pro-touring '68 firebird...on a budget

[68Formula]

But from the looks of how this thing is sitting these tires I have won't work. I think they'll rub the fender lip on a nice big bump. I think I'm returning them and getting the 215/40, or maybe I'll go with a 225/45, ahhhhhhhhhhhhh I don't know!!! this part is getting frustrating!!!!!!

Well we tried to warn you on the rim dimensions being a problem. Sometimes the "free" stuff ends up costing more and being a big headache when all is said and done.

Anyway, the front size to try next is the 225/55R16. Did you test the 245/50s for the back yet (with the correct rim offset, since the fronts and back are different on the IROC)?

[68firebird]

Well we tried to warn you on the rim dimensions being a problem. Sometimes the "free" stuff ends up costing more and being a big headache when all is said and done.

Anyway, the front size to try next is the 225/55R16. Did you test the 245/50s for the back yet (with the correct rim offset, since the fronts and back are different on the IROC)?

Yea, I know, don't rub it in, haha. I haven't given up all hope yet. When I typed the last post I was a bit aggravated. we'll see what happens this week. Just wish I had a full day to be able to work on it, I hate having to wait!

[68firebird]

ok, I put the subframe back on jackstands tonight and measured from the floor to the fender lip, and there still is a difference, so I'm thinking the old body mounts are the culprit. I really won't know until I put the global west solid mounts in, but I can't think of anything else that would cause it to measure differently on jackstands.

as for the tire situation, I'm thinking of putting the 245/50's in the rear and getting some 225/50's or 215/50's for the front.

[68400BIRD]

Were the control arm bolts torqued down after the car was on the ground?

[68firebird]

Were the control arm bolts torqued down after the car was on the ground?

The bottom ones were, but even with the subframe on jackstands the difference in meaurement is there. I have to do a bunch of measurements tonight, this is starting to piss me off!

[sr73bu]

Looking good man!.. really like the wheels... Despite the problems keep in mind how far its come from being a storage shelf a few months ago... you'll figure it out...

[68firebird]

Looking good man!.. really like the wheels... Despite the problems keep in mind how far its come from being a storage shelf a few months ago... you'll figure it out...

thanks, I'm definitely trying to stay positive, I just want to drive this thing soooooooooo bad!! walked around a cruise night for a bit last night and it only fueled the fire, lol.

started installing my global west solid body mounts last night, I'm hoping this will solve some of my issues with the body being slightly lower on the drivers side. some of the old bushings were so shot and squished that the bolts started unthreading with no effort at all. I was having a problem getting the drivers radiator support bushing out, so I just put the firewall one in and the one further back, loosely theaded the bolts in and I'll try and tackle it again tonight, hopefully get all the new mounts in tonight, but with the way things are going lately I'll probably run into some kind of problem.

One other change, The rims I'm using are from a 92 camaro, they are 16X8's front and back, but the front are 4.35 backspace and the rears are 5.00 backspace. after a bunch of research yesterday I decided to put the backs on the front and the fronts on the back. I think thats going to solve some issues too. now the lip of the rim in the front is actually inside the wheel well, not almost even with the lip, and it just clears the tie rod. instead of me having to run a big spacer in the rear (almost an inch or so on each side), now Its going to be a small one, if any at all. and I can use the 245/50's that I ordered in for the front, I'll just order some 225/50's for the front now.

[John Wright]

16X8's front and back, but the front are 4.35 backspace and the rears are 5.00 backspace.

Same thing when using IROC wheels on a second gen....fronts to the back and visa-versa due to the back spacing.

[68Formula]

i'll just order some 225/50's for the front now.

225/55r16

[68firebird]

225/55r16

Out of curiosity why do you say a 55 over a 50? I'm just a bit nervous cause the 245/50's I bought have an OD if 25.7 and that seemed really tight up in the well, and the 225/55 has a 25.9 OD. I know it's a bit narrower so it should clear the fender lip. Thanks for your help too.

[68Formula]

Out of curiosity why do you say a 55 over a 50? I'm just a bit nervous cause the 245/50's I bought have an OD if 25.7 and that seemed really tight up in the well, and the 225/55 has a 25.9 OD. I know it's a bit narrower so it should clear the fender lip. Thanks for your help too.

The 225/50 has a diameter of 24.9". It would give you more clearance from the top on your lowered car, but at the same time, it increases the gap from the front of wheel well to the tire and the back of the wheel well to tire.

I know it's sounds like a subtle difference, but aesthetically it will stand out and look odd (I've seen others). Keep in mind, the original tires F70x14s were supposedly 26.2", so the wheel wells were shaped to fit that size. So that's probably why even on a lowered car, the smaller diameter tire looks out of place.

Also keep in mind, since your car is lowered already, using the smaller diameter is going to bring your ground clearance down by half the diameter difference. So effectively you're losing .5" ground clearance between those two tire sizes.

Food for thought.

That being said, you still have to do what works. If it really looks like it's not going to fit, your choices are living with how it look (and the ground clearance it provides), or figuring a way to raise the height slightly.

One question, you mentioned the changing to solid mounts. Are you basing your clearance concern for that diameter with the old mounts or the new?

[dusterbd13]

i hope youve thought of this already, but ill make a suggestion. try going to some local tire shops. dig through their junk tire piles. find sizes you think might work. mount them, and try them. hell of a lot cheaper than guessing and not eing able to return the new ones once theyre mounted.

[68firebird]

The 225/50 has a diameter of 24.9". It would give you more clearance from the top on your lowered car, but at the same time, it increases the gap from the front of wheel well to the tire and the back of the wheel well to tire.

I know it's sounds like a subtle difference, but aesthetically it will stand out and look odd (I've seen others). Keep in mind, the original tires F70x14s were supposedly 26.2", so the wheel wells were shaped to fit that size. So that's probably why even on a lowered car, the smaller diameter tire looks out of place.

Also keep in mind, since your car is lowered already, using the smaller diameter is going to bring your ground clearance down by half the diameter difference. So effectively you're losing .5" ground clearance between those two tire sizes.

Food for thought.

That being said, you still have to do what works. If it really looks like it's not going to fit, your choices are living with how it look (and the ground clearance it provides), or figuring a way to raise the height slightly.

One question, you mentioned the changing to solid mounts. Are you basing your clearance concern for that diameter with the old mounts or the new?

yes I was basing it on the old mounts, i just thought about installing the new ones yesterday, I don't know why I didn't earlier. I've only installed the 2 back ones on the drivers side and I'm already measureing a difference in height, the old mounts were shot. plus after switching the rims around like I mentioned it looks like the new tire will fit nicely under the wheel well instead of hitting the lip. Like I said, I'm learning as I go, so I'm gonna pull some boners along the way, LOL. thank you so much for your patience and help

[John Wright]

Sweet....looks like you're getting closer. BTW, there aren't many of these old cars that sat completely level from sie to side...My car, even after all of the new suspension and body bushings sat 3/8" higher on one side.

[68firebird]

Ok, while installing the mounts I believe the welded nut under the drivers seat snapped (and of course I don't have the slightest idea of how to fix it) thats the last one that needed tightening of course, oh and there still is about a 3/4" difference in how it sits, now the gap between the door and fender was off on the bottom and of course I didn't realize it until AFTER I opened the door, which in turn scraped the paint from the edge on a couple spots. I'm taking a break from this thing for a while. After all the BS its givin me the last week I'm extremely low on patience and I'm ready to sell it.

[john5670]

I have felt the same way you have for a month now. After work 3 to 4 days a week I drive 60 miles oneway to help my dad finish the build we started 5 years ago. We also have had a few bumps along the way. We are currently finishing the wiring and a hot test wire slipped out of my hand and arced across our new wilwood chrome brake booster ruining the chrome in the areas it hit. Also chipped the paint on one of the doors during assembly. I feel like somedays I drive 120 miles to work on the car for 3 hours and get nothing done.

Car looks great..keep up the good work!

[Jim Nilsen]

Hang in there and give it a break for a few days and then get back to it. Everything you are are having happen comes with doing a car yourself. It happens to us all in some place or another. You will have better moments when it runs !!!!!!

I'll be wondering how you feel when you see all the hard work almost done and you wish you had it back if you sold it unfinshed.

Good luck

[ModernMuseum]

Hehe, don't sell it mange. One time I spent about three hours trying to get a bolt in my convertible top on the 69 because I didn't have anyone to help me. I was holding up half the weight of the top while fully extending my arm trying to get it in. I finally gave up and end up getting it in the next day.

[George Manont]

Ok, while installing the mounts I believe the welded nut under the drivers seat snapped (and of course I don't have the slightest idea of how to fix it) thats the last one that needed tightening of course, oh and there still is about a 3/4" difference in how it sits, now the gap between the door and fender was off on the bottom and of course I didn't realize it until AFTER I opened the door, which in turn scraped the paint from the edge on a couple spots. I'm taking a break from this thing for a while. After all the BS its givin me the last week I'm extremely low on patience and I'm ready to sell it.

Hi '68Bird,

I found the same unlevel on my ride too. I didn't want to spend anything...and didn't want to scratch my head , so I swapped the spring L to R / R to L ... it worked.

But your knuckles may complain a bit though !


Cheers,


GM



.

[68firebird]

Hi '68Bird,

I found the same unlevel on my ride too. I didn't want to spend anything...and didn't want to scratch my head , so I swapped the spring L to R / R to L ... it worked.

But your knuckles may complain a bit though !


Cheers,


GM



.

Thanks GM, I was thinking of swapping the springs but was unsure if it really was going to make a difference. since it worked for you I guess I'll give that a try after my little break.

thanks for the votes of confidence guys. I have very little patience to begin with and when stuff just goes wrong more than I'd like I get like that. I'll hop back on this after a little break, maybe this weekend.

Ok guys, Please let me know what I'm in for with the nut for the body mount. its the one under the drivers seat. Is it a real pain in the ass to fix? If it requires welding I'm kinda screwed since I never welded in my life. Guess my first step would be to get the gap between the fender and the door correct so I don't keep messing the paint up, LOL. I wish I had some of you guys skills.