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    1. #1
      Join Date
      Feb 2020
      Location
      Las Vegas
      Posts
      9
      Country Flag: United States

      Speedtech vs RideTech vs ??? front suspension 68 Camaro

      Hi everybody!

      I am currently building a pro-touring inspired 68 Camaro. I have installed Speedtech torque arm rear torque arm suspension and am now deciding on the front. The plan is to run wider than a 245 front tire (275 would be the goal) to go along with 315 to 325 rears. Truthfully, I doubt this car will ever see an autocross track, but may actually hit a drag strip on rare occasions. The drivetrain is a 5.3 turbo with a 4l80e, Quick Performance fully built 9" with 3:25 gears.

      The options on the table at this point are:
      • Option #1. Speedtech Pro Touring subframe - $5500 plus powdercoating, steering column, spindles unless i reuse mine, steering connection set, motor mounts, etc. Probably going to total $8000 or so. This setup was suggested to me by Blake at Speedtech. Pluses include: new rack and pinion steering, allegedly clears 275 front tire with stock inner wheel wells, "bling" factor of a new subframe, should handle very well, mostly complete kit. Downside is it is still expensive, but is not as good as their Extreme subframe, not as good of a r&p than the Extreme. I don't really want to pull the engine, trans, bend new brake lines, just more work in general than bolt ons. ST surprisingly did not recommend the Extreme subframe to me (even tho it will clear a 315 front tire) because it requires their fiberglass inner fenders ($899) that could experience melt down with the turbo, exhaust, etc.
      • Option #2. Speedtech Road Assault with Chicane coilover setup. ~$2500. Pluses: easier to install than a subframe, should handle much better than stock. Negatives: will not clear a 275 tire, i would need to buy a new steering box (~$600+) since mine is the original and due for replacement anyway. Will the Truturn setup work with the Road Assault to clear a 275 tire?
      • Option #3. ridetech front coilover setup and Truturn. Not sure on price of front-only coilover/arm setup, but guessing around $2k, plus the $1100 for the Truturn and spindles. Would still need a new steering box. Again, easier to install than a subframe, better handling than stock, etc. I suppose I would kind of prefer to keep suspension brands the same front-to-back, but not THAT important to me.
      • Option #4. Speedtech Extreme subframe. Simply the best, but most expensive, clears 315 front tire. Guessing full package would set me back around $12k.
      • Option #5. ???? Open to suggestions.


      Again, this will not be a track car but want it to have the look. Looking over suspensiongeek's website I found another option That may be the best compromise, but I haven't seen any builds or reviews of the No Limit Sniper subframe: https://749c393e-eabf-4541-8176-f848...camarofirebird

      Thanks for any input you guys give

      Edit: I should mention, Speedtech recommended to NOT go with Truturn because is spaces the front tires out. (?) I hadn't heard that before. Maybe it was just a sales ploy on their part?

    2. #2
      Join Date
      Oct 2018
      Location
      San Jose, CA
      Posts
      523
      and then there is also DSE to consider...

      I would probably go with ST to match front to back unless you have some good reasons not to.

      I don't have experience with either suspension set-up, but I am strongly considering the rear torque arm you have installed.
      How do you like that so far?

      I like the idea of the tru-turn, but I'm not convinced it's really the best approach. I think with a first gen I would replace the entire subframe.
      With a second gen like mine the stock frame vs. aftermarket frame isn't that much difference.
      1971 Camaro - 406 / T56
      2016 Camaro SS convertible
      2018 Colorado 4x4

    3. #3
      Join Date
      Feb 2020
      Location
      Las Vegas
      Posts
      9
      Country Flag: United States
      Quote Originally Posted by c4racer2 View Post


      I don't have experience with either suspension set-up, but I am strongly considering the rear torque arm you have installed.
      How do you like that so far?
      Well, it looks nice! My car has a long way to go before it will be driven, unfortunately.

    4. #4
      Join Date
      Feb 2013
      Posts
      1,308
      Country Flag: United States
      Quote Originally Posted by 67baja View Post
      Edit: I should mention, Speedtech recommended to NOT go with Truturn because is spaces the front tires out. (?) I hadn't heard that before. Maybe it was just a sales ploy on their part?
      The TruTurn doesn't change the track width at all. The only thing that can change the track width from factory would be if the brakes you choose push it out more.


      Ridetech Suspsension
      Tech Specialist
      Phone: 812.481.4734

      Project Fox
      1979 Trans Am

    5. #5
      Join Date
      Aug 2015
      Location
      charlotte
      Posts
      883
      Country Flag: United States
      I vote the ST PT subframe for the following reasons.

      1. I have one(this means nothing)
      2. you already have the matching torque arm.
      3. you can reuse your current spindles, even if only temporary.
      4. 275's will fit easily with correct backspacing
      5. It's lighter than the stock frame

      Also, get it powdercoated yourself to save $$. And It shouldn't cost $8000 because that's about what I paid and that was before they slashed it's price to make way for the extreme package.

    6. #6
      Join Date
      Nov 2006
      Location
      Mountain Springs, Texas
      Posts
      3,885
      Country Flag: United States
      The only downside of the ST pro-touring subframe is the Unisteer rack. Reliability is not the best and unisteer won’t stand behind them.

      Don
      1969 Camaro - LSA 6L90E AME sub/IRS
      1957 Buick Estate Wagon
      1959 El Camino - Ironworks frame
      1956 Cameo - full C5 suspension/drivetrain

    7. #7
      Join Date
      Feb 2020
      Location
      Las Vegas
      Posts
      9
      Country Flag: United States
      Thanks for input, guys. One question: Is the Nova and Gen 1 Camaro the exact same subframe?

    8. #8
      Join Date
      Oct 2004
      Posts
      2,445
      Country Flag: United States
      Quote Originally Posted by 67baja View Post
      Thanks for input, guys. One question: Is the Nova and Gen 1 Camaro the exact same subframe?
      GEN 3 Nova? Yes. Why?
      Red Forman: "The Mustang's front end is problematic; get yourself a Firebird."

    9. #9
      Join Date
      Feb 2020
      Location
      Las Vegas
      Posts
      9
      Country Flag: United States
      Would you believe I don't want to say it on the forum? Lol

      Sending you a pm to explain.

    10. #10
      Join Date
      Nov 2006
      Location
      Mountain Springs, Texas
      Posts
      3,885
      Country Flag: United States
      I thought there were some differences in the bumper bracket holes and possibly position of the core support hole.

      Lots of info here:

      https://www.camaros.net/search/66443...me&o=relevance

      Don
      1969 Camaro - LSA 6L90E AME sub/IRS
      1957 Buick Estate Wagon
      1959 El Camino - Ironworks frame
      1956 Cameo - full C5 suspension/drivetrain

    11. #11
      Join Date
      Oct 2004
      Posts
      2,445
      Country Flag: United States
      Quote Originally Posted by dhutton View Post
      I thought there were some differences in the bumper bracket holes and possibly position of the core support hole.

      Lots of info here:

      https://www.camaros.net/search/66443...me&o=relevance

      Don
      Plenty of people have swapped them. I did see where AMD lists a replacement separate for
      • 1967 Camaro/Firebird
      • 1968 Camaro/Firebird
      • 1969 Camaro/Firebird & '69-72 Novas


      Many aftermarket (DSE and others) sell the same part number for Novas/Camaros/Firebirds. My guess is what ever changes if necessary to adapt for differences in bumper bracket holes, they are able to combining them, so they are universally compatible. Kind of like if you look at original A-arm differences between 1967, 1968, and 1969 because of bumpstop placement, the GM service part that came out later allows use in all three years.
      Red Forman: "The Mustang's front end is problematic; get yourself a Firebird."

    12. #12
      Join Date
      Nov 2006
      Location
      Mountain Springs, Texas
      Posts
      3,885
      Country Flag: United States
      OP asked if they were the exact same subframe. They are not afaik. Can they be swapped, yes they can.

      Don
      1969 Camaro - LSA 6L90E AME sub/IRS
      1957 Buick Estate Wagon
      1959 El Camino - Ironworks frame
      1956 Cameo - full C5 suspension/drivetrain

    13. #13
      Join Date
      Nov 2010
      Location
      Ventura County CA
      Posts
      456
      If this is not a track car and you just want to have the look, you don't need any of this. You can use stock suspension with lowering springs to get the "look". The purpose of these aftermarket subframes and suspension components is to improve performance. Typically the more you spend the more competitive you can be at autocross or track events, and you will also see performance benefits on the street or carving canyons. But if you're primarily cruising and just want a comfortable feel and stance, you don't have to dump all your money into aftermarket suspension. Obviously it's up to you to determine your personal needs and where you want to take your car. For sure aftermarket setups offer huge advantages - weigh the pros and cons and be honest with yourself about what you need.

      I offered some thoughts on the stock-frame suspension upgrade path in the following thread:
      https://www.pro-touring.com/threads/...deas?p=1327909

      I do plan to eventually upgrade to an aftermarket frame/geometry, because I love autocross and want to be more competitive, but my current stock-frame suspension is great for street driving and suits my 90% of my wants and desires, leaving budget for other items of comfort, safety, and convenience not to mention other hobbies and financial pulls from life. I reserve my right to change my mind when I put an aftermarket frame under my car!

      Also be sure to include some other great options in your list like DSE, TCI, Art Morrison etc. If you are at that level of spend, you owe it to yourself to weigh all the options and identify the tradeoffs for each. One thing is for sure - there are no right answers. There are better answers and there are a lot of answers that are similar
      Clint - '70 Nova home-built "restomod"

    14. #14
      Join Date
      Apr 2007
      Location
      Aurora, CO
      Posts
      390
      Country Flag: United States
      The '69 Camaro and 69-72 Nova subframes should be identical. My daughter has a '74 Nova that we put my modified '69 Camaro subframe into. The only difference we found with them sitting side by side was a hole for the brake line under the master cylinder. Just make sure you don't throw away the spacers for the body mounts at the firewall for the Nova if you find a car to take the subframe from. Those spacers are hard to find. You don't need the spacers for the Camaro.
      Matt H.

    15. #15
      Join Date
      Sep 2017
      Posts
      471
      Country Flag: United States
      I agree with slimjim above.
      Al his reasons. Yes I have one.
      Yes it matches my torque arm.
      Yes it fits a 275
      Yes itslighter than stock.
      Yes it costs more than an upgraded stock sub. Yes you CAN tell the difference in performing feel. ( Haven't driven mine yet but rode in one that had it)
      Don is correct on unisteer racks. Not the greatest.
      All over again I'd go extreme if I had the cash not because I need it but because it's badass.
      That said the der pro touring sub is badass compared to stock.
      Speedtech quality is great. Fit was great. And it's looks kickin in the car
      TANKMASTERJ

    16. #16
      Join Date
      Aug 2006
      Posts
      377
      Country Flag: Qatar
      I have Speedtech protouring subframe with their torque arm. Mine is the older design compared to their new subframe, which you get more ground clearance with 3” exhaust. The worst thing is the unisteer rack and pinion. It is junk. They leak and I am still struggling to sort out the binding issue on the unisteer shaft. Yesterday, missed with the u joints phasing and followed their instructions (90 degrees phasing). Still binding 😡
      72 Camaro RS:SOLD
      68 Camaro:
      LS6 Engine,Tremec TKO 600,5 Speed
      Complete Speedtech Subframe Kit,Speedtech Torque Arm, 9" Rearend from Strange, Wilwood Brakes, Minitubbed, Hotchkis Subframe Connectors

    17. #17
      Join Date
      Feb 2020
      Location
      Las Vegas
      Posts
      9
      Country Flag: United States
      Okay, so how bad is the Unisteer rack? Are there a few people who have problems with them, or does every owner have problems?

    18. #18
      Join Date
      Nov 2006
      Location
      Mountain Springs, Texas
      Posts
      3,885
      Country Flag: United States
      Quote Originally Posted by 67baja View Post
      Okay, so how bad is the Unisteer rack? Are there a few people who have problems with them, or does every owner have problems?
      Quite a few problems with them and Unisteer won’t stand behind them.

      Don
      1969 Camaro - LSA 6L90E AME sub/IRS
      1957 Buick Estate Wagon
      1959 El Camino - Ironworks frame
      1956 Cameo - full C5 suspension/drivetrain

    19. #19
      Join Date
      Jul 2018
      Posts
      303
      Quote Originally Posted by dhutton View Post
      Quite a few problems with them and Unisteer won’t stand behind them.

      Don
      So, what are some of the better options for a good subframe setup?

    20. #20
      Join Date
      Nov 2006
      Location
      Mountain Springs, Texas
      Posts
      3,885
      Country Flag: United States
      DSE, Art Morrison, Speedtech Extreme to name a few. Speedtech Protouring subframe is a very old rear steer design. So many better options out there.

      I love the ride of my Art Morrison with the C6 arms with factory bushings and C6 spindles but they don’t use them anymore. No idea what bushings are in their new arms. Bushings are important if you care about ride quality imho. Decent progressive rate bumpstops too.



      I would never buy a subframe that uses heim joints. Ride quality sucks imho…

      Don
      1969 Camaro - LSA 6L90E AME sub/IRS
      1957 Buick Estate Wagon
      1959 El Camino - Ironworks frame
      1956 Cameo - full C5 suspension/drivetrain


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