1st Gen Camaro Brake Booster/Master Cylinder

[brgarris]

This may be a simple question to some, but it has me puzzled. I am currently building a pro-tour '69 camaro and I fitted everything up. I am running a T-56 magnum with a Wilwood hydraulic clutch provided by Keisler Engineering. The booster is a tuff stuff 7" dual diaphragm and as you can see it is at a pretty high angle. Is this normal? From other pictures I have seen, many people have a booster and wilwood master cylinder which run parallel to the ground. Why is mine not that way? Also, how do you run the linkage on the brake pedal in that scenario and keep it concentric with the bore? Any help would be great!!!!


62735

[Chris 68]

This may be a simple question to some, but it has me puzzled. I am currently building a pro-tour '69 camaro and I fitted everything up. I am running a T-56 magnum with a Wilwood hydraulic clutch provided by Keisler Engineering. The booster is a tuff stuff 7" dual diaphragm and as you can see it is at a pretty high angle. Is this normal? From other pictures I have seen, many people have a booster and wilwood master cylinder which run parallel to the ground. Why is mine not that way? Also, how do you run the linkage on the brake pedal in that scenario and keep it concentric with the bore? Any help would be great!!!!


62735

I don't know it is 'normal', but I have the same situation in my '68. You'll find if you use the other type of bracket (that has no angle at all and sits the booster almost parallel to the firewall) that your proportioning block will hit the inner fender. Since the 7" booster protrudes away from the fire wall more so then the larger boosters, it is the only size that has that problem. Keep in mind I'm not an expert, just sharing my (small amount of) experience!

[brgarris]

Yeah I seen the DSE brake booster bracket does not have as sharp of an angel as this bracket. Hopefully some other people have been in a similar situation and can explain.

[Charles]

I have the same problem, Im using the CPP big brake set up. What are you using? Im going to call CPP and find out why the angle is so far off. I still need to test fit the fender wells, maybe that can be the reason. I will update you on my findings later.

[Hydratech®]

Don't beat up your brake part suppliers, as this is actually a factory stock GM spec!

What you are seeing is the STOCK upward angle of 17 degrees that the GM factory vacuum boosters had when these vehicles rolled off of the assembly line...

We offer them both ways in our replacement product line up:

http://www.hydratechbraking.com/GM_1stgenF_Body.html

The 6 degree system matches the basic overall angle of the engine, and connects to the TOP / manual brake pedal rod connection point on the brake pedal. The 17 degree upward angled system matches the factory installed vacuum booster angle, and this system connects to the BOTTOM / power brake pedal rod connection point on the brake pedal.

Interesting statistic: We sell one 17 degree system for every thousand~ of the 6 degree system (!), and it is only because a customer needs this specific super high upward angle to help clear turbo exhaust plumbing or a roll cage downbar.

[Charles]

According to CPP tech support guy, the booster angle is this way in order to correct the pedal push rod to the booster pump issue. I did not know there was an issue to begin with. I did not understand him quite well but I will check it out when I get home tonight. He said I could modify the support bracket to level it iff a bit more but I will also have to modify the brake pedal assembly under the dash too??? Well, anyways, I'll see what I can come up with.

[Charles]

Thanks for the info Paul, Ill have to check what the TOP and Bottom connections are on my brake pedal. I do not like the steep angle so I will be modifying my MC mounting bracket to the 6 degree angle. What will I have to do to my brake pedal assembly if I change the angle? the pedal to linkage rod connection swivels up and down on my assembly, hopefully I do not have to modify anything here.

[brgarris]

Charles, I agree the info Paul provided is very helpful. I believe that the stock brake pedal has 2 holes?? From the factory the lower hole would be for power brakes and the upper hole utilized for manual brakes. Believe I will be transitioning my booster to the 6* angle so it looks better under the hood.

Paul, I am running a wilwood hydraulic clutch and with the lower angled booster may run into interference issues with the high pressure stainless hose fitting. In this situation, would it be okay to unbolt, and rotate the wilwood cylinder 180* so that the fitting is located on the bottom? It seems to me that everything should be okay as long as my reservoir is mounted above the cylinder. Your thoughts???

[Hydratech®]

Here is an old link that shows the two different pedal rod connection holes in the brake pedal. This was a GM A body installation, though the F body info is the same:

http://www.angryamerica.com/chevelles/hydroboost.html

Here is a link showing the various commonly available booster brackets:

http://www.piratejack.net/index.php/store?page=shop.browse&category_id=22

The straight brackets might work, though you will have to deal with sealing the booster to the firewall differently (as the angled plastic seal tube standard with the 17 degree boosters wont jive well with a straight / lesser angle). You do need to keep the brake booster pedal rod straight into the vacuum booster, as this will cause trouble with the vacuum booster if run on an angle.

As far as flipping the clutch master over, I do believe that it *could* work, but recommend against it (will cause bleeding issues - somewhat self bleeding with the fittings at the top). Once bled, it may behave, though it is designed to run in the orientation you currently have installed.

Unless you are a exceptionally good fabricator and have some engineering skills, I do not recommend you pursue this endeavour. If you do, please obviously be mindul of what you are modifying (overtstating the obvious of course!).

[brgarris]

Ttt

[brgarris]

Anyone else have a similar problem with mounting the Wilwood Hydraulic Clutch Cylinder to firewall and needing to modify brake booster bracket? Also, wonder if the angle appears to be high because of the 7" dual diaphragm booster? Guess I could go to larger booster....but i have seen many people shim the bracket to get booster more horizontal. I am afraid that If i were to do this the booster would possibly contact the clutch master cylinder....where the pressure line extends out.

Has anyone mounted the brake booster/master cylinder horizontal and used the top hole in the pedal? I dont know how this would work since the power brake booster requires more stroke?? Then again, may not work due to the hydraulic clutch cylinder being beneath the brake booster...HELP!!

[drc270]

I just went through this the hard way.
I wanted to level out my booster/master for various reasons...
By doing so, you will need to use the top hole in the pedal.
I discovered you will not get the full stroke the m/c requires.