Front End Dragging

[camaro1185]

I just rebuilt EVERYTHING suspension and brake related on my 88 Iroc. Now, at slow speed, with the wheel at full lock, the front end, "skids/draggs" along the pavement. Its almost exactly like understeer, but at no more than a couple mph. I have checked and re checked everything, what could it be?

New parts:
Del-a-lum a arm bushings
Eibach pro kit
Tokico Illumina 5 way adjustable shocks
all new ball joints, sway bar mounts, end links, center link, idler arm, inner and outer tie rods etc
I has had an alignment done as well
plus more, but thats the major parts

[BMR Sales]

I just rebuilt EVERYTHING suspension and brake related on my 88 Iroc. Now, at slow speed, with the wheel at full lock, the front end, "skids/draggs" along the pavement. Its almost exactly like understeer, but at no more than a couple mph. I have checked and re checked everything, what could it be?

New parts:
Del-a-lum a arm bushings
Eibach pro kit
Tokico Illumina 5 way adjustable shocks
all new ball joints, sway bar mounts, end links, center link, idler arm, inner and outer tie rods etc
I has had an alignment done as well
plus more, but thats the major parts



Not sure if you are saying that you already had an allignment done on the car or not. Was the car doing this before the allignment as well?

[camaro1185]

Yes, before and after. No worse, no better. FWIW, the car only has about 20 miles on the new parts.

[camaro1185]

Is it possible that when I replaced the idler arm, it wasnt set up properly and thats causing the problem. I marked where the old one was, but the new one was about .5" higher after I measure it was level. Is it possible I measured wrong and thats creating the problem?

I have talked to A LOT of third gen guys where they have larger drops, and they dont have this problem.

[exwestracer]

Get in touch with Ramey (UMI Tech)and work through the problem with him. He's a pretty sharp guy, and no one will know those components better.

[UMI Tech]

Thanks Ray!

Camaro1185, do you have our lowers with the steering stops? What size wheel/tire combo?

ramey

[camaro1185]

Ramey, thanks for chiming in, I really need to fix this problem.

Nope, stock A arms with del alum bushings.

The wheels are stock 16" irocs with stock size tires. 245 50 16

I REALLY think/hope/pray its the idler arm being too high as I am out of any other ideas.

If it helps, it happens only at full lock, if I go to full lock and then back off a little its fine. And no its not hitting anything.

[Bryce]

It sounds like at full lock something is locking the wheel or tire from rotating.

[UMI Tech]

I just checked our house IROC and the idler is at the bottom of the slots. We built steering stops into our lowers due to this phenomenon but it usually arose due to large tires.

When it's happening is the inside front tire dragging?

[camaro1185]

I just checked our house IROC and the idler is at the bottom of the slots. We built steering stops into our lowers due to this phenomenon but it usually arose due to large tires.

When it's happening is the inside front tire dragging?

Yeah, my idler is almost at the top.

I built custom stops, but they are exactly like the old ones only extended like 3/8" or 1/2" I forgot. If I didnt do that the orig steering stop will hit the banjo bolt at full lock.

Im pretty sure its not dragging on the inside.

[camaro1185]

double post

[camaro1185]

I lowered the Idler arm to what it was with the old one, and it seems to have helped about 50%, but its still not good. Im afraid of wrecking something on the car should I ever need to turn to full lock while driving or backing up. I guess If i cant figure out why, i may put the stock springs back in.

BTW, here are my alignment specs.

(-.2 Camber, 5.2deg Caster, .06&.07 Toe In)

Also, it seems like whats happening is called scrub radius. Basically that means that at full lock, the tire up top is cambered out (away from the car), so positive camber.

[camaro1185]

Pics at full lock

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/02/0203121830b-1.jpg

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/02/0203121830a-1.jpg

[camaro1185]

It looks like due to that first pic I posted, this has resulted, it seems to rub pretty good, its gotta be about a 1/16" deep. There are also 2 spots on the other side, but it does not seem like it is in line to where the wheel would touch. It seems like its touching on this side the worse, but yet it does it at full lock on both sides????



https://static1.pt-content.com/images/pt/2012/02/downsized_0203122121-1.jpg

[Bryce]

It looks like the outside tire has more turning angle than the inside tire. Ackerman looks wrong.

[camaro1185]

It looks like the outside tire has more turning angle than the inside tire. Ackerman looks wrong.

Can you explane what akerman is and what can be done to correct that? Sorry, Im a suspension idiot.

[camaro1185]

Looking at it now, I can see that. Damn it looks way more angle.

[camaro1185]

I went and turned the steering wheel 90 to the right and both wheels turned the same. then went another 90 and the wheels are still turned the same angle on both sides.

I then turned the steering wheel 90 and 90 to the left and they dont have the same angle, what could cause this?

[camaro1185]

Its official, im an idiot. My centerlink was flipped around. The kicker is for some reason when i had initially installed it, I installed it wrong, but for some reason thought the inner tie rods mounted to the front. When I went to put the tie rods on they would not go through due to the taper, so i figured the centerlink was on wrong. I ended up spinning it around, and now I have to turn it yet again. Wow im a total idiot, but at least its an easy fix. '


Heres the question, is that going to mess up my alignment, or just the toe in/out??

Thanks for the help guys!

[Bryce]

Good news, I am glad you figured it out.

[sjaroslo]

Thanks for posting up what happened. You're not an idiot; in fact, being able to own up to your own mistakes in a public forum garners nothing but respect from me. Great news that it is an easy fix. It has been great to see the outpouring of support and ideas from members and vendors as well.

[UMI Tech]

Its official, im an idiot. My centerlink was flipped around. The kicker is for some reason when i had initially installed it, I installed it wrong, but for some reason thought the inner tie rods mounted to the front. When I went to put the tie rods on they would not go through due to the taper, so i figured the centerlink was on wrong. I ended up spinning it around, and now I have to turn it yet again. Wow im a total idiot, but at least its an easy fix. '


Heres the question, is that going to mess up my alignment, or just the toe in/out??

Thanks for the help guys!

Caster and camber are set by the upper point on the strut on these cars. You should be good to go with just resetting the toe.

Glad you found your problem. And like others have said, we're one big happy Pro Touring family. This board is pretty good for advice to newbies and veterans alike. I like it here.

ramey

[camaro1185]

Thanks, thats what I wanted to hear, no alignment again. Im actually on my way out to the garage now to flip it around. Thanks for the help guys!!!