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  1. #1
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    Sep 2019
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    Steering Box Selection

    I'm putting together an AutoX, HPDE, Track Day car using an old NASCAR road race chassis. I need a steering box. I'm very entry level so I'm trying to keep the price down.

    I've sorta narrowed it down to:







    Any notable differences other than price? I see the TurnOne says its "5 lbs lighter" than stock which isn't a big deal to me. The TurnOne also says it uses "rack and pinion technology" but I'm not sure if that is a differentiator.

    What's the difference?


    Thanks,
    Sal

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
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    IL/TN
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    About the best of both worlds? for $679.00, plated, 670 box 12.7:1 R&P servo (technology), 6# lighter, 100% new and USA made.
    Attached Images Attached Images  
    https://www.pro-touringf-body.com "doing what they say can't be done"

  3. #3
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    Sep 2019
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    24
    What box is that? Can't tell from the picture...

  4. #4
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    Oct 2004
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    Quote Originally Posted by ssanto View Post
    What box is that? Can't tell from the picture...
    https://www.pro-touringf-body.com/ch...omponents.html
    Red Forman: "The Mustang's front end is problematic; get yourself a Firebird."

  5. #5
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    Sep 2019
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    What's the difference between the "670 steering box kit" and the "700 pro-touring steering box"?

    Thanks,
    Sal

  6. #6
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    Sep 2019
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    I've been googling for hours and haven't come up with anything that really compares and contrasts any two steering boxes.

    On my list I have:
    • Borgeson
    • Sweet
    • TurnOne
    • AGR
    • Lee
    • Pro-TouringF-Body



    ... I see anecdotal things here and there but not any sort of details that would be helpful in selecting between different boxes.

    Has anybody had direct experience with multiple boxes and can give some details of their differences? Any reasons why one should be ruled out? Do they all use the same technology?

    I have trouble making decisions without data.


    Thanks,
    Sal

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jul 2018
    Posts
    118
    Quote Originally Posted by ssanto View Post
    I've been googling for hours and haven't come up with anything that really compares and contrasts any two steering boxes.

    On my list I have:
    • Borgeson
    • Sweet
    • TurnOne
    • AGR
    • Lee
    • Pro-TouringF-Body



    ... I see anecdotal things here and there but not any sort of details that would be helpful in selecting between different boxes.

    Has anybody had direct experience with multiple boxes and can give some details of their differences? Any reasons why one should be ruled out? Do they all use the same technology?

    I have trouble making decisions without data.


    Thanks,
    Sal
    Probably not much help but I ended up doing the AGR 12.7:1 box along with a PSC pump and Moroso remote reservoir on my 68 big block Camaro.
    I went to Goodguys in Columbus and visited every vendor booth I could with a steering box / PS pump in mind, I visited with the Turn one guys which were very personable and willing to answer any question I had. I would have gone with a Turn one if I had that kind of budget. Borgeson booth, I felt the rep was condescending and just didn't give a crap. Cpp was good to talk to but i've heard bad things. AGR was not there but after the Good Guys show, now having more info in my head, I called their sales and tech dept and they were super.. couldn't have asked for any one more patient and willing to talk me through it. Summit racing was giving away discount coupons and had an AGR box on the shelf at my local store so that made my decision even easier.
    I have zero complaints and very happy with the feel of my steering system now.

    Resized_20190714_123032 by F G, on Flickr

    Resized_20190714_170642 by F G, on Flickr

    Resized_20190714_170634 by F G, on Flickr

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
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    IL/TN
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    the issue is focusing on the retailer's name, there are only 2 box manufacturers Delfi and psc, the 700/800 are based on a refurbished Saginaw case, most of those are "refurbished" some have new internals, problem with refurbished boxes they take thousands apart throw all the parts together to clean and inspect and as long as they pas a acceptable amount of wear they are re-used but now you have miss matched gear patterns, too much lash or not enough, gears that bind.
    Sweet, Lee, Turn one psc are builders their 700/800 boxes generally are trouble free.
    Delfi and psc 600 series are the only new boxes worth the money IMHO of course, but Delfi boxes are nearly impossible to get other than through a builder that do what they do to them and the price ends up pretty high.
    https://www.pro-touringf-body.com "doing what they say can't be done"

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Sep 2019
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    24
    Quote Originally Posted by 79T/Aman View Post
    the issue is focusing on the retailer's name
    That's kinda what I was saying... other than the name of the builder and stories posted online, I really don't have any data or information to differentiate between them. Why is one box $500 and the other $800? They don't publish any details about how they are built or tolerances.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Sep 2019
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    24
    I think I've learned something from my reading, lemme know if this is right...

    "600" series and "670" steering boxes are all new
    "700" and "800" series are remanufactured

    Furthermore, I think I can now simply spot the reman boxes by looking at them. Any box that has the standard looking cast-iron housing is a reman (700 or 800). Anything with a "different" looking housing is all new.

    So now if I'm able to separate all the remans from the new boxes, and I assume that all the brand-new boxes will meet my needs, then the next step is to differentiate between the quality of different reman units to see which one of those might be the best value. Make sense?

    And another question... when some box manufactures claim "new rack and pinion technology", is that something solely associated with the newer 600 series boxes? Do all the newer 600 series boxes essentially have "rack and pinion" technology" Do all reman 700/800 boxes not have "rack and pinion technology"? Or is that all just marketing smoke and mirrors?

    Here is my updated list of boxes:

    • Borgeson
      • The box for $495 from RiteTech is a "800" box which means it is a remanufactured

    • Sweet
      • The 208-12250 box for $556 from Speedway motors is a "700" box which means it is a remanufactured

    • TurnOne

    • AGR
      • The AGR 225153 box for $509 at Summit doesn't specify a series but I'll bet it is a remanufactured

    • Lee
      • 670 box (which I cannot find anywhere to purchase) is a brand new "600" series box

    • Pro-ToruingF-Body
      • The 670 box for $679 is a brand new "600" series box
      • The 700 box for $479 is a remanufactured box

    • ACDelco
      • IROC Z box for $150 at Autozone doesn't claim any "series" number but is clearly a remanufactured.




    Do I have that right?

  11. #11
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    Aug 2019
    Location
    Nashville, TN
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    23
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    Following

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
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    IL/TN
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    you are close. 700/800 boxes have the big round cover on the front and all will be remaned HOWEVER, the ones we sell and those from Sweet and Lee are built boxes not mas production remanufactured as those from the auto part store, equivalent to a custom built engine VS a remaned, that is why the cost is much higher new internals just a used case.
    Now you also have new off shore boxes hitting the market, bottom line if the price is not $700 and up for a NEW box they are not worth getting and service parts on some are non existent.
    Be aware there are Remaned 600 series boxes on the market now.
    Also both 600 and 700/800 can be had in plane cast or plated with the "plating de-jour" ceramic, zinc, gold clear shinny...etc. so it is not a way to tell some charge extra $100 for the platting others plate all their boxes before assembly making it relatively inexpensive.

    all US made true 600series/670 boxes will have the R&P servo, look at the picture of the one I posted, the case is plated cast iron but the servo (where the lines fit in) that is a bolt on aluminum R&P servo, others are cast iron to make it cheaper.

    As far as the best built 700/800 boxes go you have many choices PTFB PT box, Sweet, Lee, Turn one of the names you know and all of them will be very equal.



    There also is a NEW 800 box made for racing, one company even made an all aluminum version, not sure if both are still even available, the trouble is the general public does not know about product unless it is marketed, and some of the best product comes from the true dedicated shops and companies that don't spend a big amount on marketing.
    https://www.pro-touringf-body.com "doing what they say can't be done"


  13. #13
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    Sep 2019
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    24
    Thanks. This has been very helpful!!

    One last question... OK, probably not

    What is the difference in feel/performance of a well-made US built 700/800 reman (like the PTFB PT box) and a 600/670 box?

  14. #14
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    Oct 2004
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    IL/TN
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    the PTFB PT (pro-touring) box is a built 700 box not a remaned 600.

    inherently the 700/800 are going to be looser they just aren't as tight, even a well built one there is only so much that can be done, if you want a tight modern feel the 670 is the way to go
    https://www.pro-touringf-body.com "doing what they say can't be done"

  15. #15
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    Sep 2019
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    Quote Originally Posted by 79T/Aman View Post
    the PTFB PT (pro-touring) box is a built 700 box not a remaned 600.
    Oh yes. I mistyped. I'll edit my post so I don't confuse future generations who find this!

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Jul 2018
    Posts
    118
    This is the one I went with and they did a price match of $387.89 but I can't remember or find who had it for that price https://www.summitracing.com/parts/AGR-492117

  17. #17
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    Oct 2004
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    IL/TN
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    Quote Originally Posted by Just 1 More View Post
    This is the one I went with and they did a price match of $387.89 but I can't remember or find who had it for that price https://www.summitracing.com/parts/AGR-492117
    You'll notice I never mentioned that box even though it was on the OPs list...for a reason, you may as well buy a Cardone remaned, I know I know some will come out and say "worked fine for me" my experience is over 50% bad, my experience with Sweet and PSC 100% good
    https://www.pro-touringf-body.com "doing what they say can't be done"

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Jul 2018
    Posts
    118
    Quote Originally Posted by 79T/Aman View Post
    You'll notice I never mentioned that box even though it was on the OPs list...for a reason, you may as well buy a Cardone remaned, I know I know some will come out and say "worked fine for me" my experience is over 50% bad, my experience with Sweet and PSC 100% good
    Then i'm one of the lucky ones

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Pittsburgh, Pa
    Posts
    602
    I have never had a reason not to buy a Lee. In my present 69 el Camino I have a 800 Series box that Lee blueprinted, its 14:1 and has a 30 lb valve. It's has a very strong return to center. Everybody that drives my car wants Lees phone number..

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Sep 2019
    Posts
    24
    I can't find them online and I read somewhere that he retired. Made it sound like "Lee" was just a guy who built awesome boxes...

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