Anyone else sick of the cookie cutter Pro-touring cars these days?

[rdchandler]

My Car is one of the Camaro's in the sea, that said I love when some body builds "something different" and any time I see some classic car, all I think is, what would this be like as a Pro-Tour car? The Camaro's work well, everything has been well engineered and tested. For someone that does not have the resources to design engineer and test, its the easy way to go fast. More power to those who can build a BETTER (different) mouse trap! Many try, a lot "look cool" few perform.

[GNon18s]

You know the deal, Camaro, minitubs, DSE frame, Forgelines, LS3, etc. If I see one more catalog car Im going to puke.

You hit the nail on the head. How can you build a first gen camaro in a way that hasn't already been done 10+ times already?

[KnightMare]

Chose to restore my Camaro first because of simplicity, cost, and wealth of products made for the car. I love A-body's, I have 4 that I'll be doing next. Got to have something to drive first while I do the other ones

[TheJDMan]

I chose to build a 1st Gen Camaro 45 years ago when I purchased it as a 5 year old used Arizona car. I loved the first gen then and I love them now. But back in the 70's the technology simply did not exist to make them handle the way I wanted so I drag raced instead. Today, thanks to DSE, Forgeline, etc. I have put the drag strip in the past and dramatically expanded the overall capability of my 68 to the point it is actually FUN to drive. Having owned this car for 4 decades, what I really find exciting is that there are more parts available in the past 10 years than have been available for the previous 30.

As for cookie cutter, I think it depends on the context. In the PT world Camaros are plentiful, but in the real world PT Camaros are far from common. I can tell you that based on the attention my car attracts when I drive it on the street it is anything but cookie cutter.

[andrewb70]

I just glanced over in the Project Updates forum and only saw 1 or 2 first gen Camaro projects on the first page. Where are all these "cookie cutter" Camaros that you speak of?

Sure, Camaros are popular, but there is a really wide variety of cars being represented on this forum.

Andrew

[dontlifttoshift]

You know the deal, Camaro, minitubs, DSE frame, Forgelines, LS3, etc. If I see one more catalog car Im going to puke.

I would think that if one were to start a drama thread such as this, that the thread starter should be driving something a little less cookie cutter than a Camaro's red headed step brother with an LS engine.

[BuzzKillian]

Nope... not tired of Camaros. That being Said... Here is a wish list.
'70 Buick GS (Maybe a LS twin to my brother's 455)
'66-69 Chevelle and/or LeMans/GTO
'70-'72 Camaro and/or Firebird
Like Corn Husker said... I want them all... LOL

[icemanrd19]

hey i have all those mods ******* !!!!!!!!!


LOL jk

I really do have all of those mods bc i wanted the best of the best. Around here theres not alot of these type of builds. Maybe in SoCal or something but not here.

[alocker]

Are you ripping Camaros or tried and true parts that you can buy out of a catalog? I understand not everyone likes Camaros but how can you appreciate pro touring if you can't appreciate a built 69. As far as catalog parts go, I'm still amazed at the stuff you can bolt on to a car now and all it has done is make it easier for people to enjoy the hobby.

[srt1010]

I agree with STEVE HAYES, I loved the first gen then and I love them now. I wanted a 69 from the age of 14, but settled on a 72 monte when I turned 16. In 1999 I purchased my current 69. When I first built it, it was a weekend cruiser and bracket racer, caltracs, drag shocks, moroso super trick springs, etc. I knew nothing about pro-touring until approximately 5 years ago and figured, why not get a little more driveability out of it. Since then DSE parts, a TREMEC, better brakes etc. It's not a 6 figure build by any means, but I just got it back together after a year off the road with a new body resto, since the paint an body work were well over 20 years old. I am proud to say it's home built and I love every minute I spend in it, even if the wife bitches about the noise and fumes. I do however like all old cars, my dad has a 71 nova and we're currently building a 53 International L-110 pick-up, that's setting on an S-10 chassis.

[SDS MACHINING]

Plenty of guys building cars that dont fit into any " cookie cutter" I have ever seen. maybe your thinking this is a tuner forum.

[Todd in Vancouver]

Funny enough this is how I see the conversation going;

"So I've come into some money and I've always wanted a cool car. Can you help me?"

Car guy or supplier responds;
" yes we can do that, what is a cool car to you?"

Fact is most guys find Camaros to be a cool car, but let's just leave that alone for a minute

CG asks " want lots of power?" = LS will give the best of all worlds, power & drivability. so hard to argue that point
CG asks "want it to handle and drive well?" = "no I want to crash and ride like crap" so insert any of the suspension companies
CG asks "want big tires?" = what a stupid question

You can see where I'm going with this. Given the opportunity I bet 90% of the guys on here would be building this exact combination if they could.

Your honor I rest my case!

[Enzo Damico]

Well I see it this way.I am a new member here.I just bought my 69 camaro almost 100 percent done except the pro touring touch which I'm doing now.I think the opposite of you.To me cookie cutter is everything on the road now.In the past 2 years I have went through a Nissan GTR,Srt 8 jeep,mini cooper jcw and backdraft cobra. All brand new,I smile more at my camaro because it has it own personality to me.I Also kept the cobra ,to me it just art in the Garage

[dontlifttoshift]

Dude! Huge points for having a disco ball in your garage! #garage envy

[GeoffP]

I don't disagree that there are a lot of Camaros on this site, mine being one of them. I can't say they are cookie cutter though because each is unique in its own right. Just because they have mini-tubs and Forgeline wheels (among the other things you mentioned) doesn't make them cookie cutter. As someone else said, people tend to emulate what works and is successful at events. It just happens that Camaros tend to be at the top over the last couple of years. If you notice, this is starting to change as other late 60's to early 70's cars are starting to become more popular. Speed Tech's Nova is one of those cars - that car is just B-A-D. Having said this, am I going to sell my Camaro just because it's not completely unique or because someone thinks it's "pukey" - no, definitely not. My car has been in my family since the mid-80's and was a totaled wreck (that really wasn't that bad) which ended up in a guy's garage for about 10 years after the wreck. It's not perfect but it is mine and I enjoy it regularly and don't care what others think of the visible rust holes, scratches and even a few small dents. While yes there are people on here who have paid lots of money to have someone like DSE, Cris Gonzales, etc to build their car, there are those like me who've just owned theirs for a long time and built it the way they want over time. My point? There's no reason to go calling names or making derogatory comments just to stir up a thread or see if you can get a lot of comments in response. Let's all just got to our preferred events with the cars that we own and enjoy them. Isn't that what it's really all about???

Edit - found a couple typos and completed a thought that didn't make sense when reading it back

[garickman]

Dude! Huge points for having a disco ball in your garage! #garage envy

I second the cool factor of the disco ball.

[Enzo Damico]

Thanks,I do a lot of party for my kids.Im a disco light junky,I have lazers ,lights ,smoke machines.my neighbors think aliens have landed in my garage when light are shinning into the woods.

[ragz]

I have waited 10 years to start on building my " Cookie Cutter " Camaro. When i first got my 67 RS rag the options for pro tour (or what ever the term was then) were far different and much less affordable than they are now,so as i order all my parts from the classic ind catalog and my complete bolt in front to back tci suspension, as well as the 525hp connect and cruise ls3, i can only smile at what a cookie cutter can do now days and am very thankful to have a life long dream coming true.I also realize i could have bought a variety of vehicles to start, but there is always room for another fast, good handling camaro .Now i just got to get this cookie baked,can't wait!

[JMitch19]

I like all types of cars. I think if you are building a car that you plan to keep forever you should build whatever you want however you want it. Also if you have the funds to allow you to build whatever you want and you're not worried about resale value I say build whatever you like.

That being said last fall I sold one of those cookie cutter Camaros. I'm currently building another one of those cookie cutter Camaros. I enjoy building the cars and I might end up having more money in them than maybe I should. I'm not willing to take a big loss on a car if I need/want to sell the car. My 68 sold for a small profit. I know that is rare and you can't expect that to happen every time, but I think if you pick the right car and the right parts you can minimize losses.

I considered other platforms before I bought my 69 Camaro. I just couldn't find enough examples of Novas, 2nd gen Camaros, ect selling for good money. I just think the first gen Camaros are a better investment(if you can call it that) than a lot of other pro touring options. I'd say even among first gens the 69 brings a 15-20% premium everything else being the same. I know the original question wasn't about the resale value of a pro touring car, but I think for a lot of us who don't have unlimited budgets it is a big part of the reason we choose to build what we build.

[SRD art]

Ha! I added fuel to the fire to see where things would go and this has been a very entertaining thread! I've gotten several laughs out of it, keep it going!

Really I have nothing against Camaros, as I bet a lot of you don't. I think, at least for me, deep down I don't have one because of a little bit of envy. Flat out they are cool but they're more than I'd want to spend on a car, again the demand and supply thing. I particularly like early 2nd gen Camaros, again because they're not the popular car, and as I stated I tend to do what is unpopular. But if I had an opportunity to buy an inexpensive 69 truth is I'd be all over it because they are proven and their design is timeless. So instead I am a Nova owner, in particular I like the less popular (less expensive) 73/74 cars. If I can build my 74 the way I want to it'll be pretty killer, even amongst Camaros or whatever.



Geoff mentioned Speed Tech's Nova. I just recently interviewed with Speed Tech and will be joining their crew very soon. While I was there last week I saw Resurrexion in person. It is Bad. But so also is Jay's upcoming 2nd gen, Roger's 69 Red Zed and the 69 Camaro that is getting built in the shop.

Although I get sick of Camaros steeling the limelight from my maybe not so worthy cars, I agree with what has been mentioned, the key to a successful car is to design it in a way that it doesn't LOOK like it's brother, even if it has the same parts under it and then make it perform. The numbers don't lie. If Camaros make up the top 10 at the event, it's because what they and their drivers do, not what type of car it is. There I go trading sides again, lol.