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    1. #41
      Join Date
      Oct 2015
      Location
      Western Mass
      Posts
      189
      Country Flag: United States
      No to confuse anyone, but this is a diagram that I made so I have something to follow with regard to tying the PWM in to my Vintage Air Trinary Switch:



      I am going to rmake one major modification... and that's to use a two (2) post Junction Block and split it with a Relay. One post will be hot 100% of the time, the other will be Switched by the ignition. Going to use the relay to send the power (w/inline fuse) to the 2nd post when the ignition is on. Will run a #8 AWG (with a #12 AWG fusible link) from the + battery terminal to the primary post on the Junction Block. Will feed the relay Pin 30 with a short #8 AWG, and Pin 87 will connect to the 2nd post. Pin 86 on the relay will be connected to a 12v Switched Ignition source with #14 AWG, and Pin 87 will be connected to a chassis ground. Hopefully, this will give me an accessible 12v switched source for the Trinary switch, and also the PWM (unless Carl says "NO").

      My eFans are wired with #10 AWG on the Positive and #12 AGW on the Negative, and I used Delphi Metri-pack 280 plugs so if need be, I can remove the fan shroud with the fans mounted and their "harness" without having to disconnect from the PWM. I'm still trying to figure out where I can get a 12v source for a eFan LED indicator that's mounted in my dash.





      Mike
      '69 LeMans Blue Coupe, White Interior, Massaged .030" over 454, Super T10 4-Speed,
      Holley 4150, Pertronix Ignition, CompCams Xtreme Energy XS274S, 781 Oval Port Heads



    2. #42
      Join Date
      Nov 2006
      Location
      Hildebran, NC
      Posts
      980
      Country Flag: United States
      That is a nice diagram!!

    3. #43
      Join Date
      Jun 2001
      Location
      Los Angeles
      Posts
      5,722
      Country Flag: United States
      Quote Originally Posted by novadude View Post
      Carl - when you say that the wiring for the sensor can be extended, are you talking about just cutting the terminal off and soldering on an extra length of wire between the sensor and the terminal? If I wanted to make a plug-n-play sensor wire extender, can you direct me to the proper terminal ends? If I know what they are, I might be able to find them from some source (online, NAPA, etc). My controller is in transit to me. Thanks!
      The connector is an MTE connector, for sure nothing an auto parts store will have.

      The easy way is just to cut the duplex wire and add in the lengths needed. Crimp/solder + heat shrink are your friend. To make sure it's all working okay, check the resistance at the end of the small plug. Using two small pins or wires, use an ohmmeter to check the resistance across the two wires. Depending on the temperature it may be around 100ohms or so. Grab the sensor with your fingers and note how quickly the resistance changes. If it's doing all of that, you're good to go.
      VaporWorx. We Give You Gas http://www.vaporworx.com

    4. #44
      Join Date
      Jun 2001
      Location
      Los Angeles
      Posts
      5,722
      Country Flag: United States
      Quote Originally Posted by OldTimer View Post
      (unless Carl says "NO"). Mike
      "NO". ;-)

      The PWM is effectively a high speed, high power, relay. Most standard relays to not have sufficient power to handle two fans and may cause controller malfunction.
      VaporWorx. We Give You Gas http://www.vaporworx.com

    5. #45
      Join Date
      Sep 2005
      Posts
      2
      Quote Originally Posted by CarlC View Post
      The connector is an MTE connector, for sure nothing an auto parts store will have.

      The easy way is just to cut the duplex wire and add in the lengths needed. Crimp/solder + heat shrink are your friend. To make sure it's all working okay, check the resistance at the end of the small plug. Using two small pins or wires, use an ohmmeter to check the resistance across the two wires. Depending on the temperature it may be around 100ohms or so. Grab the sensor with your fingers and note how quickly the resistance changes. If it's doing all of that, you're good to go.
      Perfect! Thank you!

    6. #46
      Join Date
      Oct 2015
      Location
      Western Mass
      Posts
      189
      Country Flag: United States
      Quote Originally Posted by CarlC View Post
      "NO". ;-)

      The PWM is effectively a high speed, high power, relay. Most standard relays to not have sufficient power to handle two fans and may cause controller malfunction.
      LOL... Thanks Carl. I feel like Sister Superior just whacked my wrist with her 12" Acme solid oak ruler! Again! Happened a lot, I used to make fun of her mustache.

      Thanks for the reply, I'm going to use all the recommended wires, probably use 18AWG to connect to the compressor.

      I'm going to use Stinger type battery terminals which have two (2) connection ports (had them sitting in my parts bin). The ports have an Allen head crush screw, and I'll put the 2/0 power and 2/0 ground in one of the ports on each terminal, will put the PWM 10AWG in the secondary port along with the jumper 8AWG to the Junction Block, both will have correct size fusible links.

      Mike
      '69 LeMans Blue Coupe, White Interior, Massaged .030" over 454, Super T10 4-Speed,
      Holley 4150, Pertronix Ignition, CompCams Xtreme Energy XS274S, 781 Oval Port Heads


    7. #47
      Join Date
      Oct 2020
      Location
      Central Valley, Calif.
      Posts
      31
      Country Flag: United States
      The trinary switch idea intrigues me. How would I wire it in with your control on my 04 Tahoe?
      Forgive me if this is a dumb question, but I know ZIP about trinary switches.

    8. #48
      Join Date
      Oct 2020
      Location
      Central Valley, Calif.
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      31
      Country Flag: United States
      Anyone have an answer?

    9. #49
      Join Date
      Apr 2001
      Location
      The City of Fountains
      Posts
      15,671
      Country Flag: United States
      Quote Originally Posted by G Atsma View Post
      Anyone have an answer?
      The two poles that close at 265psi would be wired to switch a power signal to the fan controller.
      1970 GTO Version 2.0
      1967 Cougar build
      GM High-Tech Performance feature
      My YouTube Channel Please Subscribe!
      Instagram @projectgattago
      Dr. EFI
      I deliver what EFI promises.
      Remote Holley EFI tuning.
      Please get in touch if I can be of service.

      "You were the gun, your voice was the trigger, your bravery was the barrel, your eyes were the bullets." ~ Her

    10. #50
      Join Date
      Oct 2020
      Location
      Central Valley, Calif.
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      31
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      Quote Originally Posted by andrewb70 View Post
      The two poles that close at 265psi would be wired to switch a power signal to the fan controller.
      Andrew, good to hear from you!
      Excuse my ignorance, are you meaning hook them to the "A/C wire" of the controller harness? One to the wire, the other to ground?
      And which of the 4 trinary terminals are you speaking of?
      I don't have one to look at to tell the difference.
      If there is a wiring diagram to look up, please let me know.

    11. #51
      Join Date
      Apr 2001
      Location
      The City of Fountains
      Posts
      15,671
      Country Flag: United States
      1970 GTO Version 2.0
      1967 Cougar build
      GM High-Tech Performance feature
      My YouTube Channel Please Subscribe!
      Instagram @projectgattago
      Dr. EFI
      I deliver what EFI promises.
      Remote Holley EFI tuning.
      Please get in touch if I can be of service.

      "You were the gun, your voice was the trigger, your bravery was the barrel, your eyes were the bullets." ~ Her

    12. #52
      Join Date
      Oct 2020
      Location
      Central Valley, Calif.
      Posts
      31
      Country Flag: United States
      OK, I think I see how it works with a relay-type of fan controller.
      I think that Carl's PWM controller uses grounds a bit differently.
      How does the trinary hookup differ in the context of the PWM controller?
      Again, please forgive any ignorance exhibited here.
      And Carl, feel free to chime in here!
      I just need some clarification before I buy anything to avoid doing something wrong.
      Thank you, Andrew!

    13. #53
      Join Date
      Oct 2020
      Location
      Central Valley, Calif.
      Posts
      31
      Country Flag: United States
      Looking at OldTimer's drawing above and extrapolating it with the one in the provided link, the blue wires connect to a 12v keyed source for input, and then go to the A/C input wire on the PWM controller. The green/black output wire feeds the A/C clutch, and I BELIEVE the green/black input connects to an A/C signal wire.
      How many amps are needed to feed the A/C clutch?

    14. #54
      Join Date
      Jun 2001
      Location
      Los Angeles
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      To be clear, the trinary switch when used in the VA setup is originally intended to supply a ground signal to a relay. The relay then provides power to the fan(s).

      When using the PSM controller the relay is no longer used. So, instead of providing a ground signal to turn on the fan(s), we suggest changing from ground to an IGN+ signal on the trinary to feed the blue AC override wire on the PSM controller. This will turn fan(s) on to 50% power minimum.



      If using an OEM trinary switch in an OEM application, care should be exercised since IF the trinary switch is switching a ground it may be doing something else besides controlling the fan circuit. It would likely be best in this case to use the AC clutch. If the trinary is switching IGN+, then using the output routed to the PSM blue wire should be fine.

      The PSM controller needs very little power on the blue AC override wire to function. The AC clutch power system won't even know it's there.
      Last edited by CarlC; 12-12-2020 at 08:50 PM.
      VaporWorx. We Give You Gas http://www.vaporworx.com

    15. #55
      Join Date
      Oct 2020
      Location
      Central Valley, Calif.
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      Given what you say about the real reason VA uses the trinary, do you consider it worthwhile to try to use the trinary for fan control, or am I just as well (or better) off using the A/C clutch signal to directly command the fans "on" when A/C is used? It would be much simpler.

    16. #56
      Join Date
      Jun 2001
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      Either will work but the trinary is a more elegant method.
      VaporWorx. We Give You Gas http://www.vaporworx.com

    17. #57
      Join Date
      Oct 2020
      Location
      Central Valley, Calif.
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      31
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      Quote Originally Posted by CarlC View Post
      Either will work but the trinary is a more elegant method.
      OK, thank you!
      Within the context of your drawing above and my 04 Tahoe, is the best place to connect the green/black wires right to the power wire to the compressor clutch?
      In other words, cut the power wire and connect the ends to the green/black wires?

    18. #58
      Join Date
      Sep 2004
      Location
      Vacaville, CA
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      111
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      Quote Originally Posted by G Atsma View Post
      Given what you say about the real reason VA uses the trinary, do you consider it worthwhile to try to use the trinary for fan control, or am I just as well (or better) off using the A/C clutch signal to directly command the fans "on" when A/C is used? It would be much simpler.

      Its always much better to control the fans with a trinary switch. Having the fans on whenever the clutch is engaged is unnecessary and puts undue drag on the fan motor/ electrical system not to mention it will run when on the highway which causes even more problems.
      Tim

      67 Camaro RS

      64 Nova SS

    19. #59
      Join Date
      Oct 2020
      Location
      Central Valley, Calif.
      Posts
      31
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      After doing a little research, I discovered my 04 Tahoe has a low pressure switch on the accumulator, plus a high pressure cutout switch on the back of the compressor.
      Between the two switches, the compressor is protected from pressure irregularities.
      That being the case, I only need the fan activation function the trinary would offer, so actually, wouldn't a binary pressure switch in the high pressure side serve the purpose?
      If so, please advise.
      I don't want to compromise the present system in any way.

    20. #60
      Join Date
      Oct 2020
      Location
      Central Valley, Calif.
      Posts
      31
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      Thank you Carl, for helping me with answers to my questions above.
      Where does one buy a 250 psi binary switch?

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