What crossmembers and driveshaft work for an ls swap in a gen 1 camaro?

[69greyghost]

Guys what crossmembers and driveshafts work well with what transmissions? I.E.:if I use a t56 will a turbo 400 crossmember work with some tweaking, or if I use a 4l80e do I have to get an aftermarket trans and so on. I have asked this question before on a different forum but got really no answers. I currently have a 4spd muncie crossmember and driveshaft and wanted to know if I can use these for any trans that works with the ls or are they useless other than a 4 spd aplication?

[Z06vet]

T56 you will likely need aftermarket crossmember, I havent been able to make any of the staock stuff work without fabrication.. 4L60e you can move the stock 350/4spd crossmember back & drill new holes. Or an aftermarket by bowtie overdrives for 700R4/4L60 is about $175. I've never used the 4L80 in first gen, but many have. I'm not sure if any tunnel mods are needed or which xmember on that one. Driveshaft will have to be shortened or have a new one made. You'll have to wait until motor/trans/rear is installed, and the car at ride height so you can take an accurate measurement for the driveshaft.

[69greyghost]

Is the bmr crossmember the best bet for either trans?

[Tom Welch]

look up Speedtech's crossmember. Top quality and it fits perfectly. Any competent driveline shop can build a new one or adjust the length of an existing shaft.

[jwcarguy]

look up Speedtech's crossmember. Top quality and it fits perfectly. Any competent driveline shop can build a new one or adjust the length of an existing shaft.

X2 !!
skip all the researching and go with what is proven to work and work well! The ATS / Speed Tech adjustable crossmember for the T56

I just used one on my personal 68' LS2 /T56 swap along with the Dirty Dingo slider adjustable engine mounting plates

the Doug's Headers fit like a glove with my Lee Mfg. Delphi 600 steering gear box on my stock subframe

These are things that you don't want to go the "budget route" (ie Ebay knock offs!!)

You should also get the ATS / Speed tech Clutch Master Cylinder Firewall bracket too!

Give Blake at Speed Tech a call, great guy to deal with!!

[Toddoky]

X2 !!
skip all the researching and go with what is proven to work and work well! The ATS / Speed Tech adjustable crossmember for the T56

I just used one on my personal 68' LS2 /T56 swap along with the Dirty Dingo slider adjustable engine mounting plates

the Doug's Headers fit like a glove with my Lee Mfg. Delphi 600 steering gear box on my stock subframe

These are things that you don't want to go the "budget route" (ie Ebay knock offs!!)

You should also get the ATS / Speed tech Clutch Master Cylinder Firewall bracket too!

Give Blake at Speed Tech a call, great guy to deal with!!

The LS swap market is maturing more and more all the time, so keeping your eyes open for new products that correct some long standing issues is always a good idea. A case in point would be the Hooker 1st-gen T56 LS swap crossmember I've attached here, which will be released by the SEMA show as one part of the most comprehensive LS swap kit to date for this application. There is also a 4L60-4L75 crossmember available and both were CAD designed (like the engine mounting brackets) and validated by FEA analysis to take a pounding and provide the highest exhaust passage clearance available. In addition to the mounting components mentioned above, there will also be mid-length and long tube headers (mild steel and stainless steel) and 2.5" and 3" exhaust systems available with stamped crossovers and unbelievable ground clearance.

[jwcarguy]

The LS swap market is maturing more and more all the time, so keeping your eyes open for new products that correct some long standing issues is always a good idea. A case in point would be the Hooker 1st-gen T56 LS swap crossmember I've attached here, which will be released by the SEMA show as one part of the most comprehensive LS swap kit to date for this application. There is also a 4L60-4L75 crossmember available and both were CAD designed (like the engine mounting brackets) and validated by FEA analysis to take a pounding and provide the highest exhaust passage clearance available. In addition to the mounting components mentioned above, there will also be mid-length and long tube headers (mild steel and stainless steel) and 2.5" and 3" exhaust systems available with stamped crossovers and unbelievable ground clearance.

That is great news!!

I like the looks of that crossmember with alot of clearance for exhaust!!

Interested to see the "LS swap kit" to be released at SEMA!

[69greyghost]

---

Thanks Todd, I have been leaning towards the bowtie overdrives crossmember if I got t56 http://www.bowtieoverdrives.com/cata...php?ITEMID=690
Its the right price, and they seem reputable, I will look into your suggestion however.
__________________

[Tim john---]

Do you have a part number for the above cross member and or a supplier ? Nice looking part. Thank You.

Tim john---

[Toddoky]

Do you have a part number for the above cross member and or a supplier ? Nice looking part. Thank You.

Tim john---

I could give you the part number but it won't get you anywhere just yet Tim as it has not been released into the system yet. We are waiting for the 1st producting run of the matching engine mounting brackets to be completed before releasing the crossmembers for this application as they cannot be used with other engine mounting brackets due to their unique alignment geometry. Whereas the stock engine mounts and transmission crossmembers mount the engine and transmission of a 1st-gen engine and transmission just off center towards the passenger side, the Hooker engine mounts and transmission crossmembers mount both dead center in the chassis, like most aftermarket subframes do. If you used this crossmember in a universal fashion with typical swap plates on the market, your engine and trans will be mounted slightly at an angle, which is not a good thing. The only way you could go about doing it would be to offset the center holes in the crossmember towards the passenger side about 3/16" either by making an offset adapter plate. Now that I've let the cat out of the bag as to what is coming from Hooker shortly, I will be updating the release dates of these components as the actual dates become known. As of now, the planned release of every new component for this swap application is scheduled to hit just before the SEMA show the first week of November.

[Tim john---]

Thanks for the detailed update. I was going to order my engine mounts this week from DSE for the LS transplant I have in mind. I am going to install a modern GTO engine in a 69 Firebird convertible along with a Tremec six speed manual transmission. Wanting to do it right the first time around perhaps it will be best to see what Hooker has to offer in "kit" form. One question comes to mind in this new "corrected" geomerty, will the shifter not come up through the factory console then ? Tremec offers an offset shifter to hit the hole spot on and if a factory dimension is moved this will alter the shifter somewhat...right ? rendering my original floor console useless. Thank You for the update.

Tim john---

[Toddoky]

Thanks for the detailed update. I was going to order my engine mounts this week from DSE for the LS transplant I have in mind. I am going to install a modern GTO engine in a 69 Firebird convertible along with a Tremec six speed manual transmission. Wanting to do it right the first time around perhaps it will be best to see what Hooker has to offer in "kit" form. One question comes to mind in this new "corrected" geomerty, will the shifter not come up through the factory console then ? Tremec offers an offset shifter to hit the hole spot on and if a factory dimension is moved this will alter the shifter somewhat...right ? rendering my original floor console useless. Thank You for the update.

Tim john---

The variation in shifter location will be very slight Tim as the stock small block engine offset of 1st-gens is only about 3/16" to the passenger side, which is nowhere near the standard 3/8" passenger side offset that GM used on 2nd-gens any many of their other cars. Most of the popular aftermarket subframes (DSE's included) also center the engine and transmission in the subframe by design, so you can do some web searching to see what the users of those subframes do with the shifter alignment, i.e. nothing or use an offset shifter of some type to reposition it.

[Tim john---]

Again, Thank You for the detailed response. Please post an update when the forementioned items will become available. With the information you have provided this gives me confidence that the Hooker system will work out just fine. Thank You for taking the time to educate myself as well as other members.

Now I just need to come up with a nice madrel bent exhaust system for a 69 Firebird convertible that is (has DSE mini tubs) mini tubbed with a modern GTO LS-1 engine in place ! any reccomendations ?

Tim john---

[Toddoky]

Again, Thank You for the detailed response. Please post an update when the forementioned items will become available. With the information you have provided this gives me confidence that the Hooker system will work out just fine. Thank You for taking the time to educate myself as well as other members.

Now I just need to come up with a nice madrel bent exhaust system for a 69 Firebird convertible that is (has DSE mini tubs) mini tubbed with a modern GTO LS-1 engine in place ! any reccomendations ?

Tim john---

No problem, glad I could help. As far as the exhaust goes, you're going to have to plan to possibly modify any exhaust system you purchase that is going on a car that has gone through the DSE mini-tube modification. With that said and depending on what your schedule for completion is, I'd say an excellent choice would be one of the new Hooker 2.5" or 3" systems that will be coming out as part of the new swap package. Even though they are designed as a direct bolt-in kit for use with our headers on 1st-gen LS swaps, they can be just as easily modified to fit any LS or non-LS 1st-gen as any other universal exhaust systems out there. If you want a stainless system with really nice mufflers, hangers and hardware and awesome ground clearance then one of these systems might suit your needs well. The attached photo shows the new Hooker 3" exhaust system for the 2nd-gen F-body swap that is similar in its componet, hardware and built quality makeup.

[Tim john---]

Thank You for the timely response. I need to keep in mind that this car is a convertible with the lower brace (convertible specific), is mini tubbed and will have the LS and I plan on running the modern factory cast iron GTO exhaust manifolds. I have no desire to go to 3", (2 1/2" is my desire) leaving the engine in stock form. I do not want to use a universal kit for this application. I am perfectly capable to cut, bend, weld and come up with a system and may have to but if I can take the car to a shop and have it all precision bent with mandrel dies, this would be my preference. I could bend it myself if I had a mandrel table bender for I have bent tubing for well over 35 plus years and am very skilled at it. I also prefer to have a single transverse muffler, to not have two mufflers hanging down from a side view. How high up would the Hooker muffer system be, would the mufflers be hidden from view frm the side of the vehicle from like 10' back ? Once again I Thank You for your time and input.

Tim john---

[Toddoky]

Thank You for the timely response. I need to keep in mind that this car is a convertible with the lower brace (convertible specific), is mini tubbed and will have the LS and I plan on running the modern factory cast iron GTO exhaust manifolds. I have no desire to go to 3", (2 1/2" is my desire) leaving the engine in stock form. I do not want to use a universal kit for this application. I am perfectly capable to cut, bend, weld and come up with a system and may have to but if I can take the car to a shop and have it all precision bent with mandrel dies, this would be my preference. I could bend it myself if I had a mandrel table bender for I have bent tubing for well over 35 plus years and am very skilled at it. I also prefer to have a single transverse muffler, to not have two mufflers hanging down from a side view. How high up would the Hooker muffer system be, would the mufflers be hidden from view frm the side of the vehicle from like 10' back ? Once again I Thank You for your time and input.

Tim john---

Hey Tim, this is the Hooker 3" system prototypes on a 1st-gen complete with the 1-7/8" long-tube headers...this amount of ground clearance is possible primarily due to the headers and transmission crossmember, which really allow the front end of the system to be packed up tight into the car. If you chose to run our mid-length headers and the 2.5" system, I don't think you'd see the exhaust at all as that system is built on the same centerline axis as the larger 3" system. The fact that you are looking for something for a convertible will probably nulify this whole recommendation as no allowances were made for fitment on those cars...good luck to you on that project.

[Tim john---]

Wow, That is tucked up under there nicely, well done. So I assume the convertible support bracket is the deal breaker for me ? Thank You for all your assistance, the search for a quality exhaust system shall continue.

Tim john---

[Toddoky]

Wow, That is tucked up under there nicely, well done. So I assume the convertible support bracket is the deal breaker for me ? Thank You for all your assistance, the search for a quality exhaust system shall continue.

Tim john---

Thanks Tim,we knew that we really needed to achieve awesome ground clearance with this kit and the one for the 2nd-gen to really say we have something different to offer. To be honest, we never attempted to install the kit on a convertible and so I have no idea what the convertible brace even looks like. Maybe if you could share some detailed pictures with me we can determine if there would be a fitment issue or not, who knows, maybe I'll catch a lucky break and have another application I can add to the system. I think you'll find it worth your while if you are looking something with an elevated level of fitment and attention to detail in the hardware and hangers. Let me know if you are interested.


Todd

[rickpaw]

Hey Tim, this is the Hooker 3" system prototypes on a 1st-gen complete with the 1-7/8" long-tube headers...this amount of ground clearance is possible primarily due to the headers and transmission crossmember, which really allow the front end of the system to be packed up tight into the car.

That tucks up real nice. I have Dynatech headers on my 67 after the LS swap, and the headers hang real low, about 3.5 from the ground. I may have to look into your new header once it's released.

[Tim john---]

Todd, Good morning. Here is a photo of the floor pan brace on a 69 Firebird. This is not my actual car, I captured this image online with a quick Google search. Hopefully you can make out and determine if you can assist in any way. Very much appriciated.

Some how I ended up with two images of the same photo ? Various vendors do offer a tapered wedge / shim to lower this brace (one one each side of the brace) for exhaust clearance but my preference is to have a nice clean and professional installation, not shims, wedges and bandaid affairs.

Tim john---