Salesguys 1967 firebird 400 Build Thread

[salesguy01]

While I had the Engine sitting on the stand it was time to take out the Original 400 that will be preserved.

After Wrestling for several hours slowly taking the passenger fender off, disconnecting everything etc. here are some pics of that.

Hood Off



Getting Ready







Its Coming Slowly!


The Load Leveler really helps


Its OUT!



All the Tranny Fluid Leaked as you can see. I even bought the plug for the end, but it decided to hit the firewall on the way up and gush!

[salesguy01]

Taking the engine out was a solid days worth of work for just me and the Wife as a helper!.

Over the next week or so I did a few things "while I was there"

1. Change Steering box to late model Quick Ratio, and pitman arm (then have to get adapters for the lines) Since now metric Oring
2. Fiberglass patch a couple holes and cracks on the A/C box. (first time working with that nasty stuff)
3. Change Heater Core. Since I took the passenger fender off. it was bypassed so I figured it was no good.
4. Change Blower Motor. It made a ratteling sound when on high. Was the Metal Rat Trap new version is plastic.
5. Detail engine bay. Spray Paint Flat black inner liners and firewall. Then gloss the subframe that was showing.

Doing all of that was a solid 2 weeks of working on it when I could. Which was every second possible.

OK Well new Engine is Built, Original Engine Out, engine bay ready.

Time to get crackin!

[salesguy01]

this is the engine and trans going together.

It is a build 4l60E.... More on this Disaster soon..........

But it looks pretty!



Look at that Flywheel and those ARP Bolts..



The Converter is AAC Boss hog, we will see how it holds up, but should be a 1800 stall



Engine IN!!!!!!

Whew, Getting back in was not easy! Had to put engine in then lift car so I could slide the tranny in the tunnel. I know it seems Like I am going fast, but this was actually week spands of time!

Here it is during break in procedure, Wire everywhere etc. it was a nail bitting stressful event!



3, 2, 1 , Wont start! Why not? Well my logic would have said this new high flow fuel pump would have the inlet and outlets like the stock setup. Wrong! to the manufacture credit it does say "out" on the bottom,. I just couldnt wrap my head around it opposite of the factory style. Anyway switched the lines and fired up.

Bam, Why do I have ZERO Oil Pressure!!! WTF. Well it turned out I hooked the electric oil pressure guage up wrong and fried it. Off to the Zone to get a cheap Mechanical one. Came back started and had pressure!!



Since it was a Flat Tappet I let it run for 25 mines over around 2k rpm. Temp got to about 200+, smelled that break in heat smell, smoked the oil off the places. IT was Alive!

Drained the oil and changed the filter. Oil was a bit metallic as to be expected.

Still at this point do not have a driveshaft. So cant drive to seat rings yet. Waiting for the custom 3.5 inch aluminum I ordered.

[Nicks67GTO]

Are you running the CVF serpentine system? If so do you have any good pics you could put up?

[rohrt]

sweet build.

[salesguy01]

Are you running the CVF serpentine system? If so do you have any good pics you could put up?

Im not sure what the CVF system is...This is the March Pully system in the powder coated black option.... I dont have the AC pully yet so dont mind that.

This is the engine bay about 95% done, still some little things to finish

[JakeD]

I'm surprised they suggested the small block springs. I use the big block springs on pontiac with iron heads. Here's a pic of my 67 bird with small block springs. It has an aluminum LS1 motor in it. You may need spring spacers or swap to BB springs. Each car is different. Mine does have 18" wheels so you may have slightly more room w 17" and 225 tire.

So I have a 67 Firebird with a 400, iron heads. What do you think? Big block or small block springs?
Also, how do you like the ride? Im about to pull the trigger on a suspension kit, still up in the air however. Please comment: https://www.pro-touring.com/threads/...03#post1133303

Jake

[salesguy01]

So I have been enjoying the car somewhat. The main problem with the overdrive Tranny is you can hear noises that werent audible at speed before!. So Chasing down a few gremlins.

I havent updated about the new Exhaust system.

I bought the Dougs Coated D-Port Headers, and the Magnaflow Stainless system. Here are some pics when it was up on the rack the the exhaust shop. My installer was NOT happy with the fit of the pipes since he had to custom fab from the collectors to the x pipe. But from x back is was Perfect!!

They do sound awesome!!! I will say it is a more "modern" sound vs old school Flowmaster type. kind of quit at idle but sound so good when getting on it.

Still havent gone full throttle yet as the trans builder wanted a few miles on it, plus working out some steering issues with a crappy cardone box.

On to the next thing. Since the Magnaflow exhaust was in the way of the Factory traction bar we had to remove it :( It really pissed me off since I spent like $300 on the arm and getting new bushings...







So the next best thing in my eyes are some sweet Cal-Tracs. I simply couldnt do slapper bars on a car like this...
I will say the install was smooth, just a pita. the bushings had to be pressed in. doing these things by myself being a contortionist holding up the spring took a little extra time.
I LOVE the way they hang down a bit. makes the car look mean.

[salesguy01]

Havent Posted a pic of the Engine finished with the correct a/c pully and finially painted the ugly Master cyc.

Im very happy with the way it came out. LOTS of time, money, sweat, busted knuckles, all work was done by the wife and I

[salesguy01]

After putting the new quick ratio cardone box on. I have tons of play in the steering wheel. I went to get the car aligned at my buddies shop. and we could only get 1 caster and -.9 camber. Seems like I have some frame sag and need offset cross shafts. I took it as a sign to go ahead and get some tubular upper and lower control arms and went with Hotchkis. That would complete all they offer for first gens, besides the rear sway bar which I opted out of.

The hardest part about changing the lower arms were the original bolts that held the control arm on. Those suckers were in for good! just again doing a lot of this work at my own pace takes some time and over the weekend I got it knocked out.

Now I know some say that tube lowers are not worth it, but when the car is turning and you can see that bad ass tubular lower arm, it makes it worth it.

Here are some pics of the install. I will get some money shots later.













NOW. besides how awesome they look and that now I have a full Hotchkis suspension. I am having a couple issues with the UCA's. I think the car has frame sag and since these arms have static camber bult in, on the passenger side I am getting -1.9 camber with no shims. should be -.05 ..... now before you say flip the cross shaft around I did alreay and this is what it look like:



WAY to much!!!!

So I called the few main companies that make first gen Arms and Global west said there arms can have the offset cross shafts put in. So I placed an order for them. I hope thy solve the issue!
I would have liked to stay with all one brand for suspension, but it it solves the issue it will be overlooked!

[rohrt]

How are you liking you Hotchkis setup? Do you have the rear swaybar installed?

I have the spings and fox shocks like you, but not the correct front sway bar. I think it rides pretty good myself.

[salesguy01]

How are you liking you Hotchkis setup? Do you have the rear swaybar installed?

I have the spings and fox shocks like you, but not the correct front sway bar. I think it rides pretty good myself.

Rides Great! Im not getting the full benefit becausemy steering box is ****ty Cardone that is light as a feather and twitchy... Thinking of going with the new Hotchkis Delphi 600 box or the AGR one.

Will have an update on that soon!

[rohrt]

I will be curious how your tranny holds up in the long run.

I had my box first done by Lee for the quick ratio. Then got a AGR pump. Found out the box still had the stock torsion bar and was way to light for my liking. Sent box to AGR for a new torsion bar. So far so good but I think you should do the Delphi box.

[adibs]

Glad to see another first gen with Pontiac power! setup looks really fun.

[Josue]

Great thread!!!

Rides Great! Im not getting the full benefit becausemy steering box is ****ty Cardone that is light as a feather and twitchy... Thinking of going with the new Hotchkis Delphi 600 box or the AGR one.

Will have an update on that soon!

Which box is the "Cardone" one? Never heard of it, and I've been researching the hell out of this quick ratio steering crap lately. haha

I had my box first done by Lee for the quick ratio. Then got a AGR pump. Found out the box still had the stock torsion bar and was way to light for my liking. Sent box to AGR for a new torsion bar. So far so good but I think you should do the Delphi box.

Was a stock torsion bar not supposed to be in a Lee rebuilt box? A screw up on their part? It seemed like Lee's was one of the top places to go for quick ratio steering.

[Mr Nick]

Just saw this thread, great build. As an Oldsmobile guy and general BOP fan, I say "thank you" for leaving it Pontiac powered.

[rohrt]

Great thread!!!



Which box is the "Cardone" one? Never heard of it, and I've been researching the hell out of this quick ratio steering crap lately. haha



Was a stock torsion bar not supposed to be in a Lee rebuilt box? A screw up on their part? It seemed like Lee's was one of the top places to go for quick ratio steering.

Don't know if it was Lee screw up or if they just changed out the gear as Standard Operating Procedure. I used AGR the second time because I had a bad AGR pump (ebay crap) that I had to send in and so I sent in the box as well to change the Torsion Bar. When I talked with AGR about the box they took down a lot of info on the car weight, wheel size and steering wheel diameter. I don't know if I would recommend AGR just yet. I have a PS leak somewhere. I think its the pump housing not sure yet.

[Josue]

Gotcha!

I'm all about a bolt in solution too. I was researching the Jeep Grand Cherokee swap, but I don't like the idea of messing with different/custom hoses, fittings, Lee's adapters, etc. Plus I guess you never know what ratio you're getting if you get a reman box, and I wouldn't want to do a junkyard box. I just want to unbolt the stock one, and bolt a new one back in. powersteering.com might be a good solution for me, to rebuild my original, and he even includes a new pitman arm.

[salesguy01]

This is the Cardone Box, It is supposed to be a 3rd gen ws6 box, but I dont really know what it is other than crap....


Cardone 27-6550 Remanufactured Power Steering Gear

[Josue]

I'll know which one to stay away from now! haha

With all the suspension modifications, did your rubbing issues go away?