1970 GTO Version 3.0 [Archive] - Page 3

andrewb70

11-20-2022, 07:13 PM

Today was a big day. I went over to Vic's house with the goal of mocking up the engine in the engine bay. I had confidence that the Holley swap components would not be an issues, but the big area of concern was the oil drain back fitting for the turbo on the side of the Holley 302-3 pan. Holley designed those drain backs in a Fox body Mustang, and when used with a GM A-body there was some concern that the fitting would hit the front crossmember.

These are the Holley clamshells with the poly inserts. They are dimensionally identical to 4th gen Camaro engine mounts, except with a bolt together design and poly inserts.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/20/GTOV3-482.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/Movoo)

I am not sure why Holley includes such long bolts, but I decided to keep them and the included lock nuts. They will not be visible at all once everything is bolted to the engine.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/20/GTOV3-483.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/Mo8bT)

After mocking up the engine the first time, it was clear that the oil drain fitting that I got was not going to work. At least not without some modifications.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/20/GTOV3-484.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MoRCZ)

I can't believe I have gone this long without having a lathe and a mill. Both were used to modify the Earl's fitting in order to make it fit.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/20/GTOV3-485.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MoaXd)

The lathe was used to back-cut the area between the end of the threads and the hex area. This was done so that the fitting can be installed deeper into the boss on the side of the pan. The mill was used to trim the end of the threads, because with the fitting screwed in deeper, it would hit the oil pick-up tube.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/20/GTOV3-486.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MoJmE)

The outside of the fitting was also smoothed and contoured on the belt sander. It is a rather bulky fitting and there was plenty of material to remove in order for the fitting to match the contour of the front cross member. The pan was also removed in order to tap the 1/2" NPT threads a little deeper.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/20/GTOV3-487.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MoiYi)

It took a total of six rounds to get it to the point where the engine mounts dropped into the frame stands and the mounting bolts to slide in.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/20/GTOV3-488.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MoylY)

The fitting has about 1/8" clearance against the crossmember, and it is able to pivot freely.

With some luck, the transmission and the converter will go in on Wednesday and then Vic can start the fabrication for the turbo hotside.

Andrew

Bulletpruf

11-21-2022, 06:39 PM

Looks like an awesome build! I have owned a few GTO's; my '70 was a factory Ram Air IV/M21/4.33 car, so nothing I'd want to modify, but I do have a '68 Lemans that could use a pro-touring touch!

ryeguy2006a

11-22-2022, 05:20 AM

Very nice update Andrew!

andrewb70

11-22-2022, 07:34 PM

Looks like an awesome build!

Thanks!

Very nice update Andrew!

Thanks Ryan. It felt good to finally making some major progress. God knows there is a lot still left to do.

Andrew

andrewb70

11-23-2022, 07:00 PM

Today was another big day. I hauled all of the parts that were needed to install the transmission to Vic's house. We started around 10am and made excellent progress.

This is a billet steel SFI approved flex plate from Circle D. It looks amazing and has 6 converter bolts to match the Circle D billet triple disk converter.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/23/GTOV3-489.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MrXcp)

It is nice working with a clean block and a new crank. Just to make sure everything was good, I hand threaded the ARP flex plate bolts into the crank before doing anything else.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/23/GTOV3-490.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MrSme)

The flex plate went on without any drama and was torqued to 75lb/ft using blue Loctite. The flex plate locking tool came in handy for this task to keep the crank from rotating.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/23/GTOV3-491.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MrZnR)

After installing the converter into the transmission (not sure why I didn't get a picture), it was time to wrestle this beast of a transmission under the car. We had some jack stands under the rear axle and jack stands under the front frame horns to get the car high enough.

It was easy enough to get a jack under the tailshaft housing, but getting the front of the transmission up was the big challenge. I suggested using the engine hoist and attaching a strap to two bolts in the transmission case. This worked great! We got the transmission high enough to slip a transmission jack under the pan for extra safety, then slowly working it up until the transmission slipped on to the dowel pins.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/23/GTOV3-492.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MrOhH)

There was about a .130" gap between the converter and the flex plate, which is perfect. You can see that the pan is basically level with the frame.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/23/GTOV3-493.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MrzL7)

We followed the instructions that came with the Holley transmission crossmember, but had a little trouble with the transmission mount that I got. I got an Energy Suspension poly mount, which is not what is specified in the instructions (should have read them before buying it). After a little searching around on Rockauto, we got a part number for a 70 GTO TH400 mount, Anchor PN 2378. The local parts store had one in stock and it ended up being about 1/2" shorter than the Energy Suspension mount. This allowed the crossmember to slip under the transmission easily, with about 3/8" of clearance.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/23/GTOV3-494.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MrbCD)

The left side of the crossmember slips over the frame rail, while the right side (shown here) has a separate pad that slips over the frame rail and the crossmember sits on top. This makes for a really solid installation.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/23/GTOV3-495.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MruZh)

Part of the reason I ever started this project was to redo the engine and transmission mounts and use a better fitting oil pan. I can't say enough about how well the Holley swap components are engineered to work together and how well everything fit together. In this day and age, it is hard to find parts that don't need some sort of modification to work as intended. We didn't have to modify anything!

Now that the engine and transmission are in their place, the fun stuff can start...

Andrew

andrewb70

11-25-2022, 08:30 PM

Today started out well. The driver's side manifold installed with zero issues and fits perfectly.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/25/GTOV3-496.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MrHaN)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/25/GTOV3-497.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/Mrg6w)

The same could not be said for the passenger side. I can't believe that I never mocked up that side with the engine mounts when the engine was on the stand...

When I went to install it on the engine, it was obvious that that manifold was hitting something and it was not sitting flush with the head. We used some clay on the manifold and here you can see where it was making contact with the engine mount.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/25/GTOV3-498.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/Mr3oP)

We were pretty confident that the engine mount clam shells were assembled correctly and the poly inserts were oriented properly. Otherwise the engine wouldn't have fit into the frame stands as well as it did.

Here you can see the contact spot on the manifold.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/25/GTOV3-499.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MrBfm)

We jacked up the front right corner of the engine and removed the engine mount.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/25/GTOV3-500.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MrccU)

I really didn't care why it was happening, we had to fix it and keep moving forward. Vic chucked up the engine mount in the mill and we took off about .080". The material is pretty thick, so we felt confident that the integrity of the mount was not compromised. Besides, the upper clam shell is really not stressed when it is installed on the passenger side.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/25/GTOV3-501.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MrpeG)

Here is the final version of the passenger side mount after a quick coat of paint. Onward!

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/25/GTOV3-502.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MrKhk)

We used Mahle MLS exhaust manifold gaskets. These should seal really well and hold up to the heat.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/25/GTOV3-503.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MrM0K)

We then installed the radiator and fans to see what kind of room we had to work with.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/25/GTOV3-504.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MroCa)

Here is the 135 degree elbow that I got from Stainless Bros as the starting point for the turbine up-pipe.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/25/GTOV3-505.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MrwZt)

We're thinking the turbo is going to end up next to the AC compressor, oriented parallel to the engine.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/25/GTOV3-506.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/Mrxrc)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/25/GTOV3-507.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MrEf8)

Sunday we are going to do some more mocking up and maybe make a temporary mount for the turbo so that the pipes can be figured out.

Andrew

andrewb70

11-27-2022, 02:52 PM

Today we attempted to mock up an approximate location for the turbo. We hung it on an engine hoist and moved it around. The following pictures show various options.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/27/GTOV3-508.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/Mr9e5)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/27/GTOV3-509.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/Mr0g3)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/27/GTOV3-510.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/Mr564)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/27/GTOV3-511.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MrQuS)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/27/GTOV3-512.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MrFan)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/27/GTOV3-513.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/Mrn0T)

The challenge is to find a location that clears the following:

Heater hoses
AC lines
Lower radiator hose
Air filter

Bottom line, I don't think any position will work. This thing is just too big...

Andrew

FLYNAVY53

11-27-2022, 06:01 PM

Part of the reason I ever started this project was to redo the engine and transmission mounts and use a better fitting oil pan. I can't say enough about how well the Holley swap components are engineered to work together and how well everything fit together. In this day and age, it is hard to find parts that don't need some sort of modification to work as intended. We didn't have to modify anything!

Now that the engine and transmission are in their place, the fun stuff can start...

Andrew

Good to know....like you, I built my C20 Suburban before all of the swap "kits" were available so its a hodge-podge of what was available at the time and general compromises. I look forward to a complete Holley system when I pull my motor for a heads/cam swap and the conversion to a manual gearbox.

andrewb70

11-27-2022, 06:36 PM

I am not giving up. I found these picture of a 3rd gen Camaro, using the same Holley mid-mount accessory drive. Next time out I will try something similar:

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/27/camaro01.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MrAko)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/27/camaro02.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MrYai)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/27/camaro03.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/Mrtrd)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/27/camaro04.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MrjzZ)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/27/camaro05.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/Mr6TE)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/27/camaro06.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MrkgY)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/27/camaro07.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MrI7p)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/27/camaro08.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MrdeR)

Andrew

andrewb70

11-28-2022, 07:48 PM

After taking a break and stepping away from it, we came up with this placement. The wood is there to simulate worst case scenario hood clearance.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/28/GTOV3-514.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MrPzD)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/28/GTOV3-515.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MrTTe)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/28/GTOV3-516.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MrWwh)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/28/GTOV3-517.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MrC5H)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/28/GTOV3-518.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MrUu7)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/28/GTOV3-519.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MrLvm)

The center of the turbo is even with the Maven turbo mount. This will allow us to make a simple bracket from the head to help support the turbo.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/28/GTOV3-520.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/Mr4kP)

This turbo placement allows for plenty of room for all the necessary bits to clear and also gives a clear path for the turbo drain.

The inner fender will have to be modified, but that is a problem for future me...

Andrew

OLDFLM

11-29-2022, 04:40 AM

How much power do you expect to make with this turbo set-up Andrew? How much more than an NA LS?

andrewb70

11-29-2022, 06:04 AM

How much power do you expect to make with this turbo set-up Andrew? How much more than an NA LS?

I plan to max this turbo out. It has a relatively small compressor, which will be done by about 900HP at the crank, at about 22psi

Andred

ryeguy2006a

11-29-2022, 10:21 AM

I go away for a few days and this happened!! What a great update Andrew! Looks killer in there and so nice when things just fit, Holley kills it with these kits.

Larry R

11-30-2022, 06:50 PM

looking good, very nice work. Larry

andrewb70

11-30-2022, 07:26 PM

While waiting for a few small parts to arrive we decided to mock up a few intake arrangement options. My original idea was to have a side entry lid facing the passenger side. This arrangement will make it a challenge to snake the charge pipe from the compressor outlet to the throttle body, but I think it can be done.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/30/GTOV3-521.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/Mrl3G)

This is an alternative side entry. Obviously the charge pipe will be longer, but the path should be easier to lay out.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/30/GTOV3-522.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/Mr1pN)

This is the front entry options. Again snaking the charge pipe will be a challenge, plus, I am pretty sure the peak of the lid will hit the hood.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/30/GTOV3-523.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MrJ1w)

Front view of the front entry option.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/30/GTOV3-524.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/Mr87U)

You'll have to use your imagination and add another 3" to the front of the intakes for the throttle body.

Andrew

OLDFLM

12-01-2022, 05:06 AM

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/11/30/GTOV3-521.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/Mrl3G)

Probably a dumb question... but can you rotate the turbo and run the intake tube around the inner fender? Or down to the frame rail and then up?

Too bad you couldn't just move the turbo back so it's a straight shot into the intake... or through an intercooler somehow.

andrewb70

12-01-2022, 07:15 PM

The intercooler is located in the intake, between the base and the lid. moving the turbo back is not an option for various reasons, neither is clocking the compressor in any other orientation.

Andrew

eversaul86

12-01-2022, 08:14 PM

Nice work! Love the progress. Motivation for me!
Martin

OLDFLM

12-02-2022, 04:58 AM

andrewb70

12-03-2022, 07:40 AM

Gotcha! So no need to run the intake tubing forward like a radiator mounted intercooler... could you do a big loop like that to the front of the core support anyway and then back to the intake or would that create lag?

Sorry for all the questions... knowing you I'm sure you already have this figured out and I'm just being a pain trying to learn along the way.

Having the side entry lid facing the driver's side is an option. That way the charge pipe goes straight in front of the intake and then makes a couple of 90 degree turns to go into the throttle body.

I just received a couple of 4" 110 degree bends that I am hoping will clear and make a S-shaped intake tube that will allow me to keep the passenger side entry option.

Andrew

andrewb70

12-04-2022, 02:54 PM

Made some baby steps today...

We chose to do this intake orientation, just to make the plumbing path not so arduous. There will be a simple silicone coupler at the throttle body. The rest will be fitted and welded together, with the V-band at the compressor discharge. Still unsure about the hood clearance, but that is a problem for future me.

You can also see the pump for the A2W intercooler mounted to the fan. The Volt actually had a little water pump mounted in that location.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/04/GTOV3-525.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/Mww97)

I also got and installed the 90 degree fittings from Vintage Air. These will allow us to go straight down with the AC hoses and keep it neat and tidy. We also got the upper radiator hose sorted out with a Dayco D71576.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/04/GTOV3-526.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MwxPH)

One of the Earl's 90 degree swivel heater hose adapters showed up. These will route the hater hoses away from the up-pipe to the turbo. I will probably add high heat sleeving over both of the heater hoses, just in case.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/04/GTOV3-527.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/Mwr3R)

Lastly, Vic and I finalized the design of the turbo support bracket and it was uploaded to Send Cut Send to be cut out. It will be made from .190" 4130 steel.

Andrew

andrewb70

12-11-2022, 08:00 PM

Had another, fairly productive day with Vic today. We started putting the rest of the Holley mid-mount system on the front of the engine, so that we didn't have any surprises down the road. Everything went together pretty well, but this power steering return might become a problem. That's a problem for Future Me...

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/11/GTOV3-528.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MxSGh)

I am not sure where Vic got it, but he has the whole Dayco radiator hose catalog as a PDF. I sat down and looked up hoses that were 1.5" I.D. which matches the lower radiator and the thermostat housing hose size. I found this gem. It has 3 usable, tight 90 degree bends and plenty of straight section, and all of it is 1.5" I.D..

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/11/GTOV3-529.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MxNsD)

I had also ordered some 1.5" stainless, tight bend J-pipes, one with a 90 degree bend and the other with a 120 degree bend. Both were from Vibrant performance.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/11/GTOV3-530.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MxzEe)

This is the configuration that we chose to do, in conjunction with a swivel thermostat housing.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/11/GTOV3-531.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MxZSH)

In each picture it looks like it is tight in certain areas, but in reality, there is a solid 3/4" of clearance between all critical areas.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/11/GTOV3-532.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MxGW7)

Vic had this nifty, home-made bead rolling tool.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/11/GTOV3-533.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MxbKP)

It took a little effort, but we got a nice bead at each end of the tube.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/11/GTOV3-534.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MxhAm)

This is the final shape of the lower radiator hose. Murray clamps will be used everywhere on the engine.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/11/GTOV3-535.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MxBHU)

Like this one that I got for the intake pipe.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/11/GTOV3-536.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MxuRN)

It is finally starting to look like something...

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/11/GTOV3-537.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MxHQw)

The turbo bracket that was made by Send Cut Send should be here on Wednesday. My friend Tom is also coming for a visit from Alabama and our mission is to get the new Ford 9" from Quick Performance installed. I will also get my new rear tires on Wednesday. Should be interesting!

Andrew

STREETFIGHTER50

12-12-2022, 12:06 AM

Nice work!

ryeguy2006a

12-12-2022, 10:30 AM

Looking great Andrew! It looks pretty close to firing up, but I'm sure you have quite a bit more to do. I'll look into the Murray clamps.

Motown 454

12-12-2022, 08:01 PM

It looks great Andrew. A lot of trial and error.

OLDFLM

12-13-2022, 04:50 AM

https://www.murraycorp.com/turbo-seal-constant-tension-clamps

andrewb70

12-13-2022, 07:49 AM

It looks great Andrew. A lot of trial and error.

Yes Sir. That's been the case with this build.

https://www.murraycorp.com/turbo-seal-constant-tension-clamps

Those are supposedly great clamps. I saw them being used on various Rad Rides builds.

Andrew

andrewb70

12-14-2022, 03:50 PM

My friend Blake is a Solid Works wizard and we designed this bracket to support the turbo. I uploaded the file to Send Cut Send and less and a week later I have the part. The holes were left a little undersized on purpose.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/14/GTOV3-538.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/Mx2sa)

Today the tires showed up. Hopefully they fit (they should according to my calculations).

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/14/GTOV3-539.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MxMGt)

I took the bracket to Vic and today he sent me these pictures.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/14/GTOV3-540.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MxpFK)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/14/GTOV3-541.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MxgSk)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/14/GTOV3-542.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MxV4G)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/14/GTOV3-543.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MxrA8)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/14/GTOV3-544.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MxoMc)

Pretty excited to finally see the turbo installed without an engine hoist holding it up!

Andrew

dontlifttoshift

12-15-2022, 06:17 AM

andrewb70

12-15-2022, 06:28 AM

Maybe there is plenty of room but it looks like this will help with your AC lines. https://www.vintageair.com/custom/product-pop.php?pn=342311

204131

Power steering return can be cut off and tapped, then you can thread a 90* fitting in........or put the jones racing reservoir on that pump if like spending money.

Thanks for the suggestions! Any reason why the vintage Air lines are better than the VA 90° fittings that are on the compressor?

Andrew

Tsaints1115

12-15-2022, 07:03 AM

Thanks for the suggestions! Any reason why the vintage Air lines are better than the VA 90° fittings that are on the compressor?

Andrew

Between the two I think the 90* fitting would be a bit beefier when it comes to any potential stresses vs the formed and welded manifold.

thedugan

12-15-2022, 07:38 AM

Might have missed it in the threads. What intake and intercooler is that?

andrewb70

12-15-2022, 07:57 AM

Between the two I think the 90* fitting would be a bit beefier when it comes to any potential stresses vs the formed and welded manifold.

You mean the ones that are on there now?

- - - Updated - - -

Might have missed it in the threads. What intake and intercooler is that?

It's a Holley Low-ram base, Tick Performance short intercooler, and a Holley fabricated, side entry lid.

Andrew

dontlifttoshift

12-15-2022, 12:07 PM

It looks like it would save space.

204135

Side note, that intercooler pump is bonkers and moves some volume with the quickness. Jealous of your progress, well done.

OLDFLM

12-15-2022, 12:25 PM

I think it would look better too and offer more clearance so as to not bake the freon from the turbo heat....

wfo guy

12-15-2022, 02:37 PM

I so love progress. :) I doubt that you have an unlimited source of funds so progress is often controlled by such. You're putting a lot of effort into this and it shows. :)

thedugan

12-15-2022, 08:05 PM

You mean the ones that are on there now?

- - - Updated - - -

It's a Holley Low-ram base, Tick Performance short intercooler, and a Holley fabricated, side entry lid.

Andrew

Cool thanks. So does Holley make custom lids?

andrewb70

12-17-2022, 07:55 PM

Cool thanks. So does Holley make custom lids?

Holley does not make any custom lids. I am using regular Holley part numbers, which actually are not working for me, but that is for another post....

Andrew

andrewb70

12-17-2022, 08:00 PM

I consulted with Todd, who works for Holley and is a great engineer, and he suggested that the poly mount may no do well being so close to the exhaust manifold. So I got these billet aluminum mounts from ICT.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/17/GTOV3-546.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MxdmH)

I got a pair, but I only used one on the passenger side, and it fit perfectly, after we milled .050" off each end to give them enough wiggle room between the ear of the frame stands.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/17/GTOV3-545.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MxIb7)

Good to go now! More updates coming really soon.

Andrew

andrewb70

12-18-2022, 09:06 AM

My friend Tom visited me from Alabama and our goal for his visit was to mock up and ultimately install the Quick Performance 9" rear end. I knew that things were not going to just bolt together because the brackets on the QP rear are not exactly the same as an original 12 bolt, plus I ordered mine with multiple holes on the lower control arm bracket.

You can see in this picture how the Ridetech coilover bracket is designed to bolt to the original shock mount and then a tab comes around and gets bolted with the lower control arm bolt.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/18/GTOV3-547.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MxqYP)

The bracket was trimmed to allow the use of all the holes on the lower control arm bracket.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/18/GTOV3-548.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MxCXD)

The bracket was also trimmed on the side to remove a little excess material where it rests against the shock mount on the QP housing.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/18/GTOV3-549.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MxToh)

Then Vic went to work doing his thing...

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/18/GTOV3-550.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MxPlm)

Here is the final result, with the Ridetech coilover bracket fully welded to the QP housing.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/18/GTOV3-551.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MxsUe)

We also pressed the Ridetech R-joints out of the old 12 bolt and into the QP upper control arm ears. Ridetech included a tool to make this process very straightforward.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/18/GTOV3-552.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/Mx4cN)

When I ordered the QP housing I checked all the boxes for the extra internal gussets...

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/18/GTOV3-553.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MxLnU)

..and the back brace. I also chose the fill and the drain option.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/18/GTOV3-554.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MxeLw)

After the Ridetech coilover brackets were welded, I went over the whole housing and softened up all of the hard edges on the brackets and Tom shot a coat of Rustoleum primer.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/18/GTOV3-555.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/Mx8hG)

..followed by a couple of coats of Rustoleum semi gloss black.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/18/GTOV3-556.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MxJmk)

More to come...

Andrew

andrewb70

12-19-2022, 08:17 AM

The most expensive tires I have ever purchased showed up as well. If I can get two seasons out of these I'll be happy.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/19/GTOV3-557.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/Mxvot)

Had them mounted and balanced at my local Discount Tire. They have taken good care of me with the tires for the Cougar.

The fit in the wheel wells is pretty good. This rear end was ordered to be 1/2" narrower on each side, but it almost feels like they narrowed it 1" per side. I have not compared the width to my 12 bolt yet. Using a 1/2" spacer will put the tire dead center in the wheel wells.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/19/GTOV3-558.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MxaXa)

This is with the 1/2" spacer, so the new tires are good to go.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/19/GTOV3-559.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/Mxyl8)

The same can't be said for the hood.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/19/GTOV3-560.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/Mxifc)

Doh!!!

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/19/GTOV3-561.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MxRCK)

Andrew

thumper877

12-19-2022, 03:51 PM

If u get two years out of them your not driving it right. Especially with that new turbo. Looking forward to a ride :)[QUOTE=andrewb70;1385549]The most expensive tires I have ever purchased showed up as well. If I can get two seasons out of these I'll be happy.

andrewb70

12-21-2022, 08:04 PM

Made a little progress today ahead of the blizzard that is going to hit tomorrow morning. Vic bead blasted the rotors to get the surface rust off and shot then with a coat of paint. I cleaned up the calipers and bolted everything together.

Some of you may notice that the caliper is on the back side of the rotors. These are brakes from a 98-2002 F-body and normally the caliper is on the front side of the rotor. The reason for the swap is that we messed up when we pressed the bearings on the axles. I accidentally installed the caliper brackets on the wrong sides. Instead of battling with pulling the bearings off and possibly damaging something, we decided to move the calipers to the rear. I swapped the calipers side to side so that the bleeder is at the top.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/21/GTOV3-562.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MEbCT)

We put the car down on the ground in the front to check clearance with the suspension. The up-pipe is no pictured, but is about 1-1.5" away from the bushings. The Ridetech control arms use deleon bushings and I plan to wrap the up-pipe and also put a woven sock over it. I don't expect any issues.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/21/GTOV3-563.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MES0S)

I got these nifty clamps from Australia, made by a company called SS Customs.

https://sscustoms.com.au

They have been super helpful holding the pipes together for mock-up and tack welding.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/21/GTOV3-564.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MEuZE)

Andrew

andrewb70

12-24-2022, 06:58 PM

Progress has slowed down a little bit, but I did manage to completely finish the rear end installation. The rear was installed, but I needed to make some new brake lines from the center, out to the calipers.

A while back I got this tubing straightener.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/24/GTOV3-565.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MEg6Y)

It mounts in a vise and does a really nice job of turning a coil of NiCopp brake like into a straight piece.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/24/GTOV3-566.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/ME3rZ)

Here is the result after a few minutes of getting it worked through the rollers. I suggest straightening the tube before cutting it because then you can use the coil to manipulate the tubing through the rollers.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/24/GTOV3-567.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MEHao)

I also picked up this little kit that has a variety of stainless tube nuts for all of the common SAE flares.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/24/GTOV3-568.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MEcci)

Vic had this awesome flaring tool and it worked really well.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/24/GTOV3-569.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MEBfd)

The double flares turns out perfectly.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/24/GTOV3-570.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MEpep)

I reused these little brackets and adapters from the old rear end. It is a SAE to AN-3 adapter. We welded it to the housing and I hit it with a little paint. The little brake like wasn't the actual brake line. It was just a piece that I made so the threads would not get painted.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/24/GTOV3-571.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MEKhR)

For the center hose support I cut and bevelled a short piece of threaded hex stock and then welded it to the housing.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/24/GTOV3-572.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MEM07)

In other sad new, we trimmed some bracing on the underside of the hood, and it still doesn't close...

Andrew

Cshenker1121

12-27-2022, 05:57 PM

Looking good!

andrewb70

12-27-2022, 07:40 PM

Looking good!

Thank you!

Andrew

andrewb70

12-27-2022, 08:22 PM

With Christmas behind us, Vic and I are making slow, but steady progress.

Today he was able to fully weld the up-pipe that goes between the Hooker exhaust manifold and the turbine inlet. He back-purged the pipe to avoid any "sugaring" on the inside.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/27/GTOV3-573.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/ME6Tk)

Vic also welded a Summit branded clamp to the compressor discharge. It's one of those split clamps that has o-rings and allows for some movement as everything heats up. We also sorted out the filter situation, although I will be ordering a longer filter element to get as much surface area as possible. This one is 6.5" tall, and K&N has a 10" long version that will fit perfectly in the available space.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/27/GTOV3-574.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MEjzK)

Now for the elephant in the room. The hood still doesn't close. This picture makes the situation look worse than it is, but you get the idea. The "bubble" at the top of the intake is about 1" too tall to allow the hood to close.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/27/GTOV3-575.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MEn5G)

After considering all the options, we are going to start with the simple solution. We are going to mill down the bubble so the hood closes and see what we have left.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/27/GTOV3-576.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MEtra)

Andrew

andrewb70

12-28-2022, 07:58 PM

Back in 2010, I contacted The DriveShaft shop to solve a vibration issue in the GTO. They made me a CV driveshaft that use a CV at the slip yoke and a u-joint in the rear, which solved my vibration issues. Since then, many other A-body owners have done the same thing with the same, great results. When I built the Cougar, I wanted to go a step further and do a double CV shaft. That too had amazing results. If you look at any modern, RWD muscle car, that is exactly what you will see.

This version of the GTO will also get a dual CV driveshaft and this is the second part of that puzzle (the first being the CV pinion yoke). This slip yoke will use their new, non-plunging CV. This is the same CV they use on their high HP Nissan GTR and other driveshafts.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/28/GTOV3-577.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MEYvc)

It's a tight fit, but there is a minimum of 3/8" all the way around the yoke. (what the hell was I thinking, twenty years ago, with the sheet metal screw?!)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/28/GTOV3-578.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MEAkt)

Vic made a fixture to hold the intake lid on the mill. We positioned it at the approximate angle of the hood.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/28/GTOV3-579.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MEkg8)

We took about 3/4" off the peak of the bubble and this was the hole that was made.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/28/GTOV3-580.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MEI7n)

And the hood closed. As you can see, it is really tight, but nothing is touching. We are going to take a little bit more off to make room for the eventual plate that will get welded to cover the hole.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/28/GTOV3-581.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MEd13)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/28/GTOV3-582.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MEUu4)

This is the current thinking on wastegate placement. My only reservation is that it be under the downpipe and will be a pain to get to if I have to do something with the wastegate.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/28/GTOV3-583.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/METqS)

The upside is that it will have excellent, priority flow and will merge back into the downpipe.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/28/GTOV3-584.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MEC55)

If anyone has thoughts on the wastegate placement, please chime in.

Andrew

brickyard69

12-29-2022, 12:22 AM

Looks great Andrew. Thank you for your help with my efi. Steve in AZ.

alocker

12-29-2022, 06:10 AM

wfo guy

12-29-2022, 09:32 AM

Every time I have made something difficult to get at, I have regretted it. My knowledge of turbo systems is extremely limited so I have no good input. Hopefully, someone will have a possible solution that will allow access and proper performance. :)

andrewb70

12-29-2022, 07:22 PM

Kinda stinks about having to cut the intake to clear the hood. I assume you will still run the shaker?

For the gate, keep in mind you most likely will have to tune the spring weight. But once it's done it's done. If you want to go with your option, just set the downpipe up to have a joint by the trans. 2 bands and it comes right out giving you full access to the wastegate. The other option is to put the gate into the crossover. I know its controversial, but it works great on the truck applications. With the lightest spring, my setup went down to 3psi. Another benefit is it spreads out some of the really hot parts helping with heat dissipation.

Every time I have made something difficult to get at, I have regretted it. My knowledge of turbo systems is extremely limited so I have no good input. Hopefully, someone will have a possible solution that will allow access and proper performance. :)

Thanks for the input. I really appreciate it.

Andrew

andrewb70

12-29-2022, 07:25 PM

This morning I spent a few hours trying to help a local customer with a Coyote no-start issue, so I didn't have time mess with the car. But Vic sent me these pictures in the afternoon.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/29/GTOV3-585.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MEPzT)

I think as far as looks go, it looks pretty good.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/29/GTOV3-586.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MEWwE)

Tomorrow I will have a chance to go se it in person and se what kind of clearance there is with the hood. We are also going to install the Ring Brothers billet hinges, just to make sure everything fits the way it should.

Andrew

Larry Callahan

12-30-2022, 06:11 AM

Wow! That looks great.

Way to make it fit.

wfo guy

12-30-2022, 06:12 AM

Intake looks good.

andrewb70

12-30-2022, 06:51 AM

Wow! That looks great.

Way to make it fit.

Intake looks good.

Thanks guys!

Andrew

968ls1

12-30-2022, 06:57 AM

andrewb70

12-30-2022, 08:07 PM

Very nice!

Thanks Tom!

Before we finalized the intake, we thought it would be good to install the new Ring Brothers hinges. These are very well made and have plenty of adjustment to get the hood lined up well.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/30/GTOV3-587.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFGwe)

Installing them was a simple remove and replace operation and after a bit of fiddling with the adjustment, the hood was closing better than it ever has before. We did notice that these hinges don't allow the hood to open as much as the stock hinges. I guess this was mentioned on the Ring Brothers website, but I somehow missed it. I really don't think it will cause any issues...

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/30/GTOV3-588.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MEyNH)

Now that the intake was finalized it was time to keep working on the charge pipe from the compressor outlet to the throttle body.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/30/GTOV3-589.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFZih)

We ended up cutting the 180 degree bend that we had made previously so that half of it could be clocked independently.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2022/12/30/GTOV3-590.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFXID)

This gave us a more clear path to the compressor, so all that is left is to add another 90 and a couple of small straight cuts to make it all fit.

It is a bit of a tortured path, but this is why we chose to stay with 4" piping to keep the pressure drop to a minimum. It is really no more elaborate than if there was an A2A intercooler in the front and we had to make all the associated pieces to work with that. I think this looks super clean too.

Happy New Year to Everyone and thanks for following along.

Andrew

SPLATT71MC

12-31-2022, 03:32 PM

The piece you have to close up your intake would be a great place to have some custom engraving done.

andrewb70

12-31-2022, 03:36 PM

The piece you have to close up your intake would be a great place to have some custom engraving done.

It sure does ::wink::

Andrew

b17brian

01-01-2023, 07:55 PM

I have been making slow progress with the wiring. Mostly looking at things and planning things. The goal is to make the wiring as tidy as possible, while still being accessible for service. I also don't want any wires to be randomly hanging off the engine, so everything that goes to the engine must come through the EFI harness.

This is the hexapus (if that is not a word, it should be) on the driver's side of the Terminator X harness. It extends forward and contains the CTS, cam sensor, TPS, IAC, fuel pressure, and MAT sensor plugs. CTS, MAT, and cam sensors are workable. The TPS and IAC need to be eliminated, and the fuel pressure needs to be stripped out and moved all the way to the rear of the engine. I also need to add the connector for the alternator for the L and S terminals, and route them all the way through into the passenger compartment.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2021/05/06/GTOV3-192.md.jpg (https://www.hostmyjunk.com/image/pyndN)

Andrew

Could you elaborate on how you deleted the TPS and IAC wires and moved the fuel pressure? I want to do the same. As I look through the Terminator wire schematic it looks like the TPS and Fuel shares 2 wires in common with other connectors (Sensor +5V Ref Out and ground). Which wires did you re-purpose for the alternator L & S wires and did you remove them from the ECU connector?

And lastly, the Tesa harness tape you use, does it leave sticky glue residue? What’s the part number? Is it fuzzy that will collect dirt?

I love the work you’re doing and thanks for sharing all your details!

andrewb70

01-01-2023, 08:19 PM

Could you elaborate on how you deleted the TPS and IAC wires and moved the fuel pressure? I want to do the same. As I look through the Terminator wire schematic it looks like the TPS and Fuel shares 2 wires in common with other connectors (Sensor +5V Ref Out and ground). Which wires did you re-purpose for the alternator L & S wires and did you remove them from the ECU connector?

And lastly, the Tesa harness tape you use, does it leave sticky glue residue? What’s the part number? Is it fuzzy that will collect dirt?

I love the work you’re doing and thanks for sharing all your details!

Hi Brian,

Shoot me an email and I can go over the details with you. Email: projectgattago at gmail dot com

Andrew

andrewb70

01-01-2023, 08:27 PM

One of the items to replace for this update was the steering shaft. There was nothing wrong with it, but I never liked that it was a solid shaft.

This is a collapsable shaft and new u-joints from Borgeson. I will also be replacing my 20 year old AGR steering box with one from Borgeson.
In this picture the shaft is is already trimmed to fit.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/01/GTOV3-591.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFh3U)

This is the bushing that supports the steering shaft inside the column. Whenever I would drive the car on a hot summer day, I would notice that the steering would get a little sticky. I suspect that this nylon bushing swell up from the heat and causes the steering to bind a little. The holes are from the screws that I installed to pull the bushing with a slide hammer.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/01/GTOV3-592.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFOjm)

The bushing on the left is one that Vic made on his lathe. It is made out of Delrin, which I hope will be more stable with temperature changes.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/01/GTOV3-593.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFNpP)

Here it is tapped into the steering column.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/01/GTOV3-594.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFS8N)

Andrew

andrewb70

01-02-2023, 07:29 PM

Today we decided to take a little break from turbo stuff and figure out how to upgrade the brakes. Over the last year or so I have been seeing electronically assisted brakes on various cars and on a couple of YouTube channels that I watch. The technology seems really cool and by all accounts they work great.

I started by removing the manual MC and the old mount for the clutch MC. There is a little rust here and there, but remember, this car was "done" 20 years ago. That area will definitely get cleaned up.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/02/GTOV3-595.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MF3PG)

I figured a good place to start to be these brackets that I got them I was planning on doing vacuum power brakes. These are from DSE and it is their reduced angle bracket.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/02/GTOV3-596.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFcIa)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/02/GTOV3-597.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFVxK)

The is the Gen 1 Bosch iBooster unit that I got. It is from a 2010ish Tesla Model S with the adaptive cruise control. Bosch has a Gen 2 model of the iBooster available, but I don't like the looks of them and I am sure that none of the features of the new unit are even applicable to what we are doing here.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/02/GTOV3-598.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFHNk)

After a little welding, milling and hole sawing, we had the bracket modified to fit the iBooster.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/02/GTOV3-599.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFu9w)

It is bolted to the firewall here, but there is still a lot to sort out.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/02/GTOV3-600.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFgit)

I am not really happy with how the pushrod alignment is looking at the moment. The unit might actually need to be tilted up at the front a little more, but I am already concerned about hood clearance. We will sort out the details the next time.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/02/GTOV3-601.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MF22c)

I really like the way these look. They add a little high-tech touch to the engine compartment.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/02/GTOV3-602.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFKj8)

Andrew

STREETFIGHTER50

01-02-2023, 09:58 PM

Wow lotsa nice work Andrew! Looking awesome!

ryeguy2006a

01-03-2023, 06:25 AM

Great work on the intake Andrew! That solves a lot of problems for you and it looks amazing! I love that brake booster. Very interested to know more about that.

dontlifttoshift

01-03-2023, 07:25 AM

What is the pedal ratio in a Tesla?......what is the bore size on that master cylinder? *** 26mm ***

***lots of info here https://www.evcreate.nl/installing-the-ibooster/ ***

andrewb70

01-03-2023, 07:36 AM

What is the pedal ratio in a Tesla?......what is the bore size on that master cylinder? *** 26mm ***

***lots of info here https://www.evcreate.nl/installing-the-ibooster/ ***

Donny,

That's a great link and where I got a lot of my information. I also found a source for a pretty nice wring harness here:

https://tulayswirewerks.com/product/bosch-ibooster-gen-1-universal-wire-harness/

Andrew

Tsaints1115

01-03-2023, 08:40 AM

These guys sell a booster mount as well as a master cylinder adapter.

https://www.bbtfabrications.com/fab-store#!/c/0/offset=9

andrewb70

01-03-2023, 08:06 PM

These guys sell a booster mount as well as a master cylinder adapter.

https://www.bbtfabrications.com/fab-store#!/c/0/offset=9

Using this adapter plate would make the iBooster practically a bolt in deal.

Andrew

andrewb70

01-03-2023, 08:10 PM

This seems like a pretty straightforward part to make, but it's quite intricate. There is very little space and we had to use a donut to get the radii tight enough to connect the dots.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/03/GTOV3-603.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFM8n)

There is a slight gap where the pipe meets the compressor discharge. This was done to accommodate any movement due to heat, etc...The Summit Racing clamp is made to account for this movement. All that is left is to finish a couple of welds, add the blow-off valve, which will go on the outside bend just before the throttle body, and smooth out whichever welds we can.

Andrew

wfo guy

01-04-2023, 07:04 AM

Interesting to watch. :) Now, I'm going to go read all of the ibooster links. :)

andrewb70

01-04-2023, 08:37 AM

Interesting to watch. :) Now, I'm going to go read all of the ibooster links. :)

Here is a fun YouTube video that talks about the iBooster and brakes in general.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SRZ8XDNz2vU

Andrew

andrewb70

01-04-2023, 07:29 PM

Today I had a few hours to spare, so I drove to Vic's house to make a little close-out panel that would go under the brake booster. In one of the previous pictures you can see the hole that was left after I removed the clutch MC mount. That hole needed to be covered up and I also needed to clean up some of the peeling paint and surface rust that was there.

I scraped the loose paint off and then scrubbed the surface with an abrasive pad. Then I sprayed some primer into a small cup and used a small brush to apply it and then did the same with some black paint. The point wasn't to make it look pretty, but to seal the exposed metal.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/04/GTOV3-612.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFQto)

I then started to layer 2" masking tape over the whole area.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/04/GTOV3-604.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFw94)

I used a pencil to trace out the outline of the patch that I wanted to cover and also marked out the 3 mounting holes.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/04/GTOV3-605.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFxP5)

I then transferred the masking tape template to some thin cardboard and used a sharpie to draw out the shape that would capture the mounting bolts and that would overlap the opening that I wanted to cover.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/04/GTOV3-606.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFFOS)

I cut the cardboard with some scissors and did a trial fit. Everything was looking pretty good.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/04/GTOV3-607.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFrB3)

I used the cardboard template to transfer the shape and the holes to a piece of 1/8" aluminum plate.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/04/GTOV3-608.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFmxT)

I cut the couch shape on a bandsaw and then used a belt sander the arrive at the final shape. I also used a 2" hole saw to make the hole.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/04/GTOV3-609.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFD2d)

Since the column pokes through the plate at an angle, the opening had to be oval, not round, so I used a file to contour the opening until the panel fit flush against the firewall.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/04/GTOV3-610.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MF0dE)

Then I drilled out the 3 mounting holes.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/04/GTOV3-611.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MF5yZ)

The panel fits really well. It will get painted black and I will use some window mount urethane to seal the plate against the firewall. This will keep water from collecting and keep that area clean and dry. Once the booster is installed, the panel won't really be visible, but I think it adds a finished touch to an area that looks a little raggedy before.

Andrew

andrewb70

01-05-2023, 06:56 PM

Today wasn't terribly productive. I managed to install the new Borgeson steering box. Overall it looked pretty similar to my ancient AGR steering box, with the exception of having 4 mounting ears instead of 3. My frame only has 3 mounts, so the 4th is just, there...

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/05/GTOV3-614.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MF7BY)

I was able to reuse the fittings from the old box on the new box. The Borgeson box uses metric fittings with o-rings, which were the same size as my old AGR box.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/05/GTOV3-613.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFn8i)

The Borgeson box also uses a slightly smaller input shaft.

Andrew

OLDFLM

01-06-2023, 04:40 AM

Advantage of the Borgeson over the AGR?

wfo guy

01-06-2023, 07:29 AM

It appeared to me that the man in the video had EPAS as well. Rather than deal with noisy PS pumps and hydroboost, this bears further research. Thanks, Andrew.

andrewb70

01-06-2023, 07:32 AM

It appeared to me that the man in the video had EPAS as well. Rather than deal with noisy PS pumps and hydroboost, this bears further research. Thanks, Andrew.

The man in the video, Matt, used the same EPAS that I have on my Cougar.

Andrew

andrewb70

01-06-2023, 07:38 AM

Advantage of the Borgeson over the AGR?

Everyone seems to really like the feel of the Borgeson box. I always found the feel of the AGR a little vague on center. I am hoping the Borgeson box is better in that respect.

Andrew

gto406

01-06-2023, 09:05 PM

andrewb70

01-07-2023, 12:18 PM

Looks great Andrew. I have the RB hinges on my ‘69 Firebird and they are great. RB really make very high quality parts. The billet hood hinges on my GTO have already been through 1 set of gas struts (they are not Ring Brothers) and the hinges are only about 5 yrs old.

Thanks for the kind words. I really like the RB hinges. The hood fits better than it ever has, although the fact that the hood doesn't open as much is a little annoying.

Andrew

andrewb70

01-08-2023, 08:02 PM

Before the next update, I want to send a shout out to a great vendor. It is not often that a company surpasses my expectations, but Stainless Bros (https://www.stainlessbros.com) definitely has.

This is how they packaged one half of the 4" v-band clams that I received from them.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/08/GTOV3-615.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFjDp)

Each v-band was in it's own box and the clamp itself was in its own sealed bag.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/08/GTOV3-616.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFkde)

The v-bands themselves are like jewelry. Each half indexes into the other, which is a great feature that makes it easier to align the pipes.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/08/GTOV3-617.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFYO7)

I was also able to make it out to my local Napa store and picked up a roll of 5/16" butyl tape. I used it so seal the back of the close-out panel that I made the other day.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/08/GTOV3-618.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFtPR)

I was also able to use the boot that came from DSE. This is a boot they use with their low angle vacuum assisted booster.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/08/GTOV3-619.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFfEH)

Once the iBooster is installed the plate isn't really visible.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/08/GTOV3-620.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFIyD)

I also started on the new brake lines. I am using 3/16" NiCopp for the front brakes and 1/4" NiCopp for the rear brakes. The 12mm flare to AN adapters are from Earl's. I am not really happy with how far they stick out, but I am not sure what there is to do about it.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/08/GTOV3-621.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFUtP)

I also got this Cummins turbo drain as a starting point for my drain. More on that in a future update.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/08/GTOV3-622.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFsKh)

Andrew

wfo guy

01-09-2023, 10:14 AM

What is the logic for 1/4" lines to the rear?

andrewb70

01-09-2023, 10:43 AM

What is the logic for 1/4" lines to the rear?

That's what was there...:shrug:

Andrew

ryeguy2006a

01-09-2023, 11:22 AM

Those v-bands are nice! I welded those to the headers on my Camaro. Having the male/female fitment helps a lot with fitting the pipes up.

FWIW, I used 3/16" NiCopp lines front and rear on the Camaro when I did the lines. I think with rear drums it's important to have more fluid movement, but don't think it will change anything with disk brakes.

wfo guy

01-09-2023, 12:01 PM

Andrew, years ago I exp. with 1/4" lines on a dragster. It was the wrong direction. There's a bunch of math you can do about volume and pressure drop, but I believe you will be happier if you only use 3/16". The only time I use 1/4" is on a throughout bearing. then it allows for a quicker release on the bearing. I learned that from Chuck Neal who was CNC brake co.

andrewb70

01-09-2023, 12:19 PM

The line from the distribution block is 1/4" running the full length of the car. I'm not changing that. I can't see how this short run from the MC to the distribution block is going to make much difference. But I'm open to being educated...

Andrew

andrewb70

01-09-2023, 06:44 PM

I spent a little time at Vic's today working on various odds and ends.

This is a clever little part from Motion Raceworks. It's an oil inlet block that bolts to the top of the oil feed hole and seals with an o-ring. It then points the oil feed line straight out the side. This will connect to the oil feed line, which at the moment terminates at the front of the passenger side head.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/09/GTOV3-623.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFCJm)

A few days back Vic also made this fantastic mount for the Dominator ECU. It bolts in place of the glove box and will allow me easy access to the ECU connectors. Ignore the duct tape. I will be placing an order with Vintage Air soon to clean up the under-dash ducting in anticipation of having working AC in the car.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/09/GTOV3-624.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFLSG)

I also brought the shifter to see how it might fit inside the car. In the picture I have it sitting over the hole where my manual shifter was located. It is slightly offset to the driver's side. I am not really sure about the shifter placement yet.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/09/GTOV3-625.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFPDU)

Vic worked out the final placement of the waste gate and started on the fabrication of the needed plumbing.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/09/GTOV3-626.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFqHN)

It should have good priority flow in this location and provide an easy path to route the exhaust from the waste gate back into the downpipe.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/09/GTOV3-627.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFWWw)

Andrew

ryeguy2006a

01-11-2023, 06:08 AM

Loving the updates Andrew. The fab work is really coming together. I really like that you are routing the wastegate back into the primary exhaust.

matthimself456

01-11-2023, 06:18 AM

I'm sure this is a dumb question but why the need to adapt to AN from the iBooster? Is it just because the flare on the iBooster is metric?

andrewb70

01-11-2023, 02:31 PM

I'm sure this is a dumb question but why the need to adapt to AN from the iBooster? Is it just because the flare on the iBooster is metric?

It is just what I did. I am sure there are other solutions.

Andrew

wfo guy

01-11-2023, 04:11 PM

andrewb70

01-12-2023, 07:27 PM

Andrew, I have been ordering Vintage Air from Summit and Yogis' because they have it in stock. Yogis' has a reduced barrier line of hoses that are really nice to work with. He has the TBI line of compressors that can save you a little money if you're interested. I was going to plumb my last project with hard lines as much as possible but whimped out because of time. many have run the lines under the inner fender panels for a cleaner look as I'm sure you know. Lots of choices. :)

Thanks for the tips!

Finally I can say I did a few things on the car, mostly by myself...LOL

Yesterday I received the last few parts that I needed to finish the new brake lines from the MC to the distribution block.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/12/GTOV3-630.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFlAc)

I also welded on this oil drain tube. Vic made a couple of adapters on the lathe and I welded it together. The welds are horrible, but it should hold. Because of how everything is situated, the drain has to take a slight jog to the passenger side immediately after coming out of the turbo. This is a turbo drain for a Cummins something or other. It is fairly flexible and is made out of stainless steel, so it is relatively easy to work with.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/12/GTOV3-628.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MF8ya)

Once it makes the jog to the left is has to sweep right, under the up-pipe and under the exhaust manifold, then towards the drain in the side of the oil pan. I will extend this tube so it is all metal under the hottest pipes and there will be a short section of hose connecting the drain to the oil pan.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/12/GTOV3-629.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MF1sK)

The waste gate discharge is tacked to the downpipe.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/12/GTOV3-631.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFRKt)

The downpipe itself is also tacked in place.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/12/GTOV3-632.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFeEk)

There is also a 4" v-band at the end of the downpipe that connects to this pipe that shoots the exhaust straight back.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/12/GTOV3-633.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFaJ8)

I am not sure yet what's going to happen with the exhaust once it is past the transmission crossmember.

Andrew

Way2qwk4u

01-13-2023, 05:59 AM

Making progress looking good! Cant wait to see it completed. And you are going to cause me to have mission creep on my car. Did not even know that there was a thing called an Ibooster. :-)

wfo guy

01-13-2023, 05:18 PM

Andrew, have you seen this?
https://youtu.be/jipoLJToCjM

andrewb70

01-13-2023, 05:19 PM

Andrew, have you seen this?
https://youtu.be/jipoLJToCjM

I have not, but I'll take a look.

Andrew

andrewb70

01-14-2023, 06:58 PM

Today's update is a bit random because we kind of jumped around doing various tasks. Since the brake lines were done, I figured it was about time to see if the iBooster actually works ad if we can bled the brakes.

I have heard a lot of good things about the Motive Products (https://amzn.to/3Xa9Fp2) brake bleeders, so I thought I would get one to try. I have to say that I will never bleed brakes any other way. The process was super simple and I barely spilled any brake fluid.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/14/GTOV3-634.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MmzFS)

I got the version of the Motive brake blender that came with a MC cap that was compatible with the Tesla MC cap. It also works on many newer GM cars.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/14/GTOV3-635.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MmGW4)

While I wasn't around, Vic changed the angle of the downpipe a little bit to move it a little further from the firewall. There is a little over an inch now.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/14/GTOV3-636.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFyQ3)

Yesterday I also finished up the turbo oil drain pipe by welding on an extension that will feed the drain under the turbo hot parts and feed into the oil pan.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/14/GTOV3-637.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MmZS5)

Vic also made these little tabs that position the coils a little higher and over. This was done to move the spark plug wires away from the downpipe.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/14/GTOV3-638.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MFiHn)

Andrew

andrewb70

01-15-2023, 07:05 PM

Before talking about today's update, I realized that I really didn't mention how the iBooster feels. After bleeding the brakes, we powered up the iBooster and it just started working. The pedal effort is pretty light, but very smooth. Pedal travel is also fairly short before the pedal gets really hard to press. As of now I think the driving experience is going to be greatly improved over the manual brakes that I had before.

Today's update is also just a random collection of small projects. Last week I ordered all new ARP hardware for the intake lid and the intercooler. The included hardware was adequate, but silver cad plated bolts tend to look like garbage after a very short time. The ARP stainless hardware will look great for a long time.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/15/GTOV3-639.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MmhAd)

I also finished installing the new, collapsable steering shaft and new u-joints from Borgeson.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/15/GTOV3-640.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MmuRo)

I also finished up the oil drain for the turbo. Here is how it wraps around the up-pipe.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/15/GTOV3-641.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MmSGE)

Then it goes under all of the turbo hot pipes, pointing at the fitting in the oil pan.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/15/GTOV3-642.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MmbMZ)

The only thing left is to put a bead on the 5/8" tube and add a short length of rubber hose between the tube and the oil pan fitting.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/15/GTOV3-643.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MmNsT)

Lastly, I have been doing a lot of looking and thinking about where to mount the boost control solenoids. There is quite a bit of plumbing that needs to go between the wastegate, turbo compressor outlet, and the boost solenoids. I want to keep that plumbing as short and simple as possible, so I am thinking about making a bracket and mounting them under the nose of the intake lid.

This location will make the plumbing relatively short and keep the solenoids relatively hidden.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/15/GTOV3-644.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MmBHi)

Andrew

andrewb70

01-16-2023, 07:07 PM

Today I got some PTFE hose and -4AN fittings and made the flex line for the turbo oil feed.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/16/GTOV3-645.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MmV4p)

I gave it a nice, soft S-shape to keep it tucked away.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/16/GTOV3-646.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MmHQY)

Vic made a little bracket to hold the boost solenoids just under the intake lid snout. The mounting points for the bracket have slots, so the bolts just need to be loosened up to put it on or remove it.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/16/GTOV3-647.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MmpF7)

One of the big reasons for choosing this location and orientation is so that the two nipples face the general direction of the wastegate and turbo. One of the lines needs to go to the top of the wastage dome and the other needs to go to the turbo compressor discharge.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/16/GTOV3-648.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/Mm2UH)

Here is the view from the other side. I am going to have my friend Blake design and print a cover for the solenoids.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/16/GTOV3-649.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MmgSR)

Since the wastegate is not super accessible and is surrounded by hot parts, I decided to plumb everything going to it using NiCopp 3/16" tubing. That way I don't have to worry about melting through the typical nylon hose and push-lock fittings.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/16/GTOV3-650.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MmMGe)

This is the line from the compressor discharge to the bottom of the dome.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/16/GTOV3-651.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MmoMD)

This TurboSmart wastegate has provisions for water cooling, so once the heater hose fittings are finalized, I will tap them and feet coolant to the dome of the wastegate.

Andrew

wfo guy

01-16-2023, 07:40 PM

I'm a fan of nicop where ever it can be used. What is the boost solenoids functions? Do they feed to the waste gates?

andrewb70

01-16-2023, 07:47 PM

I'm a fan of nicop where ever it can be used. What is the boost solenoids functions? Do they feed to the waste gates?

The boost solenoids control how much pressure is inside the wastegate dome, which controls the boost. The wastegate will have an 8 psi spring in it, which means I will not get anything less than 8psi. The Holley Dominator ECU will control the solenoids to put more pressure on the dome, which will allow me to run boost levels higher than 8psi. There are numerous boost control strategies that are available. I will probably use either boost vs. gear or boost vs. speed.

Andrew

ryeguy2006a

01-17-2023, 06:19 AM

Looks great Andrew!! Love all of the little details.

gto406

01-17-2023, 05:57 PM

Coming along really nice - great thought & attention to detail. [emoji4][emoji106]

andrewb70

01-17-2023, 07:29 PM

Looks great Andrew!! Love all of the little details.

Coming along really nice - great thought & attention to detail. [emoji4][emoji106]

Thanks guys! I have a few more details in the works.

Andrew

Jimbo1367

01-18-2023, 12:05 PM

Andrew,
I’m sure you went over this before, what is this cars purpose?

thanks,
moi

andrewb70

01-18-2023, 01:03 PM

Andrew,
I’m sure you went over this before, what is this cars purpose?

thanks,
moi

Having fun, doing burnouts, scaring old ladies and running 10s in the quarter mile after driving 500 miles.

Andrew

thumper877

01-18-2023, 02:16 PM

Lol. Same reason I built mine
Having fun, doing burnouts, scaring old ladies and running 10s in the quarter mile after driving 500 miles.

Andrew

andrewb70

01-19-2023, 04:59 AM

I try to do a little something everyday to keep making progress. We added a bung for the oxygen sensor. I wanted it easily accessible, but also not super visible.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/19/GTOV3-652.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MmrYh)

We also added a bung in the charge pipe and I added a small tube to feed boost pressure to the feed side of the boost solenoids.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/19/GTOV3-653.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MmEVm)

It was also time to think about where the fill tank for the A2W intercooler might go. I am thinking about this location on the firewall. I added a 45 degree fitting to the intercooler just to see how the hoses might be routed.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/19/GTOV3-654.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MmwRP)

The tank looks like it is close to the downpipe, but there is actually quite a bit of space. The tank also needs to have a fill bung aded to the top of the right side and an outlet on the left side.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/19/GTOV3-655.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/Mmm4U)

This is just an overall shot of the engine compartment as it sits now.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/19/GTOV3-656.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MmFnN)

Baby steps...

Andrew

andrewb70

01-20-2023, 07:15 PM

Since I am replacing all of the more visible fasteners on the engine with ARP stainless bolts, I wanted to replace the studs that Holley includes with the Low-Ram intake manifold. I carefully measured the needed length and it looked like ARP already had an intake bolt kit in that length (55mm UHL). Long story short, the ARP bolts didn't have the needed thread length to fully engage into the heads. Vic machined the shank of the bolts so they would torque down against the intake manifold.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/20/GTOV3-658.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MmToE)

I also finished the last bit of NiCopp plumbing for the boost control systems. There is a tube from the turbo compressor to the bottom of the wastegate. There is another tube from the compressor to the fill side of the boost solenoids. Finally, there is a line from the boost solenoids to the top of the wastegate.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/20/GTOV3-659.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MmsCS)

For the intercooler water hoses, I am using the Earl's Super Stock hose and swivel fittings. I have never used these before, but they work awesome. The ferrule spins over the hose to give the hose end a finished look.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/20/GTOV3-660.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MmqfZ)

I used dish soap as a lubricant.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/20/GTOV3-661.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/Mmdm5)

Little dab here...

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/20/GTOV3-662.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MmCXT)

Little dab there...and...

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/20/GTOV3-663.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MmLni)

Viola!!!....oh, and Vic had already welded the fittings to the tank and mounted it with rivnuts.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/20/GTOV3-664.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MmPld)

We also added an EGT probe just before the turbine housing.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/20/GTOV3-665.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/Mm4co)

Andrew

andrewb70

01-21-2023, 08:02 PM

This morning I received the 1/2" hub centric wheel spacers that I ordered for the rear.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/21/GTOV3-666.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/Mm8hp)

The fit was spot on.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/21/GTOV3-667.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MmRC7)

I added this spacer to center the tire in the wheel wells. There is about 1.5" from the tire to the frame on the inside and about 1" on the outside. Also, both sides looked the same, which means the axle is well centered in the chassis and the body is well placed on the frame.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/21/GTOV3-668.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MmeLY)

The Mickey Thompson ET Street SS tires look amazing! The rear end is in full droop in this picture. Ride height is still to be determined.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/21/GTOV3-669.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MmJmR)

After the fun stuff, it was down to a rather tedious project. These are some banjo -AN adapters for the transmission cooler lines, compared to the stock adapters on the right.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/21/GTOV3-670.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MmaZH)

See that hole at the top?

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/21/GTOV3-671.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/Mmvoe)

That one...That is where the longer fitting has to go, and there isn't enough room in the transmission tunnel to take the fitting out. So I had to remove the transmission crossmember and lower the trans in order to install these. This picture is with the transmission at full droop.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/21/GTOV3-672.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MmifD)

Here they are installed with the transmission back in place.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/21/GTOV3-673.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/Mmyah)

Then I got to looking at the intercooler and grabbed a gray scuff pad and started to rub. I really like the brushed look for the intercooler, so I will use the gray scuff pad over all of it and leave it a natural brushed finish (the rest is bead blasted for now).

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/21/GTOV3-674.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0XcP)

A big "Thank you" to one of my customers, who graciously engraved my logo into the intake manifold plate.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/21/GTOV3-675.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0Z6m)

She is starting to look like something!

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/21/GTOV3-676.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0zeN)

Andrew

wfo guy

01-22-2023, 06:50 AM

andrewb70

01-23-2023, 08:06 PM

I'm getting excited for you. :) The engraved plate is a very nice touch. Always great to have talented friends. I think the egt is something that people should have way more often. AFR is only part of the info that is needed to have the engine safe and happy. :)

With any luck that plate will be welded to the intake tomorrow.

This morning I received this 4 cavity Deutsch bulkhead connector from Prowireusa (http://www.prowireusa.com). They are one of my Go-to vendors for wiring products.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/23/GTOV3-677.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0g68)

The idea behind getting this connector is that I would be able to wire the boost control solenoids to this connector and have a neat way of connecting them to the rest of the engine harness.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/23/GTOV3-678.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0pen)

My friend Blake designed this little cover for the boost solenoids and it will hold the bulkhead connector in place and also give the solenoids a much cleaner look. He is also going to 3D print the cover.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/23/GTOV3-679.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0Bfa)

Vic also added an elbow to the end of the downpipe with a v-band. The rest of the exhaust system will be built from here back.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/23/GTOV3-680.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0cgc)

This is a terrible picture, but I was just trying to show that the downpipe doesn't hang very low. In fact, the crossover pipe from the driver's exhaust manifold is the lowest point under the car.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/23/GTOV3-681.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0Hat)

Vic also made some adjustments to the short pipe that goes from the wastegate into the downpipe. It was about 3/32" too short which made it difficult to install the v-band. Vic cut that pipe, sleeved it, and welded it all back together.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/23/GTOV3-682.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0M04)

You can better see the sleeve here.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/23/GTOV3-683.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0Ku3)

He also added a small tab to keep the downpipe more stable.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/23/GTOV3-684.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0oT5)

Tomorrow is a big day and I can't wait to share what we have planned.

Andrew

David Sloan

01-24-2023, 04:10 AM

Can’t wait to here this run, love your work and attention to details!

andrewb70

01-24-2023, 04:30 PM

Can’t wait to here this run, love your work and attention to details!

Thanks David. It will sounds pretty much like the Cougar did, at least at idle...LOL

Andrew

andrewb70

01-24-2023, 04:46 PM

I love this country. Yesterday I made a call to a local company and this morning a guy named Matthew showed up with a big computer.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/24/GTOV3-685.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M00gd)

and a 3D scanner...

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/24/GTOV3-686.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0xrT)

and a bag of cocaine...(just kidding...baby powder) The baby powder was used extensively to knock the shine off the finish.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/24/GTOV3-687.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0EkE)

Then he proceeded to start scanning the bottom and the top of the hood. The purpose was to crate an accurate model that can the be used to design various options for the hole in the hood.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/24/GTOV3-689.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0FvZ)

This is at the start of the process and it took about 4 hours to do the whole hood. In a few days I should have a cleaned up 3D model of the hood.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/24/GTOV3-690.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0wzS)

While Matthew was doing the scanning, I decided to install the new automatic brake pedal. Before installing it, I took some measurements to check the pedal ratio with the existing holes. The top (manual brakes) hole gives about a 6.5:1 pedal ratio. The bottom hole (stock power brakes) gives about a 3.5:1 pedal ratio.

The various information that I could find about the iBooster said that the Tesla pedal ratio is 4:1. So we added an extra hole just above the stock lower hole, which resulted in about a 4.25:1 pedal ratio. This was about as close as we could come given the proximity to the lower hole.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/24/GTOV3-692.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M057o)

This change resulted in a much more favorable angle for the pushrod.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/24/GTOV3-693.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0QuY)

Andrew

andrewb70

01-26-2023, 03:22 PM

Progress is being made. Yesterday I sent off the up-pipe and the downpipe to HeaderShield (https://headershield.com) to have them wrapped. Today I showed up at Vic's and saw that he had installed the firewall shield that we had been discussing. We will probably take the intake off and go all the way across as much as we can with it.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/26/GTOV3-694.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0jz7)

I also pulled the drive's side seat to start mocking up the shifter. What you don't see is that under the carpet I had removed the shifter hump that was installed 20 years ago to make room for the Richmond 6 speed shifter. With that hump gone (it was bolted in) the console that I plan to use actually sort of fits. I ordered a partial left side front floor patch panel that includes part of the transmission tunnel. We are going to use that to close off the hole and have the shape of the floor be how it was with an auto trans. Then the 70 Chevelle console that I got should fit a lot better.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/26/GTOV3-695.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0twH)

In order to do the power steering plumbing, this little nipple for the fluid return had to be cut off because it was pointing right at the steering box.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/26/GTOV3-696.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0n5p)

The hole is quite small, so we are going to install a 1/8" NPT to AN-6 fitting there.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/26/GTOV3-697.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M06TR)

Andrew

andrewb70

01-29-2023, 10:00 AM

A quick trip to Star Performance (https://www.performanceparts.com) produced the 1/8" NPT to AN-6 Male fitting, and the power steering return is now sorted.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/29/GTOV3-698.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0Ake)

The next project to tackle was this hole in the side of the transmission tunnel.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/29/GTOV3-699.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0YvD)

The hole used to have a cover that had a shifter hump in it to clear the shifter and linkage for the Richmond 6 speed that used to be in the car. With that transmission gone and the 4L80e in its place, a new cover needed to be made.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/29/GTOV3-700.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0kph)

Here you can see how close the transmission is to the trans tunnel. My body bushings are 20 years old. They are not cracked, but I am sure they have settled some, which is contributing to the lack of clearance.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/29/GTOV3-701.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0d1m)

A quick Google search showed that partial floor pan patch panels were readily available. I called The Parts Place and they had one in stock and had it at my door in two days. You can see that part of the panel includes the needed piece to start making a new cover for the tunnel.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/29/GTOV3-702.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0I7P)

I trimmed it big to start...

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/29/GTOV3-703.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0U3N)

Then trimmed it to the final shape...

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/29/GTOV3-704.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0C5U)

and started to drill the necessary mounting holes.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/01/29/GTOV3-705.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0Tqw)

Turned out pretty good in the end, without having to do any custom metal shaping, which I don't have the skills to do anyway....

Andrew

Motown 454

01-29-2023, 03:32 PM

The floor came out nice, is it going to be removable? That wrap for the up/down pipes looks like a nice setup.

andrewb70

01-29-2023, 03:34 PM

The floor came out nice, is it going to be removable? That wrap for the up/down pipes looks like a nice setup.

Yes, it will be removable, like the old one was.

Andrew

andrewb70

02-01-2023, 07:25 PM

I took my intake to Hot Rod Express, where they welded the engraved manifold cover plate to the Holley intake lid.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/01/GTOV3-706.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0J18)

Today was the day that I wanted to get the heat exchanger mounted and start thinking about running the plumbing (so much plumbing in this car!!!) the A2W intercooler system. When I originally asked Vic to mount the heat exchanger to the radiator, I really had no idea how things would be plumbed. I had him mount the heat exchanger with the inlet and outlet (dual pass) on the driver's side. Clearly this is not going to work.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/01/GTOV3-707.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0Lva)

With the intercooler, fill tank, and circulation pump in place, it was clear that the best option would be to have the input and outlet on the passenger side. Before digging into that further I wanted to make sure that the circulation pump fittings would be oriented in the correct direction. I emailed Tobias at Tecomotive and he quickly responded that the pump inlet and outlet cover can be clocked in any of the 4 positions relative to the pump body.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/01/GTOV3-708.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0PNG)

I unscrewed the top and it sure doesn't look very fancy in here, but this pump is supposed to move A LOT of water.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/01/GTOV3-709.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0Wwk)

Not much to see here....

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/01/GTOV3-710.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M04IK)

I positioned the pump body in such a way that the connector was close to the fan shroud so that the wires for the pump could be routed along the bottom of the shroud.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/01/GTOV3-711.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M08jc)

I clocked the top so the outlet would face the passenger side (the top is the inlet).

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/01/GTOV3-712.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M01pt)

I also pulled both grill inserts so it would be easier to work in front of the radiator. As I was going along, I always had to make sure that I could get to everything without having to pull the grills, because once the radiator is installed, there is no way to access the grill hardware.

Here you can see that the heat exchanger was flipped (the drain is now at the top and can't be used). We couldn't rotate the heat exchanger because that would have required a complete reworking of the mounts and I did not want to do all that. I can live without a drain.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/01/GTOV3-713.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0l3n)

There is a lot more room on the passenger side for plumbing because the radiator core is slightly offset to the driver's side (note the larger tank on the passenger side).

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/01/GTOV3-714.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0a93)

With that orientation locked in, we moved to the bench where some minor fiddling had to be done to make the mounts work.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/01/GTOV3-715.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0yN5)

Both the inlet and outlet hoses fit pretty well using 90 degree fittings. With the fans removed and the radiator top tilted back, there is enough room to access these fittings from the top.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/01/GTOV3-716.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M0vq4)

I also trimmed the core support slightly so that the hoses can pass in front of the radiator. You can also see the Low Doller Motorsports temperature/pressure combo sensor in the cooling system.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/01/GTOV3-717.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M5GxS)

I still have to finalize the exact hose routing, but this is pretty good progress.

Andrew

ryeguy2006a

02-02-2023, 06:17 AM

andrewb70

02-02-2023, 06:23 AM

Looking great Andrew! That's nice that you were able to just flip the HX and it all still lined up. I'd actually argue that it's more important to have the drain fitting the way that you have it now to help purge air out of the system. It took me quite a while to finally get all of the air purged out of my system.

Thanks Ryan and great point about the purging of air! I haven't even considered that. I actually have some LS9 bleeders and I'll see about installing one in the drain.

Andrew

Blown353

02-03-2023, 05:42 PM

FYI, for all the late model GM intercooler stuff GM vacuum fills them. As mentioned it's nearly impossible to get all the air out of the system unless you vacuum fill the system, as there are often spots in the cores that are higher than the plumbing-- so they're going to trap air at the high spots unless you pull a vacuum on the system. On a few of GM's setups the fill points aren't even the highest spots in the system so vacuum filling is a necessity.

andrewb70

02-03-2023, 07:55 PM

I had mocked up the shifter a while back and it turned out that the 4 foot cable that was included with the Lokar shifter was not going to be long enough. So I ordered a 6 foot cable (which honestly could be 7 feet) from Summit and after it was defrosted in the Texas warehouse, I received it yesterday.

So it was time to put the big boy pants on and poke some holes to mount the shifter. I positioned it in such a way that with the shifter in Drive, I could, very naturally, put my hand on the shift level and slide it to the right and use the forward and backwards tap shift feature.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/03/GTOV3-718.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M5N2Z)

I drilled the first hole and shockingly it lined up perfectly where I intended it to go. I mounted the shifter and marked the other hole.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/03/GTOV3-719.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M5ZiE)

I used nut-serts (riv-nuts) inside the hole and temporarily mounted the shifter.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/03/GTOV3-720.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M5XIT)

I did a little more measuring and drilled a hole in the floor for the shifter cable. ICT Billet posted a teaser on their Instagram about their new shift cable pass-through and I have been bugging them about it for weeks. I am hoping it will be available soon so I can use it to seal the hole.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/03/GTOV3-721.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M5S8o)

For the front of the shifter, Vic whipped up a simple bracket and we (yes, I welded one side and he the other...thanks you...) welded it to the floor.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/03/GTOV3-722.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M5Ojd)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/03/GTOV3-723.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M5u9Y)

The shifter feels pretty good, but there are some minor adjustments that need to be made still.

Andrew

- - - Updated - - -

FYI, for all the late model GM intercooler stuff GM vacuum fills them. As mentioned it's nearly impossible to get all the air out of the system unless you vacuum fill the system, as there are often spots in the cores that are higher than the plumbing-- so they're going to trap air at the high spots unless you pull a vacuum on the system. On a few of GM's setups the fill points aren't even the highest spots in the system so vacuum filling is a necessity.

Good call on the vacuum bleeding, thank you! I will keep that in mind when the time comes!

Blown353

02-03-2023, 09:09 PM

andrewb70

02-03-2023, 09:23 PM

What's the size of your front mount heat exchanger? It looks pretty undersized to me given the HP that engine is going to make, but I could be wrong.

Reason I'm asking is that it seems far, far smaller than the 3 heat exchangers on my CT4 Blackwing which is only 475hp. It has one center mount heat exchanger that's the full width and probably 3/4 of the full height of the radiator core plus twin side mount heat exchangers that are probably 8 x 10 core size each.

Then again, if you aren't sizing the system to keep the charge air temps reasonable over a full send 30 minute road course abuse session and only sizing it to cool things off after quick WOT blasts from time to time you can get away with a lot smaller heat exchanger size up front.

Datalogging will show if you start to get some heat soak after several back to back WOT passes.

The heat exchanger is 26x7x2. It is a dual pass design, not sure if that makes a difference. As I was installing it, I was thinking that it might be on the small side, but I really don't know.

I am definitely not trying to run 30 minute track sessions. This is a street car that will see the drag strip a couple of times per year. I don't have a temp sensor in the heat exchanger, but I can certainly add one to monitor the water temperature of the intercooler system.

I can go with a taller head exchanger, but I can't go wider or thicker. I am open to suggestions...

Andrew

Blown353

02-03-2023, 10:02 PM

I'd suggest calling C&R, they can whip up a worksheet for your target HP level and come up with what size heat exchanger would be needed for adequate cooling under sustained use.

I don't have any access to their heat exchanger core / fin sizes or efficiency and heat transfer data related to their cores, but in the past when I've worked with them they've been very helpful when sizing radiators and intercooler heat exchangers. Once I get further along on my car I'm going to work with them on my heat exchanger. I was previously about 65-70% through my build with twin turbos and a large air to air intercooler, but now that I'm changing to a 3.0 Whipple (I tuned a car last year with an LS3 and a 2.9 Whipple and instant torque anywhere in the RPM range was stupid fun) I have to change over to air to water and I'll need a heat exchanger.

Your heat exchanger looks similar in size to what Magnussen provides with their C5 corvette supercharger kits, I used one of those on a friends 2006 GTO with a Magnussen. It's OK for street driving and occasional WOT blasts but isn't big enough to avoid heatsoak under sustained heavy use, the IATs and heat exchanger water temps started to run away on us on the chassis dyno when I did several back to back pulls. That's why I have a hunch something similar will happen with your setup, although it will probably be just fine for normal street use to keep IATs in check for a few WOT blasts followed by a few minutes of off-boost driving to cool things back down.

andrewb70

02-04-2023, 07:48 PM

andrewb70

02-05-2023, 07:20 PM

My friend Blake designed and 3D priced a cover the the boost solenoids.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/05/GTOV3-725.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M522D)

He included a cut-out on the side so that I can mount a Deutsch 4 connector bulkhead fitting, instead of the two connectors that were on the solenoids before.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/05/GTOV3-726.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M5gie)

Both Vic and I liked the raw 3D printed look of the sides, but the top was not as pretty. So Vic applied some vinyl to the top.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/05/GTOV3-727.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M5rBm)

The mounting plate itself is pretty thin, so in order to tap a hole for the hold down bolt, I drilled a small hole and used a punch to gradually enlarge the hole. This folds the soft aluminum out and gives more material to tap, making it as good as a captive nut.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/05/GTOV3-728.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M5Kth)

I also made the hose that gos from the fill tank to the top of the heat exchanger.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/05/GTOV3-729.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M5M8P)

Hear are the two heat exchanger lines where they slip between the core support and the radiator.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/05/GTOV3-730.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M5wDN)

The hose from the bottom of the heat exchanger loops towards the fender, then comes over the fan, and then down into the top of the pump.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/05/GTOV3-731.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M5xPU)

I also took the turbo off so that I could rattle can the turbo support bracket.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/05/GTOV3-732.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M5FOw)

Andrew

Josh@Ridetech

02-06-2023, 07:28 AM

Looks great, Andrew! Good work.

andrewb70

02-06-2023, 07:29 AM

Looks great, Andrew! Good work.

Thanks Josh!

Andrew

Blown353

02-07-2023, 08:59 PM

What do you think about adding a second, same heat exchanger on top and effectively making it a quad pass design?

Andrew

You’ve got me digging way back into my memories of thermodynamics and fluid dynamics, but I think you’d be better served running the 2 dual pass heat exchangers in parallel rather than in series as a single 4 pass heat exchanger… going from memory here but IIRC as the delta T gets closer between the water and the air going through the core, it’s going to be less efficient in terms of removing heat from the water. You want a larger delta T between the water and air to carry more of the heat away, but not excessively large.

Running the 2 heat exchangers in series as a single 4 pass heat exchanger might end up with a very low delta T between the water and air once the water gets to the 3rd and 4th pass, and those extra passes won’t do much for transferring heat from the water to the air at that point… and the water having to flow through all that extra core length with no extra cross sectional tube area when the heat exchangers are in series will increase the backpressure your pump has to push against, and more backpressure reduces the overall water flow rate of the pump and thus decreases the overall heat transfer rate that the system is capable of.

2 double pass cores in parallel should be more efficient at shedding heat since each core will have a larger delta T between the water and air, and with the cores being in parallel the cores should have less backpressure than a 4 pass series arrangement since the pump will see the 2 parallel heat exchangers as a larger double pass heat exchanger with tubes that are the same length as a single heat exchanger but with double the cross sectional tube area available for flow, so your overall backpressure should be lower putting the pump into a more favorable spot on its flow vs backpressure curve so the overall water flow rate will be higher, and a higher water flow rate will also help with more rapid transfer and removal of heat.

Again, this is all going off rather rusty memories from various classes many years ago. I’d have to dig back into books and equations to see if my gut feel is correct, lol

ryeguy2006a

02-08-2023, 05:25 AM

That solenoid cover you had 3D printed is really cool Andrew. Not sure if you want to or not, but I'll bet you would could sell those.

andrewb70

02-08-2023, 08:02 AM

You’ve got me digging way back into my memories of thermodynamics and fluid dynamics, but I think you’d be better served running the 2 dual pass heat exchangers in parallel rather than in series as a single 4 pass heat exchanger… going from memory here but IIRC as the delta T gets closer between the water and the air going through the core, it’s going to be less efficient in terms of removing heat from the water. You want a larger delta T between the water and air to carry more of the heat away, but not excessively large.

Running the 2 heat exchangers in series as a single 4 pass heat exchanger might end up with a very low delta T between the water and air once the water gets to the 3rd and 4th pass, and those extra passes won’t do much for transferring heat from the water to the air at that point… and the water having to flow through all that extra core length with no extra cross sectional tube area when the heat exchangers are in series will increase the backpressure your pump has to push against, and more backpressure reduces the overall water flow rate of the pump and thus decreases the overall heat transfer rate that the system is capable of.

2 double pass cores in parallel should be more efficient at shedding heat since each core will have a larger delta T between the water and air, and with the cores being in parallel the cores should have less backpressure than a 4 pass series arrangement since the pump will see the 2 parallel heat exchangers as a larger double pass heat exchanger with tubes that are the same length as a single heat exchanger but with double the cross sectional tube area available for flow, so your overall backpressure should be lower putting the pump into a more favorable spot on its flow vs backpressure curve so the overall water flow rate will be higher, and a higher water flow rate will also help with more rapid transfer and removal of heat.

Again, this is all going off rather rusty memories from various classes many years ago. I’d have to dig back into books and equations to see if my gut feel is correct, lol

Thanks for the detailed information. I think for now I will leave it as is and see how it goes. If the AITs are too high, I will re-evaluate at that time.

That solenoid cover you had 3D printed is really cool Andrew. Not sure if you want to or not, but I'll bet you would could sell those.

It would have to be a complete kit with the aluminum bracket and the lid. Something to consider...

Andrew

Way2qwk4u

02-08-2023, 04:29 PM

You’ve got me digging way back into my memories of thermodynamics and fluid dynamics, but I think you’d be better served running the 2 dual pass heat exchangers in parallel rather than in series as a single 4 pass heat exchanger… going from memory here but IIRC as the delta T gets closer between the water and the air going through the core, it’s going to be less efficient in terms of removing heat from the water. You want a larger delta T between the water and air to carry more of the heat away, but not excessively large.

Running the 2 heat exchangers in series as a single 4 pass heat exchanger might end up with a very low delta T between the water and air once the water gets to the 3rd and 4th pass, and those extra passes won’t do much for transferring heat from the water to the air at that point… and the water having to flow through all that extra core length with no extra cross sectional tube area when the heat exchangers are in series will increase the backpressure your pump has to push against, and more backpressure reduces the overall water flow rate of the pump and thus decreases the overall heat transfer rate that the system is capable of.

2 double pass cores in parallel should be more efficient at shedding heat since each core will have a larger delta T between the water and air, and with the cores being in parallel the cores should have less backpressure than a 4 pass series arrangement since the pump will see the 2 parallel heat exchangers as a larger double pass heat exchanger with tubes that are the same length as a single heat exchanger but with double the cross sectional tube area available for flow, so your overall backpressure should be lower putting the pump into a more favorable spot on its flow vs backpressure curve so the overall water flow rate will be higher, and a higher water flow rate will also help with more rapid transfer and removal of heat.

Again, this is all going off rather rusty memories from various classes many years ago. I’d have to dig back into books and equations to see if my gut feel is correct, lol

You are correct higher delta will transfer faster. Also parallel will minimize pressure drop.

andrewb70

02-08-2023, 07:23 PM

Today was another plumbing day. This time it was time to plumb the transmission cooler. Here is a little tip when working with push-lock style hose.

Add a union to the fitting and snug it down. This does two things:

1. If using a 45 or 90 degree fitting it keeps the nipple from trying to move around.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/08/GTOV3-733.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M5fE5)

2. When putting the fitting in the vise to hold it, it keeps the the nut from crushing and becoming out of round.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/08/GTOV3-734.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M5sKE)

This is the rear fitting on the transmission. The picture actually makes it look like there is a lot of clearance, but in reality it is very tight.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/08/GTOV3-735.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M5UAZ)

I managed to get the hose end started, but I will probably have to get creative with getting it tight. I think a Crow's foot should get it done.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/08/GTOV3-736.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M5IyT)

The front port wasn't too bad. I used a 45 degree fitting on this hose. Removing the trans dipstick made access easier.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/08/GTOV3-737.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M5ksS)

The hoses make a gently sweep over the bell housing area of the transmission, over to the driver's side, where they slip into a slot in the frame. This slot is where the factory hard lines were routed through the frame and out the front crossmember, by the steering box.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/08/GTOV3-738.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M5CJd)

I also experimented with some covering material for the intercooler plumbing. This is a fabric heat shrink material.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/08/GTOV3-739.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M5qHo)

The ends are finished with heat shrink. This is a close-up to show the pattern and texture.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/08/GTOV3-740.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M5PDi)

Andrew

Motorcitydak

02-09-2023, 05:18 AM

That cooler line looks like a pain to deal with. Could you attach the end to the hose and tighten it, then get the banjo fitting in place? What is that fabric sleeve you are using and what is it’s heat range? I used some corrugated aluminum stuff of varying sizes on lines that got near the exhaust. It’s all out of sight but I like the look of the stuff you used there

OLDFLM

02-09-2023, 07:31 AM

Source for the material for the intercooler plumbing? Looks great!!

andrewb70

02-09-2023, 07:34 AM

Source for the material for the intercooler plumbing? Looks great!!

The intercooler plumbing is Earl's Super Stock hose and fittings.

Andrew

OLDFLM

02-09-2023, 07:37 AM

The shrink fit covering over the hose?

andrewb70

02-09-2023, 07:40 AM

The shrink fit covering over the hose?

It's heat shrink fabric sleeve that I got from www.wirecare.com

Andrew

andrewb70

02-11-2023, 06:54 PM

This is Earl's Ultra Pro hose and it is by far the nicest hose I have ever worked with. It is super flexible, light weight, and looks fantastic. Sadly, for some reason, Earl's no longer sells this hose in sizes smaller than AN-10. I had a 6 foot section of AN-6 hose that I had purchased a while back.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/11/GTOV3-741.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M5eER)

So I decided to use it to make some of the needed hoses under the hood. This is the fuel rail crossover that links the two rails together in the front.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/11/GTOV3-742.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M5WWY)

The original plan was to have the Mighty Mouse catch can mounted to the master cylinder mount. However, with the Bosch iBooster in place, that was no longer an option. I got on the MM website and saw they had a basic mount that was designed to bolt to the head.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/11/GTOV3-743.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M5JGH)

Mounting it to the front of the heads was not an option. The passenger side has the turbo and the driver's side has the alternator. I could have modified this mount to work on the driver's side front, but instead, I chose to flip it around and mount it to the back of the driver's head.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/11/GTOV3-744.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M51s7)

It fit perfectly in the back.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/11/GTOV3-745.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M5LSp)

It places it approximately in the same location as the MC mount. There is plenty of clearance all around the can and the mount.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/11/GTOV3-746.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M5RKe)

I got this 150 degree fitting and some Earl's Ultra Pro hose in AN-10.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/11/GTOV3-747.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M5aRh)

The hose then gently bonds to the catch can.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/11/GTOV3-748.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M5lAD)

And in the front, it passes under the plate that holds the boost solenoids.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/11/GTOV3-749.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M5yQm)

Lastly, this arrived.....

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/11/GTOV3-750.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M5iHP)

This is the Hardwire Electronics 25 channel PDM (https://www.hardwire-electronics.com/product-page/pdm-25).

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/11/GTOV3-751.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M9G4N)

I saw these guys at the PRI show and was very intrigued by the product. This has way more channels than I need for the moment, but I may eventually have it handling the power distribution for the whole car. For now, the original harness will take care of all the interior and exterior lighting and the power windows. The Hardwire PDM will be use for the EFI, AC, and any other system under the dash.

The Hardwire PDM also supports the Holley 3rd Party CAN protocol (AKA the Racepak protocol), so I be able to do some neat things. More to come on that much later when I start on the wiring.

Andrew

andrewb70

02-14-2023, 08:03 AM

The hood 3D scan turned out really well. I had a chance to work with Kris Horton (http://www.carsbykris.com) with the tuning on his Chevelle and he has been working on a rendering of my GTO. He will use the hood scan to refine the rendering and also come up with various ideas about how to deal with the hole in the hood.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/14/GTOV3-752.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M92U5)

Next on the list was finding a suitable location for the Hardwire PDM. My under-dash structure is not like a typical A-body because 20 years ago a frame was built to hold the VA AC unit. Part of this fram structure was also a little shelf where the old Holley Commander 950 ECU used to live.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/14/GTOV3-753.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M9MXS)

I figured that attaching the PDM under the shelf would be the perfect, central location.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/14/GTOV3-754.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M9oMT)

I added some #8 rivnuts to the plate...

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/14/GTOV3-755.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M9rYE)

With the PDM bolted down in place...

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/14/GTOV3-756.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M9EVd)

It is slightly below the level of where the old ash tray used to be, but it is much more inconspicuous than what the pictures indicate. It is tucked up under the dash, while still having all of the connectors easily accessible.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/14/GTOV3-757.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M9wlZ)

More plumbing....I made the short hose that goes from the catch can to the back of the intake manifold.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/14/GTOV3-758.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M9Fno)

Lastly, I made a short hose for the power steering pressure side.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/14/GTOV3-759.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M9m4i)

Andrew

GTO Jack

02-14-2023, 01:37 PM

Are the power steering lines crimped, what did you use and where did you get it done. I am trying to figure that out on my car right now and not finding any real good answers. Thanks.

wfo guy

02-14-2023, 04:33 PM

GTO Jack, the ps hoses are not crimped. Those are 2 piece hose ends. There are many sources for that. If you look at Summit's website for one, you will find several brands that are available. If you have a Carquest parts store near you, most offer hydraulic line crimping so there is another option for this.

andrewb70

02-14-2023, 04:41 PM

Are the power steering lines crimped, what did you use and where did you get it done. I am trying to figure that out on my car right now and not finding any real good answers. Thanks.

It was some hose and fittings that Vic had left over from another project. They are not crimped.

GTO Jack, the ps hoses are not crimped. Those are 2 piece hose ends. There are many sources for that. If you look at Summit's website for one, you will find several brands that are available. If you have a Carquest parts store near you, most offer hydraulic line crimping so there is another option for this.

Yes, this exactly. Thank you!

Andrew

andrewb70

02-15-2023, 05:36 PM

When I originally built the car, twenty years ago, I had the foresight to install a 1/2" stainless fuel hardline that runs from the back, along the frame rail, and exits here at the front of the frame. It already had a AN-8 male fitting on the end.

I have been sourcing some of my plumbing supplies here locally from Star Performance. This PTFE hose is branded under the Red Horse brand of hoses and fittings.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/15/GTOV3-760.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M96oH)

Vic and I also made a little mount for the TMAP sensor that is above the Tick intercooler. This way I can datalog both air temperature and boost pressure above and below the intercooler, so I can see how well it is working.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/15/GTOV3-761.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M97Ye)

Vic also cut out the rest of the panels to cover the firewall. I really like the overall look. It looks clean and adds a layer of heat insulations.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/15/GTOV3-762.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M9Ach)

Back to the fuel system. I was originally going to bring the -8 hose from the frame rail, to the back of the intake and have a Y-bock and 2 -6 hoses to the rails. This was proving to be kind of a pain in the a$$, so I made my life easier...

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/15/GTOV3-763.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M9jlD)

The -8 hose from the frame rail feeds into the passenger side fuel rail.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/15/GTOV3-764.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M9YnP)

There is a cross-over hose at the front and the rear of the driver's side fuel rail is capped off.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/15/GTOV3-765.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M9fLm)

I also bent up a little NiCopp tube for the blow-off valve.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/15/GTOV3-766.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M9IhN)

This is the plate that I had made earlier. These connectors will be for the injectors and coil harnesses.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/15/GTOV3-767.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M9dmU)

Andrew

digitalsolo

02-16-2023, 08:46 AM

Progress looks great Andrew.

I've installed one of those Hardwire PDMs, once of the best units I've used (and I've used several brands). You'll love that thing.

andrewb70

02-16-2023, 02:29 PM

Progress looks great Andrew.

I've installed one of those Hardwire PDMs, once of the best units I've used (and I've used several brands). You'll love that thing.

Blake,

That is great to hear about the Hardwire PDM. I will be getting started on the wiring in a few weeks.

Andrew

andrewb70

02-18-2023, 06:57 AM

With the fuel plumbing finished up under the hood, it was time to figure out what needed to be done in the back. I recently ordered some wiring supplies from www.milspecwiring.com, and as I browsed their website, I got suckered in by this little piece of jewelry. It is the Injector Dynamics ID750 fuel filter. I got mine with the optional Bosch Motorsports fuel pressure/temp sensor. The little Schrader valve port will be repurposed to plumb the pressure relief valve that was recommended by Carl at Vaporworx.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/18/GTOV3-768.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M9qfK)

The DeatschWerks 5th Gen Camaro pump module that I am using has this alignment tab that is used in the OEM application to properly clock the pump. Since mine is going into a Rick's RestoMod tank, I did not need this tab, so it was cut off.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/18/GTOV3-769.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M9Tok)

Once the tank was installed in the car, it was obvious that the access hole that was there before was not going to work.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/18/GTOV3-770.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M9Pla)

I am also thinking that the fuel filter, flex fuel sensor, and the pressure relief valve will be plumbed inside the trunk. There is just not a lot of room under the car. I know it is "risky" (whatever that means) but that is how I am going to do it.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/18/GTOV3-771.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M94ct)

I got the whizzwheelofdeath out and made a new hole in the trunk. All of this will get cleaned up with a nice cover panel.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/18/GTOV3-772.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M9L6c)

Andrew

andrewb70

02-19-2023, 07:41 PM

I don't know how I feel about this yet, but that's what I got so far.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/19/GTOV3-773.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M9yaE)

The fuel line comes to of the pump, under the trunk floor, through a bulkhead fitting, then to the fuel filter and the flex fuel sensor holder.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/19/GTOV3-774.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M9ifT)

The upside to this arrangement is that servicing the fuel filter, flex fuel sensor, and the wiring would be very simple and easy.

Andrew

btmatt

02-21-2023, 10:14 AM

Return or return-less fuel system?

ryeguy2006a

02-21-2023, 12:13 PM

968ls1

02-21-2023, 02:07 PM

That fuel filter set up looks really nice Andrew! You're going to have so many inputs to use for datalog, I'm jealous. I like the way the location looks in the trunk, but when you go to replace the filter does that mean that fuel will spill all over the trunk? If so, I'd be moving it under the car.

Not sure how often the filter would need replacement but I can’t imagine very often. Don’t expect there would be much fuel leak out as the lines on both ends are facing down. I like the set up much easier to service when it’s required.

andrewb70

02-21-2023, 08:37 PM

Today it was "drive your hotrod to work day" so I drove the Cougar to Vic's place.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/21/GTOV3-775.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MDzeo)

I put some fabric sleeving on the fuel line that goes from the pump to the bulkhead. This is how it looks when viewed from the bottom. It looks like it is touching, but there is clearance all around that hose.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/21/GTOV3-776.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MDZ6d)

This view is from the front, looking over the top of the rear axle.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/21/GTOV3-777.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MDXgZ)

Once that was sorted, I moved to the other side where the 1/2" stainless tube terminates. The top fitting is what I had in there. It is a -AN8 to -AN6 male union.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/21/GTOV3-778.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MDS0Y)

Since the fuel like that I am using in the rear is -AN10, I needed the adapter shown at the bottom. The one that I got from Star Performance was aluminum, as they didn't have any steel ones. After discussing it with Vic, it was decided that a steel fitting would be more appropriate. So we got a -AN10, steel male weld bung, and Vic made a new fitting, using part of the old fitting.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/21/GTOV3-779.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MDOhi)

The other thing that I decided to change was not have the flex fuel sensor holder be right after the fuel filter. Even with the filter shifted to the left as much as possible, I just don't have the linear room to mount everything and still have enough room for the hoses to routed appropriately. With the flex fuel holder gone, this is how I plan to run the hose. It will sweep gently, back under the trunk floor and turn back towards the right side, where the stainless tube is located.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/21/GTOV3-780.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MDuZR)

The flex fuel sensor holder will be attached to the end of the tube with a -AN10 to -AN10 female union.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/21/GTOV3-781.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MDbTp)

Andrew

andrewb70

02-26-2023, 08:38 AM

I got the flex fuel sensor, but of course I got the wrong one to work with the Motion Raceworks holder...

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/26/GTOV3-782.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MDwzw)

I was missing one last fitting to complete the intercooler hoses. The inlet to the intercooler needs a 45 degree fitting in order to clear the fuel rail that is below it. I used the fabric heat shrink on top of the Earl's Super Stock hose and it looks remarkably similar to the Earl's Ultra Pro hose.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/26/GTOV3-783.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MDKum)

This hose makes a gentle sweep down and towards the center of the fan shroud...

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/26/GTOV3-784.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MDoTU)

Where it connects to the water pump. You can see the pump mounted to the fan shroud.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/26/GTOV3-785.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MDM5N)

Vic took a couple of fittings and welded them together to make an adapter.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/26/GTOV3-786.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MDpeP)

The adapter is used to mount the pressure relief valve.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/26/GTOV3-787.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MDxwG)

Carl from VaporWorx told me this was necessary to keep the system from getting vapor locked. He told me to purchase a small Radium Engineering fuel pressure regulator and send me a special 80psi diaphragm for it.

When the car has been running for a while, then it is turned off, pressure in the feed line can build up and lock up the injectors from firing. This valve will burn the feed line once the pressure exceeds 80psi.

I also got a modern Helical exhaust valve that uses a Küster 3 pin motor. This will be controlled by the Holley Dominator ECU.

https://youtu.be/MB0V4yTQj4U

Andrew

ProTouring442

02-26-2023, 09:41 AM

You really don't mind fuel lines in the interior?

andrewb70

02-26-2023, 11:43 AM

You really don't mind fuel lines in the interior?

It is the trunk, not the interior. My Cougar has fuel lines in the trunk as well. I don't see the big deal.

Andrew

Blown353

02-26-2023, 04:54 PM

ProTouring442

02-27-2023, 10:40 AM

It is the trunk, not the interior. My Cougar has fuel lines in the trunk as well. I don't see the big deal.

Andrew

Except there's no firewall between the trunk and the interior of a GM A-body, just some cardboard and a seat.

Can't say how it is on the Cougar.

So long as you're comfortable... you're probably right that it's no big deal... but it would make me nervous. LOL

andrewb70

02-27-2023, 12:34 PM

Fuel lines in the interior are all fun until you have a leak, then you have a lingering smell inside the car that takes a while to dissipate... plus the fire hazard, lol!

Many factory cars have fuel tanks and fuel lines in the trunk right behind the back seat partition. First two cars that come to mind are 2004-2006 GTOs and Mercedes R107/C107 SL/SLCs.

That being said, I prefer keeping the tank and all fuel related plumbing outside of the passenger compartment and trunk if at all possible. Sometimes it's a necessity though, like if you're plumbing an surge/expansion tank-- the higher the better for it for drainback reasons, which almost guarantees they have to be mounted inside the trunk.

You know these cars as well as anyone, and can probably testify to the fact that there is not a lot of room in the area in front of the tank and where the rear end wants to move up and down.

Except there's no firewall between the trunk and the interior of a GM A-body, just some cardboard and a seat.

Can't say how it is on the Cougar.

So long as you're comfortable... you're probably right that it's no big deal... but it would make me nervous. LOL

I have more than cardboard behind the seat. It is not a solid, metal firewall, but there is stuff there...

Andrew

wfo guy

02-28-2023, 06:28 AM

The last gen of crown vic had the tank behind the seat. Pretty protected as compared to many possible locations.

968ls1

02-28-2023, 06:09 PM

The fuel tank in my E46 M3 us under the rear seat and lines run out of the top of it.

andrewb70

02-28-2023, 07:36 PM

Today I decided to leave the plumbing for a while and tackle one of the last big boxes that I have. As mentioned before, this car now has a complete Ridetech suspension, front and rear, and part of that package are front and rear sway bars. This is the front sway bar.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/28/GTOV3-788.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MDFvK)

This sway bar kit is very thought out. The bushings are polyurethane, but they also include this slick Delrin bushing, which is supposed to eliminate the need for lube and is supposed to eliminate squeaks, which are so common with polyurethane bushings.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/28/GTOV3-789.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MD57t)

The ridge on the Delrin bushing rides inside a groove in the middle of the bushing, which keeps the bushing from sliding out.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/28/GTOV3-790.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MD0ga)

Judging by the weight, the bar is hollow and has there bushing ends welded to both sides.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/28/GTOV3-791.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MD91c)

The mounting system includes some plates that move the bar about 1" forward. This is done to clear the pitman arm on the passenger side. My old swaybar used to rub a little bit against the edge of the pitman arm. You can see that now there is a solid inch of clearance.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/28/GTOV3-792.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MDEkk)

The end links are Moog parts and also did not call for any lube.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/28/GTOV3-793.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MDQu8)

Lastly, I also dug out the mating connectors for the bulkhead panel.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/02/28/GTOV3-794.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MDn5n)

The connectors have the optional "backs" on them, so that I can fully cover the wires. The "backs" also provide addd strain relief, which is very important for all connectors.

Andrew

wfo guy

03-01-2023, 06:12 AM

I meant to ask earlier, what do you gain with the power distribution panel that you purchased? I see that you can record data, but how does that interface with what you are doing?

andrewb70

03-01-2023, 06:46 AM

I meant to ask earlier, what do you gain with the power distribution panel that you purchased? I see that you can record data, but how does that interface with what you are doing?

The Hardwire PDM is going to replace all the needed fuses and relays for the EFI system and AC. Here are a couple of things that I will be able to do with it.

Scenario 1. Reverse lights. Normally, there is a switch on the transmission or on the shifter that closes a switch, which then turns on the reverse lights. With a PDM that can read Holley CAN messages, I can program the reverse light circuit to turn on when I put the shifter into reverse. This is done without the need for a switch, since the PDM will receive a CAN message that the shifter has been moved to reverse.

Scenario 2. Neutral safety. Again, there is usually a switch on the shifter that closes when the shifter is in P or N. Since the starter solenoid circuit will be powered by the PDM, I can program that output to work only when the shifter is in P or N.

Scenario 3. AC compressor. Normally, the AC system sends a signal to the AC compressor to activate the AC clutch. This circuit will now be controlled by the Dominator and the PDM. The AC request will be an input to the ECU. The ECU will then look at other sensor data, namely, AC pressure, RPM, and TPS, and based on those, it will either turn on or off the AC compressor.

The possibilities are endless.

Andrew

wfo guy

03-01-2023, 04:13 PM

^^^
Thank you.

andrewb70

03-07-2023, 04:44 PM

With spring quickly coming, my tuning business has been picking up steam, which means less time to work on the GTO, but I managed to knock out a couple of tasks.

First up is the Ridetech rear sway bar. The kit comes with these brackets that would normally be held in place by a U-bolt. This this rear housing has a back brace, the bracket no longer fits around the axle tube. I trimmed the parts that were interfering and used an angle finder to make sure that both brackets were at the same angle. The actual angle is not critical, but having them be the same seemed pretty important.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/07/GTOV3-795.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MDd1d)

Next, I drilled some holes in the frame for the end link brackets. This is the driver's wide.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/07/GTOV3-796.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MDIjZ)

This is the passenger side with the sway bar bracket and the end link installed.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/07/GTOV3-797.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MDU3o)

Vic got a new MIG welded and I buggered it in place. The welds are not pretty, but they will be fine.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/07/GTOV3-798.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MDC5i)

Lastly, fiddled around with the flex fuel sensor holder. I didn't want the sensor to just be hanging by the AN union without any support. I used a large P clamp to support the other side where the fuel line will attach.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/07/GTOV3-799.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MDTqY)

Andrew

Blown353

03-09-2023, 06:13 PM

Andrew, I'd suggest welding gussets to the rear frame crossmember right next to the the swaybar mounts.

I've done a couple of sway bar installs that mount similarly on A-bodies that ended up cracking the crossmember after a couple years of hard use as mounting the bar endlinks to the bottom of the crossmember flexes the lower lip of the crossmember.

For bars that attach the endlink brackets on the lower portion of the crossmember, welding a couple of small gussets from the lower flange to the vertical wall on the inboard side of the endlink mount points stiffens the lower flange in the area where the bar mounts and stops the cracking issue.

The Hellwig rear bar mounts the endlink brackets to the tall vertical face of the rear frame crossmember for that reason, the tall vertical face of the crossmember is a much better attachment point for the cyclic vertical loading applied by the swaybar than the short lower lip of the c-section.

Outline in red of the suggested gusset... do this on the inside of the C-section of course. You just want to give that flange more support where the swaybar endlink brackets mount.

206101

Also, I would strongly suggest adding a tie bar across the frame ears where your coilovers attach. The rear shock upper mounting location on these frames was never meant to support the weight of the vehicle (the weight was meant to be supported by the stock spring seat in the forward corner where it's closer to the frame side rails and crossmember, which is much stronger) and air shocks or bolt in coilover conversions that put all the weight of the car on the shock mounting points will eventually crack the frame since the rear spring/shock brackets aren't supported as well in the shock mounting area. I've repaired several frames that have cracked there over the years, most on El Caminos with air shocks but also a couple Chevelles that had "bolt in" coilover conversions.

Global West has a stout solution that's mostly bolt in... you might want to try and do something similar.
Pics/install of one: https://www.motortrend.com/how-to/here-is-a-simple-bolt-on-chevelle-rear-coilover-shock-conversion/

A UMI bolt in rear shock tie-bar is not as good as the GW mounting solution, but better than nothing.
https://www.umiperformance.com/home/product/1968-1972-gm-a-body-rear-shock-tower-brace-bolt-in/

andrewb70

03-09-2023, 07:25 PM

I take inspiration from all kinds of places. A while back I ran across a build on the Rad Rides website. It was the 1961 Brookwood wagon (https://radrides.com/builds/1961-brookwood-chevy-wagon/) built for George Poteet:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2023/03/Poteet_62_wagon_0016-1.jpg

When I was at PRI I went to the booth of the vendor that did the cladding on the downpipe. The company is HeaderShield (https://headershield.com). I emailed them after the show, sent pictures of my parts, they gave me a quote, I paid it, sent my parts in, and ten weeks later I got them back.

This is the up-pipe that goes from the Holley manifold exit to the turbine inlet.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/09/GTOV3-800.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MDWwR)

This is the downpipe that feeds the exhaust from the turbine, under the car.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/09/GTOV3-801.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MDPNp)

The rest of the exhaust will take off from the downpipe.

Andrew

Steve68

03-09-2023, 09:05 PM

We did this to the Space Shuttle fuel lines that ran through the aft compartment since the first launch in 81'

thumper877

03-10-2023, 03:27 AM

Those turned out great. Love the look.

andrewb70

03-10-2023, 07:16 AM

We did this to the Space Shuttle fuel lines that ran through the aft compartment since the first launch in 81'

It doesn't surprise me that this technology trickled down from the Aerospace industry. Then it made it into professional motorsports and now down to the consumer level. Much like AN fittings, turbo and super sharpers, and probably a lot more.

Those turned out great. Love the look.

Thanks Ron!

Andrew

Steve68

03-10-2023, 07:52 AM

[QUOTE=andrewb70;1388203]It doesn't surprise me that this technology trickled down from the Aerospace industry. Then it made it into professional motorsports and now down to the consumer level. Much like AN fittings, turbo and super sharpers, and probably a lot more.

Yes sir, that it did, covers on the turbo pumps too, all the fuel lines were vacuum jacketed, that's the same technology that keeps your drink cold or hot in your Yeti or Artic cups!

Car is looking great!

andrewb70

03-10-2023, 07:18 PM

andrewb70

03-10-2023, 07:27 PM

I brought the pipes over to Vic's and installed them, hopefully for good. The downpipe fits great, although it is about 1/8 inch away from the frame. I am hoping the cladding will keep the powder coating on the frame from burning off.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/10/GTOV3-802.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MD1pe)

Here is the up-pipe, going from the Hooker exhaust manifold to the turbine inlet. If you look closely, you can see the bung for the EGT probe.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/10/GTOV3-803.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MDLiH)

Here is the wastegate plumbing. The wastegate itself will get a little blanket, as will the turbine housing. Both from Funk Motorsports in England.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/10/GTOV3-804.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MD4I7)

Here you can see the oil drain. Remember, it is stainless steel, but I also added an insulating sleeve over the top. The EGT bung is also clearly visible.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/10/GTOV3-805.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MD8jD)

This is just an overall shot of how things are looking.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/10/GTOV3-806.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MDJ8h)

The yellow dipstick handle needs to go...

Andrew

Steve68

03-10-2023, 09:35 PM

Very nice! clean and the new jackets look nice,

I dont need anything like that for mine I like the metal and sound deading under the toe boards, creature comforts from the headers, like in the BMW's

ryeguy2006a

03-13-2023, 04:37 AM

Looks so nice Andrew! Really like that dimpled cover for the down/up pipes.

CarlC

03-13-2023, 10:36 PM

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/10/GTOV3-806.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MDJ8h)

The yellow dipstick handle needs to go...

Andrew

I've used the fancy "billet" aftermarket dipsticks which are a multi-piece deal that have nearly no lead-in on the pan side. Getting good oil level readings was a crapshoot since the lead-in (the bottom end of the guide) does not protrude into the crankcase. This causes the stick to deflect and give poor readings. After changing to a GM dipstick assembly, all is good.

Perhaps see if just the handle can be changed?

dontlifttoshift

03-14-2023, 05:04 AM

Lokar makes a billet ring to replace the yellow plastic in case you ever wished you could brand your fingertips.

andrewb70

03-14-2023, 06:06 PM

The whole area behind the rear seat was covered with MLV. It was sad to have to cut into it...

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/14/GTOV3-807.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MQGxw)

But I needed access so that I could install this...

It is a OEM fuel vapor separator. I plan to vent the tank though this and then into a small charcoal canister. That should keep most of the fuel vapors at bay.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/14/GTOV3-808.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MDyNU)

I sealed it against the body with some butyl rope.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/14/GTOV3-809.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MDvPN)

Here you can see where the lines exit, just above the rear crossmember.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/14/GTOV3-810.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MDl3P)

I also played around with the new gauges.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/14/GTOV3-811.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MDa9m)

It is a little frustrating that the Holley gauges are 4" instead of 5", so something has to be done about that...The fuel lever gauge fit great into the 2 1/16" hole.

Andrew

dontlifttoshift

03-15-2023, 04:48 AM

andrewb70

03-15-2023, 05:53 AM

I run the stock vapor separator in the Camaro and even without the charcoal canister there are no fuel smells. I laugh when people throw them away as "emissions garbage" as they are really well designed and package in a great location.

I actually bought this one from a member here who was tearing it out of his 72 Firebird...shhhh...don't tell...

Andrew

andrewb70

03-18-2023, 06:34 AM

I like to repurpose OEM parts as part of my builds. I am not sure how I ran across this part, but it is from a 2008 Ford F250 with the PowerStroke engine.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/18/GTOV3-812.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MQS8t)

This is what Ford uses for the exhaust pressure sensor, and I figured I can use it for the same purpose. In this picture, the tube has been cut and a sleeve installed over the cut. The sleeve ends where the green tape is and where my finger is pointing.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/18/GTOV3-813.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MQOja)

This is the sensor part number. From what I have been able to gather, it is a 0-54psi sensor.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/18/GTOV3-814.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MQXdG)

The tube is stainless and 5/16" diameter and it uses 37 degree flares with tube sleeves and nuts at both ends. That size tubing translates to an -AN5, which is not super common. Luckily, I had this 90 degree NPT to -AN5 adapter that I was using on the old tank for the return line. The NPT side has been cut off and Vic turned it down in the lathe to make a -AN5 male weld fitting.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/18/GTOV3-813a.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MQZik)

Here you can see where the fitting is going to go. Yes, the first hole was way off...

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/18/GTOV3-815.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MQN2K)

The whole assembly is bolted to one of the holes on the back of the heads...

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/18/GTOV3-816.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MQhBc)

and the tube extends down to the crossover pipe...

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/18/GTOV3-817.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MQu98)

Once the tube was the right length and clocked correctly, the sleeve was welded to the tube.

Andrew

andrewb70

03-18-2023, 03:31 PM

I arrived at Vic's this morning and found that he had already stuck the stock dipstick into the lathe and got rid of the ugly yellow dipstick handle.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/18/GTOV3-818.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MQ3Pn)

He also took a piece of Delrin that he had on hand and made a new new dipstick handle, which is much more appealing.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/18/GTOV3-819.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MQcd5)

Once the parts were ready, they were cleaned and mated together with some JB Weld.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/18/GTOV3-820.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MQgyS)

Much better...

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/18/GTOV3-821.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MQVx4)

Here it is, in case you didn't notice it.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/18/GTOV3-822.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MQHO3)

I also mounted the AC condenser in its location and removed the protective cardboard from the radiator.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/18/GTOV3-823.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MQ22T)

I will have the AC and the heater plumbing sorted pretty soon.

Andrew

thumper877

03-18-2023, 04:18 PM

I need to get with vic. He does some cool stuff. :)
Getting closer

Tampa33

03-18-2023, 05:10 PM

Booooo, no turbo size comparison is official unless it's next to a Mountain Dew can. Nice parts collection so far.
The bronze Cerakote should look killer. Good call on the 9" rear too. It didn't take long for my perfectly quiet 12 bolt to start whining after a few blast on drag radials.
What rear gear are you going for?
What are you using for a heat exchanger?

andrewb70

03-19-2023, 05:59 AM

Way2qwk4u

03-19-2023, 06:47 AM

andrewb70

03-19-2023, 01:13 PM

Andrew,

What’s the thought process on the exhaust back pressure sensor? What do you want to do with that information? Is it going to be a limit of some type?

Looking good. That cladding really looks great.

It is more for monitoring purposes, more than anything else. I know this system can have some high pre-turbo back pressure. I just want to see what it is, but there isn't much I can do about it.

Andrew

ryeguy2006a

03-20-2023, 05:10 AM

Great work as usual Andrew. Love the innovation that you continually come up with.

Way2qwk4u

03-20-2023, 06:31 PM

It is more for monitoring purposes, more than anything else. I know this system can have some high pre-turbo back pressure. I just want to see what it is, but there isn't much I can do about it.

Andrew

I would be interested to know what the ratio is between exhaust and boost pressure.

Well you could just go ahead and redo it all for twins. :-) nothing like some good mission creep.

andrewb70

03-20-2023, 06:47 PM

I would be interested to know what the ratio is between exhaust and boost pressure.

Well you could just go ahead and redo it all for twins. :-) nothing like some good mission creep.

This build already has quite a bit of scope creep. I certainly don't need or want more.

Andrew

ryeguy2006a

03-21-2023, 04:57 AM

andrewb70

03-21-2023, 06:38 AM

Andrew, you are going to have all the data! Love it, and hope that you can give us an overview of how you will use that data when tuning. Or at least as much as you can without giving away trade secrets.

Eventually this thing will go on a dyno and that's where the data will be used. One of my local customers has a dyno at his home shop.

Andrew

andrewb70

03-21-2023, 06:32 PM

I decided that I wanted to rotate the Holley Lo-Ram front to back, which will put the MAP sensors in the front.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/21/GTOV3-824.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MQjDP)

The main purpose for rotating the manifold is to clean up the area behind the intake and have the ability to use the stock oil pressure sensor in the stock location. I should have done this at the beginning...

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/21/GTOV3-829.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MQdGG)

Rotating the manifold involved a bunch of changes. One of them being the plate that holds the boost solenoids. It still fits, but it had to be cut to clear the Bosch TMAP sensor.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/21/GTOV3-825.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MQ7Hh)

I also picked up some AC hose ends locally. The top hose that goes to the condenser is from the compressor.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/21/GTOV3-826.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MQtWm)

The lower hose goes to the dryer. I have a new dryer on the way along with a AC pressure sensor, which will replace the binary switch. The AC compressor will be controlled by the Dominator ECU and the HardWire PDM.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/21/GTOV3-827.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MQfEU)

I got a 45 degree fitting for the #10 hose that goes from the evaporator to the front port on the compressor. The rear port on the compressor is a #8, and goes to the top of the condenser.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/21/GTOV3-828.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MQYSN)

I also took out the dash insert.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/21/GTOV3-830.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MQksw)

With the ash insert out, I will be able to get to all of the wiring and ducting behind the dash, without actually having to pull the dash out. The 3 gauges that are front and center will be the Holley CAN RPM and Speedo, as well as a small fuel level gauge.

The holes on the right will be filled in. The 6.86" Holley Pro-dash will go where the three larger gauges used to be and below that will be two AC vents.

Andrew

andrewb70

03-23-2023, 06:21 PM

This is a small update with, hopefully, useful information.

Since the Holley EFI will be controlling the AC compressor, I wanted to use an AC pressure sensor. This is a little adapter that VA sells just for that purpose. Also pictured is a new VA dryer, where the fitting goes.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/23/GTOV3-831.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MQRMS)

This is the AC pressure sensor that I am using. The main reason that I picked it is because I have the output configuration for it.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/23/GTOV3-832.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MQJG5)

This is the new dryer, installed in its location on the radiator core support.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/23/GTOV3-837.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MQaRE)

A lot of people ask me which oil pressure sensor I like to use on Gen 4 engines with Holley EFI. This is the one, and the connector on the Holley EFI harness has the correct connector. It is a 135psi sensor.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/23/GTOV3-832a.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MQ1s4)

This sensor looks similar, but it has a 12mm thread on it, instead of the 16mm thread on the sensor shown above. I had this end cap for the Holley fuel rail, so I had an idea...

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/23/GTOV3-833.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MQeF3)

I told my idea to Vic and a little while later my idea was made reality.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/23/GTOV3-834.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MQLSn)

Vic drilled and tapped the cap for the 12mm thread and a groove for the o-ring to seat against.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/23/GTOV3-835.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MQlAT)

I installed it in the rear of the driver's side fuel rail. So I have a fuel pressure and temperature sensor after the fuel filter and this sensor in the rail, mostly because I can.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/23/GTOV3-836.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MQiVZ)

Vic is also making progress on modifying the dash insert to use with the Holley Pro-Dash.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/23/GTOV3-838.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MnG4o)

The small hole to the right of the steering column will also get filled.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/23/GTOV3-839.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MQyQd)

Andrew

David Sloan

03-24-2023, 03:51 AM

Nicely done sir, this is what hot rodding is about, I love to learn new things from other car guys.
I’ve got to look in to that pressure sensor from the Ford F-250
Thank you sir

wfo guy

03-24-2023, 05:40 AM

I hope Vic is enjoying this project. Many projects are just work. If the creativity to accomplish things is important, he should be happy. :)

andrewb70

03-24-2023, 05:34 PM

Since I decided to rotate the Holley Lo-Ram base front to back, I needed to add a fitting for the catch can. Instead of using the typical NPT to AN adapter, I used this straight thread ORB adapter.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/24/GTOV3-840.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MnZSi)

All that is needed is a little counter-sink for the o-ring to seal against. Sorted...

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/24/GTOV3-841.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MnNUp)

I needed a pass through for some wires to come through the firewall, low on the passenger side. This pass through is for wiring the heater control valve, fan speed signal, AC pressure sensor, EGT probe, and the dome pressure sensor.

I enlarged an existing hole to 1" using a step drill and...

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/24/GTOV3-842.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MnSGR)

used a TE Connectivity 90 degree heat shrink boot passthrough.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/24/GTOV3-843.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MnbM7)

This is the 4 port, electronic heater control valve that I am using. It is sold by Thermotion (https://www.thermotion.com/4-port-electronic-heater-control-valve-pn-354-69694). This will allow the coolant to flow through the heater core circuit when the valve is closed to shut the coolant flow through the heater core, when the AC is being used.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/24/GTOV3-844.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MnzFY)

Vic also finished filling the holes in the dash. He then fixtures the dash in the mill to make the opening for the Holley 6.86" Pro-Dash.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/24/GTOV3-845.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MnhYH)

Below the dash will be two of these VA dash vents:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2023/03/49062VUQ-1.jpg

Andrew

andrewb70

03-26-2023, 09:12 AM

Yesterday Vic finished the opening for the Holley ProDash.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/03/26/GTOV3-846.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MnpmN)

The Vintage Air vents will be here tomorrow, courtesy of Summit Racing.

Andrew

ProTouring442

03-26-2023, 10:12 AM

On the third day of Christmas my true love brought to me...

https://j.hmjimg.com/2020/12/20/GTOV3-014.md.jpg (https://www.hostmyjunk.com/image/gldy7)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2020/12/20/GTOV3-015.md.jpg (https://www.hostmyjunk.com/image/glCte)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2020/12/20/GTOV3-016.md.jpg (https://www.hostmyjunk.com/image/glUKH)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2020/12/20/GTOV3-017.md.jpg (https://www.hostmyjunk.com/image/glIdR)

This is the Terminator X Max system that will replace the GMPP ECU and harness kit. Given that my business now is tuning Holley EFI systems, it makes sense that I run what I preach.

The Terminator X Max will allow me to retain the DBW and also allow me to implement things like PWM fan control, and any other feature that I want to implement.

I also plan to take my time with the wiring. The Holley harness is ok, but some of the more visible parts are not up to a super clean look. The plan is to make my own injector and coil harness. Making those sub harnesses more like a motorsport harness and fully heat shrinking and labeling them. Some of the sensor branches of the harness may also get the same heat shrink covering. I also plan to integrate the alternator L and S terminals into the main harness.

More to come!

Andrew

Why the Terminator X over the HP system (https://www.holley.com/products/fuel_systems/fuel_injection/hp_efi/ecu_and_harness_kits/parts/550-604N)

andrewb70

03-27-2023, 08:13 AM

Why the Terminator X over the HP system (https://www.holley.com/products/fuel_systems/fuel_injection/hp_efi/ecu_and_harness_kits/parts/550-604N)

You actually missed the update where I have a Dominator ECU now.

Andrew

Larry R

03-27-2023, 03:31 PM

Making progress!

andrewb70

04-06-2023, 09:30 AM

I am afraid that progress has slowed down a little. I am waiting on a local shop to get me in for the exhaust work and after that the car comes home.

In the meantime, the dash is done:

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/04/06/GTOV3-847.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/Mn6o5)

I may add a thin trim ring to the fuel level gauge, just to make it match the tach and speedo.

Andrew

andrewb70

04-07-2023, 06:26 AM

I forgot to mention, the little slot to the right of the steering column is getting one of these:

https://www.molex.com/molex/products/part-detail/io_connectors/0795405067

Andrew

ryeguy2006a

04-07-2023, 07:33 AM

Now that's cool! Will you be able to integrate that hub to your dominator? So all you'd need to do is plug the cable in there to make changes?

andrewb70

04-07-2023, 08:14 AM

Now that's cool! Will you be able to integrate that hub to your dominator? So all you'd need to do is plug the cable in there to make changes?

It has nothing to do with the Dominator USB port. This is just a charger. I suppose I can install a USB bulkhead connector for the Dominator USB cable, but that's probably overkill. The ECU lives in the glove box along with the cable.

Andrew

b17brian

04-09-2023, 07:03 PM

I forgot to mention, the little slot to the right of the steering column is getting one of these:

https://www.molex.com/molex/products/part-detail/io_connectors/0795405067

Andrew
How is that wired into the car? None of the supporting data shows the chord or how to wire it.

andrewb70

04-10-2023, 08:31 AM

How is that wired into the car? None of the supporting data shows the chord or how to wire it.

There is a connector:
https://www.molex.com/molex/products/part-detail/crimp_housings/0347910040

and you also need the terminals:
https://www.molex.com/molex/search/partSearch?pQuery=&sType=a&query=560023

Andrew

andrewb70

04-12-2023, 06:51 PM

I went over to Vic's today and did a bunch of little projects to get it ready for a move to Hotrod Express to do the exhaust system. I cleaned the underside as best as I could, installed the gas tank, tidied up any loose wires, and packed up all of the left over parts to take home.

While I was doing all that, Vic tipped up a trim ring for the fuel level gauge:

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/04/12/GTOV3-848.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MnaZU)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/04/12/GTOV3-849.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/MnRTN)

Some people had expressed a concern for a lack of trim ring, so there it is...

Andrew

thumper877

04-13-2023, 03:04 AM

Definitely looks better with the trim ring

OLDFLM

04-13-2023, 04:07 AM

Looks great! The material you covered the dash insert with is a nice touch too!

btmatt

04-13-2023, 06:41 AM

good work. I don't know if you have mentioned before, but are you adding a switch panel to arm various features managed by the ECU?

I am finishing up a similar drag/drive project and contemplating a switch panel to arm transbrake, bump, line lock, 2 step, ECU MAP, etc. Are you doing something similar or have suggestions from other tuning projects.

Thanks, Matt

andrewb70

04-13-2023, 07:22 AM

Definitely looks better with the trim ring

I think so too!

Looks great! The material you covered the dash insert with is a nice touch too!

It's the same vinyl that was used on the cover for the boost control solenoids.

good work. I don't know if you have mentioned before, but are you adding a switch panel to arm various features managed by the ECU?

I am finishing up a similar drag/drive project and contemplating a switch panel to arm transbrake, bump, line lock, 2 step, ECU MAP, etc. Are you doing something similar or have suggestions from other tuning projects.

Thanks, Matt

I am not adding any switches because I don't have a trans brake, or bump, or line lock...However, if you are interested in doing all that, it can certainly be done. Feel free to PM me and we can discuss it.

Andrew

andrewb70

04-14-2023, 12:34 PM

The GTO took a ride to Hotrod Express this morning to have the exhaust system built.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/04/14/GTOV3-850.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M6XgK)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/04/14/GTOV3-851.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/Mnyak)

To recap, the plan is to carry the single 4" from the downpipe, past the transmission crossmember. From there I have a Burns Stainless single 4" to dual 3" splitter, which then will feed into Dynomax UltraFlow Welded (PN 17547) large case mufflers and then tailpipes out the back with the OEM looking dual tips in the stock location. One of the 3" pipes will also have the exhaust valve installed before the muffler. This will allow me to effectively turn it into a single exhaust system for cruising on the highway. The exhaust valve will be controlled by the Holley Dominator ECU.

Andrew

Larry Callahan

04-14-2023, 01:21 PM

I need to install a thumbs up thingy on the site. LOL!

I can't wait to hear it.

andrewb70

04-14-2023, 06:30 PM

I need to install a thumbs up thingy on the site. LOL!

I can't wait to hear it.

Won't be for a while. There is zero wiring on the engine.

Andrew

andrewb70

04-20-2023, 07:47 AM

The GTO is at HotRod Express and they have been making some progress on the exhaust.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/04/20/GTOV3-852.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M6Kud)

The ends of the tailpipes will also be modified to bring the stock looking tips through the cutouts in the rear valance panel.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/04/20/GTOV3-853.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M6g7E)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/04/20/GTOV3-854.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M6M5o)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/04/20/GTOV3-855.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M6p1Z)

There are going to be some issues with the tailpipes, which we anticipated. The the RideTech coilover is making the tailpipe fitment a little tricky. At this point it is clear that the front corners of the gas tank will need to be notched.

Andrew

ryeguy2006a

04-25-2023, 05:29 AM

Looks like they are taking their time to do it right!

andrewb70

04-25-2023, 09:44 AM

Here are some more progress pictures from HotRod Express:

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/04/25/GTOV3-856.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M691D)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/04/25/GTOV3-857.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M657e)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/04/25/GTOV3-858.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M6EkR)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/04/25/GTOV3-859.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M6Fv7)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/04/25/GTOV3-860.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M60pH)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/04/25/GTOV3-861.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M6Q3h)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/04/25/GTOV3-862.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M6n5P)

Andrew

OLDFLM

04-25-2023, 09:53 AM

Dynomax Welded Series? What's the part number Andrew? Case length? They look pretty big, glad you can package them to fit the extra volume!

andrewb70

04-25-2023, 06:40 PM

Dynomax Welded Series? What's the part number Andrew? Case length? They look pretty big, glad you can package them to fit the extra volume!

Dynomax UltraFlow welded , PN 17547 (https://www.dynomax.com/ultra-flotm-welded-offset-offset-702.html).

They have a 20in case.

Andrew

andrewb70

04-26-2023, 06:16 PM

More progress is being made on the exhaust:

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/04/26/GTOV3-863.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M6YiG)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/04/26/GTOV3-864.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M6twU)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/04/26/GTOV3-865.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M6jNN)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/04/26/GTOV3-866.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M6AIw)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/04/26/GTOV3-867.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M66qm)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/04/26/GTOV3-868.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M6kpk)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/04/26/GTOV3-869.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M6d1a)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/04/26/GTOV3-870.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M6IjK)

Andrew

OLDFLM

04-27-2023, 03:52 AM

Is the idea with the cutout on one side to change the volume of the exhaust thereby changing the noise level? Closed going down just one side (less total volume) and therefore being louder?

andrewb70

04-27-2023, 08:39 AM

Is the idea with the cutout on one side to change the volume of the exhaust thereby changing the noise level? Closed going down just one side (less total volume) and therefore being louder?

That is the idea. I am not sure if it will be quite with single exhaust, but that is part of the experiment.

Andrew

OLDFLM

04-27-2023, 08:44 AM

I think the single would be louder than the dual exhaust as it would have less volume... How long until we find out?

andrewb70

04-27-2023, 01:06 PM

I think the single would be louder than the dual exhaust as it would have less volume... How long until we find out?

Months...

Andrew

andrewb70

04-28-2023, 12:56 PM

Josh at HotRod Express is doing a great job with this exhaust system.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/04/28/GTOV3-871.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M6C9c)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/04/28/GTOV3-872.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M6PNn)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/04/28/GTOV3-873.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M6U3t)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/04/28/GTOV3-874.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M6Tq8)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/04/28/GTOV3-875.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M6Wx3)

Andrew

andrewb70

05-01-2023, 07:53 AM

This morning I received more pictures of the exhaust from Friday. Looks like Josh is finish welding the exhaust...

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/01/GTOV3-876.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M6lBZ)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/01/GTOV3-877.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M6J8E)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/01/GTOV3-878.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M6Li5)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/01/GTOV3-879.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M68jT)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/01/GTOV3-880.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M612S)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/01/GTOV3-881.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M6a9d)

My friend Tom is coming for a visit for a few days on Wednesday and I hope the car can come home on Thursday or Friday.

Andrew

Larry R

05-01-2023, 02:52 PM

Looks great!

wfo guy

05-02-2023, 03:39 AM

The exhaust is real nice. The calculator in my head was having a runaway estimating the cost. :)

andrewb70

05-02-2023, 08:02 AM

Looks great!

Thanks Larry!

The exhaust is real nice. The calculator in my head was having a runaway estimating the cost. :)

I need an intercooler wallet...LOL

Here are some more progress pictures of the exhaust. It looks like Josh has finished with the exhaust welding and is working on the lower, front corners of the gas tank.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/02/GTOV3-882.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M7Xdp)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/02/GTOV3-883.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M6vPo)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/02/GTOV3-884JPG.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M6yNi)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/02/GTOV3-885.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M7GxY)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/02/GTOV3-886.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M7ZiR)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/02/GTOV3-887.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M7N27)

Andrew

OLDFLM

05-02-2023, 08:09 AM

Some black DEI header wrap may help hide the pipes from the axle back and help with heat near the tank... they also make that gold foil you could put on the 45*'s that he's cut out of the tank for clearance to reflect heat.

andrewb70

05-02-2023, 09:12 AM

Some black DEI header wrap may help hide the pipes from the axle back and help with heat near the tank... they also make that gold foil you could put on the 45*'s that he's cut out for clearance to reflect heat.

Good idea. I am actually thinking about wrapping the whole exhaust to the mufflers. I like the shiny tailpipes peaking out from the side. Josh said he will take a ScotchBrite pad to the tailpipes and give them a brushed finish.

Andrew

andrewb70

05-03-2023, 07:30 AM

The tank is getting finished. I like that he was able to keep the vents at the top front corners.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/03/GTOV3-888.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M7uDh)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/03/GTOV3-889.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M7S8e)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/03/GTOV3-890.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M7OtH)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/03/GTOV3-891.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M7hBD)

The tailpipes also got finished.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/03/GTOV3-892.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M73PP)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/03/GTOV3-894.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M7HOm)

Andrew

wfo guy

05-03-2023, 03:53 PM

That's too bad you had to cut the tank. Extra work is just that. :)

andrewb70

05-05-2023, 05:39 PM

The exhaust and the gas tank are done. Here are the final pictures:

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/05/GTOV3-895.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M7Ktk)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/05/GTOV3-896.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M7cdU)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/05/GTOV3-897.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M7VEN)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/05/GTOV3-898.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M7gyw)

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/05/GTOV3-899.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M72KG)

Rick from Hotrod Express also delivered the car to me this morning. Big thanks to my friend Tom, who came out to visit me. He helped to clean up and organize the garage so that I have a fighting chance of having the car drivable to LS Fest in September.

Andrew

andrewb70

05-07-2023, 08:54 AM

Now that the car is back, I felt the need to go out there and do something, even if it is something small. Keeping in mind that I will be doing a lot of wiring under the dash, a removable steering wheel hub seemed like a good idea. My friend Tom had a NRG steering wheel hub on his 70 GTO and I really liked it.

I started by removing the horn button and removing the Momo steering wheel from the Momo hub.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/07/GTOV3-900.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M7FO8)

Then I removed the nut that was holding the hub in place.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/07/GTOV3-901.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M7wDt)

I had to use a 3 jaw puller to get the hub off the steering shaft.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/07/GTOV3-902.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M7MJK)

This is the Momo adapter hub for a GM steering column. If anyone needs it, PM me.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/07/GTOV3-903.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M7xWc)

This is the new NRG hub. None of these parts came with any instructions. I am not exactly sure why the hub has a ground wire on it...

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/07/GTOV3-904.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M7rBa)

This is the hub that bolts to the steering wheel and snaps on the receiver that is bolted to the steering shaft.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/07/GTOV3-905.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M7mEn)

This is the finishd column with the receiver hub bolted to it.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/07/GTOV3-906.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M70s3)

To release the steering wheel from the column, the ring under the steering wheel is pulled back...

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/07/GTOV3-908.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M7DK5)

and the steering wheel comes off, along with the hub.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/07/GTOV3-907.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M75y4)

It will be a lot easier to work under the dash without the steering wheel in the way and it adds a small level of theft protection to the whole car.

Andrew

Larry Callahan

05-07-2023, 04:53 PM

Very nice. I have one of those in my Camaro. Have you considered the locking cover?

207416

ryeguy2006a

05-08-2023, 04:40 AM

Must be a great feeling to have the car back home again! So much work has been done while it was away.

dontlifttoshift

05-08-2023, 05:12 AM

Make sure the hub isn't dragging on the column bell, they usually do.

I also remove the safety pin in the quick release.

andrewb70

05-08-2023, 05:19 AM

Very nice. I have one of those in my Camaro. Have you considered the locking cover?

207416

Great tip Larry! Thanks.

Must be a great feeling to have the car back home again! So much work has been done while it was away.

It is exciting yet still daunting, because there is so much left to do before it starts.

Make sure the hub isn't dragging on the column bell, they usually do.

I also remove the safety pin in the quick release.

I was careful not to over tighten the hub, so there is no dragging against the column. Great tip!

Andrew

dontlifttoshift

05-08-2023, 08:10 AM

Leaving the hub loosish is an option, eventually it will just be loose. I typically take .060-.080 off the hub with the lathe. This isn't an NRG problem, it is an every aftermarket hub problem.

Way2qwk4u

05-10-2023, 06:50 AM

Yup. Love mine. Works great and moved the wheel closer and fit me better.

andrewb70

05-12-2023, 06:13 PM

With the car now in my home garage I am able to spend a hour or two here and there and knock out little projects. Just like the old saying about how one might eat an elephant...

This picture is at a little bit of an odd angle, but it shows the finished turbo drain. While the car was at Hotrod Express, I asked Josh to put a bead in the 5/8" stainless tube that we used to extend the drain pipe. There is also a little section of 5/8" oil safe rubber hose that goes from the tube to the oil drain on the side of the oil pan. I used Gates heat shrink clamps on the hose. The stainless tube also has a silicone/fiberglass fire shield over it.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/12/GTOV3-909.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M7nJT)

This picture is also at a bit of an odd angle, but it shows how the heater hoses come down from the water pump and under the up-pipe. There is fire sleeving over the top of the hose where it passes closest to the up-pipe.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/12/GTOV3-910.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M7QAS)

Here is the view from the top. Everything fits very closely together, but there is just enough room to turn fasteners and fittings. I also used the Gates heat shrink clamps on the heater hoses.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/12/GTOV3-911.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M7jQZ)

I took the intake off again so that I can clean everything and get it ready for Cerakote. Here I am mocking up the little silicone plugs that I will use to seal off machined and tapped holes.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/12/GTOV3-912.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M77HE)

She is looking more apart than before, but progress is being made.

https://j.hmjimg.com/2023/05/12/GTOV3-913.md.jpg (https://hostmyjunk.com/image/M7tWd)

Andrew