Pics/vids from Streets of Willow

[CarlC]

The pump problem is also related to engine speed. The higher, and more sustained, the engine/pump RPM the greater the problems. Your bad-boy nailhead does not make a lot of engine speed. If you step up later on to the LS1 it will become a whole different deal.



Yep, I too, along with David's help, have been using the pics to evaluate suspension problems. Mine needs more spring for the track, but it's fine for the steet. Even with the new tires with a much siffer sidewall, there is too much body roll and excessive outside tire wear. The car, in the pics, has over 2* static negative camber. THANKS JON!

A 1:38, with steering and engine problems? That's great. With any luck Lee's will get the pump done sooner. You can still plumb everything since the routing will be the same either way.

[JonB69FB]

I ordered all the lines/fittings, but some of the fittings and the cooler I'm going to be using are backordered until early December.

If any of you guys are planning on going to the California Speedway event I'll consider driving up there even if the car isn't done to take pictures/video and offer my tire temperature taking services.

[Salt Racer]

...Katz, I agree with Carl, a 1:43 for your first time out is really good. And it looks like I managed to pull out a 1:38 lap, so that's something, I suppose.

On the camber: I only took tire temps once, but they were fairly even across the front tires (within 5 deg spread all the way across). I really need to start taking tire pressures and temperatures consistently (and writing them down) every time I get off the track but I always manage to forget. You're welcome on the pictures--I'm really pleased with how they turned out.

Thanks Jon. 1:38 w/ intermittent PS is pretty damn good too. Sorry to hear that your parts were backordered. I know the frustration...

I was told by a BFG tire engineer that typical modern tires generate max. lateral acceleration when they are at -1~2*. Perhaps he was speaking of street radials.

I agree. Keeping track of tire temp/pressure would be invaluable.

The pump problem is also related to engine speed. The higher, and more sustained, the engine/pump RPM the greater the problems. Your bad-boy nailhead does not make a lot of engine speed. If you step up later on to the LS1 it will become a whole different deal.

Yep, I too, along with David's help, have been using the pics to evaluate suspension problems. Mine needs more spring for the track, but it's fine for the steet. Even with the new tires with a much siffer sidewall, there is too much body roll and excessive outside tire wear. The car, in the pics, has over 2* static negative camber...

Good point! I don't have a tach, but I think my Nailhead is done by 4500rpm. It's a shame Buick choked up these motors with tiny valves. 425s have huge 4.313" bore and stroke that is barely longer than Chevy 350. I suppose I can switch to a pump with slightly lower pressure/flow rate and use bigger pulley (along with a cooler, of course) when I do high-revving motor.

I measured body roll angle of my car from the skidpad pic. Roughly 3.6* on CW and 3.3* on CCW. It's a bit more than I want, espacially with non-sticky tires. My car is the same way - current spring rate is good on street, but it needs more roll resistance. I normally take stiff spring/soft sta bar approach, but I'll try the opposite on this car. RC will also be raised from 1.6" to 3.0" when I fit 18x9.5s on. Local bone yard has a bunch of '63-'65 Rivs, so I'll get a pair of good spindles and relocated ball joints for rim clearance and better geometry (kinda like what Kyle Tucker did).

[spanky the wondermuffin]

there are many sources for the ps pump you need.canton sells the one i use with a nice pulley.a sweet pump is the big name in racing pump.they are everywhere-stock car products,port city,coleman.any of the usual sources.cvproducts makes a special low drag unit that i'd use if i didn't have a sweet.krc is another big name in ps pumps.keep a log with all that data!i log all tire and brake temps along with pressure and any setup changes.katz-i bet you placed near the top broken down by pound of car per inch of tread!i'll come up to p.i.r.i have nothing on my calender for first half of may,all of june,and september-november.i'm making a few changes now towards my goal of 185mph this year.mostly more roll cage bracing and bars and i'm thinking belly pan.and a hans!

[Salt Racer]

....katz-i bet you placed near the top broken down by pound of car per inch of tread!i'll come up to p.i.r.i have nothing on my calender for first half of may,all of june,and september-november.i'm making a few changes now towards my goal of 185mph this year.mostly more roll cage bracing and bars and i'm thinking belly pan.and a hans!

Yeah, you're probably right. My tires aren't much wider than OE tires on WRX, S2000, etc.

I thought I'd have to go through VERY expensive driving school before I do lapping at PR and PIR. If not, please let me know. I'll be there when you come out. Otherwise, I'll probably see you at Thunderhill next year.

Now speaking of open road racing, I'll probably see you in NV sometime within next couple of years. The main purpose of my trip down to CA was to help my friend build his '46 Hudson P/U. The builder (a great engine builder/developer, but not so much of a fabricator) had a tough time locating cab and bed on AME chassis, so I went down to his shop and built body mounts. Pic is attached below. It has AME C5 IFS modified for high speed runs (more caster, longer FVSA) and 4-link with wishbone located as low as possible. Initially we'll run 632ci Chevy, but he also has a Rodeck TT SBC for an alternative motor. We'll try to go 200+ at B'ville Speed Week next year, dial in suspension and then hit the Nevada highway!

[JonB69FB]

I was told by a BFG tire engineer that typical modern tires generate max. lateral acceleration when they are at -1~2*. Perhaps he was speaking of street radials.

I agree. Keeping track of tire temp/pressure would be invaluable.

Kumho actually recommends over 2deg negative camber for the tires I'm running. The most I can get on the driver's side at the current ride height (without swapping a-arm studs) is the 1.75 that I ran at this event.

It's entirely possible that as I went faster on track the car rolled over more and the tire temps changed. There's just so much going on that I'm usually lucky if I can remember where the turns are on-track and keep enough gas in the car, much less remember to make my final lap fast enough to keep temperature in the tires, get off track quickly, and get the temps taken/written down.

[Salt Racer]

...There's just so much going on that I'm usually lucky if I can remember where the turns are on-track and keep enough gas in the car, much less remember to make my final lap fast enough to keep temperature in the tires, get off track quickly, and get the temps taken/written down.

I can imagine that, with hp your car has. Maybe it's a good thing my car is slow. Gives me more time to think/correct line between corners

[CarlC]

Jon,

Next time, bring the tire temp gauge and we'll do some tuning together.

Spanky,

We're talking P-pump, not the TC style pump.

[JonB69FB]

Will do Carl.

I found the source of the oil smoke tonight. The #5 intake runner has a pit that's apparently open to the bottom of the head. I built a little fixture out of a plate of aluminum and an air adapter so I could pressurize the intake ports, and sure enough, cylinder #5 (the only cylinder that showed oil on the plug) was leaking. Pulled the valley pan off and I could feel the air leaking out on the underside of the head.

I haven't decided how I'm going to fix it yet. I'll pull the head off tomorrow and see if I can get to the back side of the porosity to plug it with some epoxy or something.

[JonB69FB]

In case anyone is interested here's a picture of the pit that was causing all the blue smoke:



Not much is it?

Oh, and here's a picture of my quick-n-dirty pressurizing fixture. It's ugly, but it works:

[Jagarang]

I had no idea that such a tiny thing could be such a pain in the assl! The car sounded great during the videos.
What kind of motor are you using John? 690 HP is sick!

[JonB69FB]

It's a 486cid Pontiac motor. The only stock parts are the block (which is a 1965 421 block) and the front cover. The car was in a High Performance Pontiac shootout back in May and they did a complete rundown of the combination--here's a link to the article:

http://www.firebirdofdoom.com/hpp_big.jpg

[spanky the wondermuffin]

i'm pretty sure p.i.r. has club racing.there must be a track closer to you (katz) than t'hill.if you add up track time,tires,fuel(both there and to-and-from)and wear and tear i wonder if lessons (using a school's equipment) aren't a better deal.hope to see you,and anyone else,in nevada.i'm sniffing around on the salt flat sites a bit now.i'm thinking of try to get 200mph.only 37 mph to go.i think the last 40 mph may be a bit harder to do than the first 40.i'll see how i do next year.to make a 200 mph attempt in open road racing i'll need to be able to average 170mph for the length of the course before being given permission.after proving i can average 150,then160.what is the qualifing procces like on the salt?do they just let a guy no one knows show up and run 200 mph?

[Steve Chryssos]

This is just the best thread ever. Thanks Jon for supplying the pix. It's good to see the attitude of each car under cornering loads. Glad you had a good time. I can't wait to move out west.

[Salt Racer]

i'm pretty sure p.i.r. has club racing.there must be a track closer to you (katz) than t'hill.if you add up track time,tires,fuel(both there and to-and-from)and wear and tear i wonder if lessons (using a school's equipment) aren't a better deal.hope to see you,and anyone else,in nevada.i'm sniffing around on the salt flat sites a bit now.i'm thinking of try to get 200mph.only 37 mph to go.i think the last 40 mph may be a bit harder to do than the first 40.i'll see how i do next year.to make a 200 mph attempt in open road racing i'll need to be able to average 170mph for the length of the course before being given permission.after proving i can average 150,then160.what is the qualifing procces like on the salt?do they just let a guy no one knows show up and run 200 mph?

Jon,
PR would be the closest track to me, but the concrete walls scare me. PIR is the next closest, and there's Spokane Raceways about 200 miles from my place. Spokane has a lot of room to spin out, and they'll let you run if you've been through regitimate Hi-perf driving school (which I just did) so I'll try there next spring for sure. I suppose I could look for club racing at PIR too. I mentioned Thunderhill b/c I want to try the track anyway, and I liked SV event a lot. Very relaxed yet well organized, and they made me feel really welcomed despite my goofy choice of vehicle. Besides, I gotta go South at least once a year for Carl's Jr.'s Six-dollar burger (Guacamole Bacon kind - Mmmmmm ) I've never seen Carl's Jr. north of Salem.

As far as B'ville is concerned, There are three major events each year - Speed Week in mid-August, World of Speed in Sept, and World Finals in Oct. Speed Week runs from Sat. to the following Friday, but the event is getting really big lately. You won't be able to make a lot of passes until Wednesday or so and lodging would be tough unless you want to camp out, but it'll give you lots of time to tinker with your setup. The other two events are 3~4-day deal, and there's a greater chance of cancellation due to desert weather in Wendover.

Tech is pretty strict, but I don't think your car will have a problem. Go to www.scta-bni.org and get SCTA rule book. It's about $7. USFRA (the event organizer for World of Speed) also goes by with SCTA tech rules. I'll probably be one of SCTA tech inspecters for next year's Speed Week, so if you show up at Speed Week, look for an asian guy with a tattoo of raven on left shoulder. That would be me.

Once your car passes tech, you have to make a couple of licensing passes on the short course. I think it goes like 125~149mph for D, 150~174mph for C, 175~199mph for B, 200~249mph for A, and 250+mph for AA. Once you get B license, you can run 200mph. Your car must be capable of hitting 175mph at 2.25 miles to be able to run on the long course. Bring some skinny tires for the salt - it'll make the car more stable. IIRC, they'll let you run a little over 200mph w/ drag race front runners on all four corners.

You can also run at El Mirage. SCTA runs a bunch of events through out the year at the dry lake. Course is shorter than B'ville and the car gets really dusty, but it maybe a little closer to you.

Check out the forum at www.landracing.com sometime. A couple of SCTA officials hang out there, so they'll be able to answer tech questions, etc.

[CarlC]

Jon, it's not the mountain that wears you down, it the grain of sand in your shoe.

Is there enough access to the back of the port to allow welding? Even if you had to do it from the inside I doubt you would lose much power. If not some epoxy should do the trick but it's got to be clean. I hate doing jobs twice.

Katz, did you try In-and-Out while you were here? There's nothing quite like a #1 Animal Style.

Steve, get out here. We need more guys for track days!

[Salt Racer]

I'm not much of an engine guy so I didn't make any suggestion, but I'd weld the pore in if possible. Epoxy works, but like Carl said, the metal must be super clean for it to stick.

I've been to In-and-Out a couple of times, but didn't see Animal style on menu. Do I just tell them I want my burger Animal style? Gotta try that next time.

Last but certainly not the least...I totally agree - we need more guys for track days! If my 4300-lb Riviera with 235s/245s can handle a road course, your Camaro or Chevelle with 245s/275s certainly can!! Doesn't matter if you pull good lap time or not, as long as you enjoy doing it.

[Rant]That's what PT is all about - modifying your car and using its full potential, and street isn't the place to do it. IMO, guys who show up at tracks in mildly modded cars are more PT'ing than people who have aftermarket subframes and 315s just for bragging right and cruise around on street. They may have PT cars, but they ain't real PT'ers in my book.[/Rant]

[CarlC]

If this isn't cool, I don't know what is:



I agree with Katz. Let's go to the track.

[Salt Racer]

Boy, that dork in the pic really makes my car stand out!

Thanks for the pic, Carl. It's a keeper.

[CarlC]

Katz,

If you want the high-res version shoot me an email.

Yep, just ask for Animal Style. You get grilled onions, pickles, and mustard grilled beef. I'm friggin' hungry now!

http://www.in-n-out.com/