do you guys get a bunch of crap for liking pro-touring style? [Archive]

sinned

07-03-2005, 01:39 PM

Yeah, the purists will always think you are ruining it and the 1/4 mile guys think that proper working suspension is "bad" for launching....ask any of them to meet at the local road course and see how well their "race car " works though. IMO there is no truer a test of a cars ability than a road course; to perform well it has to be able to turn well, stop well, and accelerate well. Nothing but a "pro-touring" style car can do all that (although the definition of what pro-touring really means is a topic of conversation right now).

In fact there a few PT cars running around that can spank half those ¼ mile guys that give you crap about your build style. Nothing funnier than watching a TT/LSX lay the smack down on a blown/injected B/B with it's the nose sticking 3 feet in the air for better weight transfer (even though the builder of the chassis has never even heard of anti-squat nor it’s impact on the chassis).

[/OFF-RANT]

Fawkes

07-03-2005, 01:46 PM

I haven't heard anything bad about the pro-touring style in general. I don't see why anybody would say anything about the transmission, but everybody has their quirks.

The engine thing is something that serious Pontiac people take to heart. So many old Poncho's have been converted (and yes, like yours, a few came from the factory) to SBC's. It's a fact of life, just look at the Street Rod world. Frankly I find them a boring choice if doing a swap, but that's just my oppinion. :ducking:

Bottom line, to each their own...

Steve Chryssos

07-03-2005, 01:56 PM

Sometimes I encounter the odd bonehead or mullet. I've learned to enjoy it. :fart:

TLWiltman

07-03-2005, 02:13 PM

I'm barely even started on my project yet, but I catch a little from the 1/4 milers, and a lot from the restoration guys ("Whatcha cuttin that up for, you moron?"). Who cares:moon: F*** 'em

Tad
:git:

Swifster

07-03-2005, 02:22 PM

Tell an old Studebaker guy the plans you have (including a GM engine) and you catch all kinds of grief. From changing the suspension to not using the engine that was designed just after WWII.

Now I've always liked road racing, and I plan some serious track time with the car, but if it didn't come from South Bend that way, it just isn't right.

Most of the guys in my local club just like cool cars, even the road course stuff (though I get a lot of crap about my SCCA Suzuki).

rocketrod

07-03-2005, 02:53 PM

I don't get any flack, but I am sure that will change as I have the only PT 1st gen in my area. I do get get unusual looks since I spend money on something other than the JUST motor, rim & tires.

Jim Nilsen

07-03-2005, 03:08 PM

In my world if somebody thinks I am screwed up for what I am doing I just tell them they have green hair. When they tell me that they don't . I ask them how do they know? They usually tell me so many different things you have to laugh. If they argue I tell them I am color blind and hair is all green to me !!

The point is, just because someone tells you something that they think is wrong about you doesn't mean it is unless you believe them. So just start laughing at them and then ask them to show you their car doing something their car can't do and tell them something like,thats pretty stupid to have a car that can't even go around a corner faster than a tricycle from their childhood.

Remember you can come here and feel safe and at home. So relax and enjoy.

Jim Nilsen

myclone

07-03-2005, 03:46 PM

You have two choices:

1. Ignore them and do things the way YOU want to and how it makes YOU happy (when someone else starts footing the bill for your projects then do it their way).

2. Have fun with them. When they say "you should have done it this way" or "thats not the right way to do it" let em finish blabbing look them straight in the eye and ask them with a straight face..."why would I want to go slower?".

While Ive got two strikes against me with the pro touring ppl (Im a 1/4mile guy and a truck guy) I still enjoy the quality of this forum and theres lots of neato stuff to read and look at. Would I let anyone here or anywhere else get under my skin cause what they think is "correct"? LOL, not in a million years since Im doing things the way that gives me satisfaction.

BTW, Im a member of a couple Pontiac forums and they are pretty critical of anything that isnt 100% poncho (turbo buick guys are the same way too) so its not anything new. Dont sweat it, have some fun, light up the rear tires every now and then, and enjoy life since you only get one of those.

SatisTraction

07-03-2005, 04:02 PM

well to me PT is no different then pro street or the ricers out there. 90% of the cars on this board are going for a certain look. the better handling is just a benifit that comes with the look. If you want proof just go look at the thread asking for pics of PT cars at the track. I think about 4 people posted and the rest were called posers.

gmachinz

07-03-2005, 04:03 PM

Here's what I think is funny. I hear from people who praise newer cars (1/4 mile guys, remember) with LS1's that can lay down awesome numbers with all factory power accessories, AC, etc. and then those same people look at me as if I had a huge turd hanging from my cheek when they see the effort I put into restoring the factory AC to better than OE specs with R134 and running with it. I tell people that I do it 'cause with all the work and $$$ I put into the interior, the last thing I want to do is sweat my ass off in it. Then, I catch flack about my anality about wiring, stereo equipment, etc. and I usually close by saying something like "well, if you don't like it, get the hell away from it then." It's my money, my car. -Jabin

ProdigyCustoms

07-03-2005, 04:28 PM

Only time I hear anything is from the resto crowd. And I bring that on myself by telling whatever I am working WAS a super rare something or antoher. I love telling purist that Prodigy was a 396 RS / SS just to watch their toes curl, LOL!.
Otherwise, even though street / race cars are all the rage here, Pro Touring cars seem to be getting respect and gaining popularity.

Kenova

07-03-2005, 04:31 PM

...............The engine thing is something that serious Pontiac people take to heart. So many old Poncho's have been converted (and yes, like yours, a few came from the factory) to SBC's......
Up here in Canada, any Pontiac built here had/has a Chev engine. Acadians, Beaumonts, and I've even seen a documented '62 Pontiac B body with a 409. These cars were all in the pipeline or design process before the Canada/U.S. Auto Pact was signed. At that time it was probably more profitable to build them with Chev engines (which were being built in Canada) than to import Pontiac engines.
Needless to say, some variants of the same Pontiac models had Chev mills and others had Pontiacs.
I was talking with a guy at a car show a couple of years ago. He had a Beaumont with a Pontiac engine in it and was complaining about how hard it was finding the right parts to put "the right Pontiac engine" in his car. Should have seen the look on his face :crying: when I told him the car was built with a chev engine, and explained why.
So, the next time someone gives you a hard time about having a Chev engine in your Pontiac, yank their chain and tell them it was built in
Canada..........or something. :spam:
Ken

Blown353

07-03-2005, 05:24 PM

About the only crap I get about my car's style is that the quarter sized rust holes at the bottom of the front fenders and the splotchy paint don't really suit the car much. LOL.

The other thing I get crap over is that people at shows constantly tell me my engine compartment would look better if I polished all the aluminum bits and added chrome parts. :lmao:

I usually tell them "sure, if you want to come over twice a week and keep 'em shiny."

Actually, the most crap I get is about the engine. Everyone seems to think it can't possibly be making more than 500hp, and I can't help but laugh about that. On second thought, I should work that angle for monetary benefit... :smoke:

Swifster

07-03-2005, 06:24 PM

The other thing I get crap over is that people at shows constantly tell me my engine compartment would look better if I polished all the aluminum bits and added chrome parts. :lmao:

I usually tell them "sure, if you want to come over twice a week and keep 'em shiny."

Cars are no different than anything else. Color and texture can be made to work for you. While I like chrome, I'm more of a believer in mixing other materials and colors to enhance the chrome. While I want a lot of modern touches on my 1964 car, I want them to have a '60's look and flair.

Steve1968LS2

07-03-2005, 07:06 PM

Not here in SoCal.. people love the pt style..

Then again we are pretty progressive compared to the rest of the country ;)

vintageracer

07-03-2005, 07:24 PM

SatisTraction

07-03-2005, 07:57 PM

For all the drag racing guys this is my quote and I have NEVER heard a good explanation as a response, just agreement.

"Drag racing is like sex/foreplay with your girlfriend, 3 hours worth of work for 10 seconds of glory".

Street driving and road racing are will always give you "hours of glory".

Why would ANYBODY drag race and spend all that time working on the car or waiting in line to run for such a short thrill???????

well my last drag car would go from 0-151 mph in 8.5 seconds with an average of 6g's over the 1st 60'. that was one hell of a thrill :)

The ultimate thrill to me would be dirt round track. beating and banging all the way to the checkered flag :box:

Steve1968LS2

07-03-2005, 07:58 PM

For all the drag racing guys this is my quote and I have NEVER heard a good explanation as a response, just agreement.

"Drag racing is like sex/foreplay with your girlfriend, 3 hours worth of work for 10 seconds of glory".

Street driving and road racing are will always give you "hours of glory".

Why would ANYBODY drag race and spend all that time working on the car or waiting in line to run for such a short thrill???????

That is the argument I make when trying to get guys to come out for open track day..

Them = "But it costs $200 and drag racing only costs $20"

Me = "But for $200 you get hours of track time.. for $20 you drive your car for less than 2 minutes (if you are lucky)

Funny how many still couldn't see it though..

formula

07-03-2005, 08:30 PM

The engine thing is something that serious Pontiac people take to heart. So many old Poncho's have been converted (and yes, like yours, a few came from the factory) to SBC's. It's a fact of life, just look at the Street Rod world. Frankly I find them a boring choice if doing a swap, but that's just my oppinion. :ducking:

So, the next time someone gives you a hard time about having a Chev engine in your Pontiac, yank their chain and tell them it was built in

no ducking necessary...my car IS a factory-original chevrolet-powered formula...wasn't built for canada though. ordered to spec through a dealership in new york.

I've got proof: window sticker, build sheet, and PHS documents soon.

as for the tranny- my car was a factory saginaw. i get BS called on me about that all the time...people swear they only built them with t-10s, and that there's no way a new-fangled five speed would be able to hold the power an old muncie could (which i dont even have!)

the biggest thing i get slack about is wheel ideas.... i want to make my car into the car pontiac would have built, given todays technology. therefore, 70s style but 00s materials, etc. I'm thinking long and hard about a set of wheel vintiques rallye IIs....i get nothing but crap about it!!! "put some snowflakes on it" "put some torque thrust IIs on it" "keep your stock wheels"....so frustrating.

ugh. i guess this is all pretty stupid....

F70t/a

07-03-2005, 08:39 PM

I don't have a problem with people not liking my style. What sucks is when you get people trying to tell you that sucks(how they would of done it) or that wont work. when 99.9% of them have never tried it or can't afford it.Your going to die one day, so might as well go out happy :nopity:

MrQuick

07-03-2005, 10:40 PM

1/4 mile guys think that proper working suspension is "bad" for launching....ask any of them to meet at the local road course and see how well their "race car " works though.
Well being from a drag race area I use to get alot of sheet from having wide tires up front and crapp from the show crowd for having dirty front rims.
I still hit the drag strip and I lost a few, but I was the only guy taking the return road turn at 80. :drive2:

Yenkostyle

07-03-2005, 11:44 PM

well my last drag car would go from 0-151 mph in 8.5 seconds with an average of 6g's over the 1st 60'. that was one hell of a thrill :)

The ultimate thrill to me would be dirt round track. beating and banging all the way to the checkered flag :box:

Not to start anything here but do you know exactly how much force 6g's is?

Just for reference: "an NHRA Top Fuel dragster leaves the starting line with a force nearly five times that of gravity, the same force of the space shuttle when it leaves the launching pad at Cape Canaveral?" taken from : ( http://www.nhra.com/streetlegal/funfacts.html (http://www.nhra.com/streetlegal/funfacts.html) )

Now are you saying your last car had more acceleration force then a TF Dragster?

Maybe you were embellishing? Which is cool because I think you were off on that number then..It was more like 8g’s right? :yeah:

Firestorm

07-03-2005, 11:52 PM

PRO TC

07-04-2005, 12:33 AM

i live in dubuque ia! i am protouring. there is nobody else here that has anything close to my car. i go to a thursday night hang out and most people just kinda look at my car like whats that. but i love talking to the people that ask me questions. its just going to take a while to catch on. just look at all the magazines. we protourers know what the hot trend is

pro tc/barry

Jeremy

07-04-2005, 01:39 AM

Go for what you want. The other thing that I learned by building my car the way I wanted is that at least people notice it. Whether they like it or hate it at least it gets them talking about it.

When I had restored originals you might get the occassional nice car comment, but I think that at shows people like to see something different every now and then. The other thing is I think some people are afraid to try something different.

steemin

07-04-2005, 05:50 AM

Pro69

07-04-2005, 06:21 AM

ugh. i guess this is all pretty stupid....[/QUOTE]

Don't fret. You can't please all the people all the time, and the ones that don't conform to your line of thinking, kill them. (LOL) :box2:

Seriously though, when I showed my car to the guy I bought it from a couple weeks ago at a local show, (he's old school), he couldn't believe the way it looked and was fairly impressed as well as the guy who originally painted it (old school as well). What I liked is the fact that he acknowledged what I had done hadn't distracted too much from what the car is "supposed" to like. We talked for about an hour on all the stuff I had done and was planning on doing and he never once chastised me for where I was going. He simply appreciated all the hard work.

To each his own I say, and never rip on somebody's elses ride (foriegn or domestic). You must appreciate what someone is trying to build for themselves and the innovations they strive to achieve. If you become genuinely interested in a car that somebody has built, be it 1/4 mile, PT, show, or drifter you will most always definitely put a smile on their face. :smoke:

phaseshift

07-04-2005, 08:17 AM

I have gotten some rather special comments from the folks who like the numbers matching cars. If you have seen my car, you know that it has fewer matching numbers than the lost luggage pile at LAX.
My feeling on that? Sorry it is not what you were looking for, but to be totally frank about the whole deal, I did my car for me and me only. True, I like the fact that my wife digs it a little and yes, I appreciate positive comments from others. Still, that is not the reason for doing the car; I did it because as a kid, I always thought it would really be cool to drive one of those Trans-Am road racing cars on the street. What was built is the realization of my childhood dreams melded with a dose of teenage enthusiasm and adult design skill. It is me and it is what I like. Maybe some folks do not agree, but to be totally honest, the ones that matter most to me are those that really see beyond a car or a machine; they see the work, the planning, the execution and perhaps the dream at the core. Could have as easily been a 65 Ford 'Streeter, a Skyline GT-R, a Diablo, a numbers matching Hemi 'Cuda or a Jeep.
I am in Manila today and saw a 46 Chevy that a friend of mine has here. He was complaining about the car, the restoration, the execution... Basically, he was displeased at the restoration because it was his dream and his plan that was shot. It did not matter to him that the car had won a lot of honors in Asia or garnered a lot of fans at places from LA to Singapore.
Building hot rods, race cars, show cars or in our case, PT cars….To me, it is all about chasing your dreams and in our case, _catching them_.

SatisTraction

07-04-2005, 09:07 AM

Not to start anything here but do you know exactly how much force 6g's is?

Just for reference: "an NHRA Top Fuel dragster leaves the starting line with a force nearly five times that of gravity, the same force of the space shuttle when it leaves the launching pad at Cape Canaveral?" taken from : ( http://www.nhra.com/streetlegal/funfacts.html (http://www.nhra.com/streetlegal/funfacts.html) )

Now are you saying your last car had more acceleration force then a TF Dragster?

Maybe you were embellishing? Which is cool because I think you were off on that number then..It was more like 8g’s right? :yeah:

LOL, i did not try to imbelish it. The car ran the first 60' in 1.18 seconds. so from a dead stop to 60' in 1.18 seconds. I am sure there is someone on here you can figure it out.

that is just one hell of a rush:) now if the front tures would have been as wide as the rear then i would have had fun on the return road:)

chicane67

07-04-2005, 09:40 AM

2.2004456 g-unit (roughly)

USAZR1

07-04-2005, 10:19 AM

LOL, i did not try to imbelish it. The car ran the first 60' in 1.18 seconds. so from a dead stop to 60' in 1.18 seconds. I am sure there is someone on here you can figure it out.

A 1.16 short time for a 8.5sec car is believable to me. T/F cars 60ft at around .900.
My 7.90 ProMod bike clicked off some 1.18 60fts.

vanzuuk1

07-04-2005, 11:38 AM

I had a 69 camaro in the late eighties with black wheels and the whole car lowered , all anybody ever said was"you should get centerlines"

Now i have a 69 camaro with black rims and all the car come up and say how good the rims look and the cementheads say "this car needs chrome wheels"

build it for yourself , @#$% those guys.

Phase shift, your car is sweet and your comment about the luggage was funny.The numbers guys are a whole other breed, not my style but thats what makes the world go round.

ProdigyCustoms

07-04-2005, 01:34 PM

Why would ANYBODY drag race and spend all that time working on the car or waiting in line to run for such a short thrill???????

Next time stay around for Saturday, and you can have Larry's seat. You may just understand! And if a man is lucky enough to have both...........

WS6

07-04-2005, 03:04 PM

show them a pic of Tony's 69 lifting the wheels at atlanta drag way. then ask them if their 10sec drag car can slow down to make the second turn off with little effort.

no offense to anyone who drag races but thats boring as hell for me. its not so bad if you can hot lap but waiting in long lines for a few seconds of fun just doesnt cut it. i travel back roads with little traffic and have more fun practicing heel toe shifting and turning at the highest speed the car can handle entering on ramps for a pull up to maybe 90mph at most. im not trying to kill anyone or get a speeding ticket, but something that simple and mundane looking to a bystander is way more enjoyable to me.

build whatever you want and be proud of the work youve done

Ishmael

07-04-2005, 03:17 PM

I say put the vintiques on it. I've been wanting to see rallye II's in 17's on a car. Oddly enough, when people tell me about their dream muscle car, they always come back to the PT style - they just didn't know what to call it.

Firestorm

07-04-2005, 04:29 PM

I get crap just for liking cars...

Gotto love liberal college campuses!

Go Reed!

I always argue that a classic car is way more environmentally friendly than a hybrid.. its not being driven 9 months out of the year! Its in the shop! Go figure..

FoxGranadaChuck

07-04-2005, 04:43 PM

Living in the heart of NASCAR country, most people here don't know much about PT. And those that do object to it because "it comes from the land of fruits and nuts (California)."
Most people where I live that do hot rod are traditionalists, i.e. big wide tires in the back and "skinnies" up front. One would be very surprised as to how many "ricers" have 15-inch tires and wheels on their rides!

69rs

07-04-2005, 07:24 PM

Tennessee should have the most pro-touring. With the roads in the mountains around there, a car with skinny tires on the front doesn't stand a chance!

gsxrken

07-04-2005, 08:25 PM

Firestorm. it isn't any different when you leave school and go to work at a corporation. I work at a huge copr HQ with about 3000 people and there are maybe 5 guys- no joke- into cars. A few guys with porsches too, but they don't do there own work. Now, I don't get any flack for being into cars, (PT or otherwise) but it's just a foreign concept to them. To most of them a car or an SUV is a needed appliance.

formula

07-04-2005, 09:45 PM

I say put the vintiques on it. I've been wanting to see rallye II's in 17's on a car.

me too. every photochop i do of them just sweetens the deal.... i wish i could find pictures of a car, any car, with the billet rallye IIs on it.

69rs

07-05-2005, 03:11 AM

The difference between car people and non car people is that non car people think of a car as a means to get from point A to point B. Car people want to enjoy the trip.:drive:

WELTERRACER

07-06-2005, 04:27 AM

man i do, especially with pontiac guys. they hate hate hate my car, for the engine, for the transmission, for the plans i have for it...i know its stupid to try to please people other than yourself, but i was just curious if this is a common thread among our hobby?

The ones who dont like it are the ones who think all cars should be left stock and add on a $10 cheepe chrome kit to the engine and put it in car shows and never drive it..