1968 GTO Questions... Pertaining to Value and a build

[rfalker1]

Hey guys and before I continue I want to thank anyone who is taking there time to answer my questions

Basically my good friend just bought a 1968 GTO Convertible with a numbers matching engine, transmission and drivetrain. It has the same Exhaust Manifold and Radiator too. It is a nice daily driver in its current status. Now my friend want to keep the car value up.. so the main question is what can we do to the car that wouldn't affect the value in the eyes of a purist.

Here are specific questions

Can we replace the radiator to a dual fan electric radiator?

What can be done to the engine? Can we replace the cam, heads, roller rockers . Plus the torque Convertor too since its an automatic. He wants about 380hp to 400hp to the ground.

Can we replace the brakes to four wheel disc brakes? Maybe even a big brake kit? ( I know this would require an update spindles probably and the loss of all "normal sized" rally wheels

Replace Axles?

Put a Serpentine Kit on it?

Redo the suspension? Such as control arms, shocks and springs?

Thanks for any knowledge donated!!!

[sokoloka]

If he's looking to appeal to purists - don't do anything that couldn't easily be undone to return to stock. If you follow that rule, do whatever you want to enjoy the car before you pass it on to the next owner!

[SShep71]

Yeah like he said, if he wants to keep the value of the car its better all original since its a rare numbers matching car I wouldnt touch it. They appeal to collectors more, buy a car that needs the attention and rebuild that one.

[Mingus]

I've always thought a person should do whatever they want to their car and not worry about trends or what other people might think. That being said, if what he wants to do is preserve the value, especially in the eyes of a real Pontiac purist, he should do absolutely nothing to the car that would make it less original. It seems out of all the GM makes, Pontiac collectors go the most overboard on no mods whatsoever. They want the original air in the tires. :-)
I agree with SShep71, if he's worried about value, stash it away and get a "plain jane" to play with. An original '68 GTO convertible would almost certainly fetch more money than any kind of a PT one. Plus you have a much larger pool of potential buyers for a stock one. If he is planning on keeping it, do whatever mods he wants and value be damned. Just don't expect to get your money back out of it if you do sell it. I passed the point of no return long ago on my Cutlass. I don't ever plan on selling it, but I know I won't come close to getting my money back if I do.
Just my 2 cents.

[andrewb70]

I've always thought a person should do whatever they want to their car and not worry about trends or what other people might think. That being said, if what he wants to do is preserve the value, especially in the eyes of a real Pontiac purist, he should do absolutely nothing to the car that would make it less original. It seems out of all the GM makes, Pontiac collectors go the most overboard on no mods whatsoever. They want the original air in the tires. :-)
I agree with SShep71, if he's worried about value, stash it away and get a "plain jane" to play with. An original '68 GTO convertible would almost certainly fetch more money than any kind of a PT one. Plus you have a much larger pool of potential buyers for a stock one. If he is planning on keeping it, do whatever mods he wants and value be damned. Just don't expect to get your money back out of it if you do sell it. I passed the point of no return long ago on my Cutlass. I don't ever plan on selling it, but I know I won't come close to getting my money back if I do.
Just my 2 cents.

I completely agree with the above.

If he wants to build, drive, and enjoy a Pontiac a-body, he should go out and find a clean LeMans and go nuts.

Andrew

[rfalker1]

Well that makes sense guys!!!

thanks for the input!! Maybe I will try to get him to do that option Andrew, it really is the best of both worlds!! But, in my opinion I say, go crazy on the car and have fun with it. Thanks for the advice!!

Currently I am talking to him about wilwood breaks, complete hotchkis suspension kits etc ;)
If he goes this route I will surely try to get him to post over the build on here or do it myself. Because I think it should be really cool

[rfalker1]

The original air comment was priceless too Mike

[LeighP]

Anything that bolts on or off would be fine...as long as he keeps the original stuff.
I wouldn't risk the original engine and box...I'd stick them on stands and oil them up. A stroker 400 block (out to 464 or similiar) coupled with a late model OD box would be my choice. Better brakes and some upgraded suspension...keep it looking stock on the outside.
Have fun, yet the car can be put back to stock in a couple of weekends.

[andrewb70]

Well that makes sense guys!!!

thanks for the input!! Maybe I will try to get him to do that option Andrew, it really is the best of both worlds!! But, in my opinion I say, go crazy on the car and have fun with it. Thanks for the advice!!

Currently I am talking to him about wilwood breaks, complete hotchkis suspension kits etc ;)
If he goes this route I will surely try to get him to post over the build on here or do it myself. Because I think it should be really cool

Also ask yourself what you want to do with the car. Will you ever attend any racing events? If so, convertibles will almost always require more safety equipment than a hardtop, which may mean installing at least a 4 point roll bar.

Andrew

[rfalker1]

Also ask yourself what you want to do with the car. Will you ever attend any racing events? If so, convertibles will almost always require more safety equipment than a hardtop, which may mean installing at least a 4 point roll bar.

Andrew
true.. I agree with that. I am pretty sure he wont be doing that though, he basically just wants a fast sporty cruiser

[rfalker1]

Anything that bolts on or off would be fine...as long as he keeps the original stuff.
I wouldn't risk the original engine and box...I'd stick them on stands and oil them up. A stroker 400 block (out to 464 or similiar) coupled with a late model OD box would be my choice. Better brakes and some upgraded suspension...keep it looking stock on the outside.
Have fun, yet the car can be put back to stock in a couple of weekends.

A new engine is not a bad idea either. I shall make sure that I inform him of these things

[CreepinDeth]

Now my friend want to keep the car value up.. so the main question is what can we do to the car that wouldn't affect the value in the eyes of a purist.

Here's my thoughts. F*** the purists. He owns the car, they don't. :)
https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/02/colbertfinger-1.gif
Pull the OE engine and transmission and put it in the back of the garage or a storage shed wrapped up.
Then go put whatever motor you want to in the car and enjoy the car without worrying about what
anyone else thinks. Anything else you take off, store it. There's nothing worse then being held back
from what you want out of a car because of sweating things like this.

I think I've pissed off most of the fanatical old timers on Classic Olds because I sold my drivetrain
and put a LY6 / T-56 in it with 18" Foose Rims and now I'm going all custom gauges + more.
They keep whining that it's a "Chevy engine" but it's a GM corporate. :rolleyes:

Truth is, I don't buy cars for anyone else's approval. I mod them to my own liking.
Plenty of the pro-touring crowd and younger crowd dig modding muscle cars to perform better.

[Steve Chryssos]

Some fantastic bolt-on parts are available for A-Bodies from suspension parts to complete chassis. Yes there is are true bolt on radiators available. You can really improve the car. I would love to see you guys a zero weld, zero drill, zero cut, 100% bolt on build. If it isn't truly bolt on as advertised, it goes back to the seller.

Restore it back to stock after you're done driving the wheels off. Or don't.

[MonzaRacer]

OK so we have a car worth a little as a GTO, suspension you can do bolt on stuff like Ridetech coil overs, control arms, etc. As for some safety/looks a Tiger cage would be an easy install and easy to fix minor damage from install. Brakes, well you can add on Corvette stuff using brackets from Kore 3, suspension mods are all over place. Engine,,,well depends on where your at. I live in Indiana and have nearly all the parts required to build a new short block 400, slap on some Edelbrock heads, fav induction (if you like different think EFI with Megasquirt3 in sequential fuel and ignition using LS2 coils bolted to cast Pontiac valve covers.
Fuel tanks no brainer just order up a replacement and add in some better fuel delivery,,,maybe you could use a Racepumps mechanical on a Pontiac,, if they make one.
As for cooling any properly sized aluminum rad can be had from cheaper Ebay champion rads and extra electric fans. small holes/damage can be fixed down road. But then GM has many little holes and mounting spots for add ons.
Wheels are bolt on, any differential is game for add on just keep old one. If he wants to mod dash down road finding old ones to cut up isnt hard and I think they even repop some.
Now if its concours perfect sell it and find a different canvas. But as long as its minor, repairable damage,,who cares, it if doesnt have multiple holes in dash from add on gauges Id be surprized.
If you want an engine built let me know I have machine shop up road and spare Pontiac short block parts.
As for stroking a Pontiac WHY in HE__ eff up a Pontiac. A well built Pontiac doenst have to turn 8k rpms and will make SCADS of torque below 6k stock rods are maxed at 5500 as they are arma cast. Cheap Hbeams and some good forged or hyperutectic pistons will make a strong, reliable Pontiac.
Any questions, let me know.
Lee

[rfalker1]

Thanks for moreeeeee input guys.. I love this site and the users that make it!! So I have talked to him and it looks like we are going to stay away from stroking, and he might send the engine to a good Pontiac engine builder.

I also think he will put the basic hotchkis suspension kit on it for the A-bodies. Maybe a big brake kit. Not Sure yet, he is still talking about rally's and stuff so that might slow that process down. Then after that, maybe new brake lines and depending on how deep he wants to go he might install an electric radiator and different serpentine kit.

Plus a sound system, but he will run it through an I-pod leaving the 8 track in its original position. I think thats what I have talked him into so far. This will be truly interesting!!

Really though thanks for the advice!!!!

[oldgoat69]

My motto has always been, "Anyone can restore one, it takes a real man to cut one up!". This from a guy that has a real 69 GTO ragtop with, let's say a few modifications. This is the latest of a parade. Build the car for your enjoyment. You can always reverse anything you may do no matter how far you go. That is why God made tools.

[rfalker1]

My motto has always been, "Anyone can restore one, it takes a real man to cut one up!". This from a guy that has a real 69 GTO ragtop with, let's say a few modifications. This is the latest of a parade. Build the car for your enjoyment. You can always reverse anything you may do no matter how far you go. That is why God made tools.


Loool!! know that is a statement

[Neil B]

My 2 cents... If it's a survivor, don't change anything. If it's a restored car, it can be restored again. I have a restored, #'s '69 Z28. It was boring stock. I added a cam, aluminum heads, headers/exhaust, ignition, springs, shocks, and wheels. Much more fun to drive now. I did no drilling, cutting, or welding. It could be put back to stock in a couple of days...

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2010/01/Side1-1.jpg

[67gtonut]

What are is long term intentions?

If he plans on a few year ownership.... then leave it as it is..... sell it, and buy a solid LeMans to mdo the crap out of it.....

If he is planning a long term ownership.... then go for it..... do whatever you want.... its his car....

I had a true #'s matching survivor...... But I honestly plan on never selling it..... I thought about keeping it all original .... that last about 3-4 years...... decided .... screw it, its my car. I am slowly turning into what I want.....

[SparkyRnD]

I've never understood that matching numbers stuff, just isn't for me. I'd rather see a car built up however it needs to be in order to be a real driver that gets used all the time. A car that is all original and doesn't get driven to 'preserver the value' is of no value to someone like me, other than as a project to cut up and make fun (that's why I don't buy high-dollar all original numbers matching cars). in my mind, it's better to let someone that gets off on the #'s buy that kind of car. I say if it's valuable money-wise, sell it to a purist and buy a similar model that you can have fun with, and not worry about if it will depreciate.

[Vicinity]

I've never understood that matching numbers stuff, just isn't for me. I'd rather see a car built up however it needs to be in order to be a real driver that gets used all the time. A car that is all original and doesn't get driven to 'preserver the value' is of no value to someone like me, other than as a project to cut up and make fun (that's why I don't buy high-dollar all original numbers matching cars). in my mind, it's better to let someone that gets off on the #'s buy that kind of car. I say if it's valuable money-wise, sell it to a purist and buy a similar model that you can have fun with, and not worry about if it will depreciate.

This, times 30 million. I really couldn't care less what numbers my car has. Hell, my vin and firewall tag don't even match on my car. :)

[rfalker1]

Thanks guys.. I have forwarded his information... he is going forward then backwards on his decision, but the real test is this summer when he drives it. I told him that I decided to do what I did to my camaro because it was boring like SPARKY said and its my car!!

However I still recommend a basic suspension upgrade and brake upgrade because, everybody should like a good ride quality, and a bit of handling and the ability to stop in case of emergencies!!!!

[rfalker1]

This, times 30 million. I really couldn't care less what numbers my car has. Hell, my vin and firewall tag don't even match on my car. :)

Lol, is that even legal Dan??? and all I could decode from my car is that it was an original v8 and probably and rs, because of the wholes in the firewall and older rubber there

[rfalker1]

Car in question too

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/03/683-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/03/684-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/03/6840-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/03/6825-1.jpg

[SShep71]

Alot of guys out there think that the protouring style cars are expensive. Numbers matching cars are much worse! Its a different kind of game its kind of like baseball card collecting you car gets a point value and like always the person with the points gets the trophy. I know several cars that get tailored and spend their times in the garage on carpets. The early model A guys have it the worst IMO,

[Vicinity]

Lol, is that even legal Dan??? and all I could decode from my car is that it was an original v8 and probably and rs, because of the wholes in the firewall and older rubber there

As long as the VIN and title match, it's G2G.

But honestly, if I were in your friends shoes, I'd sell the numbers matching for some serious coin and put that money in awesome parts for a good shell.

[rfalker1]

Alot of guys out there think that the protouring style cars are expensive. Numbers matching cars are much worse! Its a different kind of game its kind of like baseball card collecting you car gets a point value and like always the person with the points gets the trophy. I know several cars that get tailored and spend their times in the garage on carpets. The early model A guys have it the worst IMO,

I agree with u.. those parts they want cost so much!!!

[rfalker1]

As long as the VIN and title match, it's G2G.

But honestly, if I were in your friends shoes, I'd sell the numbers matching for some serious coin and put that money in awesome parts for a good shell.

Lol thats G2K (good to know) and i like the car... i just want him to be able able to stop and turn properly

[john31s]

Tell your buddy to sell it to a purist. Try selling it on the Performance Years forum, just be warned those Pontiac purist can be a real pain. Tell him to possibly switch out the wheels on it now (rally I's) in favor or the correct (rally II's). Get it as correct as possible, sell it to some nutcase who believes GM made the perfect car in 1968, and buy a Lemans for half of what he got for the GTO and go to town.