Unchewable, the D170

[kingcrunch]

This thing needs a custom oil pan anyways and i am thinking about a dry sump system.
On the other hand, there will be plenty of clearance because (i think) the absolute minimum wheel size that might fit over the SRT-10 uprights is 20".

The stock Ram SRT-10 tire is a 305/40 R22.
With the hub centers about level with the fender tips, that's about 15.5" clearance between the fender tip/rocker and ground...

[kingcrunch]

Contemplating about the next steps.
The Euro to USD rate is quite good at the time and i am thinking about acquiring all of the electronics that i will need. Like ALL.
That's basically two part numbers :D

Mopar 77072454 and
Racepak 250-DS-IQ3

And since i am having a hard time to find a decent set of OEM SRT-10 wheels, i think this will be the acquisition for february and an early birthday-present.

[kingcrunch]

Literately half an hour after writing this and checking out prices on Summitracing, my mum called and asked if i already know what i want for birthday...



To keep things short, i ordered the Mopar wiring harness and Racepak dash and the power steering pump kit for the Hemi crate engines.

[kingcrunch]

Not a lot happened here since february:
I have had some problems finding a business that would cut and bend the metal parts for this project.
Turns out, all of them have no interest in doing small singular stuff... and i can understand why but i hate it.

Ok, so now i have convinced a business to do the cutting for me and i will take the parts to a local shop and have them bent.
OR i'll do it myself if local fitters decline as well (for that reason i ordered two of everything).

Other tedious tasks:
In the meantime i have been hunting for a complete, good OEM set of RAM SRT 10 wheels.
Which is HARD, because most of them come either in parts (like cracks, welding done, damage, incomplete, etc.) or with a complete good truck attached... or people think they have "the real deal" but are in fact selling reproductions.
The OEM wheels are forged aluminum, made by Speedline in Italy.
The reproduction wheels are cast aluminum... at this point the discussion ends :D

I really thought about abandoning this project for a real SRT 10 and swapping the V10 for my 6.4 Apache... (because same power, less weight, more modern and cheaper-to-build engine) but no.
I don't like the later RAMs that much.

So stay tuned, this project is not dead, it just has a veeeery slow heartbeat at this time.

[Tincup]

Not a lot happened here since february:
I have had some problems finding a business that would cut and bend the metal parts for this project.
Turns out, all of them have no interest in doing small singular stuff... and i can understand why but i hate it.

Ok, so now i have convinced a business to do the cutting for me and i will take the parts to a local shop and have them bent.
OR i'll do it myself if local fitters decline as well (for that reason i ordered two of everything).

Other tedious tasks:
In the meantime i have been hunting for a complete, good OEM set of RAM SRT 10 wheels.
Which is HARD, because most of them come either in parts (like cracks, welding done, damage, incomplete, etc.) or with a complete good truck attached... or people think they have "the real deal" but are in fact selling reproductions.
The OEM wheels are forged aluminum, made by Speedline in Italy.
The reproduction wheels are cast aluminum... at this point the discussion ends :D

I really thought about abandoning this project for a real SRT 10 and swapping the V10 for my 6.4 Apache... (because same power, less weight, more modern and cheaper-to-build engine) but no.
I don't like the later RAMs that much.

So stay tuned, this project is not dead, it just has a veeeery slow heartbeat at this time.

I had a set of OEM wheels and most of them were bent to some degree, for some reason the stock wheels bend very easy. I sold them off and purchased a set of the aftermarket cast wheels in satin black. They are identical in every way, and about $200 ea.

[kingcrunch]

Mike,

problem is, that these reproduction wheels don't have the OEM manufacturer or Dodge parts number on them - naturally.
But this part would be crucial to come close to getting this thing road legal in germany.

I am going the "adapt a complete OEM suspension to older frame" route here and using all OEM parts which should make it easier for the engineer that will have to certify this thing.
From there - provided i can make it road legal - i want to have Forgeline build a set of 20x10s (if 10s fit after all) for racing purposes.
With a little more cash i can even have Forgelines made road legal but that's waaaaay down the road.

Alex

[kingcrunch]

Quick update:

- i got the plates for the front end made, just need to have them bent... don't ask.
- i found TWO sets of really nice SRT 10 wheels... in the process of finishing that deal.

[Angry]

Love the build,...Im in Australia,...n we have the same issues,..need Engineering for all mods n lots of crazy rules around modifying cars....at least we can use aftermarket wheels,...but some are cheap knockoffs...so we steer clear....

Im buildidng a 64 F100 with a Jaguar XJ6 front end,....a EFI 302 Windsor n 4 speed Auto,...itll be a patina cruiser n parts chaser....my 69 Camaro is the tuff car in the garage
.

keep posting...

Al

[Max_2018]

Just thought I'd say hello, since it seems like we're the two only Germans on here.
About the wheels: If the TÜV (I don't think (most) Americans know how lucky they are) doesn't certify them, maybe get a different set and put the repros on there for shows or so.
If they got Dodge-Badges on there you might just get away with it.
Trucks are rare, most cops won't know what they're supposed to complain about....

I'm still in the planning stages, and I (not really happily) chose to involve the local TÜV from BEFORE the start.
For starters, I want to turn a Mustang's solid rear into an independent suspension, and that will be a PITA to get TÜVed, since those kits don't have any paperwork.
And don't get me started on engine-power (chassis-stiffness-certification, ever heard of it?) or Lamps (LED is EVIL!!​).

Max

[kingcrunch]

Max,

i talked to different engineers and none of them can be reached any more... i figured "f it" and proceeded to build my prototype.
When that's done, i'll get an actual person to talk to and invite (read: pay) him/her to come over and check the project out him/herself, provide the drawings and a full project description.

"Chassis stiffness" is a big LOL, because these open C-channel frames are soft as hell. They were designed to be that way.
This is why i want a whole tubular cell that bolts to the frame and for one: ties the front and back of the frame together and two: incorporates my safety-cell.


I got a good deal on two sets of OEM SRT-10 wheels, from the same seller.
One good enough for powder coating, the other almost show quality. Shipping them over at the moment...


Here's some progress. I'm taken by the fact that even the bolt holes actually line up.



What i wanted to do vs. what i did.









I just made the tools to bend these myself... this is the first of four lower bucket pieces.
The top ones are less spectacular.

[Max_2018]

Max,

i talked to different engineers and none of them can be reached any more... i figured "f it" and proceeded to build my prototype.
When that's done, i'll get an actual person to talk to and invite (read: pay) him/her to come over and check the project out him/herself, provide the drawings and a full project description.



"Chassis stiffness" is a big LOL, because these open C-channel frames are soft as hell. They were designed to be that way.
This is why i want a whole tubular cell that bolts to the frame and for one: ties the front and back of the frame together and two: incorporates my safety-cell.

"None can be reached anymore".
Had that problem on my last project (Mazda MX5 restoration, gotta start somewhere).
Got a roll bar from England.
Engineer "sure, put it in, if it's properly done it'll be fine".
Now I'm about to put it in, check back and get "him? Oh, he moved to an internal position (aka desk job)".
Great :-|

I guess my approach will be to make a full concept, maybe even render up a "fake" or two, and then go and consult the tüv.
Because I'd really hate to import a car, throw a couple of ten-thousand Euros at it, and then get a "hahaha...no".
I might get some stuff green-lit on the safety-argument (disc brakes, independent suspension, frame-reinforcements/cage, maybe even lights), others actually on emissions (modern engine).
Another big question mark are wheels, a lot of imported ones have no paperwork, and as far as I know you no longer get wheels approved based on how much load they can carry.

The stiffness is a (nother) poor excuse.
For once, I don't think 400 or 500hp is that much of a difference on a 50 years old car.
Also, there are TÜV-ed Elanor-replicas driving around with 700hp, so there is some way around it.



Until all that is taken care of it'll take some time, but I got the time, so why not use it with loosing nerves and patience^^
I definitely wish you all the best for your project.
Maybe we somehow manage to run into one another some day when it's on the road.

Max

[kingcrunch]

"None can be reached anymore".
Had that problem on my last project (Mazda MX5 restoration, gotta start somewhere).
Got a roll bar from England.
Engineer "sure, put it in, if it's properly done it'll be fine".
Now I'm about to put it in, check back and get "him? Oh, he moved to an internal position (aka desk job)".
Great :-|

I guess my approach will be to make a full concept, maybe even render up a "fake" or two, and then go and consult the tüv.
Because I'd really hate to import a car, throw a couple of ten-thousand Euros at it, and then get a "hahaha...no".
I might get some stuff green-lit on the safety-argument (disc brakes, independent suspension, frame-reinforcements/cage, maybe even lights), others actually on emissions (modern engine).
Another big question mark are wheels, a lot of imported ones have no paperwork, and as far as I know you no longer get wheels approved based on how much load they can carry.

The stiffness is a (nother) poor excuse.
For once, I don't think 400 or 500hp is that much of a difference on a 50 years old car.
Also, there are TÜV-ed Elanor-replicas driving around with 700hp, so there is some way around it.



Until all that is taken care of it'll take some time, but I got the time, so why not use it with loosing nerves and patience^^
I definitely wish you all the best for your project.
Maybe we somehow manage to run into one another some day when it's on the road.

Max

Max,

it's been a while but let me reply to your message:
What others did or where allowed to do is barely an argument for my stuff. I don't even want to try and discuss with an engineer on this level.
I want to deliver a vehicle that is safe and sound and to every sane engineer looks like it is. Even more important: I want to feel safe while driving it.
There's no point in driving a vehicle that does not make you feel safe, in fact i loose interest in driving vehicles that feel spooky or "unsafe".

I noticed i can feel a loose wheel bearing in my C-class Mercedes before the guys at the shop would consider it to have play.
And it felt spooky to me way before it got a real "problem" (to others).

Which immediately takes me to "chassis stiffness". Chassis stiffness IS all important for the suspension to actually work like intended.
If your chassis flexes instead of your suspension, consecutively your suspension setup will be wrong. That applies to every vehicle.

If your chassis flexes because engine torque twists it, driveability and predictability will be awful because the front and rear axle ATTACHMENT POINTS move almost independently from eachother.

In my project i need a stable and stiff chassis for high speed autobahn driving (remember, the goal is to be able to hunt down Porsches and such on the Ring and the Autobahn).
Without that, the project is dead.



As for progress:
It's moving very slowly at the moment. I aquired a lot of OEM parts (brake discs, pads, wheel bearings, UCAs and such) AND two sets of OEM SRT-10 wheels (one very good, one for thrashing around at the track).

[Tincup]

[kingcrunch]

Just to let you know, this project is not dead at all.
I ran into some personal problems beginning of the year and it cost me about the whole year to kinda sort this out.

It's on the side burner but still occupies a lot of thought.
Especially the front axle really gives me headaches because i am not really sure if i should stick to my original plan and modify the original crossmember and build a smaller second one for the rear LCA mounts

OR

if i just should build a subframe assembly that will accept both LCA mounts and bolt to the frame as a unit.

This would allow for working around the shape of the engine and its accessories... That's something that will have to be thought through before i continue building stuff.
I'll update this thread as i proceed.

I think the next update will be somewhere in January.

Stay tuned.
Thanks.

Alex

[Sbeck09]

Especially the front axle really gives me headaches because i am not really sure if i should stick to my original plan and modify the original crossmember and build a smaller second one for the rear LCA mounts

OR

if i just should build a subframe assembly that will accept both LCA mounts and bolt to the frame as a unit.

This would allow for working around the shape of the engine and its accessories... That's something that will have to be thought through before i continue building stuff.
I'll update this thread as i proceed.

I just went through this torture on my own build. You can see it in the most recent replies. I ended up deciding to build my own to make it easier to fit to the frame rather than trying to adapt everything. Now that I'm started on it, building from scratch sounds harder than it is. Just take your time and measure over and over. Looks like you're pretty handy so shouldn't be too bad.

[dengue]

Just to let you know, this project is not dead at all.
I ran into some personal problems beginning of the year and it cost me about the whole year to kinda sort this out.

It's on the side burner but still occupies a lot of thought.
Especially the front axle really gives me headaches because i am not really sure if i should stick to my original plan and modify the original crossmember and build a smaller second one for the rear LCA mounts

OR

if i just should build a subframe assembly that will accept both LCA mounts and bolt to the frame as a unit.

This would allow for working around the shape of the engine and its accessories... That's something that will have to be thought through before i continue building stuff.
I'll update this thread as i proceed.

I think the next update will be somewhere in January.

Stay tuned.
Thanks.

Alex

Hemi 5.7, T56, 20x9, 22x10 SRT Replica Wheels and ready for install a Crown Vic front suspension

[kingcrunch]

Yeah, this is exactly what i feared it would look like with the 22s...

But that doesn't matter any more. I now have something not-so-different to put these 22s on.




This truck taught me, that i had to rethink my project.
What does that do to the project? Well, i don't know yet. I might go back to the idea of a Viper chassis...

[Tincup]

Nice...