G-body coil over conversion questions

[chumscustoms]

I am some what new to the pro touring/ autox stuff, I have a 88 monte ss with a RamJet 350 and 700r4, it is the car i cruise with. Ihave been fascinated with the autocross at the goodguys showsand the little ive seen on the power tour.
I have hotchkis lowering springs onthe car at the moment, I would like to lower the car more and also convert to something for better handling whilei am doing it.
I see Ride Tech has acoil over kit for my set up, and some other companies. I amgoing to utilize my stock arms for the moment, but would like to get my car a littel lower than the 1.5 inch drop from my springs. I will put spindles on if i need,
my questions are.

1. shoudl i just get single adjustables for now, and then someday upgrade to triples when i know how to set them and the car has the reast of the upgrades that i want.

2. how much adjustmant will my coil overs allow me for lowering.

3. If i go with different a arms like Ride Tech or DSE, will the drop spindles effect the gained benefits from the geometry changes that they claim to have made.

I just want to make my best effort to get it close to right the first time, not 4 times and 3 grand later.

4.is the step from single adjustables to double worth the money or just get singles now and wait till i have the coin and knowledge to get triples.

[marolf101x]

If this car is driven 80% on the street I suggest the single adjustable units. Triples are great if you know how to utilize them. I tell people all the time. . .think of it this way. . .there are a thousand ways to set the shocks. . .3 of which will give you the best performance. . .what are the odds you will set them correctly?

If you want to stick with your current front arms and springs you'll need our "Q-Series" smooth body, OE replacement shocks:
http://www.ridetech.com/store/shocks/

These can be had in either fixed valve (RQ) or single adjustable (RQ). So if you use the coil over conversion in the rear, with the RQ coil overs, use the RQ smooth bodies in the front so the shock valving is correct.

[SSLance]

In order to get a G-Body to turn well, the first thing you must do is correct the horrible front end geometry. I ended up choosing the Detroit Speed upper control arms to do this and they really woke the car up. Was like driving a different car. At the same I also put DSE's 2" drop springs front and rear and retained the stock spindles up front. Their springs are a great match for the car, the front and rear are balanced out really well and now I'm just tweaking on little things to edge a little bit more out of it here and there. Shocks are next on my list but have been doing pretty well with my 5 year old off the shelf Edelbrock IAS shocks for now.

The main thing is to correct the caster and camber deficiencies these cars are built with. The DSE upper arms completely rearrange the upper ball joint's position and travel completely changing how the car steers and rides. Be wary of other tubular upper control arms on the market as most of them do not change the geometry at all, leaving the ball joint in the factory position.

[UNGN]

The main thing is to correct the caster and camber deficiencies these cars are built with. The DSE upper arms completely rearrange the upper ball joint's position and travel completely changing how the car steers and rides. Be wary of other tubular upper control arms on the market as most of them do not change the geometry at all, leaving the ball joint in the factory position.

I'm trying to wrap my head around how an upper control arm can change the "camber curve".

A taller ball joint in the DSE arm is changing the geometry and the camber curve, not the arm itself. An Arm that is shaped like a banana or straight as an arrow, with have the same "camber curve" if the length is the same between the bushings and the balljoint and the same balljoint is used.

[Ron Sutton]

The DSE upper control arm is slighter shorter (pivot point to center of ball joint) than a factory stock upper control arm. When installed, obviously the ball joint is at the same point ... otherwise you'd be changing the static camber. This makes the pivot point, where the upper control arm mounts to the frame, further outboard. It does this by using less shims.

It doesn't change the camber curve a ton. Because the DSE upper control arm is only slightly shorter.

Combine this with other things like a taller spindle or taller ball joints ... to increase the angle of the upper control arm ... and more camber gain can be achieved. But you already knew that. :-)

[UNGN]

Thanks, Ron.

The DSE arms look well engineered, but I couldn't see much in the way of geometry changes coming from the upper arms themselves.

SSLance is correct that there are definately superior and inferior upper control arms on the market and one should go with what others recommend based on their experience, instead of just taking a chance on something that looks good.

[Ron Sutton]

You're welcome Chris.

Best wishes.

[SSLance]

Some comparsion pics


https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/05/DSC02097-1.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/LSVLance/media/1985%20Monte%20Carlo%20SS/DSC02097.jpg.html)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/05/DSC02098-1.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/LSVLance/media/1985%20Monte%20Carlo%20SS/DSC02098.jpg.html)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/05/DSC02101-1.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/LSVLance/media/1985%20Monte%20Carlo%20SS/DSC02101.jpg.html)

and some before and after action shots

Stock arms and springs with 2" drop spindles

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/05/DSC02092-1.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/LSVLance/media/1985%20Monte%20Carlo%20SS/DSC02092.jpg.html)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/05/DSC02090-1.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/LSVLance/media/1985%20Monte%20Carlo%20SS/DSC02090.jpg.html)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/05/DSC02082-1.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/LSVLance/media/1985%20Monte%20Carlo%20SS/DSC02082.jpg.html)


I don't have any good stills in the parking lot of after the DSE arms, DSE 2" drop springs and stock spindles, but I have this comparison video which can be stopped at certains times to see how much less the outside front tire is rolling under on hard turns.

http://youtu.be/KAOAcml1Jt4

and these from the track

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/05/kcrscca_10072012_078-1.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/LSVLance/media/1985%20Monte%20Carlo%20SS/kcrscca_10-07-2012_078.jpg.html)

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2013/03/kcrscca_10072012_043-1.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/LSVLance/media/1985%20Monte%20Carlo%20SS/kcrscca_10-07-2012_043.jpg.html)