Holley Performance Products Terminator EFI

[Derekk]

I'm happy to announce that Holley is taking pre-orders for the Terminator EFI kits. The polished units, 550-405, will be shipping mid May (according to manufacturing), and retail @ $1999.95. The Hardcore Gray units, 550-406, will ship at months end (according to manufacturing), and retails @ $2049.95. These units will include the ecu, harness's, sensors, and throttle body assembly. Fuel pumps/lines, fittings, filters, and regulator will need to be purchased separately. Please call the tech line if you would like to inquire about these units. The tech line is open 6 days a week. 270-781-9741.

75597

[Nicks67GTO]

Cool looking setup. Ill be in the market for this stuff in about 6-9 months. Can I ask how this is better or any different than the FAST EZ EFI setup?

[Merlin]

There is no specific mention of a wideband O2 sensor. I assume it does not come with the kit. Which brand/type do you suggest?

Cliff
369 CP Chevelle

[Ketzer]

Cool looking setup. Ill be in the market for this stuff in about 6-9 months. Can I ask how this is better or any different than the FAST EZ EFI setup?

x2.

[Mr Nick]

Cool looking setup. Ill be in the market for this stuff in about 6-9 months. Can I ask how this is better or any different than the FAST EZ EFI setup?

I believe it controls timing (with the appropriate ignition box) and is laptop tunable if you want to use one instead of small handheld unit. Can also be upgraded to work with boost. I didn't care about that stuff, so recently purchased the original EZ-EFI. If I didn't already have a programmable MSD 6AL-2 I would have strongly considered this new Holley unit, looks like a great product! And much better appearing than the other Holley throttle bodies!

[Derekk]

Cool looking setup. Ill be in the market for this stuff in about 6-9 months. Can I ask how this is better or any different than the FAST EZ EFI setup?


There is no specific mention of a wideband O2 sensor. I assume it does not come with the kit. Which brand/type do you suggest? Cliff
369 CP Chevelle


x2.

The Bosch wideband oxygen sensor is included with the kits.

With the EZ EFI systems, the ecu is very limited in what it can control, and what the end user can manipulate in the tune. The terminator will come with the same ECU that has been in the Avenger, and HP efi systems for 4 years. The ecu can control timing with several different types of ignition systems (HEI, TFI, COP, Waste Spark DIS, crank triggers, etc), without requiring the use of additional modules. Also, it can control 4 inputs/4 outputs which can be used for electric fans, driveshaft speed sensor, nitrous control (progressive 4 stage control), boost control, traction control, and many other functions. What makes the ecu more flexible is the fact it can be used on a throttle body injection, then simply switch the engine harness's if you want to swap to Multi Port injection. The ecu also allows the end user access to tune in speed density, alpha-N, or combination modes. This is great when you have a big nasty cam, and need to tune the idle area to compensate. So in short, the EZ EFI ecu is primitive when being compared to the Holley EFI computers.

[riles]

Finally. Will be ordering soon. Good price compared to others (F.A.S.T., MSD).

[Derekk]

Finally. Will be ordering soon. Good price compared to others (F.A.S.T., MSD).

It's a really nice piece.

[BBC71Nova]

How does the height of these throttle bodies compare to a standard 4150 carb height? I've long considered putting one of these style setups on my FFR but I have virtually no room to spare under the hood. They appear taller in pictures but that could be optical illusion because they don't have bowls to lengthen them out.

BTW very nice looking piece! Now what about maybe getting with ATI so they'll produce a damper shell to go with your 60-2 DIS system :-). Us PT guys can't afford to space everything out for the reluctor wheel due to the front accessory drives.

Thanks!

[Derekk]

How does the height of these throttle bodies compare to a standard 4150 carb height? I've long considered putting one of these style setups on my FFR but I have virtually no room to spare under the hood. They appear taller in pictures but that could be optical illusion because they don't have bowls to lengthen them out.

BTW very nice looking piece! Now what about maybe getting with ATI so they'll produce a damper shell to go with your 60-2 DIS system :-). Us PT guys can't afford to space everything out for the reluctor wheel due to the front accessory drives.

Thanks!The Terminator throttle body is 3" tall from the base to the air cleaner flange. I'm not sure who you have talked to, but John, and Chris @ ATI confirmed that they will machine the 60-2 trigger pattern into a shell. So your concerns shouldn't be a worry any longer. Throttle body is shorter than the Holley Ultra HP carbs (3.25" from base to air cleaner flange), and ATI will build you a balancer with any pattern you want. Let me know if I can help further. Thank you, Derek

[BBC71Nova]

Hey Derek. Thanks for the follow-up. I should've been more specific. You are correct. When I spoke to ATI back a while about this they did say they would build a shell. Matter of fact, they had built a few 60-2 shells for NRE. I assume those were for Electromotive ECUs which may be same as your 60-2?

The primary problem was that it was considered "custom" and thus had a long lead time and was priced as such, i.e. significantly more than a non-custom trigger shell. The number I got was $800+ or something for the shell. There was also a good bit of risk with that because it was on me to provide the design requirements. They've since worked with AEM to develop a trigger shell for the Infinity system and that new shell appears to be priced closer to their typical trigger shells. That product release was what triggered me - pun intended :) - to think maybe similar could be done for Holley.

Anyway, I was just thinking maybe with the popularity of the newer Holley EFI w/DIS that maybe you guys could work with ATI to get them the correct info they'd need to design the shell. Then maybe it would be closer to a "stock item" than a "custom".

[obengston]

I called about a month ago to inquire some info on this unit. I was trying to find out if this unit could be used with a nitrous system (plate style). Was told that this unit was still being tested, and that it has been talked about and may be a option. So has this been addressed or can it be done with this unit? Thanks

[Derekk]

Hey Derek. Thanks for the follow-up. I should've been more specific. You are correct. When I spoke to ATI back a while about this they did say they would build a shell. Matter of fact, they had built a few 60-2 shells for NRE. I assume those were for Electromotive ECUs which may be same as your 60-2?

The primary problem was that it was considered "custom" and thus had a long lead time and was priced as such, i.e. significantly more than a non-custom trigger shell. The number I got was $800+ or something for the shell. There was also a good bit of risk with that because it was on me to provide the design requirements. They've since worked with AEM to develop a trigger shell for the Infinity system and that new shell appears to be priced closer to their typical trigger shells. That product release was what triggered me - pun intended :) - to think maybe similar could be done for Holley.

Anyway, I was just thinking maybe with the popularity of the newer Holley EFI w/DIS that maybe you guys could work with ATI to get them the correct info they'd need to design the shell. Then maybe it would be closer to a "stock item" than a "custom".I can probably get you the pattern. I don't see where it would be a big deal. Before I release it I would have to get approval. I didn't think about asking them a price to machine one. I've been slammed since I came back to work. Data logs, emails, and phone calls keep me very busy. If I get a chance to follow up with ATI I will surely do so.


I called about a month ago to inquire some info on this unit. I was trying to find out if this unit could be used with a nitrous system (plate style). Was told that this unit was still being tested, and that it has been talked about and may be a option. So has this been addressed or can it be done with this unit? ThanksYou could run a wet plate under the throttle body. However, it has not been tested, and the tune ups would be something for the end user to figure out. My suggestion, if considering this, would be to have the nitrous system flowed for high pressure. I wouldn't suggest a dry nitrous setup at this time due to the injector sizing. We are very limited in resources, and it's a stretch to release what we do, all while working on 6 other product lines. FYI, if anyone has called us in the last 3 weeks, you should get that feeling. 35-50 minute wait times on the tech line :(

[sccacuda]

Hey Derek. Thanks for the follow-up. I should've been more specific. You are correct. When I spoke to ATI back a while about this they did say they would build a shell. Matter of fact, they had built a few 60-2 shells for NRE. I assume those were for Electromotive ECUs which may be same as your 60-2?

The primary problem was that it was considered "custom" and thus had a long lead time and was priced as such, i.e. significantly more than a non-custom trigger shell. The number I got was $800+ or something for the shell. There was also a good bit of risk with that because it was on me to
provide the design requirements. They've since worked with AEM to develop a trigger shell for the Infinity system and that new shell appears to be priced closer to their typical trigger shells. That product release was what triggered me - pun intended :) - to think maybe similar could be done for Holley.

Anyway, I was just thinking maybe with the popularity of the newer Holley EFI w/DIS that maybe you guys could work with ATI to get them the correct info they'd need to design the shell. Then maybe it would be closer to a "stock item" than a "custom".


I talked to ATI last year as well. The shell is $350 and the lead time was 8 weeks. That is to put on your existing ATI damper. The issue is where to put #1. It will be different with different engines. They have LS and SB Chevy clocked, put you have to provide the info for anything else.

I agree it would be nice if Holley offered this as an option, just one more advantage over the other guys, but probably way down the road.

[Derekk]

I can't dictate what another company charges for a balancer. However I can tell you the pattern is very straight forward. 60 evenly spaced teeth, with 2 teeth removed during machining. The teeth have the same amount of "rise", and "fall". I could give you the dimensions for our wheels, however the diameter of the balancer changes the spacing between teeth. So my trigger wheel may not have the correct pattern for your applications. Another viable option, is Innovators West. I've been using their balancers for many years with success.

[70Uglybird]

Does that line on the left of the carb come up to the top of the tb? I have a roller 466 and the next mod is fi but its gotta fig under a formula hood with a torquer ii and a drop base air cleaner.

Very interested in this setup.

[Derekk]

Does that line on the left of the carb come up to the top of the tb? I have a roller 466 and the next mod is fi but its gotta fig under a formula hood with a torquer ii and a drop base air cleaner.

Very interested in this setup.

The inlet comes in on one rail, goes through the cross over (does not go higher than the air cleaner flange), then exit's on the opposite rail. The regulator is installed after the throttle body, and the return line goes from the regulator to the fuel tank.

[70Uglybird]

I don't think that is doing to work with the formula air cleaner. Is that a hard line or can it be adjusted/modified to hand sideways? Ill have to see if any local shops carry it to test it.

[Merlin]

I'm currently setting up my fuel system. Can wait to try the Terminator efi. What is the size of the fuel fitting? 08-an, 06-an, 06 orb, 08 orb? Thank you very much.

Cliff
369 CP Chevelle

[Derekk]

I'm currently setting up my fuel system. Can wait to try the Terminator efi. What is the size of the fuel fitting? 08-an, 06-an, 06 orb, 08 orb? Thank you very much.

Cliff
369 CP Chevelle

The fittings in the rails are 6 AN Oring sealed

[Merlin]

Thank you Derek for the quick response. Now I can order all the fittings.

Cliff
369 CP Chevelle

[Nicks67GTO]

Another question. I bought a used 455 Pontiac engine last year and it runs great. The problem is I have no idea what the cam specs are or the exact compression. All I know is its very mild, pulls 18" of vacuum at idle and runs fine on 89 octane. Without knowing these things, is there any way to get your system to work with my 455" mystery engine, until i build another?

[Derekk]

Another question. I bought a used 455 Pontiac engine last year and it runs great. The problem is I have no idea what the cam specs are or the exact compression. All I know is its very mild, pulls 18" of vacuum at idle and runs fine on 89 octane. Without knowing these things, is there any way to get your system to work with my 455" mystery engine, until i build another?18" of vacuum tells me the cam is very mild, and the engine is sealed fairly well. As long as you are not over 600HP, the Terminator can be used on your application.

[Ketzer]

I have high hopes of going FI on my BBC but it is right at 600hp and only holds about 10" of vacuum at idle. My setup may not be "ideal" for FI.


Jeff-

[Derekk]

I have high hopes of going FI on my BBC but it is right at 600hp and only holds about 10" of vacuum at idle. My setup may not be "ideal" for FI.


Jeff-

The ecu can be tuned in speed density, alpha-N, or combination. So any engine from street to race can be tuned. Keep in mind that as tuning strategies change, the tuning level of difficulty increases. Holley throttle body injection is limited to 600HP at this time due to the limited amount of fuel flow. Anyone that is making more than 600HP should be considering multi port injection IMO.

[Chevelle489efi]

Will Holley write a program for cars with A/C to bump up idle when A/C is turn on?

[Derekk]

Will Holley write a program for cars with A/C to bump up idle when A/C is turn on?All you need to do is enable the IAC kick under the A/C Basic I/O. Once enabled, wire the input, and assign the pin location in the pin map.

[wadem]

Looks good Derek,you could always send your buddy down here in Ga one for some testing in the shop on my new project,lol.

[hifi875]

When I turn my air on the idle automaticaLly adjust. You dont need to do anything. I didn't anyway

[Derekk]

Looks good Derek,you could always send your buddy down here in Ga one for some testing in the shop on my new project,lol.
Wade - What are you building? How close is it to being completed?


When I turn my air on the idle automaticaLly adjust. You dont need to do anything. I didn't anyway Some applications will need the IAC kick, some don't. If your IAC responds to the engine load, and it brings the idle rpm up, that's great. Not all combinations can recover that quickly. That's why we have the IAC kick. Some applications will stall out when the A/C is enabled. To activate the IAC momentary bump, the I/O has to be enabled, and pin mapped. The default setting looks for 12V.

[wadem]

Wade - What are you building? How close is it to being completed?



68 camaro.its honestly will probably be the end of summer or so before it is finished up and drivable,not going to be super over the top but clean and were going to drive it everywhere to events

[Derekk]

68 camaro.its honestly will probably be the end of summer or so before it is finished up and drivable,not going to be super over the top but clean and were going to drive it everywhere to events How much power?

[wadem]

probably 400.its not very wild or radical,like i said its something we are going to drive everywhere

[Chevelle489efi]

Is Fast efi 2.0 better? order my Holley EFI on back order. Why should I keep my Holey?

[Derekk]

Is Fast efi 2.0 better? order my Holley EFI on back order. Why should I keep my Holey?What did you order, and when? Also, which FAST part number are you wanting me to compare to?

[Chevelle489efi]

new fast 2.0 ez efi just release I purchased terminator.

[Ollie8974]

Another question. I bought a used 455 Pontiac engine last year and it runs great. The problem is I have no idea what the cam specs are or the exact compression. All I know is its very mild, pulls 18" of vacuum at idle and runs fine on 89 octane. Without knowing these things, is there any way to get your system to work with my 455" mystery engine, until i build another?

What are the number-letters cast on the center exhaust ports.

[Derekk]

new fast 2.0 ez efi just release I purchased terminator.

HEFI Terminator is cheaper than the FAST EZ 2.0
HEFI Terminator can be tuned by laptop if needed for applications that need a little more tunability
HEFI Terminator has the 700R4 kickdown attachment integrated into the throttle lever
HEFI CFD modeled air entry. Same technology used by NASCAR.
Technical Service available 6 days a week via email, and phone. I'm also available on several internet forums for quicker assistance.

We are building, and shipping weekly. I'd wait for your kit.

[hifi875]

The terminator is a great piece IMO. It works great. Performs great. Easy to install. The fuel system is more work to install than the system. It is very install friendly

[mincharlie]

Man I would really like to try that on my 454! Hope to buy one before rtth. Can it be run with the push lock fittings or will the 45# be to much pressure? I have 1/2 line now with a holley mechanical pump and holley billet regulator. Wish I could use those to save some money. Looks like a great product, I've always loved holley's.

[Derekk]

Man I would really like to try that on my 454! Hope to buy one before rtth. Can it be run with the push lock fittings or will the 45# be to much pressure? I have 1/2 line now with a holley mechanical pump and holley billet regulator. Wish I could use those to save some money. Looks like a great product, I've always loved holley's.

If you are running Earl's Super Stock hose, the push lok fittings will work fine. If you are using some other brand, you will need to check with that manufacturer.

[chillininnh]

Just installed Holley Terminator EFI on my 69 Mach 418W, I am very pleased with the results. Using Ford TFI to control the timing, pieced together the fuel system using an Aeromotive 18697 tank and PTFE fuel line. I have had to do nothing but drive the car. Write the check, EFI is worth every penny.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/07/20130703_195636_zps02b4666d-1.jpg (http://s63.photobucket.com/user/chillininnh/media/20130703_195636_zps02b4666d.jpg.html)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/07/20130515_105335_382_zpse6e42bdf-1.jpg (http://s63.photobucket.com/user/chillininnh/media/2013-05-15_10-53-35_382_zpse6e42bdf.jpg.html)

[Derekk]

Just installed Holley Terminator EFI on my 69 Mach 418W, I am very pleased with the results. Using Ford TFI to control the timing, pieced together the fuel system using an Aeromotive 18697 tank and PTFE fuel line. I have had to do nothing but drive the car. Write the check, EFI is worth every penny.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/07/20130703_195636_zps02b4666d-1.jpg (http://s63.photobucket.com/user/chillininnh/media/20130703_195636_zps02b4666d.jpg.html)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/07/20130515_105335_382_zpse6e42bdf-1.jpg (http://s63.photobucket.com/user/chillininnh/media/2013-05-15_10-53-35_382_zpse6e42bdf.jpg.html)Nice looking ride. Glad you are a satisfied customer

[scott67ss396]

derek looking to put it on a zz454, should be good

[Derekk]

Nice. Post some pics as you go along.

[Nicks67GTO]

What are the number-letters cast on the center exhaust ports.

Its a 73' 455, .030 over, cast piston, cast rod, performer intake and its got 6X-4 heads on it

[Chevelle489efi]

Anyone got Terminator EFI installed . POST Pic's

[Derek@ModernSpeed]

hifi875 has it on his Camaro.

[another69]

How does it control the fuel pump? Does it just turn the pump "on" with the key on or will it prime the lines and run the pump only while the engine is running? Can it be used return less? If it needs a return line can it be used with some sort of a fuel pump speed controller, like the one made by Aeromotive? (I'm thinking of using one of the Aeromotive drop in tanks).

[Derek@ModernSpeed]

The pump will come on for a 5 second "prime" cycle, shut off, then come back on as the ecu picks up the rpm signal. The system cannot be used with a returnless fuel system, you can use a pump controller if you like, however you may end up keeping the fuel pump independent of the ecu control. The ecu outputs a solid 12V signal. You might be better off allowing the ecu to send 12V to a secondary relay, which provides the 12V to the controller.

[another69]

Ok. Do you think that the Aeromotive "Stealth" pump (340 liters/hour) looks like a good fit with the Terminator? I want an in tank pump that flows enough to supply the motor but not too much so that it overheats the fuel and itself. Thats why I was thinking a fuel pump controller. I really don't want to overcomplicate things if I don't have to though. I'd rather not use one if its not needed. I like the way the ecu primes and then turns on with a rpm signal - will it turn off the pump if it looses the rpm signal? Also how much fuel pressure does the Terminator efi run at?

[Derek@ModernSpeed]

I think the 340 lph pump without a controller will be fine. The system runs at 43 psi. The pump, and ignition will shut down when the ecu loses the rpm signal.

[another69]

Ok. So far your system really stands out. Before this thread I was leaning toward the MSD or FAST, but I really like the upgradeability of your system, and the OEM sort of way that you run the pump is great too. One other thing that I can't seem to find much info on with your system though is ignition timing. What kind of ignitions does your system support? I have a very simple "billet" distributor that runs off of a MSD digital 6 box. So the distributor only controls mechanical advance, actual spark distribution to the motor, and provides a reference signal to the MSD. Having timing control is nice, but not really a deal breaker for me. Would your system be able to control my timing?

[Derek@ModernSpeed]

Yes, the Holley can control the timing. You can actually use the magnetic distributor you have. Lock the rotor, wire the distributor up as a crank trigger, and sync the timing with the ecu. Pretty simple/standard setup. You will continue to use the MSD 6 box to energize the coil in this application. Let me know if you need pricing.

[another69]

Give me pricing if you can. I am planning on using an Aeromotive tank and would be more than happy to give you any other info that you need.

[Greg from Aus]

Hi Guys,

Looking for some information on what I need. I have a Dominator ECU, I need to order the harnesses, can you please let me know which ones.

I have a 440 RHS block with mast motor sport heads, Ozmo dual throtle body setup with fly by wire. I have the recomended GM throtle body's and pedal assembly. We are going to run it on E85 with 2 x ZL1 fuel pumps and the Vaporworx controller.

Thanks in advance
Greg

[riles]

Hey Derek,
I'm installing the holley fuel system for an LS1 with the 550-602 ECU & Harness. Did all the wiring but can't seem to find a wire for the electric cooling fans, though there is a hookup for temp. Also can't figure which wire to use for the factory tach, though there is a yellow wire for RPM out (do not use on CD coil). Is this the wire to use for tach?

[Ron.in.SoCal]

Hi Guys,

Looking for some information on what I need. I have a Dominator ECU, I need to order the harnesses, can you please let me know which ones.

I have a 440 RHS block with mast motor sport heads, Ozmo dual throtle body setup with fly by wire. I have the recomended GM throtle body's and pedal assembly. We are going to run it on E85 with 2 x ZL1 fuel pumps and the Vaporworx controller.

Thanks in advance
Greg

Greg - John510 in Lat-G has looked into this and may be able to help.

[Greg from Aus]

Thanks Ron.

[Chevelle489efi]

Got my EFi up and running on my 489BBC. But idles at 1200 rpms any help

[hifi875]

vacuum leak^^^ mine did the same thing, and found a leak.

[Chevelle489efi]

On manifold or TBI

[Derek@ModernSpeed]

Also check the iac %. Vacuum leaks, to much throttle opening, and iac position will affect the idle speed.

[Derek@ModernSpeed]

Hey Derek,
I'm installing the holley fuel system for an LS1 with the 550-602 ECU & Harness. Did all the wiring but can't seem to find a wire for the electric cooling fans, though there is a hookup for temp. Also can't figure which wire to use for the factory tach, though there is a yellow wire for RPM out (do not use on CD coil). Is this the wire to use for tach?i would suggest using harness 558-400 to connect your fan(s). The yellow wire, if located in A1, can be relocated to A28. This is a 12v square wave output. Same signal auto meter uses for their tachs. I'm not certain the factory tach uses the same signal. Research before connecting.

Sorry for not being on lately. I'm working with several people and 3 ultra street/ real street race cars and getting my website finished. Feel free to call me or email me if I don't reply promptly to a pm. Thanks guys.

[oestek]

Here's a video series of a Holley Terminator system we installed on a '65 Chevelle. The install went smoothly, and the car drives really nicely.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yCJxQrLU0s4


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SkMv2OvzDew


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bpuXdYMnJ3c