coating burned off?

[rockdogz]

When I first got my coated headers, they looked bulletproof. They're from Chassisworks, because they fit around the Chassisworks front clip like a glove. They say it has a silver high temperature coating, but not what kind/brand.

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

When I first fired up my engine, the timing was off and the exhaust got super hot. It seems to have burned off the coating:

https://static1.pt-content.com/images/noimg.gif

Should this have happened? It really makes me mad because not only are the headers impossible to remove without pulling the engine (the motor mount fits between the tubes), but I had to modify the flanges to fit around the head bolts when I installed them.

[Blaster11]

Most of the coated headers I have had recommend several short heat cycles on the headers and don't reccomend breaking in cams with new coated headers because of the excessive heat.

Bruce

[astroracer]

That's exactly what will happen on a set of fresh, uncured headers. This is cautioned against in the start up literature from JetHot and they say they will not warranty it. You could contact Alston but I'm sure they'll say the same thing...
Mark

[rockdogz]

There was NO literature with the headers... great :banghead:

[Steve68]

What I understand about coated headers is no engine break in, no cam break in, try not to get anything on them if you going to use them to break in a engine you have to put fans all over the engine, I'm going to remember this because I have coated for my car too!!

[Railing68]

Same thing happened to mine when I broke in the cam after having HPC recoat mine. I ended up having to spray the #8. 6,4 tubes with a thin coat of vht ceramic silver header paint to cover some blemishes. Sounds hoaky but worked pretty well( alternative was bare metal) you can sometimes bring the luster back using aluminum polish ( I like Heavy Metal) my problem areas were too far gone.

It is not like I/you can switch headers for break in. It seems pretty impossible to compensate for temps even with fans, Outside temps were in the high 30's and still happened to me. Maybe with one of those industrial pedestal fans. SS

[Blown353]

Sorry to see the pics. Been there, done that myself and learned a valuable lesson. Not only did I cook my headers I also burned a couple plug wires and melted the wires going to my starter. About your only option now if you can't live with the discoloration is to have the headers recoated.

I know the guy who owns the shop that does Alston's powercoating and header coating (did my headers too), and they're a great outfit that uses GOOD coatings; the coating isn't to blame here, it's too-high EGT's from the engine break-in. The coating doesn't appear to be burned off right now, but it is discolored and will probably start to flake off down the road. That's been my experience when you cook header coatings during break in. It turns grey then starts flaking off with some more usage.

I've broke in several cars now using coated headers and haven't had a problem. The trick to breaking in without cooking the headers is to keep the EGT's down by putting plenty of timing in the engine (I like about 40 degrees, although at break in RPM and no load on the engine you can even run up to 50 degrees), put fans blowing air on the headers, and make sure you're not lean. It's even better if you can run the engine for about 2-3 minutes to heat the headers to cure them, then shut it down and let the headers cool, then do it again, but I understand that's not a good thing to do with a flat tappet cam. I recently did a break-in on a friend's car with 1/2 hour of running on new coated Hookers and the headers still look as good as they did out of the box. We jetted the primary side of the carb rich, I opened up the idle screws a bunch, and I had a distributor wrench and timing light in hand. As soon as the engine fired I put 42 degrees of timing in it and tightened the distributor down, then we moved in 2 pedestal fans to point on the headers. The fans and mixture definately help, but the biggest mistake people make is not having enough timing in the engine for break in. At high rpm/no load the engine will tolerate a TON of timing, and the more timing you put in it the lower the EGT's will be.

Troy

[Blue70]

Mine did the same thing, in the same spot..
Nothing came with my headers saying not to use while breaking in a new cam/engine...I might give the VHT a try :crying:

[malibu9in]

Why would the timing be off on a fi engine like yours? So yall mean to tell me that when a cam swap or engine swap ,with a new set of coated headers you must swap the headers out with some old ones ,then start engine break it in then swap back to coated headers? thats bs.

[paul67]

I have seen on some street rodder engines a stainless cover that goes over the 1st couple of inches of the headers will see if I can find the add.
paul67

[rockdogz]

I called up Chassisworks just to see if they were aware of a break-in period with the coated headers and the guy I spoke to (Jim) was not. I guess my only option is to pull the engine and have them re-coated (at a cost of somewhere close to $200).
I understand what happened and realize that I could have prevented it, but I was not given all the information at the time (no literature with the coated headers to warn me of this).
Just venting I guess.

[CAMAROBOY69]

Thats my worst fear of buying new expensive headers. To have them discolor or the finish burn off! Whats the best headers to get to prevent this from happening? I would never use nice headers to break an engine in.
In that 200MPH Mule video the headers were glowing orange. Will that finish be screwed now?

[Blown353]

Header coatings are most sensitive to burning and flaking during the initial run with them because the coating is not fully cured, and therefore not as temperature resistant.

To compound this issue, people often break in their engines with a new set of headers which means high-RPM and no airflow through the engine compartment. To make things worse, people usually don't put enough timing in the engine during break in, which makes the exhaust temps even hotter... and you get the picture-- you burn the coating off rather than curing it.

One thing you can do to help avoid cooking the headers is go for the higher temp rated coatings. There are different temp ranges of coatings; most "shiny" cermaic coatings that you see on headers are rated to around 1200-1300F. There are other ceramic coatings out there that can withstand 1800-2400F, but they're not shiny coatings. I'm running a satin "titanium" header coating rated to 2000F (you can see it in this picture (http://home.comcast.net/~swedish_chef/stuff/lateralg/engine_2.jpg)) and they still look fantastic even with my higher than most application EGT's-- it's an extremely durable coating. I believe the Mule is using the high-temp stuff too, but I'm not sure who did the coating.

The downside of these higher temp coatings, at least in the case of my headers, is they're even more fragile than the standard shiny coatings prior to their first "running" which is what fully cures them. This means you have to be extra careful handling them, and unfortunately, they're even more prone to burning off during the first run-in unless you're really careful with them (i.e. make sure you have lots of timing in the engine and you only run it a few minutes and then let them cool.)

The best option of all is to find someone with a large enough high temperature oven and oven-cure the headers prior to installing them on the car. Most coating shops do the initial bake on the coating at 350-400F; if you can find someone with a large furnace that can handle 800-1000F (that's furnace territory) you can wheel them in for a few minutes and final cure them without fear of baking the coating.

Troy

[race-rodz-inc]

i really dig that titanium coating, who, what, where, how much, etc. i plan on doing initial firing and breakin with headers plain, then pull em off and get em coated.... but i didnt want the shiny bling finish.

next question.... the headers on my project will be hanging out in the wind/rain, how durable/stain resistant is that coating? as you can see from the pic, the tires will constantly be showering them with **** off the road.

[yody]

when i fired up my motor, i just turned the engine off and on every 2-3 minutes. There is no problem with this with a flat tappet, as long as it doesnt' idle much. My headers look brand new. You just have to be sensible.

[GUS68]

Hey guys!!! I feel your pain. I have the same problem, the coating is flaking off near the heads. BUT hears the thing. I had my old crusty headers on my chevelle for more years than I can remember (like 10 or 12) Then I finally decided to order a set from Dynomax with the Jet hot coating. Same motor same exhaust, and after about 2 years it has started to flake near the heads. My car has never overheated and I have had the same motor in it forever. Is it posible jet hot would warenty this???? The say there supposed to last for something like forever!!!!

[Tiger]

I had coated three quarter lenght headers on my car, but after one year the coating was burned off and pitted.
I have bought stainless headers from Stainless works this time around but they are not installed yet.