived.

8. If you are not shooting, you should be communicating, reloading,and running.

9. Accuracy is relative: most combat shooting standards will be more dependent on "pucker factor" than the inherent accuracy of the gun.Use a gun that works EVERY TIME. "All skill is in vain when an Angel pisses in the flintlock of your musket."

10. Someday someone may kill you with your own gun, but they should have to beat you to death with it because it is empty.

11. Always cheat, always win. The only unfair fight is the one you lose.

12. Have a plan.

13. Have a back-up plan, because the first one won't work.

14. Use cover or concealment as much as possible.

15. Flank your adversary when possible. Protect yours.

16. Don't drop your guard.

17. Always tactical load and threat scan 360 degrees.

18. Watch their hands. Hands kill. (In God we trust. Everyone else, keep your hands where I can see them.)

19. Decide to be aggressive ENOUGH, quickly ENOUGH.

20. The faster you finish the fight, the less shot you will get.

21. Be polite. Be professional. But, have a plan to kill everyone you meet.

22. Be courteous to everyone. Friendly to no one.

23. Your number one Option for Personal Security is a lifelong commitment to avoidance, deterrence, and de-escalation.

24. Do not attend a gun fight with a handgun, the caliber of which does not start with a "4".

[Matt@RFR]

I am thinking of buying one. I like the 1911 models. Particularly Kimber & Springfield. The kimbers are a little more expensive, but I think are better guns. Was thinking 9mm because shells are cheaper. Who has one, what is it, & caliber? What is your opinion on Kimbers / Springfield & 9mm or .45?
Here's mine. Springfield 1911A1. I can't remember exactly what model it is, but I don't think they're offering it anymore. It's parkerized, and all I did was add the extended slide release, extended safety (non ambidextrous) and Uncle Mike's grip. I have fairly small hands, thus those modifications. The thing is dead reliable with any kind of round you want to put through it...I'm inside the 8 ring at 50 feet on my worst days, and I'm not that great of a shooter. You do have to be fairly agressive with these guns because they're heavy, but beyond that, they are just a joy to shoot.

It's proven itself well enough to be my carry gun, if that says anything.

My opinion on 9mm vs. .40S&W vs. .45ACP is that, for self defense, you want a big heavy round that will knock someone off their feet, but not go through them. Very important when there are other people around. I won't go into it, but I do have personal experience with this, and wouldn't choose anything other than the .45ACP.

[CarlC]

[quote=chicane67] And Carl..... clips are for paper and hair..... magazines are for guns.

:machine: :help:

[dcozzi]

I shot the HK and Sig and wound up with the Colt Gold Cup .45. It just feels right to me. Probably because it has some heft to it and the grip fits my hand well (don't have banana hands). It is also easy to shoot accurately without using the sights which is where a handgun will save your butt.
I went out with some friends when I got the gun and outshot them all with their HKs and Sigs Even they were more accurate with my Colt (although hesitant to admit it).
Just do not buy anything cheap or anything you have not shot first.


:firefire:Got Beavis?

[Steve1968LS2]

I have a full size HK USP .45 ... I love this weapon. It shoots super smooth and has a double recoil buffer spring to reduce recoil. At first I didn't like the polymer guns, but I put on a Houge grip and the feel is much better now. The HK functions are very intuitive.. gotta love that German innovation :)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

I have the stainless model that isn't made any longer.. funny part is that the gun is worth more now then when I got it.

It's mainly for taget shooting.. for Home defense I have a Benelli Nova 12 gauge.. :D

[Steve1968LS2]

[quote=chicane67] And Carl..... clips are for paper and hair..... magazines are for guns.

:machine: :help:

"This is your weapon.. This is your gun.. One is for fighting.. the others for fun"

Name that movie.. ;)

[chicane67]

Name it ??? Hell... I lived it.......

[Jagarang]

I have no complaints....P229
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

[jy211]

I have no complaints....P229
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

Sig's are awesome...there are 5 or 6 of them in my family..:grouphug:

[EFI69Cam]

:hail:
I have no complaints....P229
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

[toofun]

I agree with the comments on the SIG. You really get your moneys worth with one. However, a very nice dependable gun is the Beretta 92sf. It is a 9mm,easy to disassemble and clean, and shoots very very reliably. It is in my opinion a good starter gun and one that you will feel comfortable with.The .40 caliber is nice, so is the .45 but dont knock the 9mm. As far as people who are against the 9mm I say this. I use two types of ammo, range rounds and defensive rounds. My defensive rounds comprise of full metal jacketed hollow points. I GUARANTEE NOONE would be laughing after getting plugged a few times with that ammo!!!

Hell there are a whole slew of firearms I would like to get my hands on but living in Massachusetts you really are limited on what is legal in this state.

[CarlC]

[quote=CarlC]

"This is your weapon.. This is your gun.. One is for fighting.. the others for fun"

Name that movie.. ;)

.....here you are all equally worthless.

[MikeDVC]

Scot,
I own two Springfield 1911's, one in .45 acp and one in .38 super (kind of a 9mm on steriods). Both are very accurate and reliable. As far as Kimbers, I'm not sure if this is still true, but when they first came on the market, they used cheaper internal parts (Hammer, Sear, Disconnect) to compete with the other manufacturers. I have shoot both Kimbers and Springfields, I would go with a Springfield.

After shoot competitively (IPSC, IDPA & Steel) for many years, IMO you can not beat a correctly tuned 1911 when is comes to speed, accuracy and reliablity. Just my 2 cents.

[6'9"Witha69]

"This is your weapon.. This is your gun.. One is for fighting.. the others for fun"

Name that movie.. ;)
You climb obstacles like old people f%^$!!


I have a Springfield XD45. THE next generation in Polymer handguns! Added a grip and it is awesome! Better than my 1911. And the dual safeties are good but not cumbersome and can't be forgotten when it is go time. The easy access home defense weapon is a .38 with police hollow points. A very agressive round. And for those that knock the 9mm, My 92fs has Talons in it!

[68BNUT]

"How do you shoot woman and children!?"

"Easy You just dont leed em as much!"

[toxicz28]

[quote=CarlC]

"This is your weapon.. This is your gun.. One is for fighting.. the others for fun"

Name that movie.. ;)
Only steers and queers come from Texas, Private Cowboy. And you don't look much like a steer to me so that kinda narrows it down.

[toxicz28]

I got something to stop him.

They made it for him special.It's an eighty-eight Magnum.

It shoots through schools.

[toofun]

FULL METAL JACKET quotes seem to be common here... Except the 88 magnum one which shoots through schools... Oh BTW that was from JOHNNY DANGEROUSLY I believe. Heres one for you.


1."Barnes has been shot six times...six times!!! And he still aint dead yet!!! The only one that can kill Barnes... Is BARNES!!!

and one from FMJ...

How tall are you soldier...

5"10 sir!!

5"10? WHOA I didnt know they could pile **** that high!!

[toxicz28]

Except the 88 magnum one which shoots through schools... Oh BTW that was from JOHNNY DANGEROUSLY I believe.

THAT IS CORRECT! You won a cigar!

[Steve1968LS2]

1."Barnes has been shot six times...six times!!! And he still aint dead yet!!! The only one that can kill Barnes... Is BARNES!!!


Platoon :thankyou:

[Frank69]

I started in LE in the mid-70's, wheel guns all the way.....S&W 19's and 66's in .357Mag. First auto I carried was the S&W 59 9mm. Thought I was pretty cool then, until I experienced the frequent jamming. It was often referred to as the "jam-o-matic". Went back to revolvers. In the mid-80's I went to Gunsite and became a .45 "cocked and locked" believer. Carried lots of custom stuff, mostly built around the Commander frame. Went this route into the mid 90's. Saw LOTS of failures in training scenarios and a couple in "real life" with "built" 1911-style combat pistols.

In '93 Sig Sauer offerred a LE discount on the P-226. It was so cheap I had to buy one. Since that time I have had P-220, P-228, P-229, even a little P-230. I have pumped thousands of rounds through each one. Never had a failure in all that time. I'm a confirmed "Sigaholic" now.

[PeteRR]

Here's my custom Para-Ordnance P-13. 13+1 rounds of .45ACP. I had the Springfield Armory custom shop install a 6" Caspian slide and 6" match barrel. They also did a reliability job. They guaranteed 2" groups at 50yds. I'm nowhere near that accurate with it. I can shoot consistent 4" groups at 50yds.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

[kman67rsss]

One thing thats worth mentioning when shopping for hand guns is handle as many as possible. Fit is a big factor in my book.

[Jims78elky]

Harry Callahan: I know what you're thinking. "Did he fire six shots or only five?" Well, to tell you the truth, in all this excitement I kind of lost track myself. But being as this is a .44 Magnum, the most powerful handgun in the world, and would blow your head clean off, you've got to ask yourself a question: Do I feel lucky? Well, do ya, punk? LOL..One of the best movies "Dirty Harry"

Well,this is mine,always wanted one of these,i also have a SW .45
and a colt .45 (my dads old gun) The eagle shoots hard with a kick
but iam still having trouble with the sights,i will have to take it to
a good gunsmith shop to make it right..Sure makes a "big hole" in
anything it hits.


Desert Eagle
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

[EFI69Cam]

Here's my custom Para-Ordnance P-13. 13+1 rounds of .45ACP. I had the Springfield Armory custom shop install a 6" Caspian slide and 6" match barrel. They also did a reliability job. They guaranteed 2" groups at 50yds. I'm nowhere near that accurate with it. I can shoot consistent 4" groups at 50yds.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

4" groups means you are a hellofa shooter.

[PeteRR]

4" groups means you are a hellofa shooter.
With that pistol I am. I've shot 1000s of rounds through it. I went to a meet up with a bunch of plastic gun shooters. All 4 of them fell in lust with the Para. It was making them look good starting with the 1st magazine they fired.

I've bought a lot of "toys" in my life. With most of them I regreted the purchase fairly quickly. This pistol is the exception.

[dogtag]

I've got several guns but my favorite is a Tarus .454 Casull.

Some favor the 44 mag and still others favor the 50 cal but you can't
beat the .454 for stopping power.
Why?

45 cal usually runs a muzzle velocity of 900 feet per second.
The projectile is usually a 200 grain slug. Some can be smaller or bigger.

The 44 mag
Usually runs a muzzle velocity of 1375 feet per second
The projectile is usually a 240 grain and again, some bigger some smaller.

The .454 Casull
Usually runs a muzzle velocity of 1800 feet per second and
a projectile of around 260 grain. 300 grain are widely used with
a slightly reduced velocity.

The .50 cal (mag)
Usually runs a muzzle velocity of 1400 feet per second and a
projectile of around 350 grain. Some bigger and some smaller.
(bad azz gun)

Still, in comparison, getting hit by a .50 cal is like getting hit by an
18 wheeler going 60, or,
Getting hit with a .454 is like getting hit by a greyhound bus at 100.

Here's a couple of comments I plagiarized from a magazine.


Quote:
The Winchester factory load using a 260 grain Nosler PartitionGold bullet can be taken as representative. Winchester figures show a muzzle velocity (MV) of 1800 fps with 1871 ft. lbs. of muzzle energy. At 50 yards the figures are 1605 fps and 1485 ft. lbs. At 100 yards the velocity is 1427 fps, and the energy is 1176 ft. lbs. These energy figures are about twice those achieved by Winchester .44 Magnum factory loads with a 250 grain bullet.

The price for all of this power is increased recoil, greatly increased recoil. The .454 generates almost 5 times the recoil of the .45 Long Colt, and about 75% more recoil energy than the .44 Magnum.

Bottom line is I carry the gun when I work in the woods. I've been surprised by bear too many times.
The .454 will put a round through a piece of 1/4 in steel deck plating like it was a metal punch....
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

[Hotrod406]

Sigs for me too. I love my P229 and will probably get a P239 for a carry gun.

I agree with they guy that said to handle as many as possible. You can't be as effective with a gun that doesn't fit naturally in your hand.

[RobM]

clips are what were used for the top loading magazines of WWI rifles they were a strip of metal that held 5 rounds for quick loading. people call them stripper clips.... ANY WAY. the 1911 is by far my favorite hand gun and is EXTREEMLY reliable ive seen people dump them into the mud, sand, or even under water and they still function flawlesly. I even read a magazine article where they were shooting them underwater and the only trouble they had was with holow points (the expanded in the barel) my second favorite gun is the .357. For concieled carry i would go with a small s&w .40 or 9mm. I really like the .40's

[gt1guy]

One thing I might add, never, for any reason, keep handloads in a home defense gun. If you end up in court they will have your lunch. Only load with factory ammo.

Kevin

[Matt]

The finest proper defense pistol I've ever shot is my pop's oh-so-custom Wilson Combat .45. The fit and finish is awesome, and by my third mag I was keeping 3" groups at ~50 feet. We only put about 18 mags through it that day, but it never even came close to hiccuping, which should go without saying of course.

I think Glocks are fantastic guns, everything I've read about them, how reliable, and indestructible they are. That said, I've never liked shooting them, I always shoot low with them, no matter what. Maybe with another 100 mags through one I'll get better with it, but I don't enjoy them, so I'll never do that.

Personally I'm looking for a steyr, they generally have a more rakish grip which is preferable for me. Plus that's what my target pistol was (back when I did a lot of competitive shooting) and it'll always be my favorite. Again, if you wanna keep a dime sized group at 10 meters hammerli and steyr are the way to go, just don't ever kid yourself into thinking they are carry weapons.

Remember, there are a lot of very good handguns out there, but there might not be many that are good for you. Try to test stuff out before you buy to find something that suits your build.

[boodlefoof]

Sig all the way. P-220, .45

[white79bu]

I carry a Springfield XD40 service concealed eveyday. It's a great weapon. I just bought a Springfield XD9 Tactical for plinking. Also a great gun. I installed a 16 pound recoil spring that tightened my groups. I am thinking about having them refinished. I love my xd's. I would like to have a few other pistols but I can't get away from xd's. To be honest I have been shooting more recently than driving the Malibu. But with car events comming up all of that will change. Andy

[muthstryker]

get a .454 casull :P but after you shoot it it leaves you thinking "should i do it again?"

[MikeDVC]

I carry a Springfield XD40 service concealed eveyday. It's a great weapon. I just bought a Springfield XD9 Tactical for plinking. Also a great gun. I installed a 16 pound recoil spring that tightened my groups. I am thinking about having them refinished. I love my xd's. I would like to have a few other pistols but I can't get away from xd's. To be honest I have been shooting more recently than driving the Malibu. But with car events comming up all of that will change. Andy

I replaced my Glock 26 with a XD9...and agree the XD is a great pistol.

[JamesJ]

I have not read all this, so this may have been said but .40 is a compression load and has alot more kick then a 9 or 45 so would go with one of then for cal size. and the 1911 springfeild is one heck of a tool.

[Steven]

Scott, go with the the .45. If you practice enough, you would not notice the recoil, and you can get low cost or reloaded, sorry, remanufactured .45 ammo. I just retired from the Police Dept. from where I live. My department issuses the Sig P220 and it has never failed. Several members carry the Glock in .45 and those guns have never failed. I carried and shot the Sig, but have carried and used the Colt MkIV Series 70 for approx. 20 out of 30 years. Due to being assisgned the less than lethal weapon on the Special Enforcement Team, I carried a Para Ord. P-14, a double stack magazine makes one feel a little better on entry. One thing to think of is with a 1911 style pistol, Springfield, Kimber, Colt, you can get a .22 cal upper to do some low recoil pratice with. (As with any sport, quality practice makes perfect). I believe that you can get them for some Glocks and other pistols.
Oh ya, I can tell you that people do not like getting hit with a 40mm soft impact round. Brings a smile just thinking about it.

[Madspeed]

I own a P220 Sig .45 I lub it moocho, very balanced and not much recoil, it sleeps under my pillow with some hollow points sleeping inside.
As far as a good home wep Id have to agree that a 357 revolver isgood but a shotgun is really best as it wont go through your walls and kill somone else IF you miss. It is UBER accurate and u can plink with .38's cheap enough. I own a ruger .357 as well

My other weps are a Mouser 8MM, Marlin 30 30, and a stainless Ruger Mini 30

[Samckitt]

After talking to the gun shop guy, he says the springfield 9mm can take 6 months or so to get because they only make the 9mm twice a year. For the price the .45 cal Kimber wasn't that much more. I may go look at one of them. But like I was told, I am going to go "hold" as many as I can first.
Thanks,
Scot

[Matt@RFR]

Allthough it's definetely a good idea to physically handle some pistols before buying one, keep in mind that with a 1911 you can change a lot of it's ergonomic characteristics with simple bolt on parts. Flat or bowed main spring housings, different triggers, different slide releases and main safety, pinky pads for the bottom of magazines if you have big hands, different grips, different beavertails, etc.

[TSSPAYNE69RS]

I like the .40 cal over 9's and it is very balanced with the one cartridge clip extension that allows your pinky something to go around. Compact enough to carry anywhere.

Troy

[64Comet]

Sig P239 .40 cal for me, fantastic gun. use it for home defense.

[jetsiphon]

Well, I wasn't going to post in this thread, but I can't resist.

For everyone who thinks that 9mm isn't substantial enough for carry, you need to do some more research. Modern bullet technology has pretty much leveled the playing field in the autoloading handgun world.

That being said, I own one of each and they all preform just about the same, however, I carry the one that I shoot the best with.

[Roadrage David]

Guys i got a 1914 german made Luger..... there is no substitute

[2Slow4U]

I will say that caliber makes little difference(9, 40, 45) if shot placement is good.

Ammo price shouldn't be much of a factor. There are many websites that offer bulk rates. I bought 2k .40 for around $350.(I shoot almost everyday) You just have to keep up with the deals.

[chicane67]

For everyone who thinks that 9mm isn't substantial enough for carry, you need to do some more research. Modern bullet technology has pretty much leveled the playing field in the autoloading handgun world.

Well, lets use another analogy shall we.....

If you wanted to drive thru a house, would you rather drive a Honda...... or a MACK truck ??

You are right about projectile technology. The .45ACP 230gr SXT (AKA Black Talon) is pretty much the cats meow. Not to mention that it will not over penetrate and go thru your objective and then another bystander.... or another wall.... and another.... and another....

As I stated earlier, when you have seen a subject take an entire magazine of 9mm Corbon hollow points in the upper torso and then he continues to come after you..... right then and there you learn to hit him once with a MACK truck instead. That is enough research for me.

Yeah you could carry a 9.... by I am under the idology of walking softly and carring a big stick.

And then there is rule 24. :headbang:

[zero g]

I have carried Beretta's for the last 17 years when we switched from S&W M27's and Colt Python's in .357mag. The top one for the last 6 years 96G .40 and the bottom one the prior 11 years 92 SF 9mm.

I have shot thousands of rounds through these guns with all kinds of ammo w/nary a misfire. I stake my life on it every day and it has never failed me.

If you are a relatively new handgun shooter I would go with a double action rather than a single action.

[jetsiphon]

Well, lets use another analogy shall we.....

If you wanted to drive thru a house, would you rather drive a Honda...... or a MACK truck ??

You are right about projectile technology. The .45ACP 230gr SXT (AKA Black Talon) is pretty much the cats meow. Not to mention that it will not over penetrate and go thru your objective and then another bystander.... or another wall.... and another.... and another....

As I stated earlier, when you have seen a subject take an entire magazine of 9mm Corbon hollow points in the upper torso and then he continues to come after you..... right then and there you learn to hit him once with a MACK truck instead. That is enough research for me.

Yeah you could carry a 9.... by I am under the idology of walking softly and carring a big stick.

And then there is rule 24. :headbang:

What it boils down to is pistol calibers are not ideal for anything.

However, if you are putting rounds COM and the person isn't going down, I'm willing to bet that caliber had little to do with it.

[MrQuick]

my .308 and .45 make nice holes in paper but thats not the point. My .223 is just small but it throws alot of them. Its personal preference. I like the guns over caliber. That new Kimber is real nice..

If someone where to break into my shop their getting a lump to the head to wake up to shackels and a push broom. Better to clean my shop then go to prison. I might even feed them. LOL

[airflowdevelop]

I have shot just about anything you could get your hands on. I have owned a number of Kimber's. The older the Kimber, the better the gun. The newer stuff has return troubles...STAY AWAY! Here are the things that are important to me...maybe important to you.

1. I use my carry, I like to target, and use my primary every time on the range. It must be accurate, and a pleasure to shoot.

2. I do not want to have to carry "special" ammo for my carry to perform.

3. I do not want a maintenance hog. I want to know that the gun can sit in my uncle holster for a couple months, and perform like the day it was bought.

4. You do not have 3 shots in a life or death situation. Do you want to count on enough time to spray and pray, when it is you, your wife, and kids on the line?


I primary carried a couple of Kimbers , a Sig, and a XD of a friends. I am not a German fan, but a friend (this was 6 years ago) got out of the USMC. He had a USP 45, we went to the range on a damp sunday morning. As I was fiddling around with my Kimber (damp return problems) , he was shooting a 6 inch group at 50, never missing a beat.

The next day, I went to my local armory store...ordered one up...and have not looked back! My USP is well broken in, and preforms as good, if not better than day one! Something I cannot say for every Glock, Sig, Kimber, Colt..that I have owned.

Good luck with your purchase...and buy something that is comfortable for YOU!
Dennis

[airflowdevelop]

Also ... Remember that most situations happen in the bedroom when you are ASLEEP! The attacker has the advantage as he has just not be awaken. Spray and pray....not a very good plan! I also keep a deerslayer, with 3.5 shot loaded by my headboard ... just incase.

It's your call,
Dennis

[Mr.VENGEANCE]

anyone know what types of holsters are allowed as of late..

i heard that underarm slings are illegal.