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    Results 41 to 47 of 47
    1. #41
      Join Date
      Jul 2013
      Posts
      22
      Country Flag: United States
      Andrew, thanks for the tire size info. I suspect that is probably part of my low dyno numbers. Dyno test was performed on a dynojet dyno and my tire size is 15/29/15. Bigger tires throw off numbers. Not like it matters anyways. A number is a number.

      It was nice out today so i got a chance to take the car on a ride. After the dyno tune its definitely alot better. More power throughout the rpm range and i can really feel the cam come on strong. From a dead stop i can roast the 15/29 rear tires through all gears until i let off and gain traction. So its alot better than what it was. Mid rpm pulls really good when throttle is heavily applied. But, i feel that there is still something just not right as you suggested. RPM feels like it drops of too early and Feels/sounds rich on the bottom end. Getting this thing running I remember there was some issues with the ECM. As in, the first guy that programed it seemed to just make things work so there was some hacking (IMO) involved. So with that said, im gonna have to search for ANOTHER tuner to tune this thing. I know that the speedo in the ECM is all jacked up to get the RPMs higher among some other issues.

      As far as BBC vs LS, i still think that even if everything went right and fell into place, the BBC would have been a better choice. Cost wise, power wise, tunability, would have been better for me. I wanted reliability with low maintenance and with the cost of the swap, im sure i could have got that out of the BBC for cheaper. Now had i intended on putting 20,000+ miles a year on this car then I can see the benefits of the LS.

      Badbowtie, glad you can see where im coming from as far as price. Its not cheap to swap over and even though these are becoming more popular swaps, its still not cheap. Unfortunately i dont have to time to cut oilpans or fab engine mounts to save a few bucks here and there. Either way, whatever way you choose to go, good luck.

      Interceptor5588, while you do have some good points, im a hardcore pontiac guy so im biased! �� Building a big HP pontiac pontiac isnt cheap or as easy so I understand your delima.

      Badass81z28, i can see you favor the LS and thats great. Its provided me with good info through your dedication to it. Alot of good valuable points you bring up. I have been taking in all if them.

    2. #42
      Join Date
      Apr 2001
      Location
      The City of Fountains
      Posts
      15,971
      Country Flag: United States
      Quote Originally Posted by Fbird View Post
      .

      As far as BBC vs LS, i still think that even if everything went right and fell into place, the BBC would have been a better choice. Cost wise, power wise, tunability, would have been better for me. I wanted reliability with low maintenance and with the cost of the swap, im sure i could have got that out of the BBC for cheaper. Now had i intended on putting 20,000+ miles a year on this car then I can see the benefits of the LS.

      .
      I wholeheartedly disagree with the paragraph above. The GTO has a built 502 bb in it when I first built it. It was a GM short block but had the excellent Holley (305 Canfield) heads on it, a lumpy Lunati cam, and it was fuel injected. It made 600hp on the engine Dyno at Fast Times in Chicago and made over 500rwhp on the chassis dyno at Speed Inc.

      I don't miss that engine one bit. I'd do the swap again...again...and again...

      Sometimes is clearly wrong with your combination. Maybe the cam is ground wrong...maybe the reluctor has slipped on the crank and the timing is off...maybe your tuner is a moron...maybe the converter is wrong...or maybe your expectations are unrealistic. You just said that it smokes the tires through all the gears....so maybe you just need better tires.

      Andrew
      1970 GTO Version 3.0
      1967 Cougar build
      GM High-Tech Performance feature
      My YouTube Channel Please Subscribe!
      Instagram @projectgattago
      Dr. EFI
      I deliver what EFI promises.
      Remote Holley EFI tuning.
      Please get in touch if I can be of service.

      "You were the gun, your voice was the trigger, your bravery was the barrel, your eyes were the bullets." ~ Her

    3. #43
      Join Date
      Jun 2010
      Location
      Deployed
      Posts
      3,280
      Country Flag: United States
      Quote Originally Posted by andrewb70 View Post
      I wholeheartedly disagree with the paragraph above. The GTO has a built 502 bb in it when I first built it. It was a GM short block but had the excellent Holley (305 Canfield) heads on it, a lumpy Lunati cam, and it was fuel injected. It made 600hp on the engine Dyno at Fast Times in Chicago and made over 500rwhp on the chassis dyno at Speed Inc.

      I don't miss that engine one bit. I'd do the swap again...again...and again...

      Sometimes is clearly wrong with your combination. Maybe the cam is ground wrong...maybe the reluctor has slipped on the crank and the timing is off...maybe your tuner is a moron...maybe the converter is wrong...or maybe your expectations are unrealistic. You just said that it smokes the tires through all the gears....so maybe you just need better tires.

      Andrew

      you wouldn’t believe how many bad tuners there are...my last time was done at Dyno Jet and there was a big difference in the car and the guy explaining what he saw before and after corrections. Wasn’t like that with the other guys like “Calspeed”

      I sure do favor the LS, trust me 10 years ago that wasn’t the case I would argue against a swap until I was blue in the face. Once I actually looked into it and did it 3x, I was so wrong and now see I was very ignorant to the LS capabilities. I can’t believe the power these modern cars are getting. The new Camaros are making 800+ rwhp with very simple mods.
      1970 Camaro/DSE build


      Are you driver enough? Maybe....come on blue!
      https://www.pro-touring.com/threads/...71#post1147371

    4. #44
      Join Date
      Jul 2013
      Posts
      22
      Country Flag: United States
      Quote Originally Posted by andrewb70 View Post
      I wholeheartedly disagree with the paragraph above. The GTO has a built 502 bb in it when I first built it. It was a GM short block but had the excellent Holley (305 Canfield) heads on it, a lumpy Lunati cam, and it was fuel injected. It made 600hp on the engine Dyno at Fast Times in Chicago and made over 500rwhp on the chassis dyno at Speed Inc.

      I don't miss that engine one bit. I'd do the swap again...again...and again...

      Sometimes is clearly wrong with your combination. Maybe the cam is ground wrong...maybe the reluctor has slipped on the crank and the timing is off...maybe your tuner is a moron...maybe the converter is wrong...or maybe your expectations are unrealistic. You just said that it smokes the tires through all the gears....so maybe you just need better tires.

      Andrew
      Maybe i was unrealistic. I expected more useable power, less maintenance, easier tunability. What i got was none of that. To properly tune these things it seems like its either big money for software or pay someone to tune...which doesnt seem to be the ticket either. So, ripping all the efi stuff off of it is one option but like i stated, im tired of dumping money into this setup. I just dont see a advantage of the LS engine.

      I kept the old BB stuff (less engine) so i can switch back fairly easily. I can sell the complete LS setup and recoup most of my money. The rest that i lost, i can just chalk it up to a learning experience. For now, the car is just gonna sit until i get the time and motivation to touch it.

      Thanks for all your advise.

    5. #45
      Join Date
      Oct 2018
      Location
      San Jose, CA
      Posts
      523
      When starting from scratch the LS platform is pretty hard to argue with - even with the fuel system and efi tuning requirements.

      With an existing good running combo it’s harder to justify. For example I have a very nice running carb 406 sbc that makes 525/500 with a nice flat wide tq curve from 3-6500 similar to a LS3 hot cam combo. I would gain some drivability and some mpg swapping but not much else. So I am sticking with the old stuff for now.

      I am a big believer in electric fuel pumps with return lines for a carb motor - basically the same setup you would run on a LS with a lower pressure regulator being the only difference. That really improves operation of a carb motor. Mine starts right up with a twist of the key and has no vapor lock or drivability issues under any conditions.

      Now -if I was building a car from scratch it would get the 525hp or the 580hp version of the LS3 for sure. Can’t go wrong there. Imo.
      1971 Camaro - 406 / T56
      2016 Camaro SS convertible
      2018 Colorado 4x4

    6. #46
      Join Date
      Jun 2010
      Location
      Deployed
      Posts
      3,280
      Country Flag: United States
      Quote Originally Posted by c4racer2 View Post
      When starting from scratch the LS platform is pretty hard to argue with - even with the fuel system and efi tuning requirements.

      With an existing good running combo it’s harder to justify. For example I have a very nice running carb 406 sbc that makes 525/500 with a nice flat wide tq curve from 3-6500 similar to a LS3 hot cam combo. I would gain some drivability and some mpg swapping but not much else. So I am sticking with the old stuff for now.

      I am a big believer in electric fuel pumps with return lines for a carb motor - basically the same setup you would run on a LS with a lower pressure regulator being the only difference. That really improves operation of a carb motor. Mine starts right up with a twist of the key and has no vapor lock or drivability issues under any conditions.

      Now -if I was building a car from scratch it would get the 525hp or the 580hp version of the LS3 for sure. Can’t go wrong there. Imo.
      I went from a perfectly running SBC 350 crate with 400hp. After going to the track, it was easy to justify lol...On the 1000ft track in California, it would go 95mph. With the 347 LS it went 105-106 so it was significant. It was a good feeling moment to know the swap was worth it. The good thing is you can always sell what you got to offset the cost. I have had no issues selling my pull outs.
      1970 Camaro/DSE build


      Are you driver enough? Maybe....come on blue!
      https://www.pro-touring.com/threads/...71#post1147371

    7. #47
      Join Date
      Oct 2018
      Location
      San Jose, CA
      Posts
      523
      Yes that’s true there is a resell market for a nice running SBC or BBC.

      1971 Camaro - 406 / T56
      2016 Camaro SS convertible
      2018 Colorado 4x4


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