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    Thread: E-crate engines

    1. #1
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      Feb 2013
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      E-crate engines

      It's coming:
      https://www.roadandtrack.com/car-cul...c-crate-motor/



    2. #2
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      Feb 2013
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      Yeah... I just can't get on board with that...


      Ridetech Suspsension
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    3. #3
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      " $60,000 for the parts alone..." LOL

      Andrew
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    4. #4
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      GMs hinted at similar options. When these take-off, ICE of the past will be a joke.

    5. #5
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      The copo gm had at sema a few years ago was electric with a th400, wasn't it?
      Scott from NJ.

      Vent Windows Forever! ... My junk, featuring the Red Dragon ... NastyZ28 ... NJ Camaros & Firebirds

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    6. #6
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      Yes the first one is expensive like anything else. My daily driver is electric and I can't justify buying another gas burner for every day use.

      At some point, probably after we're dead a while, gasoline will be a novelty item that powers museum pieces and relics for the wealthy.

    7. #7
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      Quote Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
      Yeah... I just can't get on board with that...
      I can totally get on board with it, once the recharge time problem is solved. As long as it takes longer to charge it than it takes to use it, I have zero interest in an electric drivetrain. Once they do though... folks have been building electric cars hitting low 7 seconds in the quarter mile.

    8. #8
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      Strictly out of wanting to know your perception of this, what do you see as an acceptable recharge time? I plug in to 220 every night when I get home to be topped off in the morning. At 30 minutes for a supercharger station, yeah that's an inconvenience for driving cross country, which I don't do in this car.

      When people ask me how often I have to charge my car, like visiting my outlet in the garage is an extra trip, I'm always surprised and usually rephrase the mileage question to time in the car. With an i3 like mine, it's a little over 2.5 hours before I use the range extender. Most months I just run the engine for 15 minutes to keep it lubricated.

      Quote Originally Posted by Vimes View Post
      I can totally get on board with it, once the recharge time problem is solved. As long as it takes longer to charge it than it takes to use it, I have zero interest in an electric drivetrain. Once they do though... folks have been building electric cars hitting low 7 seconds in the quarter mile.

    9. #9
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      Quote Originally Posted by JustJohn View Post
      Y....

      At some point, probably after we're dead a while, gasoline will be a novelty item that powers museum pieces and relics for the wealthy.
      I actually agree with this completely. I fact, I fully understand how an electric only drivetrain is vastly superior to internal combustion engines. Once the battery technology catches up, there is zero reason to have internal combustion powered cars.

      I have actually been thinking about doing an EV conversion on an older VW bug. My wife likes those cars a lot and it would be a fun project. EV West offers kits already, but I am waiting for the Tesla motor powered VW kits.

      Andrew
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    10. #10
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      I think it's a cool idea and would even attempt to build one some day, once prices come down and battery technology advances.

      I remember when Chevrolet introduced the ECOPO concept and they talked about a crate kit to fit in your older car, but that seems to have fallen by the wayside. There's been no talk of it at all, they even sold the ECOPO!

    11. #11
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    12. #12
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      You could probably package the i3 driveline a lot easier. It's closer to the right size car and probably more readily (cheaply) available.

      Quote Originally Posted by andrewb70 View Post
      I actually agree with this completely. I fact, I fully understand how an electric only drivetrain is vastly superior to internal combustion engines. Once the battery technology catches up, there is zero reason to have internal combustion powered cars.

      I have actually been thinking about doing an EV conversion on an older VW bug. My wife likes those cars a lot and it would be a fun project. EV West offers kits already, but I am waiting for the Tesla motor powered VW kits.

      Andrew

    13. #13
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      Nov 2018
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      Quote Originally Posted by JustJohn View Post
      Strictly out of wanting to know your perception of this, what do you see as an acceptable recharge time? I plug in to 220 every night when I get home to be topped off in the morning. At 30 minutes for a supercharger station, yeah that's an inconvenience for driving cross country, which I don't do in this car.

      When people ask me how often I have to charge my car, like visiting my outlet in the garage is an extra trip, I'm always surprised and usually rephrase the mileage question to time in the car. With an i3 like mine, it's a little over 2.5 hours before I use the range extender. Most months I just run the engine for 15 minutes to keep it lubricated.
      10 minutes tops. I should be able to pull into a charging station on electrons (otherwise known as fumes,) top up and be back on my way with full range in that time. And before you say it can't be done, here's a couple of promising breakthroughs being worked on.

      https://www.design-engineering.com/r...es-1004033965/
      https://www.hybridcars.com/mits-liqu...minutes-30157/

      So far as charging at home, that's nice until you have an overnight storm that knocks your power out. If it's out long enough, you're stranded until power comes back on long enough to recharge. I can also get into any car I own and drive coast to coast at a moment's notice, can't do that in an electric. It's not an ability I wish to give up, and I do occasionally have the need to drive further one way than an electric car can manage on one charge. If I need to haul people I take the SUV, if I need to go for work I take the truck, if I'm going to a show I'll take my project when it's done. Gasoline allows me to go there and back in a day, electric requires an overnight stay at a motel where I can charge the car, if that's even possible. Might require a 2 night stay, so I can go find a place to recharge the car enough to make it home. EVs are not ever going to be anything more than a curiosity or a city commuter until the 10 minute recharge is a thing, and infrastructure is put into place to support it. And consider, I'm a PRO-EV person. Imagine trying to convince an anti-EV person without the above in place.

    14. #14
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      Jan 2011
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      Achieving less expensive buy-in, easy access to quick charging, and weight are the prime impediments. I'm on board once that happens.

    15. #15
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      When it's takes 5 minute or less for charge, doesn't cost arm and a leg to repair and such I might get on electric bandwagon BUT if you run out of juice on road, your hauling it to charging station or home.
      Lee Abel
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    16. #16
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      Sep 2007
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      417
      Electric drivetrains "just need to improve the weight, range, charging times" in the same way that space travel "just needs to improve the speed, safety, and cost problems." These problems are not minor hiccups, they are the whole story. Researchers have been struggling with this stuff for 100 years.


      That said, electric cars are probably the future for short/medium commutes. They are simpler & cheaper than IC cars if range is not an issue. Lately the battery tech has gotten good enough that the price math starts to make sense.

      I'm guessing EV vs IC will develop into an urban/rural difference. Nobody is gonna be plowing snow in the backwoods with an electric F250 any time soon. It's just not practical to carry the battery equivalent of 30 gallons of gas. Current EV cars are carrying more like 3 gallons worth of stored energy.

    17. #17
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      Quote Originally Posted by mikedc View Post
      I'm guessing EV vs IC will develop into an urban/rural difference. Nobody is gonna be plowing snow in the backwoods with an electric F250 any time soon. It's just not practical to carry the battery equivalent of 30 gallons of gas. Current EV cars are carrying more like 3 gallons worth of stored energy.
      And in the coming split between the urban EV and the rural F250, the F250 will burn wood.



      http://www.driveonwood.com/

    18. #18
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      Nov 2007
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      Melbourne FL
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      17
      ive been reading around quite a bit the past week about tesla drivetrain swaps. Its a very cool idea, but its still a lot of money and you need about 1000lbs worth of batteries, and range is less than 100 miles.
      I dont mind the range, its not like a tesla swapped chevelle or whatever is going to be what i build to drive across the country anyway.

    19. #19
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      Quote Originally Posted by mikedc View Post
      Electric drivetrains "just need to improve the weight, range, charging times" in the same way that space travel "just needs to improve the speed, safety, and cost problems." These problems are not minor hiccups, they are the whole story. Researchers have been struggling with this stuff for 100 years.


      That said, electric cars are probably the future for short/medium commutes. They are simpler & cheaper than IC cars if range is not an issue. Lately the battery tech has gotten good enough that the price math starts to make sense.

      I'm guessing EV vs IC will develop into an urban/rural difference. Nobody is gonna be plowing snow in the backwoods with an electric F250 any time soon. It's just not practical to carry the battery equivalent of 30 gallons of gas. Current EV cars are carrying more like 3 gallons worth of stored energy.
      People seem to wrongly assume that Moore's Law will apply to all of these problems (like they did for computers), and conclude that in ~20 years or so batteries will have orders of magnitude more storage than the batteries of today. Problem is that it doesn't apply, as batteries are physically limited: https://blogs.scientificamerican.com...ology-no-dice/

      As you said, batteries have been the subject of intense research for going on 40 years, and are still a very long way from even coming close to matching the range of an ICE w/o 1000+ lb of dead weight.

    20. #20
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      Quote Originally Posted by ICrombie View Post
      People seem to wrongly assume that Moore's Law will apply to all of these problems (like they did for computers), and conclude that in ~20 years or so batteries will have orders of magnitude more storage than the batteries of today. Problem is that it doesn't apply, as batteries are physically limited: https://blogs.scientificamerican.com...ology-no-dice/

      As you said, batteries have been the subject of intense research for going on 40 years, and are still a very long way from even coming close to matching the range of an ICE w/o 1000+ lb of dead weight.
      You're correct that Moore's law does not apply, however research will advance the cause. To me, this is the most promising solution (see link below) for EV recharging, provided the electrolyte could be recharged and is not a one-use kind of thing. It wouldn't matter how long it took to recharge the electrolyte, so long as the process to replace the electrolye in the car didn't take more than 10 minutes. The electrolyte could either be recharged on-site, or taken to a refinery for recharging. If the car itself could recharge the electrolyte via a plug-in charger, even if that part did take overnight, bonus. You'd only need to drain and fill if you travel.

      https://www.hybridcars.com/mits-liqu...minutes-30157/

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